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Steve Jobs fields questions following Apple's UK iPhone launch - Page 2

post #41 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

It's likely that those applications would be the first of any to receive an official endorsement from Apple, according to Jobs' comments, as those that require Internet access could threaten the 'high standard' of experience customers have come to expect with the iPhone.

I can't believe no one' picking on this. First, what is this 'high-standard of experience' apple is talking about. And, second, why exactly would non-internet apps be OK, but internet-based ones would somehow magically threaten that experience. Wouldn't stand-alone apps have just the same ability to threaten that experience? Or is it Apple wanting to make sure no one dares do anything that could cut into their business model?
post #42 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ti Fighter View Post

why not? apple could make an extended battery, other companies do it. I would much rather have a 3g iPhone with a slight buldge on the back than an edge phone who's battery life isn't even that great.

There are companies that make portable battery rechargers for the iPhone, and iPods.

They use a larger battery than the devices use. You recharge them, and take them with you. If you need to charge your device battery, you plug them into this, and it does that.

While I don't remember the names of the companies who have these products, they are out there.
post #43 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by Louzer View Post

I can't believe no one' picking on this. First, what is this 'high-standard of experience' apple is talking about. And, second, why exactly would non-internet apps be OK, but internet-based ones would somehow magically threaten that experience. Wouldn't stand-alone apps have just the same ability to threaten that experience? Or is it Apple wanting to make sure no one dares do anything that could cut into their business model?

I think he's offering tentative support. It may be a way of backing out of his earlier statement, but doing so slowly.

You now how he changes his mind about things. If there seems to be enough support for these products, and Apple isn't coming out with their own SDK, which I still think is a possibility, he may want to allow them. But, he can't just go whole hog. He has to step carefully.

It looks to be the same thing about phone unlocking, except the other way around. Earlier on, he said that Apple would NOT try to stop it. Now he is saying that they will. Why that changed, I have no idea.
post #44 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ti Fighter View Post

Also let's not forget there are plenty of 3G phones that last a whole day using phone/music/net/email on one charge. My moto q being one.

Are you sure your Q lasts all day talking and surfing the web, because poor battery performance (2-3 hr) seems to be one of the main complaints about that particular phone?

m

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post #45 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post


Jobs also left the door open for a 3G version of the iPhone somewhere down the line, but maintained that current 3G chipsets are "power hogs." He said most of today's 3G devices have battery lives that span only 2 to 3 hours, compared to the iPhone's average 8 hours. "We've got to see the battery lives for 3G get back up into the 5+ hour range," he said. "Hopefully we'll see that late next year."

This debate about battery life and 3G must be treated seriously, and once Apple is done marketing the iPhone in Europe the Japanese market - where Edge is a joke - beckons. I have been using 3G phones for a while now. I prefer phones from Sony-Ericsson, and I try to hookup the device to charge overnight, but not always. My current phone is the SE P1i which I use extensively as a phone, internet/email (via Wi-Fi, on the phone itself and bluetoothed to my portable computer), video calling (a few calls each day). I need to charge it once every other day.

Until recently I used the SE K610 (possibly one of the smallest 3Gs). On this one the battery lasts even longer. Granted, I don’t talk for a solid 2 hours each day, but the combination of functions on both devices allow for a comfortable use of the deviceover several days.

One function I never used on either phone is the music player, for that I have an iPod. Probably this is the main factor that limits the battery life - especially with videos?

BTW, when I travel to the US, I take my main phone with me, but in order to avoid the exorbitant roaming charges I also use a quad-band / Edge SE S500i with a local pre-paid SIM card.
post #46 of 114
Why is the iPhone a power hog? It has more memory? It has a larger screen? A more powerful processor? People would have a tendency to use the iPhone constantly. You really believe Apple is conning people about 3G chips being power hungry. To what end? Apple could build a brick phone that's much thicker and that has a bigger battery to get longer life. Maybe that's what you want and that's why you own a Motorola Q. I'm not putting down the MotoQ. It has different dimensions from the iPhone. You really think the MotoQ is a great handset? We'll see how many get sold. Reviewers said that it's stale and won't get much buyer's attention.

