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Sources: MacBook Air battery replacements take only minutes - Page 5

post #161 of 221
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

It'll be cheaper than that. A new Apple battery is $129 (all Mac batteries) and those are much denser. Id est, more expensive to produce. I'd expect a 3rd-party product to be under $100.

I was saying they should include a kit with extra options, which would cost them more, and they could make some money off of it too.
post #162 of 221
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

.

Good God man... all you do is flame.
I think we would all like to see you offer up your own opinions and sentiments, instead of your incessant flaming rhetorical remarks.
post #163 of 221
Quote:
Originally Posted by rain View Post

Good God man... all you do is flame.
I think we would all like to see you offer up your own opinions and sentiments, instead of your incessant flaming rhetorical remarks.

Who exactly have I flamed?
I don't see how I could become more opinionated than I already am.
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post #164 of 221
Quote:
Originally Posted by Haggar View Post

Is Apple responsible for damage caused by people upgrading memory or hard drive in a Mac laptop? Or PCI Express cards in a Mac Pro? Is Apple responsible for damage caused by end users installing any of those parts since they all require opening the computer?

Hmm... Good question. I don't know the specifics for that. I'd say that notebook memory is protected from the motherboard, but I can't say that for PCIe cards.
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post #165 of 221
Quote:
Originally Posted by rain View Post

Good God man... all you do is flame.
I think we would all like to see you offer up your own opinions and sentiments, instead of your incessant flaming rhetorical remarks.

He didn't flame anybody. Look at his post as an example of how to debate WITHOUT flaming.

Compare that to the numerous people calling names and insults - who may or may not ever notice that their posts are unceremoniously deleted.
--Johnny
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post #166 of 221
A bit off topic, but this crowd may appreciate some of the movies below as possible rentals. I am fan of these type films and haven't seen even half of them..... yet.

The Top 50 Dystopian Movies Of All Time
Quote:
Originally Posted by lundy View Post

He didn't flame anybody. Look at his post as an example of how to debate WITHOUT flaming.

Compare that to the numerous people calling names and insults - who may or may not ever notice that their posts are unceremoniously deleted.

Thanks, Lundy.
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post #167 of 221
Quote:
Originally Posted by lundy View Post

He didn't flame anybody. Look at his post as an example of how to debate WITHOUT flaming.

Compare that to the numerous people calling names and insults - who may or may not ever notice that their posts are unceremoniously deleted.

good maybe you can delete 135 where i am referred to as the "dumbest " person
just joking, don't care, you develop a thick skin in sports message boards quickly ... and when you go to techie areas they are refreshingly civil ... in comparison of course
post #168 of 221
Quote:
Originally Posted by stevetim View Post

good maybe you can delete 135 where i am referred to as the "dumbest " person

I'm not sure if it's a blanket statement or you are referring to me, but for what it's worth, I didn't call you dumb.
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post #169 of 221
Quote:
can't argue with the facts.

I wish you'd use some.


Quote:
can't argue with the facts. i'm not saying they will trash your computer.

No, you said:

Quote:
"warn(s) you that they MAY trash you harddrive and its not their fault when they replace your battery."

What Apple really says:

"Will the data on my MacBook Air be preserved?

Don't rely on it being preserved. Many repairs require Apple to replace or reformat the hard disk, which will result in the loss of your data. Please make sure you back up your data on a regular basis to minimize your data loss. .Mac members may download and use Backup to save an archive of their data to a series of CDs. Apple and its AASPs are not responsible for any damage to or loss of any applications, data, or other information stored on your MacBook Air while performing service."


A common sense approach to sending in any computer for repair. Why wouldn't somebody back up their hard drive on a regular basis, and especially when sending it in for repair? And I don't think you should *have* to be warned, but only who would not heed such common sense advice. Business people with sensitive data would presumably swap out a drive (in the case of MBs) use an external drive, or erase the data or drive. And you actually offered facts as facts there, though you had to spin them.

But as anyone can see, you chose to characterize Apple as trashing the hard drive. You have some obvious biases. You offer specious arguments further tainted with your bias:

Quote:
... but I seldom flame. . . Rich yuppies who can afford to go to starbucks 4 times a week? Who wants this?


