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The Wii: does it do it for you? How much longer until it's passed by? - Page 5

post #161 of 165
Marvin:

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Maybe it's people that couldn't get a Wii?

It's probably just some Christmas thing. Families are always looking to buy unique gifts just to see the looks on people's faces when you open it, not realizing it's not really a good surprise.

I bet the second hand bins will be full of Guitar Hero after Christmas.

Yet more predictions from the guy incapable of saying anything worthwhile.

Fortunately, many people who play games do so simply to have fun, not necessarily to perpetuate and imagine about their video game preferences. Some of these people even have friends who are not gamers.

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You only know about the stores you've seen and my opinion is based on people I've come in contact with over a number of years which is a social observation.

I have seen it and I have read/heard others reporting having seen the same thing. Then I see the sales numbers. Anecdotal and hard evidence show that the Wii is selling better and is more popular.

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Also, having PS3s and 360s left on shelves is a good thing. That means supply > demand so fewer unhappy people at Christmas time.

Good for those who want a PS3/XBox 360, yes, not so good for MS and Sony.

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Some figures put the Wii ahead but others put the 360 ahead so the Wii isn't completely wiping the floor when you also have to consider that the 360 is fighting off the PS3 and a bad reputation for hardware failure.

What numbers show the 360 ahead?
Who said the Wii was "wiping the floor" with the 360? (It is wiping the floor with the PS3.)

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Maybe the extra 360s are in store to allow for exchanges over the Christmas period.

This makes absolutely no sense at all. They are there to be sold, not to be held in case of exchange. All repairs on the consoles is handled by Sony/MS, anyway.

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There was also a rumor going round that Nintendo were deliberately holding back supplies. Given the hype that surrounds an out of stock product, it's not surprising why they'd do that really.

It is extremely surprising given that they actually profit from every Wii sale. That rumor is beyond stupid and I am not surprised at all that you believe it. (Wii rainchecks)

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Ah no, y'see I think that Sony and Microsoft are targeting a slightly bigger market but it's because their market is divided between PSP, 360, PS3 and PS2 that it seems smaller.

PSP? Nintendo dominates the handheld side. Keep trying.

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But anyway, I don't think companies necessarily go after the biggest market, they go after the most profitable (like Apple) or at least what they feel is more profitable.

Which company is making the most profit off of their game products? Keep trying.

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They probably know that a 20-something guy would be willing to spend more than the average parent on a game or console.

They're right. It's unfortunate that they actually lose money on the console, then, isn't it?

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Of course but the difficulty is pretty low and even if there are tricky bits, the overall presentation is pretty weak but like I say, it's subjective based on experience.

You have no experience with it, though, that's the key. You obviously haven't played these games.

Is Zelda: Twilight Princess as difficult as Ninja Gaiden: Sigma? No. It's no easier than Ratchet & Clank or even Halo on medium settings.

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If it improves gameplay then it has to be more than purely marketing. You'd probably say that the Wii-mote improves gameplay whereas I think it hinders it and I would say it's a marketing gimmick so I guess it's subjective too.

When did I say the gameplay itself was marketing? It is the "OMG THE ARMY USES IT IT'S SO REAL" nonsense that is just marketing.

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I agree with you that it would look pretty bad on the Wii but doesn't that mean the Wii doesn't do it for you?

Doesn't do what for me? Play a game I'd rather play on a PC than any console?

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You want to play the Orange Box but it's not available for whatever reason and yet it is for the 360 and PS3.

It's on the PC, which is superior for FPS gaming than the 360 or PS3.

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If software defines a platform then a lack of certain extremely popular games has implications for the platform itself if for whatever reason, it cannot deliver what is needed for the content.

I am sure that if Valve really wanted to they could make a decent version of HL2 for the Wii. But there's no real reason for them to. The reason they won't involve themselves in a Wii version is the same reason they bothered to make inferior versions for the PS3 and 360… money. There isn't a big market for FPS games on the Wii.

There is for the 360/PS3, and I don't understand it. FPS games without a mouse/keyboard combination are baffling.
proud resident of a failed state
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proud resident of a failed state
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post #162 of 165
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Originally Posted by filburt View Post

Thanks to BRAVIA TVs, Sony's stock is actually doing decent, even immediately after said fiascoes. Then again, if it weren't for Blu-Ray (I think PS3 would be at least as successful as Xbox 360 otherwise), memory stick, rootkit, exploding battery, etc., Sony would be doing very well.

I'm no stock player, but last time I checked they were still a sell. For example, this is from Business Wire:

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Sony Struggles with PlayStation 3

We believe Sony Corp. (NYSE: SNE) will continue to struggle as it faces competition from innovative digital products and struggles to ramp production of PlayStation 3. In addition, Sony is facing increasing competition from low-cost manufacturers in Asia as the consumer market slows. We therefore maintain a Sell recommendation on SNE shares set a new $42.50 price target.