I personally think the iPhone should be a bit thicker to get more battery life, but that's not my decision. GPS chips are power hungry, too. I think the iPhone's dimensions are going to see some design revisions. Give it a chance.
post #47 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post

No offense intended to anyone, but from a design/looks standpoint, most people think that "thin is cool."

Isn't the UK trying to ban size zero models from the catwalk nowadays because there is such a thing as 'too thin?' Apple should be careful... they might be next.

"Bring on the fat iPhones!!!"

post #48 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by ouragan View Post

Steve Jobs is so greedy!!! What he wants to do is illegal as it denies the ownership of iPhone buyers. Apple VP of Legal Affairs should instruct Steve Jobs that:

1) Apple is breaking consumer protection laws in preventing consumers from choosing a phone carrier for the phones they buy and own;

2) Apple is likely breaking the laws against false advertising;

3) Apple is breaking antitrust laws because tied sales are illegal in that a seller cannot tie the sale of a product, the iPhone, with a service, the ATT or O2 cell phone service;

4) Apple signed a contract which cannot be enforced against iPhone buyers without breaking the law, especially the right of every owner to choose what he wants to do with what he owns, as iPhones are sold, not leased;

5) Apple will damage its image with consumers by breaking the law to enforce a contract that cannot be enforced, just as Apple damaged its image with investors by paying a $650 million bonus to Steve Jobs in 2006, making him the highest paid CEO on the planet.


Here is a link that explains phone unlocking in the US.

http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,1895,2064707,00.asp
post #49 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by caliminius View Post

Isn't Jobs' comment about the short battery life somewhat of a half-truth? I could see the battery life being shortened to 2-3 hours if someone were constantly using 3G, but how often is someone going to be doing that?

[ ... stuff deleted ...]

Just seems at times Jobs likes to pull excuses out of his a**.

Ok, Let' take a look at the BlackBerry 8830 which in North America runs on the 3G EV-DO network, but roams internationally on a GSM network. We can also look at the BlackBerry 8800 which runs on the EDGE network all the time.

RIM's published battery life for these devices?

8800: 22 days (standby), 300 minutes (talk)
8830 (on an EV-DO network): 9 days (standby), 220 minutes (talk)
8830 (when on a GSM network): 16 days (standby), 300 minutes (talk)

So yes, even if you aren't constantly accessing the network, 3G chews up battery life.

A mobile phone is constantly in contact with a tower to say "hey, I'm alive, and I can be found here". And smart phones can often be more chatty than a plain old cell phone. E.g. if they don't have push email, they will poll every 15 minutes to ask "has anyone emailed me recently?"

So, for BlackBerry, 3G causes the standby time to diminish by about 40%, and the talk time to diminish by about 25%. They do not publish battery time for internet use, audio or video playback.
post #50 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by jhayman View Post

They do not publish battery time for internet use, audio or video playback.


Hmmm...... I wonder why. Isn't it supposed to have all those functions?
post #51 of 114
I have a SaMSUNG Blackjack, and it comes with a extended battery, and has the ability to choose between edge and 3g. there also is a auto select feature that will wich one of the two, that is available
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

There are companies that make portable battery rechargers for the iPhone, and iPods.

They use a larger battery than the devices use. You recharge them, and take them with you. If you need to charge your device battery, you plug them into this, and it does that.

While I don't remember the names of the companies who have these products, they are out there.
post #52 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by OriginalMacRat View Post

"[P]eople are going to try and break in and it's our job to try and stop them."

Huh?

It's Apple's job to LIMIT use of their product?

With the agreements they have in place, yes.
post #53 of 114
my battery life is great using the extended battery, its only ok using the slim battery. I use opera mini to surf the net, check gmail,dowload song/video clips, and play nintendo games quite frequently.
post #54 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by BlackSummerNight View Post

my battery life is great using the extended battery, its only ok using the slim battery. I use opera mini to surf the net, check gmail,dowload song/video clips, and play nintendo games quite frequently.

Could you be more specific? 3 hours with mixed use? 4? 5? 6?

I regularly get about 6 hours with mixed use on the iPhone.
post #55 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by vinney57 View Post

No. It's Steve's job to make it look as if they are making an effort to limit use; to appease their network partners who are paying Apple large amounts of money for the privalege of working for them.