In this or another AI thread (they all begin to sound alike after awhile) somebody posted that the complaints seem to be coming from those who were expecting more and didn't get what they wanted, and for the most part failed to consider who this might be aimed at. That seems to be the case. There is more flame than fact, little heat, and anybody who doesn't have something bad to say about the MBA must be an Applefanboyorgirl.

There has not been a product made that makes everybody happy, and some will complain just because they think it makes them "special" and they can pretend they actually have some geek-fu. The truth is much of this is just venting, and has little merit.

Most "Jobs made a bad decision- this is lame; will never sell" are just "He didn't do what I wanted, and I KNOW BEST!!"

My *opinion*: The MBA won't sell like the iPod. Nothing sells like the iPod, not even the iPhone. But I predict it will sell well enough that Apple won't drop it, and that you detractors will have to admit it did much better than you thought ( but you probably won't).

Like the ATV, Jobs saw a future, a market in the MBA. And remember the ATV isn't new and improved. He tossed it out there to a giant focus group. Then unchanged except for forthcoming software, it has a new lease. Same form factor, no additional fabrication costs, just a software update, and agreements with movie studios. It was never gone.

People are quick to flame and even when proven wrong will resort to saying things like "...only rich/stupid/yuppies/fill-in-the-blank people will buy it..."

Maybe Diogenes should have been looking for somebody with objectivity.
post #170 of 221
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacGui View Post

Maybe Diogenes should have been looking for somebody with objectivity.

He was retasked last month to look for the xMac...
post #171 of 221
i stand by what i said ... they MAY trash your harddrive ... my language is less harsh than apple that says MANY repairs require apple to replace and format the harddrive. Please remember we are talking about battery replacement here ... not a mother board switch out. My point is if they had user replaceable batteries they would not have to have the nasty weasle words.

the question about the yuppies and the power exec was an innocent probing question trying to figure out the market and who may buy this. another poster and I have even made some light hearted jokes about the post.
I have an open mind and i was asking for opinion ... because I admit I don't get this machine any more than i got apple tv take one. I did not mean to offend. I am disagreeing, but would hardly call my comments flaming ... please. Some poster said i am the "dumbest". at least i never resort to personal attacks, come on ... to call what I do flaming is a stretch.

I agree with your assessment of the product that apple won't drop it and make it better ... yet it is important for apple to know what we think is good and bad about it. And I have stated good things which are significant 1. it looks great ... 2 great keyboard ... 3 nice and light ... 4. great looking monitor ... 5. sort of green ... well done. But apple please don't stop there.

On the appletv ... actually i think you do have to buy a new one to take advantage of the new computer less features ... so i believe it is a new product ... but don't know for sure.

and finally i did not say only rich/stupid/yuppies etc will buy it. I was asking who is buying it and threw out some target groups who I think may. come on don't put words in my mouth. are we so politically correct that I am offending when I ask if yuppies will buy it.

I love your final slam about my lack of objectivity. why is it when someone who only says good things about the product and someone who says good and bad about the product is the less objective. sorry that dog don't hunt.
post #172 of 221
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

I'm not sure if it's a blanket statement or you are referring to me, but for what it's worth, I didn't call you dumb.

I know you didn't. I have no issues with your posts
post #173 of 221
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marvin View Post

$129 seems expensive and at first you might think that Apple are forcing people to pay up more by sealing the battery in. But looking at PC laptop batteries, they cost around the same, sometimes more so it's not an overpriced replacement.

Apple is not selling the MacBook Air battery without the replacement service. So for all we know, the battery could be $89 with a $40 installation fee.
post #174 of 221
Hello. Let me start with my basic opinion on the MacBook Air. While it does compromise on many features, it is still an extremely attractive (in concept, not just appearance) machine. I wouldn't replace my MacBook with it as it is my primary computer, however if I had a desktop at home (and could afford one!) I would definitely buy a MacBook Air. It's portability would be perfect for what I typically use my laptop for and I wouldn't miss any of compromised features (remember, this is assuming I have a desktop).

Now my responses to various other posts:

Quote:
Originally Posted by stevetim View Post

The reality is it doesn't take minutes it takes 5 days. And what if I am in a factory doing a photo or video shoot and I have no AC and no battery replacement.

