AppleInsider › Forums › Mac Hardware › Current Mac Hardware › How the MacBook Air stacks up against other ultra-light notebooks
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

How the MacBook Air stacks up against other ultra-light notebooks - Page 2

post #41 of 142
1/22/08 at 8:45am
Quote:
Originally Posted by JeffDM View Post

Actually it is, because that assumes you can get to a working outlet, on the airplane or at the airport. I've never been on an airplane that had a working power jack. One airport lobby I was at had four accessible jacks for about every 100 seats.

That is why i always take THIS with me. They usually only have 2 or 4 outlets and they are usually maxed out.
Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
Reply
Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
Reply
post #42 of 142
1/22/08 at 9:07am
Quote:
Originally Posted by JeffDM View Post

"up to" should mean that it should be possible to achieve that. That's why I'd like stronger truth in advertising laws. If no one can get more than 3 hours in the most battery optimized settings, then claiming "up to 6 hours" is unethical.

It is truth in advertising.

As Apple, and I defy anybody to find a reference to another manufacturer's site that explains it better, states in its 'legal' declaration, that "Battery life depends on configuration and use.(1)" And goes on to explain what that may mean.

One important consideration to understand is, "Apple batteries share the characteristics common to lithium-based technology found in other devices." In other words, they are all in the same boat. The difference is the hogability of the OS, utilities and programs being run, as well as the settings that are available to optimize the consumption. Even how you store your laptop is a major factor (2).

Unfortunately, most of us will not even open the pages to see how we should treat our laptop, and for sure, never comply with the directions if we had. Never mind that Apple has set a link, i.e., "Remind me to charge and discharge my notebook battery" to your iCal, to remind you to "Exercise Your Machine."

One thing for sure, Apple does not do or hides, is the fact that most of those who claim 8-10+ hours battery life was achieved using your computer to play MP3 files.

(1) http://www.apple.com/ca/batteries/
(2) http://www.apple.com/ca/batteries/notebooks.html
(3) webcal://www.apple.com/images/notebook_icalreminder.ics
Reply
Reply
post #43 of 142
1/22/08 at 9:07am
To me, the most important feature of the MacBook Air is OS X. If I could run OS X on my Sony TX, I might not even consider the MBA. Ok, the deathly slow performance of the TX (on certain functions) and the iffy keyboard that doesn't always register when I hit a key, make it less than a joy to use. But it's certainly a joy to carry.

I've owned a variety of subnotebooks over the years, and never been very satisfied with any of them. There was the HP with the non-backlit screen and PC Card storage -- and the goofy pop-out mouse. I never did any real computing with that one. Then there was the almost-pocket-sized Toshiba, which came with Windows 95, but I upgraded to NT. It was quirky and darn close to useless. I think I reached the zenith of my insanity when I paid $2000 for that one. I currently have the first Toshiba Portege tablet, which was always flaky as a tablet, but works find as small (but heavy) notebook. And finally there's the Sony Vaio TX that's remarkably small and full-featured. I do use it a lot, but it's often worth the extra weight to haul my MacBook Pro.

The specs on the MBA really aren't what I wanted, but I think I could learn to love it. I will probably wait until the first "bump" update before I buy one. I really want the SSD, but don't want to pay the huge premium since the prices will probably fall pretty quickly.

BTW, another light subnotebook that wasn't listed in the table is the current Toshiba Portege (500?), which is very thin and light, and is a decent performer. Still, no OS X, and lightly built. There's always compromise in this corner of the market.
Reply
Reply
post #44 of 142
1/22/08 at 9:15am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Abster2core View Post

It is truth in advertising.

I'll call it truth in weaseltising. Notebook runtimes are useless numbers as given because tests from all makers do not reflect actual use, it might not even reflect actual batteries. It's possible that Apple pulled the best battery and mated it with the lowest consuming CPU of the lot to get those numbers. I've set my notebook to Apple's recommended settings, left the thing idle (not even playing music) and it still does not get close to Apple's numbers. The battery got cycled more often than Apple recommends as well.

Quote:
As Apple, and I defy anybody to find a reference to another manufacturer's site that explains it better, states in its 'legal' declaration, that "Battery life depends on configuration and use.(1)" And goes on to explain what that may mean.