Exactly right. No cellular provider—not AT&T, not anybody—would have taken a chance on the iPhone under the terms dictated by Apple unless they were guaranteed an exclusive contract for some period of time. Had Apple refused to offer an exclusive deal to their cellular partner, most likely there would never have been an iPhone.
post #56 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by Booga View Post

So your solution to the 3G power consumption problem is to have the user swap out their cellphone battery every 2 hours? Let's just say I'm glad it's Apple doing the product design.

My Treo 755 has 3G and it runs ALL day, none of this 2 hour BS. So I guess you're telling me what I already know, my Treo is superior to the iPhone in some important ways.
post #57 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by BlackSummerNight View Post

I have a SaMSUNG Blackjack, and it comes with a extended battery, and has the ability to choose between edge and 3g. there also is a auto select feature that will wich one of the two, that is available

My older Samsung i300 and i330's came with a regular battery, and an extended battery. The stand allowed two batteries to be charged at once. One in the phone, and one in the stand.

I only used the extended battery.

My feeling is that all of the batteries in these sealed models are the equivelent to the extended versions.

My Samsungs were before the 3G services from Sprint, so I can't say about them.
post #58 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by OriginalMacRat View Post

"[P]eople are going to try and break in and it's our job to try and stop them."

Huh?

It's Apple's job to LIMIT use of their product?

Of course, what are you smoking.

It's a product that is only sold with a monthly contract. You honestly expect them NOT to try and enforce that?
post #59 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by segastyle View Post

actually, 3g vs. edge can make a huge impact on talk time, because even though you are not downloading data (as in a web page) you are talking on that network. AnandTech has an article about 3g vs edge battery life on a samsung blackjack:
http://www.anandtech.com/printarticle.aspx?i=3036

for just talk time, on 3g a blackjack got 251 minutes, but on edge got 525 minutes. that's a huge disparity. in other cases the difference was much less and in some cases (email) even better for 3g than edge.


I'm not a technical person, but does the iPhone "talk" over the network checking e-mail and maybe other things(?) and does a derivative of OS X & iTunes, etc. have anything to do with battery drain due to receiving data packets. I mean didn't people who went to Europe and did not turn off their EDGE or whatever have huge bills at the end of the month. Does this cause a big drain on the battery as is when on EDGE and even worse if on a 3G network?

I keep reading posts of people with G3 phones saying they get ok time from the battery then what SJ says but does SJ know more because the iPhone is not like your standard Nokia, Samsung etc. cell phone maker? The iPhone is more OS computer centric then others? Just curious???

Ten years ago, we had Steve Jobs, Bob Hope and Johnny Cash.  Today we have no Jobs, no Hope and no Cash.

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post #60 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rot'nApple View Post

I'm not a technical person, but does the iPhone "talk" over the network checking e-mail and maybe other things(?) and does a derivative of OS X & iTunes, etc. have anything to do with battery drain due to receiving data packets. I mean didn't people who went to Europe and did not turn off their EDGE or whatever have huge bills at the end of the month. Does this cause a big drain on the battery as is when on EDGE and even worse if on a 3G network?

I keep reading posts of people with G3 phones saying they get ok time from the battery then what SJ says but does SJ know more because the iPhone is not like your standard Nokia, Samsung etc. cell phone maker? The iPhone is more OS computer centric then others? Just curious???

Apple is claiming 8 hours talk time. That's pretty good. That's 480 minutes. Who else claims that much?

Remember that all official numbers may not meet real world usage patterns.
post #61 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by ouragan View Post

Steve Jobs is so greedy!!! What he wants to do is illegal as it denies the ownership of iPhone buyers. Apple VP of Legal Affairs should instruct Steve Jobs that:

Jobs runs a company that is out to make a profit... the biggest profit it can. As a shareholder, I like that!
Quote:
Originally Posted by ouragan View Post

1) Apple is breaking consumer protection laws in preventing consumers from choosing a phone carrier for the phones they buy and own;

Buy a diesel car and you HAVE to use diesel petrol. You're free to buy a car that runs on unleaded if that's what you want.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ouragan View Post

2) Apple is likely breaking the laws against false advertising;

The iphone does everything it is advertised as doing.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ouragan View Post