Pathetic decision by apple. If the MacBook and MacBook Air was same price I would still buy the macbook that is plenty portable.

I have to agree with others who have responded to this. If you know your job requires a replaceable battery, then this obviously isn't the laptop for you. Also, if you are a serious photographer / videographer you would likely benefit from a more powerful computer anyway.


Quote:
Originally Posted by roustabout View Post

In my line of work, the other mistake Apple has made is to not include an integrated ethernet port. My laptop is a work box, and I frequently am using it because I need to troubleshoot a network outage. So I need to be able to plug into a switch port, end of story.

Same goes for this comment... if that is a feature you depend on, then get a laptop with an ethernet port. This obviously wasn't designed to perform that job.


Quote:
Originally Posted by joshmtx View Post

A couple of points to make:
Does Apple do focus groups, questionaires and listen to their buyers? I can't imagine being asked, "Would you like to be able to replace the battery easily?" and answering, "No, I want to have to send my laptop away."

No, but perhaps they would ask such questions as "Have you ever replaced your laptop battery?". I know I personally have not, and from the sound of things many others on this forum have never needed to do so either. (I own a MacBook... bought it the day it came out. I also owned a PowerBook before that and a Gateway laptop before that. Never replaced the battery in any of the machines).


Quote:
Originally Posted by joshmtx View Post

From Apple's own website:

http://www.apple.com/batteries/notebooks.html

"Long Term Storage
If you dont plan on using your notebook for more than six months, Apple recommends that you remove and store the battery with a 50% charge. If you store a battery when its fully discharged, it could fall into a deep discharge state, which renders it incapable of holding any charge. Conversely, if you store it fully charged for an extended period of time, the battery may experience some loss of battery capacity, meaning it will have a shorter life. Be sure to store the ejected battery at the proper temperature. (See Notebook Temperate Zone.)".

So.. you want to buy an $1799 notebook and store it in the closet for 6+ months? Also, couldn't you use the laptop until the battery is at about a 50% charge and store the whole laptop that way? I know it says to store the ejected battery, but as long as it is at the proper charge and temperature, perhaps it wouldn't matter if it is still inside the notebook.


Quote:
Originally Posted by stevetim View Post

Steve Jobs will come to the convention next year and give his mia culpa and say they didn't listen to us ... which they didn't ... and introduce MacBook Air and Here is "Take Two". It will have ethernet ... another usb ... firewire ... a better core duo processor ... upgradeable memory to 4 gig ... and a replaceable battery all with the SAME footprint and weight.

Sounds to me like you want an upgraded, slimmer profile MacBook rather than a MacBook Air.


Quote:
Originally Posted by bdkennedy1 View Post

A new battery for my MacBook is $99 and I replace it myself. Apple is charging a $30 premium to replace the battery in the MacBook Air. They are taking in $30 for labor.

You seem to be assuming that the same bulky battery that the MacBook uses (which is probably close to the thickness of the MacBook Air by itself..) costs the same as the smaller, probably more efficient battery used by the MacBook Air.


Quote:
Originally Posted by CREB View Post

After reading Apple's own ordering page, and as linked to the Apple MacBook Air ordering page for additional AppleCare (as I purchase AppleCare whenever available):

AppleCare Protection Plan

b. Limitations The Plan does not cover:

(ix) Consumable parts, such as batteries, except in respect of battery coverage under APP for iPod or unless failure has occurred due to a defect in materials and workmanship;

(Please note the emphasis in the quote has been modified.) If you are getting the battery replaced in the first year or two, it is probably safe to assume that you either treated it horribly causing a drastic decrease in performance (and thus do not deserve a free replacement), or the battery was defective.


Quote:
Originally Posted by drblank View Post

I think that Apple should have made this a user replaceable component.... If it HAS to be replaced by a technician, they should have it where a person at the Genius Bar could do it. if it is that easy, all it takes is to do to a nearby Apple Store and have them do it while the person waits.

A computer that is meant for someone that travels shouldn't have to send it in and wait 5 business days.

This is ridiculous. Anyone should be able to go a local Apple Store and have it done.

Sorry Apple, I have to disagree with you guys on this one. Imagine the DHL bills? Wouldn't this reduce Greenhouse gas emissions if the user can get it done locally?

