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post #161 of 194
3/10/08 at 1:05am
Yeah - you have to be careful here.

You also get 6-bit TN screens that are described as 8-bit FCR, and you also get 6-bit MVA/PVA panels (MVA/PVA doesn't guarantee a panel is 8-bit) - so it can be tricky to generalise?

With regards to LCD TVs I'm probably not the best person to ask about that. My knowledge doesn't really extend beyond pro computer panels! But I do know that the pixel count on LCD TVs is far lower than that of computer panels...
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post #162 of 194
3/17/08 at 8:12pm
Stopped in to Costco today and saw an Acer 24" widescreen LCD display for CDN$399.
Specs were 1920X1200, brightness 400cd/m2, response 2ms.

It also had DVI/HDMI and a 3 year limited warranty.

Apple's 23" display is still listed in the Canadian Apple Store at $1049.
It's little wonder that Macs are viewed as overpriced by the general population.
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post #163 of 194
3/18/08 at 3:35am
One of the main reasons for the price difference is down to the quality of the colour reproduction on the screen.

As previously discussed, this is a good argument for the two-tier Apple display product idea - A Pro range using 8-bit or above screens, and a consumer 6-bit TN LCD range.
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post #164 of 194
3/18/08 at 4:19am
Rather than go on the "Apple's overpriced" route, it would make sense to delve into why the Apple Cinema Display is more expensive. As I understand it, there are three LCD "types". TN (inexpensive), PVA (better), IPS (best). I think if Apple marketed their displays by showing these differences, how they are using the best LCD out there in terms of color accuracy and viewing angle, and why these things set them apart from the competition, maybe they could justify the price they charge. However, it also seems to reason that Apple's shooting themselves in the foot by continually leaving the line stagnant. Sure, they could be waiting for LED-backlighting, but seriously, does it all have to be LED all-at-once?
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post #165 of 194
3/18/08 at 7:49am
Yeah, I don't expect Apple to match the Acer's price, but that a mighty big margin between them.

I agree that Apple's decision to push one display line to both consumers and pros is the problem here.

For those that champion the Mac minitower, this is another problem with the concept to consider.
Is Apple going to create two display lines? Otherwise, it will just create more pricing complaints.
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post #166 of 194
4/14/08 at 4:47pm
C'mon Apple!
Innovate and give us some new Cinema Displays.

See what HP's up to:
http://www.electronista.com/articles...hp.dreamcolor/
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post #167 of 194
4/14/08 at 7:11pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by BJNY View Post

C'mon Apple!
Innovate and give us some new Cinema Displays.

See what HP's up to:
http://www.electronista.com/articles...hp.dreamcolor/

30-bit color?!?!?!?!!?!?!!? sorry but that is mind blowing. billions of colors? can't the human eye only see about 10 million?
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post #168 of 194
4/14/08 at 10:32pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by looksthatkill View Post

I wanna' see two lines of display;

20" Apple Home Display
  • Glossy 1680x1050,
  • 3x USB, IR Receiver, iSight Webcam, SD card reader

24" Apple Home Display
  • Glossy 1920x1200,
  • 3x USB, IR Receiver, iSight Webcam, SD card reader

24" Apple Studio Display
  • Matte 1920x1200 LED,
  • 4x USB, 1x FW400, 1x FW800, DisplayPort, IR Receiver, iSight, component, HDMI, S-Video, 9 in 2 media card reader

30" Apple Studio Display
  • Matte 2560x1600 LED,
  • 4x USB, 1x FW400, 1x FW800, DisplayPort, IR Receiver, iSight, component, HDMI, S-Video, 9 in 2 media card reader

Why remove iSights from the Studio displays? I'd make the above changes ^^^
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post #169 of 194
4/15/08 at 2:22am
Quote:
Originally Posted by bobertoq View Post

30-bit color?!?!?!?!!?!?!!? sorry but that is mind blowing. billions of colors? can't the human eye only see about 10 million?

10bit Red
10bit Green
10bit Blue.