3) Apple is breaking antitrust laws because tied sales are illegal in that a seller cannot tie the sale of a product, the iPhone, with a service, the ATT or O2 cell phone service;

You don't have to sign anything to buy an iphone. You buy it, you can do what you want with it. But to use it to it's full potential, use it with the Certified Apple Partner.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ouragan View Post

4) Apple signed a contract which cannot be enforced against iPhone buyers without breaking the law, especially the right of every owner to choose what he wants to do with what he owns, as iPhones are sold, not leased;

Once again, YOU DO NOT NEED TO SIGN A CONTRACT TO BUY AN IPHONE.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ouragan View Post

5) Apple will damage its image with consumers by breaking the law to enforce a contract that cannot be enforced, just as Apple damaged its image with investors by paying a $650 million bonus to Steve Jobs in 2006, making him the highest paid CEO on the planet.


Steve Jobs gets paid if Apple continues to grow. He saved Apple when he came back. His $650 million was the exercise of stock options... if the stock is worth nothing, he gets nothing.
AAPL has made me alot of money in the past year. Jobs is responsible for that with how he plays the media and creates want.
He is worth more than any other CEO on the planet.

When will people get over the fact that Apple is a business. They are out to make the best return on investment possible. They do this by making some of the best products out there and charging a bit more for them. I'm hooked, are you?
post #62 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by caliminius View Post

Isn't Jobs' comment about the short battery life somewhat of a half-truth?

Of course it is, but it's also his job to protect Apple the company. Note the late next year comment about a 3G iPhone. That's insane (giving up the Asian market until the end of 2008?) but if he said at Macworld 2008 there will be a 3G iPhone then current sales would slow, stock would drop, and he wouldn't have been doing his job.

As I continue to point out 3G used constantly on a modern UMTS phone (i.e. Japan) has a battery drain of around 30%.

On an iPhone in Europe or the USA 3G would be powered up dynamically when needed to download data (and, perhaps, optionally for better sounding voice calls) and thus we're looking at a situation where 30% is the worst case scenario and 10% is more likely.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Louzer View Post

I can't believe no one' picking on this. First, what is this 'high-standard of experience' apple is talking about. And, second, why exactly would non-internet apps be OK, but internet-based ones would somehow magically threaten that experience. Wouldn't stand-alone apps have just the same ability to threaten that experience? Or is it Apple wanting to make sure no one dares do anything that could cut into their business model?

That does strike me as weird, especially since much of the best potential for iPhone apps exists in using the web/desktop hybrid model (as Apple's own applications do). Perhaps it's aimed directly at VOIP.

Quote:
Originally Posted by aljawad View Post

This debate about battery life and 3G must be treated seriously, and once Apple is done marketing the iPhone in Europe the Japanese market - where Edge is a joke - beckons. I have been using 3G phones for a while now. I prefer phones from Sony-Ericsson, and I try to hookup the device to charge overnight, but not always. My current phone is the SE P1i which I use extensively as a phone, internet/email (via Wi-Fi, on the phone itself and bluetoothed to my portable computer), video calling (a few calls each day). I need to charge it once every other day..

Technically speaking EDGE (or GSM) doesn't even exist in the Japanese market. In fact both the South Korean and Japanese markets will require a 3G iPhone model. They also require an e-cash chip, a better camera, preferably digital TV, preferably GPS, and a lot of additional software for stuff like QR code handling.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rot'nApple View Post

I'm not a technical person, but does the iPhone "talk" over the network checking e-mail and maybe other things(?) and does a derivative of OS X & iTunes, etc. have anything to do with battery drain due to receiving data packets. I mean didn't people who went to Europe and did not turn off their EDGE or whatever have huge bills at the end of the month. Does this cause a big drain on the battery as is when on EDGE and even worse if on a 3G network?

Talking over 3G would impose little more battery impact than talking over EDGE. You lose a little turning the 3G chipset on/off, you lose a little because 3G uses more power, you gain a little because it will all download much faster.
post #63 of 114
i havent done any real testing, so this is jus a guess. i'd have to say aroud 4 hours talk time with heavy data use. I usually go a two days without charging with mixed use using the extended battery. I give the battery like on the blackjack a A-
Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post

Could you be more specific? 3 hours with mixed use? 4? 5? 6?

