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Junk Science, (sponsored by) The British Government

post #1 of 62
Thread Starter 
http://www.reuters.com/article/envir...rpc=22&sp=true

Quote:
There is a 25 percent chance that a severe heat wave will strike England and kill more than 6,000 people before 2017 if no action is taken to deal with the health effects of climate change, a report said on Tuesday.

The report for Britain's Department of Health estimated more than 3,000 people could die in an intense summer hot spell in southeast England, with just as many more dying from heat-related deaths over the summer.

So in other words, there is a 75% chance that prediction is flat wrong. Of course, like all hysterical climate change predictions, it falsely claims a cause-effect relationship between "climate change" and the 2003 heat wave, then extrapolates what could happen if such a heat wave happened again.

If there is another heat wave, it will surely be attributed to global warming. If there isn't, well no worries, it will be "coming soon!"

This, despite the following:

http://ibdeditorial.com/IBDArticles....87279412587175

Quote:
Back in 1991, before Al Gore first shouted that the Earth was in the balance, the Danish Meteorological Institute released a study using data that went back centuries that showed that global temperatures closely tracked solar cycles.
To many, those data were convincing. Now, Canadian scientists are seeking additional funding for more and better "eyes" with which to observe our sun, which has a bigger impact on Earth's climate than all the tailpipes and smokestacks on our planet combined.

And they're worried about global cooling, not warming....

...Solar activity fluctuates in an 11-year cycle. But so far in this cycle, the sun has been disturbingly quiet. The lack of increased activity could signal the beginning of what is known as a Maunder Minimum, an event which occurs every couple of centuries and can last as long as a century.

Such an event occurred in the 17th century. The observation of sunspots showed extraordinarily low levels of magnetism on the sun, with little or no 11-year cycle...R. Timothy Patterson, professor of geology and director of the Ottawa-Carleton Geoscience Center of Canada's Carleton University, says that "CO2 variations show little correlation with our planet's climate on long, medium and even short time scales."

Rather, he says, "I and the first-class scientists I work with are consistently finding excellent correlations between the regular fluctuations of the sun and earthly climate. This is not surprising. The sun and the stars are the ultimate source of energy on this planet."

...

Let the "Global Warming is Settled Science" chant begin. Free protest signs with this message printed on them will be handed out at your local pub, payed for by your tax dollars.
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post #2 of 62
Whose evaluation is it that it's junk science? I wouldn't necessarily assume that no government scientists could produce junk science, but I'd like to see more than just your personal opinion that it is, especially when your personal, non-scientific opinion about this topic is that all the science is junk science.
post #3 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by SDW2001 View Post

http://www.reuters.com/article/envir...rpc=22&sp=true

So in other words, there is a 75% chance that prediction is flat wrong. Of course, like all hysterical climate change predictions, it falsely claims a cause-effect relationship between "climate change" and the 2003 heat wave, then extrapolates what could happen if such a heat wave happened again.

If there is another heat wave, it will surely be attributed to global warming. If there isn't, well no worries, it will be "coming soon!"

This, despite the following:

http://ibdeditorial.com/IBDArticles....87279412587175

Let the "Global Warming is Settled Science" chant begin. Free protest signs with this message printed on them will be handed out at your local pub, payed for by your tax dollars.

I do not work for, and have no associations with, Investor's Business Daily Editorials. Thankfully!

Quote:
Investors Business Daily also carries editorials and columns on topics from "economics and government to politics and culture". Its editorials generally take a conservative to libertarian stance, and have been popular with conservative and libertarian bloggers. It carries columns from writers "On The Left and On The Right", including L. Brent Bozell, Richard Cohen, E. J. Dionne, Victor Davis Hanson, Charles Krauthammer, and Thomas Sowell. Pulitzer winning cartoonist Michael Ramirez has worked for IBD since late 2005. Investors Business Daily also publishes editorials skeptical about global warming and the proposed solutions to fight climate change.