Can we please stop complaining about how long it takes to get this battery replaced until someone has actually gone to an Apple Store to do so? Thanks. Oh, and also, I have used AppleCare's mail-in service multiple times before and I always had my laptop back within 2-3 business days.


Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

While still high for most people's taste, 64GB for $999 is not a very good price.

Try and find a 64GB SSD for less than $999. I couldn't. In fact, I couldn't find one for less than $1200 or so.


Quote:
Originally Posted by stevetim View Post

my point here is that apple potentially has an issue without including the ethernet port. They told me when i was configuring the n station to put an ethernet wire from the station to my mac book to configure some stuff. I told them I did not have the wire. they told me to call back when I do. so I went to work and borrowed the wire and brought it home and the apple tech fixed it. the point is they required me to have the ethernet connection (temporarily) to fix my wireless problem. this will not be a solution that apple tech people will have with the MBP.

This goes back to the fact that the MacBook Air is not intended to be one's ONLY computer. You need another computer to install software from CDs / DVDs so supposedly you have another computer which you could use to configure your Internet connection.
post #175 of 221
Quote:
Originally Posted by tdamon View Post

Try and find a 64GB SSD for less than $999. I couldn't. In fact, I couldn't find one for less than $1200 or so.


I'm on board with your sentiments. I don't know how I made that typing error. I meant to say it was a good price. The cheapest I had found, until yesterday, was $1400 as an OEM upgrade and about $2000 as a standalone purchase. Yesterday, Engadget blogged about a Fugitsu with a 64GB SSD for $887.
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post #176 of 221
Someone earlier wanted to know if anyone had actually ordered the MBA. I had mentioned that 'll be planning to get mine in June. (And Bergermeister - sp? - said he had pre-ordered his).

Well guess what.... while I am procrastinating on my purchase, my wife - who fell in love with the seeming convenience and functionality of this thing the moment she saw it - just went ahead and pre-ordered it. The form factor and weight of this thing is going to be a HUGE hit with women.
post #177 of 221
You state that this is a second machine and also admit you are not buying one. How big is the market for a 2nd machine that costs $3000 plus accessories? We are not talking about a $500 iphone or a $150 ipod here.

this is only going to be successful if the pricepoint/margin they chose matches their estimated sales for their target market. Being in advertising myself ... i just don't see this market. I don't get it. I admit i could be wrong if you read my posts. I also wish the best for apple as I have been a customer even in the early 80's.

Also in the interest of fairness I now see they sell a ethernet dongle that plugs into the usb port ... so good for them to provide at least that. So if you need to you can wire direct to ethernet on the air.
post #178 of 221
Quote:
Originally Posted by stevetim View Post

You state that this is a second machine and also admit you are not buying one. How big is the market for a 2nd machine that costs $3000 plus accessories?

It's surely a lower market than the $1,800 price that most people will be buying it at.
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post #179 of 221
Quote:
Originally Posted by stevetim View Post

You state that this is a second machine and also admit you are not buying one. How big is the market for a 2nd machine that costs $3000 plus accessories? We are not talking about a $500 iphone or a $150 ipod here.

Be fair and use the $1799 price if you are going to argue that it is too expensive, as that is the lowest price point for the MacBook Air.

I know a huge number of people who have both a desktop and a laptop, often a MacBook Pro. If people can afford that, I assume they can afford a MacBook Air, too.

The question is not whether people will pay that much for a second machine... the question is how many people are willing to pay for the smaller form factor over the feature-rich MacBook Pro.
post #180 of 221
Quote:
Originally Posted by stevetim View Post

You state that this is a second machine and also admit you are not buying one. How big is the market for a 2nd machine that costs $3000 plus accessories? We are not talking about a $500 iphone or a $150 ipod here.

this is only going to be successful if the pricepoint/margin they chose matches their estimated sales for their target market. Being in advertising myself ... i just don't see this market. I don't get it. I admit i could be wrong if you read my posts. I also wish the best for apple as I have been a customer even in the early 80's.

Also in the interest of fairness I now see they sell a ethernet dongle that plugs into the usb port ... so good for them to provide at least that. So if you need to you can wire direct to ethernet on the air.

See my post just above yours: FYI, this will be my wife's second machine (she has a 2-year old 15" MBP). It's not like she is rolling in $$, not at all.

