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post #361 of 395
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Originally Posted by Marvin View Post

This is why AMD can't die out. If they do, Intel have no reason to make an effort. They only need to be better than their competition to make the sale.

I think competition is good, but I don't think a lack of competition would necessarily mean no progress. There has to be some improvement over time. Intel's gotten used to computers getting replaced every few years. If there's not much of an improvement, there's less reason to buy a new computer.
post #362 of 395
Exactly JeffDM... everyone predicting the sky falling because amd dies off... It's funny that people forget who made AMD in the first place... Yep... that's right... INTEL.

 

 

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post #363 of 395
Quote:
Originally Posted by JeffDM View Post

I think competition is good, but I don't think a lack of competition would necessarily mean no progress. There has to be some improvement over time. Intel's gotten used to computers getting replaced every few years. If there's not much of an improvement, there's less reason to buy a new computer.


Just think; if we really had no real competition in the computer operating system market, and one company controlled over 90 percent of the market, we would really be in trouble. But that will never happen as we look over the vista of the computer system market.
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post #364 of 395
Quote:
Originally Posted by Royboy View Post

Just think; if we really had no real competition in the computer operating system market, and one company controlled over 90 percent of the market, we would really be in trouble. But that will never happen as we look over the vista of the computer system market.

I think MS was able to ride on Intel's coat tails with that though. If it weren't for faster computers, not nearly as many people would bother to get a new computer.
post #365 of 395
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lemon Bon Bon. View Post

I would have thought with programmers working on the multi-chip 360 and the PS3 consoles that design of the chips/architecture would create a mainstream environment for threading to go mainstream...especially as they move to squeeze every drop of performance out of them. I would have thought that will help or contribute to the threading gene pool in the next 3 years as these beasts hit critical mass in their millions upon millions. The incentive to multi-thread, financially will be there? And these developers can feed the techniques back into the land of computers?

Yes, but its a very slow process. Consumers are used to things moving at a lightening pace, but reality is slower than that.
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post #366 of 395
Well we're approaching the two week mark to announcement. Anyone here think Apple has gone so consumer base that Steve won't mention the Mac Pro January 15th? I think that's absurd.

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post #367 of 395
Quote:
Originally Posted by Multimedia View Post

Well we're approaching the two week mark to announcement. Anyone here think Apple has gone so consumer base that Steve won't mention the Mac Pro January 15th? I think that's absurd.

There better be an announcement on or before that day. I'm starting to think before now. If you order a custom MacPro now, it says 4-6 days now and not 2-4... Could the MacPro kick off the year this Tuesday? 1/1/08? So that MacWorld can be for consumers? Either way, I'm still going with MacWorld. But before it would be nice.
post #368 of 395
Quote:
Originally Posted by darthraige View Post

There better be an announcement on or before that day. I'm starting to think before now. If you order a custom MacPro now, it says 4-6 days now and not 2-4... Could the MacPro kick off the year this Tuesday? 1/1/08? So that MacWorld can be for consumers? Either way, I'm still going with MacWorld. But before it would be nice.

Or it could be high demand for the Mac Pro which is causing the delay in shipping. High demand for a product usually means the manufacturer does not change or update the product.

New Mac Pros Summer/Fall of 2008?
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post #369 of 395
Quote:
Originally Posted by Royboy View Post

Or it could be high demand for the Mac Pro which is causing the delay in shipping. High demand for a product usually means the manufacturer does not change or update the product.

New Mac Pros Summer/Fall of 2008?

Hahahaha, Summer/Fall 2008? Yea right. Won't happen.
post #370 of 395
To manage news coverage, MacWorld is generally about one major hardware product and a 'One More Thing'.

The major hardware announcement will be the new Mac Pros, and the One More Thing may be either be the video rentals and a new AppleTV or it may be the rumoured sub-notebook.

The harder thing to guess is whether we'll see any software upgrades at the same time.
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post #371 of 395
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank777 View Post

To manage news coverage, MacWorld is generally about one major hardware product and a 'One More Thing'.

The major hardware announcement will be the new Mac Pros, and the One More Thing may be either be the video rentals and a new AppleTV or it may be the rumoured sub-notebook.

The harder thing to guess is whether we'll see any software upgrades at the same time.
iWork and iLife are already '08 editions.


There are many ways to slice this. I'd say the major announcement is a new AppleTV and then the video rentals, or the other way around. This two items kind of go together. The one more thing will be the Mac sub-notebook.

This leave the Mac Pro, a professional product, to be announced before the consumer oriented Macworld.

post #372 of 395
Quote:
Originally Posted by snoopy View Post

There are many ways to slice this. I'd say the major announcement is a new AppleTV and then the video rentals, or the other way around. This two items kind of go together. The one more thing will be the Mac sub-notebook.

This leave the Mac Pro, a professional product, to be announced before the consumer oriented Macworld.


I keep seeing this bandied about but is it really a possibility? It seems unlikely to me. Why forsake the chance to introduce a product while everyone's watching, instead introducing it when no one is paying attention?

Has Apple ever done anything like this before?

