I would like to see some truly credible sources on Seg's claim. He seems to think that a few verses should be enough for me, just because he said so. The claim is that 'believers" includes all Christians and Jews. What he posted supported that, but something tells me that's not the whole story. How about some expert opinions? That's all I'm asking for. So far what I've gotten is a few verses and the notion that any other interpretation is just anti-Islamic propaganda. I'm not buyin' it.
Fair enough. Thank you for the clarity. I was just trying to ascertain which sources you'd like: academic or religious.
Of course we have already the primary religious source, the Qur'an, which strangely is not good enough to quote in support of Islamic doctrine but, nevertheless, I will give both of the above types. And of course they will then be rejected or ignored haha - but them's the rules!
First some more Qur'anic quotes with my commentary so you can grasp the full import. And surely if someone does not believe these Qur'anic quotes or acts against them their status as a Muslim is in question no?
Remember, 'Allah' is the word for God and is used in Arabic by any faith speaking of God. Here God is saying:
I am setting those who follow thee above those who disbelieve until the Day of Resurrection.
That is, followers of Jesus are set up those who disbelieve until the final day. It really cannot be clearer.
You might argue about what 'believe' means or 'belief in what' is meant but again:
I repeat: We believe in what has been revealed to us (Qur'an) and to you (Bible).
I repeat the earlier Qur'anic verse also as you have ignored it and it is unequivocal:
There is no doubt about this verse whatsoever. No religious scholar or cleric has argued against it and every Muslim - except extremists who choose to ignore it - accepts it.
Also, look at the marriage laws. It is illegal to marry an unbeliever:
But wait..... there is another law:
This is where the famous 'logic' we hear so much about (but rarely se in action) comes in. I shall leave you to play with it a while.
On to other sources...from the Catholic Church:
The Catechism of the Catholic Church, the official doctrine document released by the Roman Catholic church, has this to say regarding Muslims:
So we have two sources: the Qur'an and Catholic dogma.
But there's more:
I am a Christian and a Muslim
She does both, she says, because she's Christian and Muslim.
Redding, who until recently was director of faith formation at St. Mark's Episcopal Cathedral, has been a priest for more than 20 years. Now she's ready to tell people that, for the last 15 months, she's also been a Muslim drawn to the faith after an introduction to Islamic prayers left her profoundly moved.
Redding has been embraced by leaders at the Al-Islam Center of Seattle, the Muslim group she prays with: "Islam doesn't say if you're a Christian, you're not a Muslim," said programming director Ayesha Anderson. "Islam doesn't lay it out like that."
And that's how it is: Islam doesn't lay it out like that.
One last word to my favourite 'homo-erotic' poet - the one you ignored before, I guess you're not so into poetry - the 13th century Persian poet, Islamic jurist, and Hanafi theologian Mawlānā Jalāl-ad-Dīn Muhammad Rūmī (Persian: مولانا جلال الدین محمد رومی).
Come, come, whoever you are, come and come again,
If you are an infidel, a fire worshipper, or a Buddhist, Come.
Our conviction is not of despair,
Come, come again, even if you broken your repent a hundred time.
Rumi lived in a time of religious war and he tried to serve as a uniting figure among the followers of all faiths. Among his pupils were Muslim, Christians, and Jews. He loves them all and he related his teaching to all religions:
What is to be done, O Muslims? For I do not recognise myself
I am neither Christian, nor a Jew, nor a fire-worshipper, nor Muslim
I am not of the East, nor of the West, nor of the land, nor of the sea;
I am not of Natures mint, nor of the circling heavens.
I am not of India, nor of China, nor of Bulgaria, nor of Saqsin
I am not of Iraq, nor of Khurasan
My place is the placeless and my trace is the traceless.