If my memory serves me, you started a similar thread like this a few months ago, with an IBD editorial to boot!

I particularly like this part;

Quote:
The lack of increased activity could signal the beginning of what is known as a Maunder Minimum, an event which occurs every couple of centuries and can last as long as a century.

The Maunder minimum was localized to the Northern Hemisphere, this sun spot "urban legend" has been shot down so many times, that I've truly lost count.

[CENTER]







[/CENTER]

So a solar researcher seeks funding, boy am I surprised.

SDW10000BC, you really need to crawl out of your cave more often!

[CENTER][/CENTER]
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Every eye fixed itself upon him; with parted lips and bated breath the audience hung upon his words, taking no note of time, rapt in the ghastly fascinations of the tale. NOT!
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post #4 of 62
Yeah you're right. Global warming has nothing to do with emissions. Let's just keep polluting then! Yay! Let's have a pollution party! Let's go get in our Humvees and crash over all thost pussy Priuses and then we'll burn their tires just to show that we can, because it just doesn't effect the climate! Boogie!
post #5 of 62
I would listen to you if your questioning of global warming was scientifically and not politically motivated.
post #6 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by BRussell View Post

Whose evaluation is it that it's junk science? I wouldn't necessarily assume that no government scientists could produce junk science, but I'd like to see more than just your personal opinion that it is, especially when your personal, non-scientific opinion about this topic is that all the science is junk science.

I'll just accept that a 25% chance of a 6000 kill heat wave in the next 10 years is junk science. After all they are trying to predict the weather.

It actually hurts the cause when Governments and NGOs beat the alarmist drum with claims that cannot be proven in fact and have to solid scientific basis. It just give people like SDW2001 more fuel.\
post #7 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by mydo View Post

I'll just accept that a 25% chance of a 6000 kill heat wave in the next 10 years is junk science. After all they are trying to predict the weather.

It actually hurts the cause when Governments and NGOs beat the alarmist drum with claims that cannot be proven in fact and have to solid scientific basis. It just give people like SDW2001 more fuel.\

I doubt you've ever run a numerical model, you clearly don't understand the GCM's, with your one word weather dismissal. Talk about being clueless.

And before you dismiss the Health effects of climate change in the UK 2008: an update of the Department of Health report 2001/2002 reports as "junk science" based on seven short paragraphs in a MSM news feed, and a fundamentally flawed and incorrect editorial from the usual wingnut suspects, perhaps you should hold off on your flippant commentary, TYVM.
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post #8 of 62
Do not start a thread where franksargent can go research crazy on you.

You will regret it.

post #9 of 62
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by franksargent View Post

I do not work for, and have no associations with, Investor's Business Daily Editorials. Thankfully!



If my memory serves me, you started a similar thread like this a few months ago, with an IBD editorial to boot!

I particularly like this part;



The Maunder minimum was localized to the Northern Hemisphere, this sun spot "urban legend" has been shot down so many times, that I've truly lost count.

[CENTER]







[/CENTER]

So a solar researcher seeks funding, boy am I surprised.

SDW10000BC, you really need to crawl out of your cave more often!

[CENTER][/CENTER]

Ooohh! Look at the pretty colors!
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post #10 of 62
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by franksargent View Post

I doubt you've ever run a numerical model, you clearly don't understand the GCM's, with your one word weather dismissal. Talk about being clueless.

And before you dismiss the Health effects of climate change in the UK 2008: an update of the Department of Health report 2001/2002 reports as "junk science" based on seven short paragraphs in a MSM news feed, and a fundamentally flawed and incorrect editorial from the usual wingnut suspects, perhaps you should hold off on your flippant commentary, TYVM.

"Health effects of climate change in the UK 2008"

What climate change would that be exactly? Really, I'm asking.
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post #11 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by SDW2001 View Post

"Health effects of climate change in the UK 2008"

What climate change would that be exactly? Really, I'm asking.

... I just might have to give it a quick read, you think? Unfortunately, I don't have the time right now, perhaps in the next few days, when I get a chance.