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post #373 of 395
Quote:
Originally Posted by donebylee View Post

I keep seeing this bandied about but is it really a possibility? It seems unlikely to me. Why forsake the chance to introduce a product while everyone's watching, instead introducing it when no one is paying attention?

Has Apple ever done anything like this before?


Apple doesn't need the MacWorld keynote in order to have everyone paying attention. They schedule a media event and they show up in droves, and the reading public anxiously awaits whatever they have to announce. In fact, one school of thought is that Apple should try to get into the public eye as often as possible so having a separate event is better than taking advantage of the keynote at MacWorld. On the other hand, the MacWorld keynote is something of a tradition (especially since Jobs' return to the helm) and if they stopped announcing worthwhile things people who stop paying attention to them.

In the past its been done both ways -- intro the pro-level product at the MacWorld keynote, or intro it at a separate event weeks or months later. Which they choose will most likely depend on whether they are actually ready to go out the door right away, and what else they have waiting to introduce. They've been pretty good in the past few years about ensuring shipping quantity on the day of introduction, especially considering how badly they got slagged for that back in the 90s.
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post #374 of 395
I think it works how ever Apple decides to do it. Although, I've never seen a Mac Pro at an invitation style press event, and I'm not sure how well that would work. I think the Press events are best suited for brand new products, or consumer ones because press fall into the consumer category, and they get all riled up and excited about a product, and they cause an industry rattling all their own. I'm not sure if the press could get excited about a Mac Pro like they did the iPhone, or whatever this rumored laptop is going to be. Either way. I think MacWorld works just as good to unveil products as anything. Watching SJ get all worked up over a PowerMac/ Mac Pro, or any products is exciting, and it causes a stir.
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post #375 of 395
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Originally Posted by onlooker View Post

...I've never seen a Mac Pro at an invitation style press event...

You've been around a while, onlooker, so perhaps its just a memory fault? I'm pretty sure it has happened a few times.
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post #376 of 395
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Originally Posted by Programmer View Post

You've been around a while, onlooker, so perhaps its just a memory fault? I'm pretty sure it has happened a few times.

But I don't remember one. I've only been watching since the first G5, which is a bit over four years ago. Almost all of them are at or near one of four types of events: WWDC, NAB, some photo event and I think a couple updates were bylines at a MacWorld Expo. If it's not at/during an event, it's close, and with a fairly unceremonious update to the web site and a press release.
post #377 of 395
Quote:
Originally Posted by JeffDM View Post

But I don't remember one. I've only been watching since the first G5, which is a bit over four years ago. Almost all of them are at or near one of four types of events: WWDC, NAB, some photo event and I think a couple updates were bylines at a MacWorld Expo. If it's not at/during an event, it's close, and with a fairly unceremonious update to the web site and a press release.

I guess my age is showing. I distinctly remember a couple of them (not always in January)... but perhaps they were all from the G3/G4 era?
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post #378 of 395
Mac Pro (formerly Power Mac) introductions are all about the Photoshop head-to-heads.
Nowadays, I imagine that's expanded to include Final Cut and Aperture head-to-heads as well.

Those happen primarily at larger shows where Jobs is guaranteed to have a large receptive audience, and lots of control to manage the intro.

That generally means MWSF or WWDC.

With the profit-laden Mac Pro overdue for its first complete overhaul in five years and the first of the Intel era, you had better believe Jobs isn't leaving this to some half-baked special event for reporters.
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post #379 of 395
Quote:
Originally Posted by JeffDM View Post

But I don't remember one. I've only been watching since the first G5, which is a bit over four years ago.

This is where a lot of people get confused. Many people think the many speedbumps of the Cheese Grater design of recent years count as an Intro. They do not.

Most of today's Mac market has never seen Apple introduce a complete overhaul (interior and exterior) to the Professional line.

Before the Cheese Grater debuted, you would have to go back to the debut of the BlueBerry G3, which if memory serves, was Jobs' first redo of the line after the Beige era.
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post #380 of 395
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Originally Posted by Frank777 View Post

Mac Pro (formerly Power Mac) introductions are all about the Photoshop head-to-heads.
Nowadays, I imagine that's expanded to include Final Cut and Aperture head-to-heads as well.

Those comparisons were done because it was G5s vs. the Pentiums: "Our chips are better than theirs" sort of thing. Now that everyone is using the same chips, it doesn't make sense to do that. But perhaps if they compared the new Mac Pros to the old ones...

If there was anything to show off, it would be a new case design with some innovative new features built in which aren't available in the other lines yet.
post #381 of 395
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank777 View Post

This is where a lot of people get confused. Many people think the many speedbumps of the Cheese Grater design of recent years count as an Intro. They do not.

Most of today's Mac market has never seen Apple introduce a complete overhaul (interior and exterior) to the Professional line.

Before the Cheese Grater debuted, you would have to go back to the debut of the BlueBerry G3, which if memory serves, was Jobs' first redo of the line after the Beige era.