I didn't say anyone else is better at it. I don't think it's acceptable to excuse Apple Just because other makers do the same thing.
Reply
Reply
post #45 of 142
1/22/08 at 9:22am
[QUOTE=JeffDM;1203746][QUOTE=NYCMacFan;1203741]Not sure on this. Doesn't an SSD with an 1.8hertz processor consume the same power as a HDD with 1.6hertz. I was thinking it was comparable, but not sure. Would stink if 5 hours was a quote for SSD with 1.6hertz though
Quote:

You can buy the SSD with the 1.6GHz version too.

Yeah, as I noted, that would stink and be fear. If that was quoted at say 5 hours it means that all other setups would be worse powerwise.
Reply
Reply
post #46 of 142
1/22/08 at 9:37am
How can the 13" 1280x800 screen of the MBA beat out the 11" 1366x768 of the Asus U1F, resolution is what matters, that's what decides how much you can fit on the scree, not the size, plus smaller is better, so the Asus is better now matter how you look at it.

And why isn't any of the powerfull ultra portables in the comparison, like the Acer Ferrari and the Asus Lambo, they both are more powerfull than the MBA in most ways. And I realise this is an Apple fan site, but listing MacOS as superior to Vista is a little fanboyish.
Reply
Reply
post #47 of 142
1/22/08 at 9:44am
[QUOTE=NYCMacFan;1203789][QUOTE=JeffDM;1203746]
Quote:
Originally Posted by NYCMacFan View Post

Not sure on this. Doesn't an SSD with an 1.8hertz processor consume the same power as a HDD with 1.6hertz. I was thinking it was comparable, but not sure. Would stink if 5 hours was a quote for SSD with 1.6hertz though


Yeah, as I noted, that would stink and be fear. If that was quoted at say 5 hours it means that all other setups would be worse powerwise.

OK, I missed the last line, so I can see your point. All I can say is we'll have to wait until the MacWorld test.
Reply
Reply
post #48 of 142
1/22/08 at 9:45am
Quote:
Originally Posted by JeffDM View Post

I'll call it truth in weaseltising. Notebook runtimes are useless numbers as given because tests from all makers do not reflect actual use.

Virtually impossible. As one once involved in pharmaceutical industry, setting up a protocol to reflect actual use is one thing. To ensure that all the configurations reflect actual usage is another.

If anything, Apple would be able to comply with the second condition better because their products and its components are so tightly standardized and regulated. As a result, Try to find two identical PCs that satisfy the majority would be impossible.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JeffDM View Post

I didn't say anyone else is better at it. I don't think it's acceptable to excuse Apple Just because other makers do the same thing.

I didn't say that you did. However, I can find it acceptable why manufacturers can't explain beyond the fact that battery life depends on configuration and use. Afterall, they rely on other third-party manufactures for their batteries and everybody uses their computers differently. Besides the affects that one OS has over another, applications, e.g., Microsoft Word consumes power differently on different PCs and different Macs.
Reply
Reply
post #49 of 142
1/22/08 at 9:56am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hansii View Post

And why isn't any of the powerfull ultra portables in the comparison, like the Acer Ferrari and the Asus Lambo, they both are more powerfull than the MBA in most ways. And I realise this is an Apple fan site, but listing MacOS as superior to Vista is a little fanboyish.

Please supply link. Aren't these machines like 6 and a half pounds?
Reply
Reply
post #50 of 142
1/22/08 at 9:56am
Quote:
Originally Posted by JeffDM View Post

"up to" should mean that it should be possible to achieve that. That's why I'd like stronger truth in advertising laws. If no one can get more than 3 hours in the most battery optimized settings, then claiming "up to 6 hours" is unethical.

Its true. The other thing that would be nice is if you had some agreed upon specification or test that all manufacturers can meet. Unlikely to happen, but it would give you a comparative sense of how a laptop performs. The torture tests they use are nice as they give you a good worst case scenario for the battery life.

