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Toshiba rumored to quit HD DVD as Wal-Mart pulls support - Page 5

post #161 of 312
Quote:
Originally Posted by s.metcalf View Post

Well as far as M$ being in the HD-DVD camp, I'm pleased that they've lost! I mean...Blu-Ray is a sexier name anyway...who came up with HD-DVD anyway...gold medal for creativity there, sounds like something from the nerd patrol at MicroShite.

It is less creative, but it's also a more logical association with non-technical masses who are familiar with the term DVD and HD, in reference to TVs. If I had to choose the nomenclature I'd have gone with HD-DVD despite Blu-ray's obvious "cool" factor.
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post #162 of 312
I agree. 'HD-DVD' may be a tad boring as names go, but it tells you exactly what it is, and in a way that even a mainstream, very non-technical person can get.

'Blu-ray' is a lot more esoteric, most ppl have no idea that a blue laser is involved or why it's important.

Going forward, if it were me, I'd re-name Blu-Ray to 'Blu-Ray HD' or somesuch.


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post #163 of 312
Quote:
Originally Posted by Royboy View Post

What do you mean! Sure the consumer decided. Retailers offered both formats. The consumers bought more Blu Ray than HD. 2 competing formats fought it out in the marketplace and the major of consumers voted with their dollars that they wanted Blu Ray over HD. I don't remember anyone being held hostage until they bought a Blu Ray. I bought neither.

Give me a break. The consumers didn't decide anything. Besides the Blue Ray player that was included with the Sony PS3, hardly any stand alone players were even sold. Fact is, far more HD players were sold as stand alone units then Blue Ray players. Do a Google search, the margin was something like 4 HD players for every 1 Blue Ray player. Granted, the PS3 made the numbers seem lopsided in the other direction. Strange really, as hardly anybody I know has used the DVD player build in the PS2 as their DVD player. People buy games systems to play games, not watch video. Including the Blue Ray players in Sony PS3s to determine total amount of players sold is kindof like including cell phones in the sale of MP3 players to suggest Nokia is really the most successful maker of music players. If anything, the Blue Ray player is just a mere afterthought in a consumer's decison to buy the PS3.

Moreover, even with the PS3 sales included, the number of Blueray players in the wild is peanuts compared to standard DVD players. Certainly, not enough to decide the victor considering the sales of HD content is almost relatively non existent compared to typical DVD sales (again do a Google search).

Make no mistake, studios and retailors decided the victor. Consumers will inadvertently support whatever format is hand feed to them because they eventually will not have a choice. Most consumers are to ignorant to know the difference. Here big studios were paid big dollars to support a particular format. Do a Google search, recently both Fox and Warner were paid hundreds of millions of dollars to go with Blue Ray. Consumers are not going to buy into a format that doesn't have any content.

Which brings us to my next point. Retailors wanted a winner selected because it cost more money to support multiple formats. They had to buy movies for both formats, stock players for both, and divide advertising costs. Companies like Best Buy, Walmart, Blockbuster, and Netflix could care less what consumers were selecting, as the sales were almost non existent. They merely wanted a winner. They picked the camp with the most studio support. Afterall, they are in the business of selling content.

Blue Ray might have benefits. However, HD for consumers was the more open format. Like everything Sony does, DRM was the primary thought behind Blueray.
post #164 of 312
Quote:
Originally Posted by mdotdubz View Post

I was comparing it to the same reason of why people buy PCs over Macs, they don't know any better. Most, 90%, have never even spent 3 seconds with a Mac.

Same with PS3, most people bought it because they thought "PS2 Successor" and because of all the hype surrounding it. Why do you think PS3 sales fell flat after launch? Because its expensive? No, they dropped the price, it didn't help. People realized that it didn't live up to its promise and looked elsewhere for satisfaction, some bought it because they liked it regardless, others bought it because they were clueless. Overall it definently did not fly off the shelves

PS3 was all hype when it launched, It launched DOA and sales fell flat, and it hasn't gotten any better since. Its still just all hype, nothing more.