And, I have absolutely no idea where you get the idea it's going to be "$3000 plus accessories." She ordered the 1.6/80 ($1699 academic price) + External drive ($99) + USB Ethernet adaptor ($29) + Applecare ($183), or $2010 total.
post #181 of 221
Quote:
Originally Posted by stevetim View Post

good maybe you can delete 135 where i am referred to as the "dumbest " person
just joking, don't care, you develop a thick skin in sports message boards quickly ... and when you go to techie areas they are refreshingly civil ... in comparison of course

I can't scan all the posts. Just hit the report post button and whichever one of us gets to it first will take a look and take the appropriate action.

Members hitting the report button for spam have really helped us take out some of the trash that clutters things up.

Regarding #135, I have no idea to whom he was referring. I just zapped it anyway and gave him a point.
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post #182 of 221
Quote:
Originally Posted by tdamon View Post

Be fair and use the $1799 price if you are going to argue that it is too expensive, as that is the lowest price point for the MacBook Air.

I know a huge number of people who have both a desktop and a laptop, often a MacBook Pro. If people can afford that, I assume they can afford a MacBook Air, too.

The question is not whether people will pay that much for a second machine... the question is how many people are willing to pay for the smaller form factor over the feature-rich MacBook Pro.

ok fine ... same question applies for the 1800 plus accessories. but my guess is the early adopters of this machine would be interested in the harddriveless model even though it has less capacity.

please everyone don't take it personally when i don't think apple does everything right.
post #183 of 221
Quote:
Originally Posted by stevetim View Post

please everyone don't take it personally when i don't think apple does everything right.

What company or person has ever down everything right? I can't imagine anyone here thinking that Apple is perfect or that it's the all signing, all dancing crap of the world*. That comment comes across, to me, as if you are fomenting an argument.


* I just wanted to use a quote from Fight Club.
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post #184 of 221
Quote:
Originally Posted by stevetim View Post

ok fine ... same question applies for the 1800 plus accessories. but my guess is the early adopters of this machine would be interested in the harddriveless model even though it has less capacity.

please everyone don't take it personally when i don't think apple does everything right.

I don't think Apple does everything right, but I think the objections some people haveover MBAir seem to be carried on a bit long, as if Jobs personally kicked their puppy or something.

It's clearly not a power user machine, but that wasn't the point. It would have been nice to have another USB, FW & Eth, but my parent's Compaq notebook is similarly lacking in ports and they really don't miss it. And Apple isn't taking away the MB and MBP models, so I don't see what the problem is. Maybe the MBAir is a bad idea, we won't know. I hope Apple did its homework and set realistic internal expectations.
post #185 of 221
Quote:
Originally Posted by JeffDM View Post

I don't think Apple does everything right, but I think the objections some people haveover MBAir seem to be carried on a bit long, as if Jobs kicked their puppy or something.

HAHA
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post #186 of 221
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

What company or person has ever down everything right? I can't imagine anyone here thinking that Apple is perfect or that it's the all signing, all dancing crap of the world*. That comment comes across, to me, as if you are fomenting an argument.


* I just wanted to use a quote from Fight Club.

i love that show ... ok i;ll quit beating the dead <strike>horse</strike> "dog" and move on to another post
post #187 of 221
Quote:
Originally Posted by stevetim View Post

got to admit that is pricy but cool. i get it now.

however i would prefer an easy battery exchange, but this is a legitimate alternative when it is available for mba. it puts me to 3500 so price is an issue.

Shop around for a cheaper option, e.g. Battery Geek sell something called Portable Power Station for $250 + $10 for a magsafe cable. 118Wh, not quite as good as 130Wh, but not bad for half the price (this one operates as an extra battery not as a charger replacement, so it's not clear if it will work for the MBA ... maybe in a few days a longer list of options will surface).

On balance, I wonder if this is such a big deal. In my own experience, notebook battery failure has been gradual enough that I could plan replacement if I had to. The one exception: when Apple had a recall for batteries suspect of bursting into flames, which happened a few days before I was due to travel, and I had to take another computer.