30 Bit Color.
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post #170 of 194
4/15/08 at 8:59am
30 bit, LED backlit? It'll be pricey.
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post #171 of 194
4/15/08 at 12:54pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Isomorphic View Post

30 bit, LED backlit? It'll be pricey.

http://www.eizo.com/products/lcd/sx2461w/index.asp
[CENTER]


[/CENTER]

\t

Wide Color Gamut
The FlexScan SX2461W reproduces 95% of the Adobe RGB color space so it can display most colors in a photograph taken in Adobe RGB mode. Furthermore, it has an sRGB mode to accurately reproduce this narrower but commonly used color space. This ensures that colors meant for sRGB such as those used on web pages and any photos taken with a digital cameras sRGB mode will be reproduced on the screen as intended.

12-Bit Gamma, 16-Bit Internal Processing
Comes quipped with EIZOs latest integrated circuit which has a 12-bit look-up table with a color palette of 68 billion colors from which the most appropriate 16.7 million (8-bits) are displayed. It also features 16-bit internal processing for smooth display of grayscale tones, especially in dark areas of an image which typically are difficult for LCD monitors to display without banding.

24" SX2461W
CDW Pricing befor Tax:
http://www.cdw.com/shop/products/def...px?EDC=1436334

$1,479.99

30" SX3031W-BK
CDW Pricing befor Tax:
http://www.cdw.com/shop/products/def...px?EDC=1375944

$3,339.99
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post #172 of 194
4/15/08 at 12:57pm
It is surprising that HP/Dreamworks has been able to take the lead in a product category that should have been first tackled by Apple/Pixar.

Apple must be too busy with that music player business to remember that graphic design is one of the staples of their computer platform.
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post #173 of 194
4/15/08 at 8:01pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank777 View Post

It is surprising that HP/Dreamworks has been able to take the lead in a product category that should have been first tackled by Apple/Pixar.

Apple must be too busy with that music player business to remember that graphic design is one of the staples of their computer platform.

Seeing how nothing in that article is about proving or even bothering to "take the lead" I don't see Apple being too concerned.

HP doesn't make the panels and neither does Dreamworks. They rely on the small click of companies that do and that I have been following, most of them are selling inferior quality monitor panels instead of advancing the technologies and making improvements in quality and delivering more affordable solutions, combined.

Samsung, Philips [spinning off LG], Hitachi and more are flooding the market with crappy LCD panels.

We aren't getting better solutions. We are getting cheaper knockoffs.

Eizo offers top quality displays and you pay through the ass for them.
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post #174 of 194
4/15/08 at 8:21pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by mdriftmeyer View Post

Seeing how nothing in that article is about proving or even bothering to "take the lead" I don't see Apple being too concerned.

HP doesn't make the panels and neither does Dreamworks. They rely on the small click of companies that do and that I have been following, most of them are selling inferior quality monitor panels instead of advancing the technologies and making improvements in quality and delivering more affordable solutions, combined.

Samsung, Philips [spinning off LG], Hitachi and more are flooding the market with crappy LCD panels.

But isn't accurate colour reproduction primarily a software issue?

It sounds to me like HP/Dreamworks is developing an LCD-based framework for managing colour like ColorSync.
Given Apple's penchant for leading in this area, it's surprising that this didn't come from them first.
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post #175 of 194
4/15/08 at 8:30pm
@mdriftmeyer: I stand corrected!

Edit: Scratch that. Are those even LED backlit?
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post #176 of 194
4/15/08 at 8:31pm
http://www.prad.de/en/news/shownews_tft1389.html

Quote:
Acer has introduced two LCD monitors with LED backlights at CeBIT in the form of the AL1917L and AL2216WLsd. The monitors are available from now for 369.00 and 469.00 (RRPs).

Acer?

/points at Apple and laughs
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post #177 of 194
4/18/08 at 12:11am
Hello everybody,

I was just wondering if I should buy a new Apple Cinema Display, or wait an see if they announce any new displays at the coming WWDC this coming June.
What do you guys think?, any chance Apple will have finally roll out new displays?.
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post #178 of 194
4/18/08 at 5:13pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by birdwings View Post

Hello everybody,

I was just wondering if I should buy a new Apple Cinema Display, or wait an see if they announce any new displays at the coming WWDC this coming June.
What do you guys think?, any chance Apple will have finally roll out new displays?.