I regularly get about 6 hours with mixed use on the iPhone.
post #64 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by caliminius View Post

Isn't Jobs' comment about the short battery life somewhat of a half-truth? I could see the battery life being shortened to 2-3 hours if someone were constantly using 3G, but how often is someone going to be doing that? I believe my current Verizon phone has 3G (EVDO is a 3G network, correct?). It will last a couple of days without needing recharged since I don't use the 3G network (nor is it disabled in anyway, just not actively used). I'd imagine that most places you're going to use the iPhone long term would be the same places you could have wi-fi and 3G usage would still be pretty limited (just like EDGE) to short spans between wi-fi hotspots. The iPhone battery life would also be helped if Apple allowed real applications on the phone (thus not requiring "apps" to be using the data network).

Just seems at times Jobs likes to pull excuses out of his a**. Like the previous lame excuse explaining why no 3rd party apps allowed on the phone because it could bring down the AT&T network (if the AT&T network is that fragile, they shouldn't be running a cellular network in the first place).

There seems to be some truth to that. Steve appears to be exaggerating the battery life hit that 3G would cause, likely because he doesn't have a 3G iPhone to sell yet. \

Once he does, you can bet he'll have nothing but great things to say about 3G. Steve's a very aggressive salesperson, and can switch rationales on a dime.

.
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post #65 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by Constable Odo View Post

Why is the iPhone a power hog? It has more memory? It has a larger screen? A more powerful processor? People would have a tendency to use the iPhone constantly. You really believe Apple is conning people about 3G chips being power hungry. To what end? Apple could build a brick phone that's much thicker and that has a bigger battery to get longer life. Maybe that's what you want and that's why you own a Motorola Q. I'm not putting down the MotoQ. It has different dimensions from the iPhone.

Huh? The iPhone is 0.46" thick. The Q9m is 0.47". Hardly a 'brick'.


Quote:
I personally think the iPhone should be a bit thicker to get more battery life, but that's not my decision.

Wouldn't hurt. I can't really see someone going, "Eww, this phone is 0.50" thick instead of 0.46". It must suck!!"

Yet that's the way Apple seems to design... in fear of this mythological customer. \

.
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post #66 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by Electric Monk View Post

That does strike me as weird, especially since much of the best potential for iPhone apps exists in using the web/desktop hybrid model (as Apple's own applications do). Perhaps it's aimed directly at VOIP.

Looks like its aimed at VOIP.

Quote:
Technically speaking EDGE (or GSM) doesn't even exist in the Japanese market. In fact both the South Korean and Japanese markets will require a 3G iPhone model. They also require an e-cash chip, a better camera, preferably digital TV, preferably GPS, and a lot of additional software for stuff like QR code handling.

I don't see Japan as a big market for Apple right now. They've certainly put very lackluster effort into it and the product needs are different from the US. Note the lack of ultraportable in the laptop lineup.

I suspect Apple would be happy serving those two market with just the iPod touch and foregoing the iPhone for the moment. Those additional requirements you listed simply don't look likely.

V
post #67 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by Electric Monk View Post

Of course it is, but it's also his job to protect Apple the company. Note the late next year comment about a 3G iPhone. That's insane (giving up the Asian market until the end of 2008?) but if he said at Macworld 2008 there will be a 3G iPhone then current sales would slow, stock would drop, and he wouldn't have been doing his job.

As I continue to point out 3G used constantly on a modern UMTS phone (i.e. Japan) has a battery drain of around 30%.

On an iPhone in Europe or the USA 3G would be powered up dynamically when needed to download data (and, perhaps, optionally for better sounding voice calls) and thus we're looking at a situation where 30% is the worst case scenario and 10% is more likely.

That does strike me as weird, especially since much of the best potential for iPhone apps exists in using the web/desktop hybrid model (as Apple's own applications do). Perhaps it's aimed directly at VOIP.

Technically speaking EDGE (or GSM) doesn't even exist in the Japanese market. In fact both the South Korean and Japanese markets will require a 3G iPhone model. They also require an e-cash chip, a better camera, preferably digital TV, preferably GPS, and a lot of additional software for stuff like QR code handling.