Assuming you had the SSD and then had bluetooth and airport off, I'd expect the MBA would have to be closer to the advertised specs. The only variable/excess drain on the battery would be if the processor is working hard. All other parts of the computer are a constant (no HDD or optical drive that drain it faster).
Reply
Reply
post #51 of 142
1/22/08 at 9:58am
I'm surprised everyone finds the 13.3" screen to be a good thing. I'd prefer an 11" screen like that asus, if I'm trying to get as portable as possible it's screen size should be considered to be part of it's overall footprint.
Quote:
Originally Posted by appleinsider vBulletin Message

You have been banned for the following reason:
Three personal attacks in one post. Congratulations.
Date the ban will be lifted:...
Reply
Quote:
Originally Posted by appleinsider vBulletin Message

You have been banned for the following reason:
Three personal attacks in one post. Congratulations.
Date the ban will be lifted:...
Reply
post #52 of 142
1/22/08 at 10:05am
Quote:
Originally Posted by ecking View Post

I'm surprised everyone finds the 13.3" screen to be a good thing. I'd prefer an 11" screen like that asus, if I'm trying to get as portable as possible it's screen size should be considered to be part of it's overall footprint.

Hard on the eyes. Also bear in mind that 13.3 widescreen = 12 inch in 4:3 and similarly 12 widescreen is like 11 inch in 4:3 aspect ratio.
Reply
Reply
post #53 of 142
1/22/08 at 10:09am
Quote:
•\tThe X61s has a Thickness of 0.8 to 1.1 inches by comparison to the alleged 0.16 to 0.76 of the Air. (However, even a superficial inspection of the photographs shows that the advertised “0.16in” thickness is only at the VERY front of the machine. It very quickly increases to approx 0.5” thickness and then tapers to its full thickness of 0.76”)...

I was wondering when someone would make that observation. The Air is a spectacular design exercise aimed at reducing the appearance of size and weight. Surfaces taper underneath until they're out of sight at the point where they meet the resting platform or base, coming as close to optical illusion as is possible in industrial design. But the computer is not 0.16" thick at its leading edge, any more than the original apple portable (see below) would be if it had been designed with a 0.16" lip projecting around its perimeter. Someone needs to place a metal ruler across the top front of the Air and measure the distance from the surface the computer is sitting on: THAT is the thickness. Ditto for the rear. This exercise won't change the light weight of the computer, and won't diminish the gorgeous, successful design. But it'll have us dealing with reality and I'm all for that.

Disclaimer: I'm all "for" the Air, too: My brother's bought one. I might. But let's keep the discussions rational.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:M...h_portable.jpg
Reply
Reply
post #54 of 142
1/22/08 at 10:15am
The Air looks great to me. I'm considering it.
Personally I'll miss out a FireWire port since most of my disks and audio card is FW. The USB protocol seems to draw more power and CPU and generate more heat in previous Mac notebooks, compared to the FireWire ports.
Reply
Reply
post #55 of 142
1/22/08 at 10:15am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Abster2core View Post

Please supply link. Aren't these machines like 6 and a half pounds?

Acer Ferrari: 3.7lb
http://shopping.yahoo.com/p:Acer%20F...NlYwNiZ3NpYg--

Lamborghini VX1: 5.3lb
http://shopping.yahoo.com/p:ASUS%20L...NlYwNiZ3NpYg--
Reply
Reply
post #56 of 142
1/22/08 at 10:18am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hansii View Post

How can the 13" 1280x800 screen of the MBA beat out the 11" 1366x768 of the Asus U1F, resolution is what matters, that's what decides how much you can fit on the scree, not the size, plus smaller is better, so the Asus is better now matter how you look at it.

So ppi is the only thing to look at when choosing a computer? it wasn't long ago that 1024x768 was the limit for 15" displays, and people were happy with that.

Quote:
And why isn't any of the powerfull ultra portables in the comparison, like the Acer Ferrari and the Asus Lambo, they both are more powerfull than the MBA in most ways. And I realise this is an Apple fan site, but listing MacOS as superior to Vista is a little fanboyish.

The functionality and usability of the operating system is a major consideration. First time Mac users may be drawn to the aesthetics, but it's the operating system that wins them over. I can't imagine there are many people buying macs just to install Windows on them.

Listing computers whose selling point is that they are painted to match an Italian car doesn't make any sense to me.