But I tell you what I'll do for you, I'll read it to you at bedtime, I'm quite sure you'll be fast asleep before I finish the first page!
Every eye fixed itself upon him; with parted lips and bated breath the audience hung upon his words, taking no note of time, rapt in the ghastly fascinations of the tale. NOT!
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post #12 of 62
double post
"We've never made the case, or argued the case that somehow Osama bin Laden was directly involved in 9/11. That evidence has never been forthcoming". VP Cheney, 3/29/2006. Interview by Tony Snow
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"We've never made the case, or argued the case that somehow Osama bin Laden was directly involved in 9/11. That evidence has never been forthcoming". VP Cheney, 3/29/2006. Interview by Tony Snow
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post #13 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by SDW2001 View Post

http://www.reuters.com/article/envir...rpc=22&sp=true



So in other words, there is a 75% chance that prediction is flat wrong. Of course, like all hysterical climate change predictions, it falsely claims a cause-effect relationship between "climate change" and the 2003 heat wave, then extrapolates what could happen if such a heat wave happened again.

If there is another heat wave, it will surely be attributed to global warming. If there isn't, well no worries, it will be "coming soon!"

This, despite the following:

http://ibdeditorial.com/IBDArticles....87279412587175

The severe heatwave in Europe in summer 2003 caused the following number of deaths:
France: >14,000, Germany >7,000, UK: >2,000.. for a total of >35,000 excess deaths in a very short period of time, ie some 2 weeks.
A December 2004 article in Nature, which you probably regard as leftwing propaganda, mentioned that "climate change" was a contributing factor.

Quote:
....using a threshold for mean summer temperature that was exceeded in 2003, but in no other year since the start of the instrumental record in 1851, we estimate it is very likely (confidence level >90%)9 that human influence has at least doubled the risk of a heatwave exceeding this threshold magnitude.

The probability of an even more severe hot spell in the UK, causing many thousands of deaths in SE England (the most likely affected area, and the most densely populated region of the British Isles, is a real one. For the UK Government to fund such a study is hardly junk science, especially considering that such an event occurred just 3 and a half years ago. (Sure, that event "only" caused 2000 deaths in the UK, but hey, they were mostly poor or older people who couldn't afford air conditioning, so they didn't really count for much, perhaps?).

It appears that (some) rightwingers are uncomfortable with the notion of human causes of climate change/global warming because to combat this, we might need to act as a global community, and some individual freedoms (such as the divine right to glug gasoline in our glorious V8 engines ad infinitum) might have to be compromised. Oh the pain! My liberal heart, it bleedeth so. Pinning the "irresponsibility" tag firmly on the shoulder of unrestrained jungle law capitalism is such a contentious notion for rightwingers that its not just enough to attack the messenger, as is customary, but also the message itself. Such is the war on science.

Perhaps its not important to undertake studies, SDW, because Muslims couldn't be blamed for those 35,000 dead folk?

You prefer that we unite in the war on science?
"We've never made the case, or argued the case that somehow Osama bin Laden was directly involved in 9/11. That evidence has never been forthcoming". VP Cheney, 3/29/2006. Interview by Tony Snow
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"We've never made the case, or argued the case that somehow Osama bin Laden was directly involved in 9/11. That evidence has never been forthcoming". VP Cheney, 3/29/2006. Interview by Tony Snow
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post #14 of 62
Spot on Sammi,I agree with your analysis completely; and I love your " War on Science" Scarily true. I remember that summer and the shocking number of deaths across Europe, but as you say, hey, they were poor and old.

"Wankers talking about other wankers and wanking." XamaX

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"Wankers talking about other wankers and wanking." XamaX

I'll never get back the time i just wasted reading that post." Miami Craig
" It's like you've achieved some kind of irrelevance zen, or...