Sony is currently banking on its next-generation game console, PlayStation 3 (PS3), to drive its video game business. However, an overly complex design and high price tag resulted in long delays and a slow uptake by the market. We believe Sony has significantly damaged its position in the video game market and has lost substantial ground to Nintendo. Although the company has reduced the price by $100, the PS3 costs far more than the Xbox 360 or Wii game consoles.

Although Sony maintains strong distribution channels and a brand name, we would avoid the stock until the company demonstrates sustainable improvements in results. Our new price target reflects a P/E multiple of approximately 15.6x our estimated fiscal 2007 EPADR of $2.73 and 14.0x our estimated fiscal 2007 EPADR of $3.03, which we believe is a reasonable valuation for a company in Sony's position.

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Originally Posted by groverat View Post

FPS games without a mouse/keyboard combination are baffling.

Gospel. I tried Halo/Halo 2 on my younger brother's Xbox. I just didn't see the attraction, I guess when a console is all you've got you think that type of FPS is good.
You need skeptics, especially when the science gets very big and monolithic. -James Lovelock
The Story of Stuff
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You need skeptics, especially when the science gets very big and monolithic. -James Lovelock
The Story of Stuff
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post #163 of 165
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Originally Posted by groverat View Post

Then I see the sales numbers. Anecdotal and hard evidence show that the Wii is selling better and is more popular.

What difference does that make? This isn't about sales numbers.

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Originally Posted by groverat View Post

What numbers show the 360 ahead?
Who said the Wii was "wiping the floor" with the 360? (It is wiping the floor with the PS3.)

http://www.vgchartz.com/

Wii in America 7.27 million
360 in America 9.43 million

Japan dramatically skews the stats. Like I say, it's not really meaningful to apply buying trends across vastly different cultures. And again, it's not about sales numbers.

Yes the PS3 isn't selling well no matter how you look at it but this was never about Wii vs PS3.

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Originally Posted by groverat View Post

It is extremely surprising given that they actually profit from every Wii sale. That rumor is beyond stupid and I am not surprised at all that you believe it. (Wii rainchecks)

http://www.gamesindustry.biz/content_page.php?aid=23825

How can it be beyond stupid if a major retailer rep is making the assessment based on his purchasing? I think he'd have more of an idea about it than you would.

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Originally Posted by groverat View Post

PSP? Nintendo dominates the handheld side. Keep trying.

Sure but the PSP is still a far better product and delivers a far better gaming experience.

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Originally Posted by groverat View Post

Which company is making the most profit off of their game products? Keep trying.

They're right. It's unfortunate that they actually lose money on the console, then, isn't it?

You say this like it's a good thing. People do the same thing with Apple. They're making money so that means they are better. I'm concerned about the quality of product that I get not the profit margins of the company. If a company sells me old hardware wrapped up to look like new hardware then I'm not going to be dumb enough to pay the same price for it.

Would I pay the same price this year for an iMac that is slower than last year's? No. Would I pay for a Wii which costs close to a proper next-gen console but whose games look worse than a PS2? No.

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Originally Posted by groverat View Post

Doesn't do what for me? Play a game I'd rather play on a PC than any console?

Why would you rather play it on a PC? Is the Wii not very good for FPS games? I thought this was supposed to be one of the selling points of the Wii-mote.

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Originally Posted by groverat

It's on the PC, which is superior for FPS gaming than the 360 or PS3.

That's your opinion too. I would personally agree but I know 2 people who own 360s and they've completed the Orange Box and Splinter Cell games on the highest difficulty and they don't like the PC controls.

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Originally Posted by groverat

I am sure that if Valve really wanted to they could make a decent version of HL2 for the Wii. But there's no real reason for them to. The reason they won't involve themselves in a Wii version is the same reason they bothered to make inferior versions for the PS3 and 360… money. There isn't a big market for FPS games on the Wii.

There is for the 360/PS3, and I don't understand it. FPS games without a mouse/keyboard combination are baffling.

The reason FPS games are popular on the 360/PS3 is because it's a different market. That's what I'm saying. The Wii is really meant for children or inexperienced gamers who don't really get any benefit out of playing an FPS title. Likewise, FPS gamers don't get the same enjoyment out of games like Mario or Zelda.