Talking over 3G would impose little more battery impact than talking over EDGE. You lose a little turning the 3G chipset on/off, you lose a little because 3G uses more power, you gain a little because it will all download much faster.


Well said and interesting as always, EM.

.
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post #68 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by vinea View Post

I don't see Japan as a big market for Apple right now. They've certainly put very lackluster effort into it and the product needs are different from the US. Note the lack of ultraportable in the laptop lineup.

I suspect Apple would be happy serving those two market with just the iPod touch and foregoing the iPhone for the moment. Those additional requirements you listed simply don't look likely.


Well, Apple has already stated that they're going to do an Asian iPhone launch in '08.

So, given that Japan and Korea are the two major cellphone markets over there (China is coming up, but is still heavily into low-end, cheap phones), and Korea and Japan are similar in their requirements (3G, advanced features)...

...Apple then has two options for said Asian launch:

Option A- Do an 'iPhone 2.0' next year, with 3G and advanced features

Option B- Crash and burn in Asia


Not a tough choice for them.


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post #69 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by vinea View Post

I don't see Japan as a big market for Apple right now. They've certainly put very lackluster effort into it and the product needs are different from the US. Note the lack of ultraportable in the laptop lineup.

I suspect Apple would be happy serving those two market with just the iPod touch and foregoing the iPhone for the moment. Those additional requirements you listed simply don't look likely.

It's the world's third largest market (and a lot more homogeneous then America or Europe), has a high per capita GDP, and is utterly mobile mad (much much more so then they'd care about the touch).

Ignoring Japan & South Korea because Apple wasn't willing to make minor hardware/software changes to the iPhone is insane.
post #70 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by Electric Monk View Post

It's the world's third largest market (and a lot more homogeneous then America or Europe), has a high per capita GDP, and is utterly mobile mad (much much more so then they'd care about the touch).

Ignoring Japan & South Korea because Apple wasn't willing to make minor hardware/software changes to the iPhone is insane.


Bingo.

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post #71 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by caliminius View Post

Isn't Jobs' comment about the short battery life somewhat of a half-truth? I could see the battery life being shortened to 2-3 hours if someone were constantly using 3G, but how often is someone going to be doing that? I believe my current Verizon phone has 3G (EVDO is a 3G network, correct?). It will last a couple of days without needing recharged since I don't use the 3G network (nor is it disabled in anyway, just not actively used). I'd imagine that most places you're going to use the iPhone long term would be the same places you could have wi-fi and 3G usage would still be pretty limited (just like EDGE) to short spans between wi-fi hotspots. The iPhone battery life would also be helped if Apple allowed real applications on the phone (thus not requiring "apps" to be using the data network).

Just seems at times Jobs likes to pull excuses out of his a**. Like the previous lame excuse explaining why no 3rd party apps allowed on the phone because it could bring down the AT&T network (if the AT&T network is that fragile, they shouldn't be running a cellular network in the first place).

Except if you were using an iPhone where using the Internet is a joy, you'd be using it for more than you do on your current Verizon phone.
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post #72 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by johnnygill View Post

When asked whether Apple would share Wi-Fi iTunes Store revenues with carriers in the same way that carriers share service revenues with Apple, Jobs said, "We're not going to go into it, but if it's using the network you can conceptually imagine that it might make sense."

I thought Apple's Wi-Fi iTunes Store would ONLY be accessible over wi-fi ... So, it sounds to me like the iPhone is NOT using the carriers' network, and therefore there would be no sharing of revenue.

Other thoughts?

It is wifi only today. It could be on 3G someday. But in any case, Jobs could be implying that The Cloud is compensated for use of their wifi network when a song is bought. And also with Starbucks. Although if anyone bought a tune being played at a Starbucks store over iTunes wifi, Starbucks might also be compensating Apple.
"you will know the truth, and the truth will
set you free."
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"you will know the truth, and the truth will
set you free."
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post #73 of 114
Since it seems likely that T-Mobile will be the carrier for the iPhone in Germany what are the changes that someone in the US and uses T-Mobile will be able to buy a iPhone in Germany and have it shipped to the US to be used on the T-Mobile network (unlocked or not) here in the US.
I know that there may be the possibility that the phone will not have the proper band for the US but since T-Mobile will more then likely want its German subscribers to be able to travel to the US and use the iPhone here this would allow T-Mobile to and gain the added revenue of international roaming voice and data charges I can see that it may be a possibility.
Personally I would like to see the ability of doing this ( even if its not a 3G version ) and not have to worry about having to wonder if Apple will try to re-lock the phone.
Anyone have any thoughts on this option.
post #74 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by Electric Monk View Post

It's the world's third largest market (and a lot more homogeneous then America or Europe), has a high per capita GDP, and is utterly mobile mad (much much more so then they'd care about the touch).