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post #15 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by sammi jo View Post

The severe heatwave in Europe in summer 2003 caused the following number of deaths:
France: >14,000, Germany >7,000, UK: >2,000.. for a total of >35,000 excess deaths in a very short period of time, ie some 2 weeks.
A December 2004 article in Nature, which you probably regard as leftwing propaganda, mentioned that "climate change" was a contributing factor.



The probability of an even more severe hot spell in the UK, causing many thousands of deaths in SE England (the most likely affected area, and the most densely populated region of the British Isles, is a real one. For the UK Government to fund such a study is hardly junk science, especially considering that such an event occurred just 3 and a half years ago. (Sure, that event "only" caused 2000 deaths in the UK, but hey, they were mostly poor or older people who couldn't afford air conditioning, so they didn't really count for much, perhaps?).

It appears that (some) rightwingers are uncomfortable with the notion of human causes of climate change/global warming because to combat this, we might need to act as a global community, and some individual freedoms (such as the divine right to glug gasoline in our glorious V8 engines ad infinitum) might have to be compromised. Oh the pain! My liberal heart, it bleedeth so. Pinning the "irresponsibility" tag firmly on the shoulder of unrestrained jungle law capitalism is such a contentious notion for rightwingers that its not just enough to attack the messenger, as is customary, but also the message itself. Such is the war on science.

Perhaps its not important to undertake studies, SDW, because Muslims couldn't be blamed for those 35,000 dead folk?

You prefer that we unite in the war on science?

Thanks for the Nature link SJO, for those that want to get free copy, click on the following link;

Human contribution to the European heatwave of 2003

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post #16 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by franksargent View Post

I doubt you've ever run a numerical model, you clearly don't understand the GCM's, with your one word weather dismissal. Talk about being clueless.

And before you dismiss the Health effects of climate change in the UK 2008: an update of the Department of Health report 2001/2002 reports as "junk science" based on seven short paragraphs in a MSM news feed, and a fundamentally flawed and incorrect editorial from the usual wingnut suspects, perhaps you should hold off on your flippant commentary, TYVM.

I tell ya what. We'll run the next 10 year over again for a hundred times and see of 25% of the runs ends in 6000 deaths. That should generate some good stats.
post #17 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by mydo View Post

I tell ya what. We'll run the next 10 year over again for a hundred times and see of 25% of the runs ends in 6000 deaths. That should generate some good stats.

I can easily see your NOT an engineer, and have never done an engineering design.

In fact, I would estimate a significantly higher probability, than the 25% you seem to enamored too, given current, and future trends in, CO2 emissions and atmospheric GHG's, for your speculative one thousand year simulation.

Of course, the lack of potable fresh water will cause much greater health effects (e. g. mortality rates) than intermittent spells of heat waves at higher latitudes.
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post #18 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by franksargent View Post

Thanks for the Nature link SJO, for those that want to get free copy, click on the following link;

Human contribution to the European heatwave of 2003


Thanks for the online version, I've only read it in lo-tech (print on paper).
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"We've never made the case, or argued the case that somehow Osama bin Laden was directly involved in 9/11. That evidence has never been forthcoming". VP Cheney, 3/29/2006. Interview by Tony Snow
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post #19 of 62
On the case on real science, I thought I'd mention that Titan's surface organics surpass all of the oil reserves on Earth.

Quote:
Saturn's orange moon Titan has hundreds of times more liquid hydrocarbons than all the known oil and natural gas reserves on Earth, according to new data from NASA's Cassini spacecraft. The hydrocarbons rain from the sky, collecting in vast deposits that form lakes and dunes.



Titan Sea and Lake Superior

So, when do we liberate Titan?
post #20 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by franksargent View Post

I can easily see your NOT an engineer, and have never done an engineering design.


I take that as a complement. You honor me sir.

Quote:
Originally Posted by franksargent View Post

In fact, I would estimate a significantly higher probability, than the 25% you seem to enamored too, given current, and future trends in, CO2 emissions and atmospheric GHG's, for your speculative one thousand year simulation.