PS3 sales are flat because the Blue Ray player was included. The Blue Ray player didn't add enough value to justify an otherwise marginally better gaming platform. I say marginally better because PS3 has more potential then the X-Box, The hardware is more powerful. Sony, however, released its product a year behind Microsoft. Consequently, it will take a while to catch up in terms of games and to refine its performance. Sony also doesn't have the defective hardware problem the X-Box suffers. I honestly doubt the Blue Ray player was a big plus in anybody's mind when buying a PS3. It personally is the reason I haven't bought one. Die hard gamers bought a PS3 despite the Blue Ray player.
post #165 of 312
The main advantage to the Blu-Ray player I saw when buying the PS3 was the storage space for games. For a recent example of this limit being a problem for the X360 see GTA:4 commentary. The developers were (are) quite concerned about the limits of the DL-DVD.
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post #166 of 312
Quote:
Originally Posted by Walter Slocombe View Post

Didn't Bill gates say something similar about not needing more than 640K of RAM ??

No, it was someone else.

And I was referring to the current time period (i.e. this year.) That should've been obvious.
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post #167 of 312
TBell, do you intentionally make your posts hard to read with tons of spelling, grammatical and factual errors? Proofread, spellcheck, edit and above all, check your facts, please. You keep telling people to do Google searches but never cite any websites that back your claims. Everybody knows you can't trust everything you read on the Web, but you don't give us any way to judge the sites you're using to back up your arguments. No reputable websites back your contention that Sony or the BDA paid off Fox or Warner. Your other points are just as shaky.

Besides, when all is said and done, you can rail and rant all you want that it wasn't a fair fight and Sony did this and Sony screwed up, but the simple, undeniable fact of the matter is Blu-ray won. You can type until your fingers are raw and it won't change a blessed thing.
post #168 of 312
Quote:
Originally Posted by TBell View Post

Strange really, as hardly anybody I know has used the DVD player build in the PS2 as their DVD player. People buy games systems to play games, not watch video.

Including the Blue Ray players in Sony PS3s to determine total amount of players sold is kindof like including cell phones in the sale of MP3 players to suggest Nokia is really the most successful maker of music players. If anything, the Blue Ray player is just a mere afterthought in a consumer's decison to buy the PS3.


Wow... really? Because I certainly bought a PS2 as much to have a DVD player as to have a game system. And I'll be buying a PS3 as much to have a Blu-Ray player as to have a game system. Why not? With standalone players priced the way they are, it makes a lot of sense. I'm far from the only person I know who did/is doing the same thing.

*shrug*


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post #169 of 312
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

Have you tried WebKit nightly builds?


Ok, tried WebKit. Same result.

I now officially kick Safari and all things Safari-related to the curb.

Back to Firefox 3 Beta 3.


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post #170 of 312
Quote:
Originally Posted by TBaggins View Post

In an unrelated side note, I've officially GIVEN UP on Safari... it just will NOT let go of memory, and sooner or later I'm hitting the disk and everything gets very slooooooooow. Even quitting or resetting Safari doesn't seem to help much.

And I still, even with 3.0.4, get the occasional crash on top of everything else.

Now running Firefox 3 Beta 3, with no regrets. Sorry Stevie, I gave it every chance... you just didn't deliver.


.

Did you open up the Activity window to see if a particular download was hanging up? Tonight I had problems where it was taking two minutes or more to download individual AppleInsider pages. I opened the Activity window and found Doubleclick was failing to respond. Safari eventually timed out and completed the download. The problem could be Doubleclick not Safari. -- This isn't the first time Doubleclick has caused problems. They just are unable to do their job properly.
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post #171 of 312
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kolchak View Post

Oh, BTW, to anyone who says "downloads are the future," see this article at Macworld. You may or may not get really fat pipes in the future, but it won't be all the data you want anymore. So is it really worth paying for a download from the iTunes store or wherever, paying for the bandwidth and paying for the disk space to store it on or the blank to burn it to rather than just ordering the movie on Blu-ray?

It could be that with really fast pipes, such as what Verison will be serving up in the next few years, with at&t following, we may not need to store anything locally, except for portable viewing, and maybe not even then.

Verison is planning 150Mb/s. They also have upgrade plans for a 1Gb/s speed.