Ignoring Japan & South Korea because Apple wasn't willing to make minor hardware/software changes to the iPhone is insane.

E cash chip, better camera, digital TV, etc doesn't seem like minor modifications and there's not a whole lot of room for those additions.

I see them launching with the same 3G US/European iPhone features but I don't see extra frills for the Japanese/Korean market.

Would Apple be "ignoring" Japan? I dunno...is just having the MacBook ignoring Japan? They choose "Option B" for the Mac lineup already. Apple has crashed and burned in the Japanese laptop market.

Do you believe that they're going to the engineering effort of an Asian only SKU? Or do you think US centric Apple is going to remain US centric with the iPhone? Hell, it looks like they're doing a Europe launch without 3G.

V
post #75 of 114
Here's the Japanese handset market share for Q4 2006 and Q1 2007.

Notice that Nokia and Motorolla both lumped into Other? Notice that all the top 5 companies come from one particular nation?

http://analytica1st.com/analytica1st...shipments.html
http://wirelesswatch.jp/2007/03/08/s...-market-share/

The probability of Apple penetrating the Japanese market in significant number is slim to none. And you know what they said about Slim. I just don't see a significant amount of effort in this direction and say what you want about Nokia and Motorolla...they really did want IN on Japan and they (with Samsung) are the dominant players worldwide.

How do you go from 65% combined global market share (Nokia, Samsung, Motorolla) to "other"?
post #76 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by vinea View Post

The probability of Apple penetrating the Japanese market in significant number is slim to none.





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Cut-copy-paste, MMS, landscape keyboard, video-recording, voice-calling, and more... FINALLY
To the 'We Didn't Need It' Crowd/Apple Apologista Squad : Wrong again, lol
Thanks for listening to your...
Reply
Cut-copy-paste, MMS, landscape keyboard, video-recording, voice-calling, and more... FINALLY
To the 'We Didn't Need It' Crowd/Apple Apologista Squad : Wrong again, lol
Thanks for listening to your...
Reply
post #77 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by ouragan View Post

Steve Jobs is so greedy!!! What he wants to do is illegal as it denies the ownership of iPhone buyers. Apple VP of Legal Affairs should instruct Steve Jobs that:

2) Apple is likely breaking the laws against false advertising;

They are already being accused of that in a spurious lawsuit.

Someone else mentioned VOIP -- I found this which looks like a bit of a kludge but maybe better than nothing. I'd prefer a real Skype or similar via WiFi once iPhone reaches Australia. Even though free WiFi is not that common here, I could use it as a handset for Skype at home.

Philip Machanick creator of Opinionations and Green Grahamstown
Department of Computer Science, Rhodes University, South Africa

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Philip Machanick creator of Opinionations and Green Grahamstown
Department of Computer Science, Rhodes University, South Africa

Reply
post #78 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by TBaggins View Post

Well, Apple has already stated that they're going to do an Asian iPhone launch in '08.

So, given that Japan and Korea are the two major cellphone markets over there (China is coming up, but is still heavily into low-end, cheap phones), and Korea and Japan are similar in their requirements (3G, advanced features)...

...Apple then has two options for said Asian launch:

Option A- Do an 'iPhone 2.0' next year, with 3G and advanced features

Option B- Crash and burn in Asia


Not a tough choice for them.


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What about Australia? We're eager to get our hands on the iPhone over here.

Apple's best bet is to improve the iPhone in each successive launch, then start again with the US. By then, the iPhone'll be awesome.
post #79 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by TBaggins View Post



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Proud AAPL stock owner.

 

GOA

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Proud AAPL stock owner.

 

GOA

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post #80 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by TBaggins View Post

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Another personal attack from you. That seems to be a pattern when you have no factual rejoinder.
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