Quote:
Originally Posted by ecking View Post

I'm surprised everyone finds the 13.3" screen to be a good thing. I'd prefer an 11" screen like that asus, if I'm trying to get as portable as possible it's screen size should be considered to be part of it's overall footprint.

As NYCMacFan said, it's not just about the size, it's about a size size and reduced performance WHILE still being a useful machine. There is no one machine to fit everyone here. Some people would rather have a UMPC with a 5" screen while others would prefer their 17" notebook with multiple batteries. To each their own.
Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
Reply
Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
Reply
post #57 of 142
1/22/08 at 10:19am
Quote:
Originally Posted by RonHurley View Post

\tThe X61 is 2.2 narrower (10.6 v 12.8) and 0.6 (8.3v 8.9) shallower than the Air, resulting in a 30% smaller footprint overall. This smaller footprint is quite important when one uses a laptop on airplanes etc

I've used my 17" MBP on economy flights. The width is of little issue even though my laptop extends over the edges. The depth and height are the primary gotchas as both are related. When the person in front of you is fully upright I don't have significant problems even with my MBP. When the seat is reclined at all there is a problem with the top of the screen getting crunched by the seat.

An economy tray is about 16.5" x 9". The MBA should have no problems with use on an airplane.

Does anyone have problems with using a MB in an airline seat?

Does anyone seriously use a X61s with a mouse on an airline tray? That's still a tight fit even with 2 extra inches.

Quote:
\tThe weight of the X61s is 2.75 lbs, i.e. lighter by a smidgen than the 3lbs Air

With the slimline battery.

Quote:
While the Macbook Air is certainly an interesting product, it is more evolutionary than revolutionary. Anybody that travels with a Subnotebook will tell you that the Footprint (for use on Planes etc.) and Weight (for carrying purposes) are AS if not MORE important than Thickness, which appears to be the main Promotion focus of the Air. Other factors are just as important (IMHO)

Yeah. Like how my Keynote presentations look a heck of lot better than your Powerpoint presentations on the X61s...otherwise the Thinkpads are great. I've owned several and I considered the tablet version recently but decided nah.

Thinness isn't the only promotion focus of the Air. Its also that it runs OSX Leopard...arguably the best desktop OS on the market. And that it looks damn good doing so.

If you don't think looks matter, try giving your next presentation in ratty jeans and a t-shirt.
Reply
Reply
post #58 of 142
1/22/08 at 10:20am
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

That is why i always take THIS with me. They usually only have 2 or 4 outlets and they are usually maxed out.

You rock. I've never seen these before. With a toddler at home, I don't get to travel much these days, but I do frequent coffee shops, and often run into the same problem there. I'm so buying one!
Reply
Reply
post #59 of 142
1/22/08 at 10:24am
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

The functionality and usability of the operating system is a major consideration. First time Mac users may be drawn to the aesthetics, but it's the operating system that wins them over. I can't imagine there are many people buying macs just to install Windows on them.

This thread is not about operating systems, but I do think that Mac OS is objectively better (and that is the general reaction of people like Mossberg at WSJ or CNET types). I use both windows and mac daily. I find that the mac OS is:
-faster in booting up
-seems less sluggish when using same processor and ram
-more stable
-easier to use, more intuitive
-possesses more handy features I appreciate
-naturally less prone to spyware and ads

This is not trivial as it is a major reason why I am looking to the MBA. I also favor Apple's elegant design and what I consider to be higher build quality. So I am a little ticked off on the MBA execution, but leaning toward buying as the jump from 3 to 5lbs just seems like a lot of additional weight to me.
Reply
Reply
post #60 of 142
1/22/08 at 10:24am
Quote:
Originally Posted by djames42 View Post

You rock. I've never seen these before. With a toddler at home, I don't get to travel much these days, but I do frequent coffee shops, and often run into the same problem there. I'm so buying one!