Just look at the top 20 or so games for each console (count the Mario ones):

PS3:
The Elder Scrolls IV: Oblivion\tRole-Playing
The Orange Box\tSci-Fi First-Person Shooter
Rock Band\tRhythm / Music
Assassin's Creed\tHistoric Action Adventure
Call of Duty 4: Modern Warfare\tModern First-Person Shooter
Ninja Gaiden Sigma\tFantasy Action Adventure
Tom Clancy's Rainbow Six Vegas\tModern Tactical Shooter
Resistance: Fall of Man\tModern First-Person Shooter
FIFA Soccer 08\tSoccer Sim
NBA 2K8\tBasketball Sim
DiRT\tRally / Offroad Racing
NHL 08\tIce Hockey
Warhawk\tSci-Fi Shooter
Tom Clancy's Ghost Recon Advanced Warfighter 2\tModern Tactical Shooter
Madden NFL 08\tFootball Sim
The Darkness\tModern First-Person Shooter
Tekken 5: Dark Resurrection\t3D Fighting
NHL 2K7\tIce Hockey Sim
MLB 07: The Show\tBaseball Sim
Virtua Tennis 3 Tennis sim

Wii:
Super Mario Galaxy\t3D Platformer
Resident Evil 4: Wii Edition\tHorror Action Adventure
WarioWare: Smooth Moves\tParty Game
Paper Mario\tRole-Playing
The Legend of Zelda: Ocarina of Time\tFantasy Action Adventure
Super Paper Mario\t3D Platformer
The Legend of Zelda: Twilight Princess\tFantasy Action Adventure
Zack & Wiki: Quest for Barbaros' Treasure\tAdventure
Metroid Prime 3: Corruption\tSci-Fi First-Person Shooter
Super Metroid\t2D Platformer
Mercury Meltdown Revolution\tPuzzle
Super Mario World\t2D Platformer
The Legend of Zelda: A Link to the Past\tAction Role-Playing
Madden NFL 07\tFootball Sim
Super Mario Bros.\t2D Platformer
Super Monkey Ball: Banana Blitz\tParty Game
Gunstar Heroes\tShoot-'Em-Up
Trauma Center: New Blood\tAction
Medal of Honor Heroes 2\tHistoric First-Person Shooter
Alien Soldier\t2D Platformer

XBox360:
Gears of War\tSci-Fi Shooter
The Elder Scrolls IV: Oblivion\tRole-Playing
The Orange Box\tSci-Fi First-Person Shooter
Halo 3\tSci-Fi First-Person Shooter
Forza Motorsport 2\tGT / Street Racing
Tom Clancy's Ghost Recon Advanced Warfighter\tModern Tactical Shooter
Tom Clancy's Rainbow Six Vegas\tModern Tactical Shooter
Rock Band\tRhythm / Music
Assassin's Creed\tHistoric Action Adventure
Call of Duty 4: Modern Warfare\tModern First-Person Shooter
Puzzle Quest: Challenge of the Warlords\tPuzzle
BioShock\tSci-Fi First-Person Shooter
Perfect Dark Zero\tSci-Fi First-Person Shooter
Guitar Hero II\tRhythm / Music
Call of Duty 3\tHistoric First-Person Shooter
Burnout Revenge\tRacing
Dead or Alive 4\t3D Fighting
Project Gotham Racing 3\tGT / Street Racing
Call of Duty 2\tHistoric First-Person Shooter
Command & Conquer 3 Tiberium Wars\tSci-Fi Real-Time Strategy
Tom Clancy's Ghost Recon Advanced Warfighter 2\tModern Tactical Shooter

Men shoot, fight, race and play sport so the PS3 and 360 satisfy.
The Wii is for people who like fantasy and relaxed party games.

There is some overlap but the distinction is very clear that the PS3 and 360 are in direct competition and the Wii is in another market altogether.
post #164 of 165
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Originally Posted by iPoster View Post

I'm no stock player, but last time I checked they were still a sell. For example, this is from Business Wire:

Do we have to quote an analyst's opinion on AppleInsider? Let's just look at the facts. Take a look at Sony's stock performance. While it is not doing very well, it isn't doing anywhere near as poorly as the earlier graph suggests. I know the graph was in good fun, but like Microsoft, Sony is a giant and PS3 represents just a fraction of their revenue.

I have a Wii, so naturally I am biased toward Nintendo. But it's not be-all of gaming console. For my gaming needs, Wii suits me better than PS3 and Xbox 360. But at the same time, I would love for it to be capable of outputting lush 720p graphics over HDMI. But in the end, games are all that matter to me and my family prefer to play Wii games.
post #165 of 165
I've got a Wii and a PS3 (I've also got a PS2). I use the PS3 primarily for movies as it fits in the nook where my TV is above my fireplace really well. I have one game for it (Oblivion) and I'm dying to get my hands on Little big Planet.

My Wii is every bit as much fun now as the day I bought it. My wife and older son play it as well and they both love it. If anything, I'd hope that a future version allows DVD playback and or higher resolution output. I'm more than happy with the evolutionary upgrade to the overall hardware as opposed to the revolution that Sony is trying to usher in.

The Wii delivers exactly what it promises and that's why I like it. A year in I'm still a huge fan.
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