If you are willing to wear the extra weight of a spare battery, are you looking for the absolute lightest notebook anyway? On long trips, keeping my hand luggage as light as possible is a win. I've never carried a spare battery. I pace my usage away from power points to the available power in the battery and give up when it runs low. Any extra time from a spare battery would be made up by more time in physio for my back

I am more concerned about the lack of built-in ethernet. Add this to absence of a built-in optical drive, and it means you have only two protocol stacks that you can rely on to restore a corrupted disk: WiFi and USB. I can imagine scenarios where having another would be useful as an extra recovery option.

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post #188 of 221
Quote:
Originally Posted by tdamon View Post

The question is not whether people will pay that much for a second machine... the question is how many people are willing to pay for the smaller form factor over the feature-rich MacBook Pro.

Almost every executive I know? None of my bosses are "power" uses anymore -- that's my job -- they are busy making presentations and traveling to meetings. The MBA is the laptop for them.

This is the simple market distinction I don't understand why people don't get. Power users, those of us doing production, use MBP's; our bosses will use the MBA. Sounds so simple to me.

And about time on Apple's part.
post #189 of 221
Quote:
Originally Posted by philipm View Post

Shop around for a cheaper option, e.g. Battery Geek sell something called Portable Power Station for $250 + $10 for a magsafe cable. 118Wh, not quite as good as 130Wh, but not bad for half the price (this one operates as an extra battery not as a charger replacement, so it's not clear if it will work for the MBA ... maybe in a few days a longer list of options will surface).

On balance, I wonder if this is such a big deal. In my own experience, notebook battery failure has been gradual enough that I could plan replacement if I had to. The one exception: when Apple had a recall for batteries suspect of bursting into flames, which happened a few days before I was due to travel, and I had to take another computer.

If you are willing to wear the extra weight of a spare battery, are you looking for the absolute lightest notebook anyway? On long trips, keeping my hand luggage as light as possible is a win. I've never carried a spare battery. I pace my usage away from power points to the available power in the battery and give up when it runs low. Any extra time from a spare battery would be made up by more time in physio for my back

I am more concerned about the lack of built-in ethernet. Add this to absence of a built-in optical drive, and it means you have only two protocol stacks that you can rely on to restore a corrupted disk: WiFi and USB. I can imagine scenarios where having another would be useful as an extra recovery option.

That is pretty cool. I do hope Apple makes one. $250 is pretty steep and i will need all those ports I'll be paying for.

That battery pack weighs 2.4lbs. That makes it plus a MBA as much as a MBP, but with a whole lot more juice. A solid 12 hours would be a sweet spot for me.
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post #190 of 221
no doubt it is very sexy laptop, which I also would like to be my next laptop, but still I feel that the lack of optical drive may keep flocks of people away from it. and I hope that in near future Apple is planning to bring cd drive on it.

Sachin
post #191 of 221
I agree with your about the business men and woman needing this. I also think that it is almost an unfinished product pushed out the door. The revision that may come down the line will make this a sweeter deal, plus the price drops on SSD
post #192 of 221
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryanr14 View Post

I agree with your about the business men and woman needing this. I also think that it is almost an unfinished product pushed out the door. The revision that may come down the line will make this a sweeter deal, plus the price drops on SSD

most of those business execs will be forced to get a windows based computer ... remember we hear that apple has anywhere between 4 to 8% market share. A vista bootcamp requires at least 20 gigs ... How much room does it leave on your mac ... Not sure this will work for the high end or even low end business user because their IT geeks have mad bad decisions (my opinion) in making windows the operating system.
post #193 of 221
Quote:
Originally Posted by stevetim View Post

most of those business execs will be forced to get a windows based computer ... remember we hear that apple has anywhere between 4 to 8% market share. A vista bootcamp requires at least 20 gigs ... How much room does it leave on your mac ... Not sure this will work for the high end or even low end business user because their IT geeks have mad bad decisions (my opinion) in making windows the operating system.

Oh no! Something else we disagree on.

I don't think Windows is a bad decision, though I do think it's a bad operating system. If a company goes in with OS X they are stuck using Apple's hardware. There is no alternative! There are no longer 3rd-party vendors supplying OS X on their hardware. While I much prefer Macs I don't think I would choose Macs for most medium to large companies if I were running it.