I feel like an idiot...I've never even looked for a mini powerstrip even when I've thought to myself "gee, I wish I had a powerstrip...". Thanks. That's a nice tip.
Reply
Reply
post #61 of 142
1/22/08 at 10:24am
Quote:
The X61s has a Thickness of 0.8 to 1.1 inches by comparison to the alleged 0.16 to 0.76 of the Air. (However, even a superficial inspection of the photographs shows that the advertised “0.16in” thickness is only at the VERY front of the machine. It very quickly increases to approx 0.5” thickness and then tapers to its full thickness of 0.76”)

I'm not so sure what's alleged about its size. You make it sound as if their is some deception. In the keynote presentation Steve described it has going from .16 to .76, front to back. You make it sound as if you discovered some secret that refutes the Air being thinner than its competitors.
Reply
Reply
post #62 of 142
1/22/08 at 10:25am
Quote:
Originally Posted by NYCMacFan View Post

Hard on the eyes. Also bear in mind that 13.3 widescreen = 12 inch in 4:3 and similarly 12 widescreen is like 11 inch in 4:3 aspect ratio.

Being 4:3 the Asus will have more screen area. Can you, or anyone, figure out the math to determine the ppi of both machines?
Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
Reply
Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
Reply
post #63 of 142
1/22/08 at 10:25am
Quote:
Originally Posted by RonHurley View Post

As an owner of both an iMac 24 2.8GHz and Macbook Pro 17, I also find the Macbook Air to be an interesting product. One that I want to take a good look at when its actually released

However, in the interests of accuracy (and at the risk of being flamed) I feel its important to post ACCURATE comparison data with other Subnotebooks. I feel that the total Focus on Thickness to be disingenuous

I use a Thinkpad X61s for Business Travel and the article above would be better served by comparing the Macbook Air against that. It would have thrown up a far more interesting comparison than the numbers quoted. For example

\tThe X61s has a 31Whr battery compared to the 37Whr battery in the Air (16% less)
\tThe X61s has a Thickness of 0.8 to 1.1 inches by comparison to the alleged 0.16 to 0.76 of the Air. (However, even a superficial inspection of the photographs shows that the advertised 0.16in thickness is only at the VERY front of the machine. It very quickly increases to approx 0.5 thickness and then tapers to its full thickness of 0.76)
\tThe X61 is 2.2 narrower (10.6 v 12.8) and 0.6 (8.3v 8.9) shallower than the Air, resulting in a 30% smaller footprint overall. This smaller footprint is quite important when one uses a laptop on airplanes etc
\tThe weight of the X61s is 2.75 lbs, i.e. lighter by a smidgen than the 3lbs Air
\tThe Hard Drives available are 120Gb and 160Gb and spin at 7,200rpm, as opposed to the slower 4,200rpm of the 80Gb Hard Drive in the Air. This will have an impact on performance
\tThe X61s comes with 1Gb Ram and this can easily and cheaply be upgraded to 2Gb and 4Gb
\tThe 5 Hour Battery Life quoted for the Air is with the Solid State drive. It will be interesting to see what the battery life is under real world conditions with the spinning hard drive
\tYou can also use a 73Whr battery ($130) with the X61s, adding 1 to the overall depth, but still only 0.5 (9.3 v 8.9) deeper than the Air. The weight now becomes 3.2lbs, a smidgen heavier than the Air. This takes the battery life out to Eight hours and the machine will still have a smaller footprint than the Air
\tThe screen on the X61s is 1.5 narrower (9.7 v 11.2) than the Air, but 0.25 taller than the Air. Obviously, this is due to the 4:3 profile
\tThe Air does have 30% more pixels than the X61s (1024 by 768 versus 1280 by 800 for the Air)
\tBoth the Air and X61s have Full Size Keyboards and Full Size keys. The Key Travel on the X61s is the full 5mm that you get on a desktop keyboard

While the Macbook Air is certainly an interesting product, it is more evolutionary than revolutionary. Anybody that travels with a Subnotebook will tell you that the Footprint (for use on Planes etc.) and Weight (for carrying purposes) are AS if not MORE important than Thickness, which appears to be the main Promotion focus of the Air. Other factors are just as important (IMHO)

Flame suit on!!!

No need for flame suit. Well written and informative. Question is, what is the actual target market for the MacBook Air? Maybe it is not the business traveler? If not who, the consumer? If the consumer, what makes it attractive to the consumer?
just waiting to be included in one of Apple's target markets.
Don't get me wrong, I like the flat panel iMac, actually own an iMac, and I like the Mac mini, but...........
Reply
just waiting to be included in one of Apple's target markets.
Don't get me wrong, I like the flat panel iMac, actually own an iMac, and I like the Mac mini, but...........
Reply
post #64 of 142
1/22/08 at 10:26am
Quote:
Originally Posted by TenoBell View Post

I'm not so sure what's alleged about its size. You make it sound as if their is some deception. In the keynote presentation Steve described it has going from .16 to .76. And described that as thinner than every other ultra-light.