Of course, the lack of potable fresh water will cause much greater health effects (e. g. mortality rates) than intermittent spells of heat waves at higher latitudes.

Chance is chance. If someone tells me the probability of an event in the next ten years is 0.25 then that means that the average over many repeated runs will be 0.25. There's no two ways about it.

Oh and BTW it's not a thousand year simulation. It's 100 10 year simulations.
post #21 of 62
I agree with SDW10000BC. If summer here in Utah suddenly became an extended experience of 105º+ weather and winters either were more like this unending nightmare of snow or were, say, much warmer and featured no snow, I wouldn't worry. Nothing would really change. We don't need those lakes and stuff, anyway. And those friggin' Meeses can all die of thirst, for all I care. They keep interrupting our Christmas parades like some scene in Northern Exposure. Lazy Meeses oughta find their own damned food.
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post #22 of 62
What do the people in the UK think the people down in Spain or North Africa do in the summer?
post #23 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by mydo View Post

What do the people in the UK think the people down in Spain or North Africa do in the summer?

Yeah!
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post #24 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by mydo View Post

I take that as a complement. You honor me sir.



Chance is chance. If someone tells me the probability of an event in the next ten years is 0.25 then that means that the average over many repeated runs will be 0.25. There's no two ways about it.

Oh and BTW it's not a thousand year simulation. It's 100 10 year simulations.

You're very welcome, we wouldn't want a dangerous individual such as yourself, doing incompetent engineering in the REAL WORLD, now would we?

You can't do repeated simulations, with the REAL WORLD!

In your parallel universe POV, we'd need 100 real Earth's and 100 real Sun's, each with 10 years of real data, from 2008 thru 2017.

Care to enlighten us with more of your all too very real and obvious n00bness?
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post #25 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by midwinter View Post

Yeah!

They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
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They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
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post #26 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by franksargent View Post

Your very welcome...

Christ, we learn the phrase "you're welcome" in kindergarten.
post #27 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by mydo View Post

What do the people in the UK think the people down in Spain or North Africa do in the summer?

You think that the whole world just shrugs and puts on the air con when it gets hot, don't you?

I was in Portugal in the summer five years or so ago when a national emergency was declared: the temperature got to 50º where I was. There were strong winds blowing heat off the Sahara; I remember the sky was full of dust and many people died.

This in a place, like Spain, where people are prepared for ridiculously hot summers.

What do they do when it gets unseasonally hot? They suffer really badly.




I also have to point out it it's pretty callous of you to make light of people's deaths because you want to make a political point.
post #28 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by tonton View Post

Christ, we learn the phrase "you're welcome" in kindergarten.

Thanks, english wasn't my best subject.
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post #29 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hassan i Sabbah View Post

I also have to point out it it's pretty callous of you to make light of people's deaths because you want to make a political point.

I'll have to remember that myself, I guess? \
post #30 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by @_@ Artman View Post

I'll have to remember that myself, I guess? \

Nah... I do that all the time.

I'm just trying to win an argument on the internet by making someone feel guilty for being a bastard.

post #31 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hassan i Sabbah View Post

Nah... I do that all the time.

I'm just trying to win an argument on the internet by making someone feel guilty for being a bastard.


Sometimes and American trying to understand the British can have disastrous results.

I'm just trying to reveal the truth. Doesn't work with this bastard either. I'll just post pictures of cats then...







post #32 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hassan i Sabbah View Post

You think that the whole world just shrugs and puts on the air con when it gets hot, don't you?

I was in Portugal in the summer five years or so ago when a national emergency was declared: the temperature got to 50º where I was. There were strong winds blowing heat off the Sahara; I remember the sky was full of dust and many people died.

This in a place, like Spain, where people are prepared for ridiculously hot summers.

What do they do when it gets unseasonally hot? They suffer really badly.




I also have to point out it it's pretty callous of you to make light of people's deaths because you want to make a political point.