How big is Vista. The smallest Boot Camp partition is 5GB, but a defualt build of OS X is quite hefty, though one can remove many things to thin it out. E.g.: Language files, printer drivers, iLife apps (GarageBand loops), and localization files.
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post #194 of 221
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

Oh no! Something else we disagree on.

I don't think Windows is a bad decision, though I do think it's a bad operating system. If a company goes in with OS X they are stuck using Apple's hardware. There is no alternative! There are no longer 3rd-party vendors supplying OS X on their hardware. While I much prefer Macs I don't think I would choose Macs for most medium to large companies if I were running it.

How big is Vista. The smallest Boot Camp partition is 5GB, but a defualt build of OS X is quite hefty, though one can remove many things to thin it out. E.g.: Language files, printer drivers, iLife apps (GarageBand loops), and localization files.

On your first point obviously more people will agree with you than me. The 92% windows vs 8% mac is proof (i know those numbers are wrong and i'm generalizing). Yet I think the security reasons and potential productivity enhancement alone are worth switching. I cross platform my word/excel documents with 99.9% success.

On the second issue people should know that with vista you are required to have 20 gig bootcamp partition. I tried to do 5 and it wouldn't let me. They would let me do 5 for XP.

However you really need more than the 20 gigs ... I'm just giving the minimum in the interest of fairness. I'd say Vista is sucking up about 15 gigs on the bootcamp partician of my main mac working computer. I have the home version installed on it right now.
post #195 of 221
Quote:
Originally Posted by GQB View Post

Guess you won't be buying one, then huh?
In case you're interested, you're echoing the same venom we've been hearing since 1984 when DOS users scoffed at the horrible limitations Jobs was 'inflicting' on users with that childish GUI.
The Jobs hatred really does get old after a while, dontcha think?

But welcome!

Its not hatred, not really. To sit there and gloat about how innovative and amazing these products are is kinda goofy though... its kinda like a kind of madness. To characterize me as hating guis is wrong as well. But the capper is again, this product, and its $2500 dollar price tag. All your really buying is a brand.
post #196 of 221
Quote:
Originally Posted by interval View Post

But the capper is again, this product, and its $2500 dollar price tag. All your really buying is a brand.

You've shot over the price by 700 bones. Can you find a better item from another "brand" for less I'm not talking about OS X because that would make it impossible, but hardwar wise.
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post #197 of 221
I think that the MBA bashers are missing an important point ... if the MBA is truly stingier in power consumption and Apple's claims of longest battery life are true, then is an extra battery really necessary? Sure, we know that the TZ advertises 4 hr battery life, but that is if the laptop is just playing back music. Most laptops have batteries that last about 2 hours ... if the MBA actually lasts 4 or 5 hours, isn't Apple in fact already including an extra battery in the cost of the MBA without adding any extra weight? Considering that a transcontinental flight is probably less than 5 hours of usable flight time (including subtracting time for serving drinks, stowing time during takeoff and landings, and perhaps a short nap time), if the MBA can run 4 to 5 hours continuously, it will fulfill most needs for most business travelers - even ones who "work" for most of the flight. (Believe me, I fly a ton for business, and I rarely see anyone with their laptop open the whole flight working ... maybe part-time working, and part-time watching movies.) For all of those people talking about carrying an extra battery for their laptop, are they just saying this as a status symbol? Are they saying that they should actually be carrying two or three batteries to meet their needs with their current laptops?

How about an internal DVD player? Well, you all do realize that the DVD laser is one of the biggest power consumers in a laptop don't you? If you are so concerned about getting work done on a transcontinental flight, what the heck do you want a power-draining DVD player in your laptop for?

The FW debate is similar. People want to talk about being able to edit video, but the MBA comes with a hard drive limited by space (the 80GB is the largest currently offered in the 1.8" form factor), that is also a relatively slow speed. That means that to be useful, the portable actually needs TWO FW ports unless you have actually tried to capture video in a daisy-chained configuration that rarely works with the consumer, 4-pin, non-powered version of FW.