I'd trade .2 inches for 1inch taken from both sides of the keyboard (0.5 per side) and say another .5 from the bottom.

Again, at this point, I am just in wait and see mode to hear about the first tests of it, especially sound and battery life.
Reply
Reply
post #65 of 142
1/22/08 at 10:30am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Abster2core View Post

Please supply link. Aren't these machines like 6 and a half pounds?

I tried but Acer's website is a trainwreck and the Asus site isn't great either, plus I don't think the Asus Lambo is for sale yet, but the basic specs of the Ferrari is 4 lbs, 2.3Ghz AMD X2, up to 4GB memory, 250GB HDD standard, virtual sorround speakers, optional internal DVD. And it includes a lot of Ferrari branded stuff, like leather bag, bluetooth mouse, etc. But it does cost about as much as the MBA with SSD.
Reply
Reply
post #66 of 142
1/22/08 at 10:33am
Quote:
Originally Posted by vinea View Post

I feel like an idiot...I've never even looked for a mini powerstrip even when I've thought to myself "gee, I wish I had a powerstrip...". Thanks. That's a nice tip.

Quote:
Originally Posted by djames42 View Post

You rock. I've never seen these before. With a toddler at home, I don't get to travel much these days, but I do frequent coffee shops, and often run into the same problem there. I'm so buying one!

It's the only thing by Monster I've ever considered buying and well worth it.
Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
Reply
Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
Reply
post #67 of 142
1/22/08 at 10:35am
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

That is why i always take THIS with me. They usually only have 2 or 4 outlets and they are usually maxed out.

I probably should get something like that, though not one with the Monster name. Monster is what you get when you dress up scum and villainy in business suits.
Reply
Reply
post #68 of 142
1/22/08 at 10:35am
Quote:
Originally Posted by NYCMacFan View Post

This thread is not about operating systems, but I do think that Mac OS is objectively better (and that is the general reaction of people like Mossberg at WSJ or CNET types). I use both windows and mac daily. I find that the mac OS is:
-faster in booting up
-seems less sluggish when using same processor and ram
-more stable
-easier to use, more intuitive
-possesses more handy features I appreciate
-naturally less prone to spyware and ads

This is not trivial as it is a major reason why I am looking to the MBA. I also favor Apple's elegant design and what I consider to be higher build quality. So I am a little ticked off on the MBA execution, but leaning toward buying as the jump from 3 to 5lbs just seems like a lot of additional weight to me.

Both Vista and Leopard are great operating systems, when it comes to personal taste I prefer Vista, there are so many design decision that makes working on a Mac real tedious to me and I find the whole OS very cluttered and messy in design, so if I buy an MBA, the first thing I will do is install Vista.
Reply
Reply
post #69 of 142
1/22/08 at 10:38am
Quote:
Originally Posted by JeffDM View Post

Acer Ferrari: 3.7lb
http://shopping.yahoo.com/p:Acer%20F...NlYwNiZ3NpYg--

Lamborghini VX1: 5.3lb
http://shopping.yahoo.com/p:ASUS%20L...NlYwNiZ3NpYg--

Thanks, but the Asus Lambo I was thinking about was the one announced at CES, it's 12" I believe, the one you linked to is 15"
Reply
Reply
post #70 of 142
1/22/08 at 10:42am
What about the Toshiba offerings?
Matyoroy!
Reply
Matyoroy!
Reply
post #71 of 142
1/22/08 at 10:43am
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

Being 4:3 the Asus will have more screen area. Can you, or anyone, figure out the math to determine the ppi of both machines?

I didn't do the math, but I did do it in a CAD file that I keep.

12.1" in 4:3 is about 70.3 in^2

13.3" in 16:10 is about 79.5 in^2.