There have been plenty of significant milestones beyond just the blueberry and the initial cheese grater... just hanging the intro label on case replacements doesn't do the various machines justice. Can you really ignore the transition from PowerMac to MacPro just because it didn't replace the case's outward appearance? Virtually everything else about the machine changed! The G3 -> G4 transition was also a major milestone (and a painful one at that). The arrival of the dual core G5 was also notable.
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post #382 of 395
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Originally Posted by Programmer View Post

There have been plenty of significant milestones beyond just the blueberry and the initial cheese grater... just hanging the intro label on case replacements doesn't do the various machines justice. Can you really ignore the transition from PowerMac to MacPro just because it didn't replace the case's outward appearance? Virtually everything else about the machine changed! The G3 -> G4 transition was also a major milestone (and a painful one at that). The arrival of the dual core G5 was also notable.

That's certainly true. However, what I was trying to convey was that a lot of the present Mac market has actually never seen Apple do a total overhaul of the insides AND outsides of the Pro line.

Assuming that's what happens this year, I doubt Apple would settle for a simple Press Event to introduce the machine to the Professional market.
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post #383 of 395
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Originally Posted by Frank777 View Post

That's certainly true. However, what I was trying to convey was that a lot of the present Mac market has actually never seen Apple do a total overhaul of the insides AND outsides of the Pro line.

Assuming that's what happens this year, I doubt Apple would settle for a simple Press Event to introduce the machine to the Professional market.

Well unless they have something else that's even bigger (and I don't know what that would be), I agree with you. The new MacPro as the star of the keynote, and the "one more thing" being the rumoured sub-notebook would make some degree of sense. They're only going to do a separate event if they have too much to fit into the keynote... and the iMacs are relatively new, the MB & MBP were recently revved and there is little credible rumours of anything else. Of course, that's just the way Jobs likes it.
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post #384 of 395
If they release this sub-notebook under the Macbook Pro line, all ideas that they don't release "Pro" hardware at Macworld should go out the window.
post #385 of 395
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Originally Posted by suneohair View Post

If they release this sub-notebook under the Macbook Pro line, all ideas that they don't release "Pro" hardware at Macworld should go out the window.

You are a hard person to track down. Welcome back! Hopefully this machine gets released by MacWorld, otherwise, I think I am just gonna buy. I've been waiting for too long.
post #386 of 395
While we're on the subject...after doing some comparison shopping...I know we have been over this before...but Apple needs to reduce their notebook pricing in order to remain competitive. I spec'd a comparable Dell notebook to an top model 15-inch MacBook Pro and it was $300 cheaper with the same or better specs than Apple.

The rumored ultra light notebook should be a the next MacBook replacement...and the entire MacBook / MacBook Pro line should be unified. Drop the pricing on the 15" to $1,599 and quit it with this lousy product differentiation based on screen size.
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post #387 of 395
It seems like the only places that talks about new Mac Pro introduction.. are forums!

New iPhones, new sub-notebook even new Apple TV rumours are floating around but no one predict new pro desktops or displays.

So when I get down by browsing those predictions, it feel good to come here, in the reality distortion field, to get a little hope about new Mac Pro. Thanks guys!

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On the plus-side, my office computer, bought in november '06 is still available from the Apple Store!
post #388 of 395
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Originally Posted by ViralRacoon View Post

So when I get down by browsing those predictions, it feel good to come here, in the reality distortion field, to get a little hope about new Mac Pro. Thanks guys!



Surprise! They are here today, a week BEFORE MWSF. They'll elicit a yawn from some (since they are just a natural continuation of a solid lineup), and excitement from others (since they are the bleeding edge of Mac performance).
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post #389 of 395
Lol! so I guess thats why it was not a MWSF rumours..

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post #390 of 395
The standard config's gone up (for Canadians) from $2799 to $2899. Even with our high dollar.

Maybe they're creating room in the middle for a seriously upgraded Mini (or other headless Mac.)
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post #391 of 395
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Originally Posted by Frank777 View Post

The standard config's gone up (for Canadians) from $2799 to $2899. Even with our high dollar.

Maybe they're creating room in the middle for a seriously upgraded Mini (or other headless Mac.)

It's better than before when the standard config was US$2499 and 2799 CAD + taxes.

The cheapest config is now 2399 CAD (single quad 2.8) and should be faster that the old 2.66 dual dual.
post #392 of 395
Quote:
Originally Posted by snoopy View Post

There are many ways to slice this. I'd say the major announcement is a new AppleTV and then the video rentals, or the other way around. This two items kind of go together. The one more thing will be the Mac sub-notebook.

This leave the Mac Pro, a professional product, to be announced before the consumer oriented Macworld.




Does this mean I get to say 'I told you so?'

post #393 of 395
I'm right there with you....... lol @ the ones saying it wouldn't even be released at or before mwsf .

 

 

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post #394 of 395
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Originally Posted by snoopy View Post

Does this mean I get to say 'I told you so?'


I'll eat crow over this one as well. I still don't understand why Apple has not updated the displays for such a long time if they knew the next rev of the Mac Pro would have the same design.
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post #395 of 395
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Originally Posted by Multimedia View Post

Well we're approaching the two week mark to announcement. Anyone here think Apple has gone so consumer base that Steve won't mention the Mac Pro January 15th? I think that's absurd.

Did you fall off the earth Multi??

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