The MBA is a beautiful machine that I lust after, but I am not ashamed to admit that it is out of my price range. It was built for executives (any coincidence that Jobs chose the name Macbook Air with the initials MBA?) who on those long overseas flights CAN afford to get the seats with Empower connections? Considering their attention to detail, I suspect that Apple looked at their replaceable battery sales and figured that rather than trying to drain another $100+ out of consumers, if they simply made a laptop that could actually last a whole flight, they would have very little market for user-replaceable batteries. I do know that Apple was ridiculed for not having a replaceable battery on the iPod because people were comparing it to MP3 players that used AA or AAA batteries that WOULD die because the manufacturers spent more time on figuring out ways to swap batteries than on how to preserve power.
post #198 of 221
Quote:
Originally Posted by elehcdn View Post

I think that the MBA bashers are missing an important point ... if the MBA is truly stingier in power consumption and Apple's claims of longest battery life are true, then is an extra battery really necessary? Sure, we know that the TZ advertises 4 hr battery life, but that is if the laptop is just playing back music. Most laptops have batteries that last about 2 hours ... if the MBA actually lasts 4 or 5 hours, isn't Apple in fact already including an extra battery in the cost of the MBA without adding any extra weight?

Jobs advertised the MBA as lasting 5 hours with Wi-Fi active. I suspect that you could get quite a bit more if you are using Word in Airplane Mode. We'll surely get a battery of tests once they start shipping.

Most other notebooks advertise their battery life at the lowest possible power usage settings and often advertise their weight without the battery. Apple didn't say it had the longest battery life as there are ultra-portable notebook with double that of the MBA, unless you mean of any Mac portable. There is also no extra battery in that cost. Based on the image on the internals and the thinness I suspect the battery is about 70% of a MacBook's battery size.

As I mentioned before, I'd like an external battery for my MBA to get me a full 12 hours for international flights. But I have doubts that will be coming anytime soon.
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post #199 of 221
Quote:
Originally Posted by stevetim View Post

ok fine ... same question applies for the 1800 plus accessories. but my guess is the early adopters of this machine would be interested in the harddriveless model even though it has less capacity.

please everyone don't take it personally when i don't think apple does everything right.

How was I 'taking it personally'..? Did I sound offended to you? I shouldn't have. I was just pointing out the fallacies in your logic.

Quote:
Originally Posted by k squared View Post

Almost every executive I know? None of my bosses are "power" uses anymore -- that's my job -- they are busy making presentations and traveling to meetings. The MBA is the laptop for them.

This is the simple market distinction I don't understand why people don't get. Power users, those of us doing production, use MBP's; our bosses will use the MBA. Sounds so simple to me.

And about time on Apple's part.

Interesting point. Just to be clear, I wasn't suggesting earlier that people WOULDN'T pay for the smaller form factor, but that the form factor is the reason for the price. Therefore, the success of the MacBook Air depends on people's willingness to pay for the 'thinnovation'.

BTW, I think one of the writers at TUAW did an excellent bit on the MacBook Air that is appropriate for this forum: Analysis: What the MacBook Air is and what it isn't
post #200 of 221
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

Jobs advertised the MBA as lasting 5 hours with Wi-Fi active. I suspect that you could get quite a bit more if you are using Word in Airplane Mode. We'll surely get a battery of tests once they start shipping.

Most other notebooks advertise their battery life at the lowest possible power usage settings and often advertise their weight without the battery. Apple didn't say it had the longest battery life as there are ultra-portable notebook with double that of the MBA, unless you mean of any Mac portable. There is also no extra battery in that cost. Based on the image on the internals and the thinness I suspect the battery is about 70% of a MacBook's battery size.

As I mentioned before, I'd like an external battery for my MBA to get me a full 12 hours for international flights. But I have doubts that will be coming anytime soon.

There are ultra-portable notebooks with 10 hours of battery life? When I look at http://www.pcworld.com/article/123867-1/article.html most of the portables are listed between 4 and 6 hours just playing back video. Not sure how much usable time that actually calculates out to when you are actually working, but based on the iPod battery life, I would suspect that the MBA would probably outlast most of them. My point about the "extra" battery was that in real usable time, it would be much like you would already have an extra battery because the life would be longer than the other laptops.

If you are flying for business on international flights with a real need to work 12 hours and not getting seats with Empower ports, then your company is really failing you. Still, your need is at least somewhat unusual, and is probably best addressed with an external battery. For tooling around town, I certainly would think that 5+ hours between charges would usually have me leaving any spare battery in the office or at home.
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