The 16:10 13.3" is almost as tall as the 12" 4:3 but wider.
Reply
Reply
post #72 of 142
1/22/08 at 10:50am
Quote:
Originally Posted by vinea View Post

I've used my 17" MBP on economy flights.........When the seat is reclined at all there is a problem with the top of the screen getting crunched by the seat.

Does anyone seriously use a X61s with a mouse on an airline tray?

With the slimline battery.

Like how my Keynote presentations look a heck of lot better than your Powerpoint presentations on the X61s

Just to deal with some of your points in turn

I've also used my 17" Macbook on long and short flights and it is positively an issue when the person in front reclines their seat, which just about everybody in Economy does (if they are sane!!!)

Why would anyone "use a mouse with an X61s". The Trackpoint is more than fine, as is the Apple Trackpad.

As regards the "Slimline Battery", that is what my earlier post says very specifically. The 31Whr Slimline battery has 16% less available power than the 37WHr Air battery. This battery gives about 160 minutes in real world conditions, longer if Wifi is off and Screen Brightness is turned down. With this Battery installed, the machine weight is 2.75lbs

Using the larger 73Whr battery increases the machine weight to 3.25lbs and the battery life to 7.5 hours, again longer with Wifi off

As regards the capabilities of Keynote and Powerpoint, I'm glad that Keynote meets your needs and it certainly a decently capable product for some presentations. But it still doesn't match Powerpoint for some of the more complicated tasks. MANY reviews of Keynote (including the recent one here on Apple Insider) refers to its limitations, so I won't repeat them here. Keynote is quite capable but don't overstate its relative capabilities
Reply
Reply
post #73 of 142
1/22/08 at 10:52am
Quote:
Originally Posted by JeffDM View Post

The 16:10 13.3" is almost as tall as the 12" 4:3 but wider.

For people who use word, powerpoint and internet surfing, this is very telling. 13.3 inch widescreen actually gives us a touch less usable vertical space. Bummer.
Reply
Reply
post #74 of 142
1/22/08 at 10:53am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hansii View Post

Thanks, but the Asus Lambo I was thinking about was the one announced at CES, it's 12" I believe, the one you linked to is 15"

OK, I didn't know. It took me a bit of digging, the most I can find is that it's called VX3, and it's 3.7lb.
Reply
Reply
post #75 of 142
1/22/08 at 10:54am
It seems unfair that the Dell XPS m1330 was also not considered; it falls in at just under 4lbs, and has a faster processor, more RAM, discrete graphics, integrated optical drive, all the wireless options, larger hard drive, memory card reader, more USB ports, etc...

In my opinion the only reason to go with the MacBook Air would be OS X, which, granted, is a pretty big reason. But if we're going to be comparing notebooks, I think the m1330 should be in the mix too. Just my two cents.
Reply
Reply
post #76 of 142
1/22/08 at 11:01am
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrbofus View Post

It seems unfair that the Dell XPS m1330 was also not considered; it falls in at just under 4lbs, and has a faster processor, more RAM, discrete graphics, integrated optical drive, all the wireless options, larger hard drive, memory card reader, more USB ports, etc...

In my opinion the only reason to go with the MacBook Air would be OS X, which, granted, is a pretty big reason. But if we're going to be comparing notebooks, I think the m1330 should be in the mix too. Just my two cents.

The MacBook Air doesn't fit well into any of the previous categories for light notebooks so I thinkt hey should have showed that. The author looks to have chosen a model from each OEM for comparison. We certainly welcome more comparison here. Feel free to post the specs of the m1330.

Welcome to AI.
Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
Reply
Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
Reply
post #77 of 142
1/22/08 at 11:08am
Ask and you shall recieve.
Since the Fujitsu at 4 lbs was included in this category for comparison, here's a configuration for the just-under 4 lb.
Dell XPS M1330:
3GB (to 4GB) vs. Air's 2GB
nvidia 8400MGS 128MB DDR3 vs. Air's integrated Intel x3100
160GB 7200RPM (320GB 5400RPM +$75, 64GB SSD +$750) vs. Air's 80MB 4200RPM
9-cell 85WHr battery vs. Air's 37Whr
smaller LxW dimensions vs. Air
Same new LED display&resolution, video- audio-out, 1 USB, .11n/BT
Plus: 2nd USB, FW, Enet, HDMI, internal broadband option, slotload DVD burner, ExpressCard, 8-in-1 card reader, audio-in, dual array mics, fingerprint reader