Thank you we agree. While the UK can predict a 25% chance of Armageddon the parts of the work south of there have been dealing with that kind of heat for thousands of years.
post #33 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by mydo View Post

Thank you we agree. While the UK can predict a 25% chance of Armageddon the parts of the work south of there have been dealing with that kind of heat for thousands of years.

Everybody pack up the cars! We're all movin' to MISSISSIPPI!
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post #34 of 62
Dear Mydo.

In Portugal and Spain and France when it gets really, really, unusually hot, people really suffer.

Is this because

a) The Portuguese, Spanish and French are all really gay, much gayer than Americans, whose bodies are unique and different to othe human populations, and who can survive extremes of temperature because they are American and shit

or

b) Actually, fuck B, the same thing happens in America whenever theres a heatwave and theyre not prepared: http://www.slate.com/id/2125572/ and http://www.slate.com/id/2068612/

Just for the record: 50º C is 122º F, of course, and Im sure it gets that hot across the whole of the southern United States all the time and everyones like Well well, hot out today, isnt it?
post #35 of 62
Yes. Exactly my point. We agree. So maybe the UK could focus a little to the south and learn something or realize that other have been dealing with this for centuries.
post #36 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by mydo View Post

Yes. Exactly my point. We agree. So maybe the UK could focus a little to the south and learn something or realize that other have been dealing with this for centuries.

[Ad hom edited out. Called Mydo 'weird.']
post #37 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hassan i Sabbah View Post

[redacted spurious claim about Jesus's mental state]

Oh, come now! Everyone knows it's only going to get hotter! It's even in the name, fer Christ's sake! Global Warming. Not Global Wildandunpredictableshangesinclimateandseverityofi nclementweather.
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post #38 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by midwinter View Post

Everybody pack up the cars! We're all movin' to MISSISSIPPI!

I moved to MS 24+ years ago. I couldn't survive down here without AC.

I came from VT where I grew up poor, lived on the 2nd floor of a flattop, and all we could afford was a few electric fans. And boy, all I can tell you that it was very uncomfortable indoors in that VT flattop in the summertime.

People living at higher latitudes aren't as likely to have AC as people living at lower latitudes. Also people who have lived for thousands of years (or significantly longer periods of time) have become more genetically adapted to their warmer climates, just as people living at higher latitudes have become adapted to their cooler climates.

Case in point, world class long distance (5K through marathon) runners.

Another case in point since I'm of northern european stock, and was a long distance runner in MS, is the term "heat acclimation" which occurs when you train in warm/hot conditions, this takes a few weeks, as your body adjusts and becomes more efficient at dissipating excess heat. Basically you start to sweat less, and while you sweat less, it improves (lowers) your core body temperature (within certain limits) as the sweat evaporating from your body is used more efficiently in cooling your body.

Quote:
When humans move from a cool or temperate environment to a hot, dry desert environment or vice versa, they should spend up to seven days acclimatizing to the change in their environment. This lets the body make internal adjustments (see homeostasis) to compensate for the change in environment conditions. If the acclimatization process is ignored, then the person is at higher risk for heat related injuries (heat stroke, heat cramp, pneumonia).

Now, as should be obvious, this requires training (or continuous exposure) to gain this effect if you are not regularly exposed to continuous high temperatures.

Now let's look at the p = 0.25 number, would any of you board a passenger jet if you were told that it had a 1 in 4 chance of crashing? I know I wouldn't, but I'm sure mydo would, given this person's obvious n00bness.

Now let's look at the field of hydrology, since I'm a Research Hydraulic Engineer, a typical design is p = 0.01 annually, or what is called a one in one hundred year event, a water level, or rainfall event, or a hurricane that, on averege, is expected to occur only ONCE in one hundred years.

Now if we go back to the passenger jet example, and consider each transit (or hop) as an event, and people were told that each passenger jet transit had a p = 0.01 chance of crashing, how many people do you expect would fly passenger jets, excluding mydo of course?