I don't believe they can wait til next year to announce, I believe you'll see something within the next 4 months
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post #179 of 194
4/23/08 at 2:14pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by ncee View Post

I don't believe they can wait til next year to announce, I believe you'll see something within the next 4 months


Thanks for your reply ncee. I'll wait until WWDC in June (I believe), if nothing is announce I might buy a new display.
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post #180 of 194
4/24/08 at 9:18pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by mcarling View Post

I imagine such institutions would remove or destroy the cameras.

They'd call it the iFright, or perhaps the Cyclops Option.
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post #181 of 194
5/15/08 at 7:05am
There haven't been any indications of a new Cinema Display upcoming, have there? No reports of parts purchases, patents or anything?

We've been waiting on this for so ridiculously long, it makes you wonder seriously what is going on. We know Apple has present technology to make better displays, so why aren't they?

I'm starting to think that the one way to ensure that there will be new displays is buy giving in, and dropping cash on one of the present ones.
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post #182 of 194
5/15/08 at 12:50pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by bkjj40a View Post

I'm starting to think that the one way to ensure that there will be new displays is buy giving in, and dropping cash on one of the present ones.



Is this like getting it to rain by washing your car?


I've made WWDC my line in the sand. I'm ordering a monitor after WWDC one way or another, Apple or not. If it's not Apple I might buy a 24" to hold me over until a 30" LED-backlit model comes out. Either way I need a new monitor, right now.
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post #183 of 194
5/15/08 at 1:14pm
I'm in the same boat. My options are, 23 Apple Cinema Display (IPS but no HDCP and only one input); NEC 2470WNX (the S-PVA panel from the Dell 2408 and Samsung 245T but a better looking backlight and NEC's customer service); an arm and a leg (NEC 2490UXi, which does exactly everything I want, but so much money); or wait.

The ACD wins on the design front -- IPS, small, light, FireWire hub, easy-to-replace external power supply, easy to adjust brightness from very high to very low dependong on how much light is coming in the window, and totally sealed from dust -- but it seems an awful lot of money for not having HDCP support or dual inputs, and in fairness the PVA panel in the NEC 2470 is very good. I'd like this monitor to be able to replace my TV if necessary as well as serve on the computer. And I really need something with two-page support now for working on a pressing deadline.
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post #184 of 194
5/15/08 at 4:48pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Isomorphic View Post

http://www.prad.de/en/news/shownews_tft1389.html
Acer?/points at Apple and laughs

If you want a crappy TN display, go right ahead...

Quote:
Originally Posted by photoeditor

I'm in the same boat. My options are, 23 Apple Cinema Display (IPS but no HDCP and only one input); NEC 2470WNX (the S-PVA panel from the Dell 2408 and Samsung 245T but a better looking backlight and NEC's customer service); an arm and a leg (NEC 2490UXi, which does exactly everything I want, but so much money); or wait.

I was in the same boat until a few weeks ago when I simply got sick of waiting and picked up an ADC 30". Best display I've ever used. I was considering the Apple 23" as well but was put off with some of the problems people were having with them—pink hues, displays going bad, etc. I'm happy to say my 30" arrived in perfect condition.

I was also considering the 245T but it's really not that great if you check out the reviews and it's still S-PVA and has mediocre color. I ended up biting the bullet and going for the Apple. I could have gotten the Dell for a few $$$ less but I hate to support that company—especially when they play panel roulette with some of the other monitor models. If you absolutely need to do HDCP or plug something else into it, get the Dell or HP versions...