2.2GHz T7500 vs. Air LV Merom Whatever 1.8GHz
$1404 (with SSD: $2154) vs. $2099

So... 1.5x the price for these feeble-in-comparison components buys over a lb. lighter, slimmer, superduper trackpad, camera w/ more MP... and [drumroll] tapered for illusion of even more slimness. Whoopi.
And Leopard (+ iLife). Whew. OK. Not a RDF ripoff.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Apple Insider

Dell and HP both make lighter notebook models, but none are really comparable to the top competitors in the ultralight market; instead, those two companies target the mass market, which hasn't yet started chasing light thin notebooks because of the engineering tradeoffs they require to drop the pounds and millimeters and their commensurate price tags.

What does that mean?
Reply
Reply
post #78 of 142
1/22/08 at 11:09am
Quote:
Originally Posted by zunx View Post

Too large and too heavy all of them. We need a true full handheld and true pocket computer like these (5 inches screen or so), but with FireWire and with full Mac OS X 10.5.1 inside:

OQO e2
http://www.oqo.com/intl

Samsung Ultra Mobile PC Q1
http://www.samsung.com/us/consumer/t...=ultramobilepc

Now it is possible with the new Intel Silverthorne chip. Will Apple deliver or should ou University switch to Windows-Linux?

Amen, brother zunx!!!

Unfortunately, since Apple doesn't offer an ultraportable still, I recently got an OQO E2 and really enjoy using it a lot. Only 1# and fits in a coat pocket, so is truly ultrportable!!

Also, unlike any Apple portables, it gives me the choice inputting via keyboard or by stylus, what a concept, user choice!!!

Also, FWIW, I was very surprised that the comparison chart choices as others have noted. Toshiba should have been listed as they've made 'thin & lights' (which is what I think the MBA is) since way back with the Portege/Dynabook series 7 years ago and the Sony TZ series which is quite thin and light but has more features in a smaller footprint....

Before anyone flames me, I've been a loyal Apple customer since '86 puchasing plenty of Macs; desktop and portable, Newtons, iPods, iPod Touch along with doing some consulting with Apple, and own many shares of Apple stock.....but having said all that I still wish that Apple would release a true ultraportable that allows typing and handwriting input, not just a skinny large laptop with limited features!!!

Also, FWIW, I do think that the MBA is nice for what it is, just that for me it isn't that compelling of a difference from my MB C2D to make me want to get one.

Mark
Posted this from my ultraportable OQO E2....
Mark
Silicone Valley Digerati

MacBook C2D 2.0
PMG4/1.3GHz/OSX
Fujitsu T4010 TPC (work)
OQO E2
iPod Touch 16GB (jailborken)
Sony UX90S (sold)
Sharp Zaurus SL-C3200 (sold)
Reply
Mark
Silicone Valley Digerati

MacBook C2D 2.0
PMG4/1.3GHz/OSX
Fujitsu T4010 TPC (work)
OQO E2
iPod Touch 16GB (jailborken)
Sony UX90S (sold)
Sharp Zaurus SL-C3200 (sold)
Reply
post #79 of 142
1/22/08 at 11:17am
Quote:
Originally Posted by RonHurley View Post

However, in the interests of accuracy (and at the risk of being flamed) I feel its important to post ACCURATE comparison data with other Subnotebooks.
\tThe 5 Hour Battery Life quoted for the Air is with the Solid State drive. It will be interesting to see what the battery life is under real world conditions with the spinning hard drive

As you stated, "in the interests of accuracy" it was with the, "spinning hard drive>"
Reply
Reply
post #80 of 142
1/22/08 at 11:19am
Quote:
Originally Posted by NYCMacFan View Post

For people who use word, powerpoint and internet surfing, this is very telling. 13.3 inch widescreen actually gives us a touch less usable vertical space. Bummer.

It's not much difference, 7.26" vs. 7.05", a difference of about 3%. But the 13.3" is 1.6" or 16% wider.
Reply
Reply
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Current Mac Hardware
AppleInsider › Forums › Mac Hardware › Current Mac Hardware › How the MacBook Air stacks up against other ultra-light notebooks