So given that people living at higher latitudes are less likely to have AC (particularly the poor and elderly if they've never experienced excessive heat events regularly in their lifetimes), and must take at least a week to become acclimated, have higher body mass to surface area ratios (on average, see BMI for a simplified definition (e. g. correct units of M/L^2)), and p = 0.25, what do you think is going to happen to a finite set of the total affected population if an extreme event occurs with greater than historical frequencies?

They die prematurely. \
Every eye fixed itself upon him; with parted lips and bated breath the audience hung upon his words, taking no note of time, rapt in the ghastly fascinations of the tale. NOT!
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Every eye fixed itself upon him; with parted lips and bated breath the audience hung upon his words, taking no note of time, rapt in the ghastly fascinations of the tale. NOT!
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post #39 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by franksargent View Post

I moved to MS 24+ years ago. I couldn't survive down here without AC.

Dude, you know you sit there in V'burg and look longingly across the river thinking about how nice it'd be to live in Munnnnnnn-roe.

I lived in Hattiesburg for 4.5 years with no AC at all. Well, we had ONE ancient window unit in one room of the house, but it was so expensive and inefficient that we just never ran it. Cold showers are nice, although really disturbing to be sweating again as soon as you get out.

Anyway, when it got too hot, we'd just pack up ourselves, our families, all our stuff, all the local flora and fauna, all the local industry, all the freeways, all the social problems and crime and just moved to Mydo's house.

And to be honest, and I'm sure Hassan will agree, even northern places like London get horribly, horribly hot in the summer, too, and that even though it may seem that we're comparing apples to oranges, my experience is that sea level = thick air and that concrete and population density will make 30º C in London or 90º in Chicago or 90º in NYC feel like 107º in Vicksburg.
Gangs are not seen as legitimate, because they don't have control over public schools.
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Gangs are not seen as legitimate, because they don't have control over public schools.
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post #40 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by midwinter View Post

Dude, you know you sit there in V'burg and look longingly across the river thinking about how nice it'd be to live in Munnnnnnn-roe.

I lived in Hattiesburg for 4.5 years with no AC at all. Well, we had ONE ancient window unit in one room of the house, but it was so expensive and inefficient that we just never ran it. Cold showers are nice, although really disturbing to be sweating again as soon as you get out.

Anyway, when it got too hot, we'd just pack up ourselves, our families, all our stuff, all the local flora and fauna, all the local industry, all the freeways, all the social problems and crime and just moved to Mydo's house.

And to be honest, and I'm sure Hassan will agree, even northern places like London get horribly, horribly hot in the summer, too, and that even though it may seem that we're comparing apples to oranges, my experience is that sea level = thick air and that concrete and population density will make 30º C in London or 90º in Chicago or 90º in NYC feel like 107º in Vicksburg.

I admire your fortitude living in the south without AC. You mentioned Hattiesburg, did you teach at, or go to, USM?

As to Vicksburg, this past year I've seen several anecdotal examples of "weird" weather;

1) The Canadian Geese usually leave for about a month in August and return in September (I think mainly to exercise their young), this year at one of our ponds at work, the normal population of ~60 nearly doubled,

2) last spring we poured a reinforced concrete slab, we only had one ran day in about a two month period, highly unusual for a MS spring,

3) over the past ~10 years our highest summertime temperatures rarely broke 100º (prior to that time we had 100º+ temps), this past summer we had at least ten 100º+ days,

4) this winter has been unusually mild, I now live in an apartment complex, and the grass this winter where I now live hasn't stopped growing all winter, I've never seen that happen before, and

5) over the years it was very rare to see Robins in February, the norm was always March for their migration, now February is the norm, it's been like that for the past 5-10 years.
Every eye fixed itself upon him; with parted lips and bated breath the audience hung upon his words, taking no note of time, rapt in the ghastly fascinations of the tale. NOT!
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Every eye fixed itself upon him; with parted lips and bated breath the audience hung upon his words, taking no note of time, rapt in the ghastly fascinations of the tale. NOT!
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