BTW: those Eizo's above are not LED. Samsung has a 30" LED but it's about $4500. I highly doubt Apple is going to refresh their displays until they go LED and technology drops to support a 30" about $3000. I'm all for going green but it's certainly not cost effective at this point. (Go Green in other ways, like biking to work, etc.) I'd be surprised to actually see a revision at WWDC... but if you're going to buy, don't buy until a little after June in case they do slash any prices so you can take advantage of the 14 day price protection.
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post #185 of 194
5/16/08 at 6:51am
"don't buy until a little after June in case they do slash any prices so you can take advantage of the 14 day price protection"

Thanks for the advice! Yes I'll be waiting, and glad (well relatively) that I'm not the only one in this boat. I see people complaining about it on other sites too. We shall see.
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post #186 of 194
5/22/08 at 7:49am
Quote:
Originally Posted by mdriftmeyer View Post

http://www.eizo.com/products/lcd/sx2461w/index.asp

Wide Color Gamut
The FlexScan SX2461W reproduces 95% of the Adobe RGB color space so it can display most colors in a photograph taken in Adobe RGB mode. Furthermore, it has an sRGB mode to accurately reproduce this narrower but commonly used color space. This ensures that colors meant for sRGB such as those used on web pages and any photos taken with a digital cameras sRGB mode will be reproduced on the screen as intended.

12-Bit Gamma, 16-Bit Internal Processing
Comes quipped with EIZOs latest integrated circuit which has a 12-bit look-up table with a color palette of 68 billion colors from which the most appropriate 16.7 million (8-bits) are displayed. It also features 16-bit internal processing for smooth display of grayscale tones, especially in dark areas of an image which typically are difficult for LCD monitors to display without banding.

24" SX2461W
CDW Pricing befor Tax:
http://www.cdw.com/shop/products/def...px?EDC=1436334

$1,479.99

30" SX3031W-BK
CDW Pricing befor Tax:
http://www.cdw.com/shop/products/def...px?EDC=1375944

$3,339.99

Gotta get a word in for the EIZOs.. absolutely love mine... best monitor I've ever owned, incredible color, brightness, and tone.
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post #187 of 194
5/27/08 at 1:08pm
Can we get the spam deleted and the poster banned please?
This is an interesting thread, I'd hate to see it derailed for such nonsense.
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post #188 of 194
5/27/08 at 2:46pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank777 View Post

Can we get the spam deleted and the poster banned please?
This is an interesting thread, I'd hate to see it derailed for such nonsense.

An interesting thread, that has been dead for 5 days.
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post #189 of 194
5/27/08 at 2:52pm
That will be solved easily enough. The MacWorld silly season is almost upon us.
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post #190 of 194
5/27/08 at 6:17pm
For those interested in S-IPS Monitors and it looks like only in Europe:

Overclockers UK:
http://www.overclockers.co.uk/search...=&search=hazro

Hazro:
http://www.hazro.co.uk/products/products.html

23,24,26 and 30 in monitors.

http://www.hazro.co.uk/products/hazro_hz23w.html

Too bad I can't get these at NewEgg.
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post #191 of 194
5/30/08 at 1:02am
apple is advertising cinema displays again on their UK storefront, possibly a sign they want to shift stock before announcing new ones next week? Or maybe I just want new displays so badly I'm hallucinating...
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post #192 of 194
5/30/08 at 11:25am
Quote:
Originally Posted by maxx66 View Post

apple is advertising cinema displays again on their UK storefront, possibly a sign they want to shift stock before announcing new ones next week? Or maybe I just want new displays so badly I'm hallucinating...

Apple's UK store is a mess ATM. Click on the Mac mini and see if anything's weird on its page.

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post #193 of 194
5/30/08 at 11:31am
Quote:
Originally Posted by BJNY View Post

C'mon Apple!
Innovate and give us some new Cinema Displays.

See what HP's up to:
http://www.electronista.com/articles...hp.dreamcolor/

Old story (relatively speaking)...
http://www.tfot.info/news/1169/hp-on...s-display.html

So I guess there's really no news component.

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post #194 of 194
6/16/09 at 3:00am
Your Apple LED Cinema Display comes with 90 days of free telephone technical support and a one-year limited warranty. To extend your service and support to three years from your displays purchase date, you may register one display in the AppleCare Protection Plan when you purchase the display at the same time as a MacBook Pro with Mini DisplayPort. To cover an individual display or second display, purchase the AppleCare Protection Plan for Apple Display. Only the AppleCare Protection Plan provides you with direct telephone support from Apple technical experts and the assurance that repairs will be handled by Apple-authorized technicians using genuine Apple parts. For more information, visit Apple support or call 800-823-2775.
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