With that, downloading even 1080p with decent compression (or none!) would take under a minute.
post #172 of 312
Quote:
Originally Posted by TBell View Post

Give me a break. The consumers didn't decide anything. Besides the Blue Ray player that was included with the Sony PS3, hardly any stand alone players were even sold. Fact is, far more HD players were sold as stand alone units then Blue Ray players. Do a Google search, the margin was something like 4 HD players for every 1 Blue Ray player. Granted, the PS3 made the numbers seem lopsided in the other direction. Strange really, as hardly anybody I know has used the DVD player build in the PS2 as their DVD player. People buy games systems to play games, not watch video. Including the Blue Ray players in Sony PS3s to determine total amount of players sold is kindof like including cell phones in the sale of MP3 players to suggest Nokia is really the most successful maker of music players. If anything, the Blue Ray player is just a mere afterthought in a consumer's decison to buy the PS3.

Moreover, even with the PS3 sales included, the number of Blueray players in the wild is peanuts compared to standard DVD players. Certainly, not enough to decide the victor considering the sales of HD content is almost relatively non existent compared to typical DVD sales (again do a Google search).

Make no mistake, studios and retailors decided the victor. Consumers will inadvertently support whatever format is hand feed to them because they eventually will not have a choice. Most consumers are to ignorant to know the difference. Here big studios were paid big dollars to support a particular format. Do a Google search, recently both Fox and Warner were paid hundreds of millions of dollars to go with Blue Ray. Consumers are not going to buy into a format that doesn't have any content.

Which brings us to my next point. Retailors wanted a winner selected because it cost more money to support multiple formats. They had to buy movies for both formats, stock players for both, and divide advertising costs. Companies like Best Buy, Walmart, Blockbuster, and Netflix could care less what consumers were selecting, as the sales were almost non existent. They merely wanted a winner. They picked the camp with the most studio support. Afterall, they are in the business of selling content.

Blue Ray might have benefits. However, HD for consumers was the more open format. Like everything Sony does, DRM was the primary thought behind Blueray.

Your numbers are off. The ratio during most of the time up to the last quarter was 2 to 1, not 4 to 1.

But that bgan to change in the holiday season, as BD player sales increased more than Hd-DVD sales did. and that was after Toshiba paid Paramount to stop producing BD disks.

You might say that Toshiba ws the one trying to decide for us.

That BS about Fox and Warner has been debunked so many times already it's not worth mentioning it.

Your second to last paragraph is correct, but then you go and spoil it again with the silliness in the last one.

BD has the same DRM as HD-DVD. Look it up. Both have Managed Copy. that's all that matters. As though most people will want to pay more for extras.
post #173 of 312
Quote:
Originally Posted by TBell View Post

PS3 sales are flat because the Blue Ray player was included. The Blue Ray player didn't add enough value to justify an otherwise marginally better gaming platform. I say marginally better because PS3 has more potential then the X-Box, The hardware is more powerful. Sony, however, released its product a year behind Microsoft. Consequently, it will take a while to catch up in terms of games and to refine its performance. Sony also doesn't have the defective hardware problem the X-Box suffers. I honestly doubt the Blue Ray player was a big plus in anybody's mind when buying a PS3. It personally is the reason I haven't bought one. Die hard gamers bought a PS3 despite the Blue Ray player.

Now that is a really specious argument. If you were to argue that the price of the PS3 was too high in the beginning, and part of that reason was the inclusion of the BD drive, it would make sense.

But please don't try to tell people that the PS3 didn't sell as well as it should have because of BD, the format, as you are implying!

Price, yes. Format, no. Now that the price has dropped to just $50 more than the 360, sales have jumped, and are actually higher than the 360. It's a far better value.

You do know that the BD player plays DVD and CD's as well, don't you? There is no reason for someone who knows what the unit is to not buy it because of it.

Jeez, the game mags, and sites, have explained this very well, ad infinitum.

Sony also has more room to drop prices than MS does, BECAUSE of the newer technology.
post #174 of 312
Quote:
Originally Posted by TBaggins View Post

Ok, tried WebKit. Same result.

I now officially kick Safari and all things Safari-related to the curb.

Back to Firefox 3 Beta 3.


.

There are some issues:

http://arstechnica.com/staff/nate.ar...3-webmail-woes

There is a serious security issue as well, though I can't seem to find the reference right now.
post #175 of 312
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

There are some issues:

http://arstechnica.com/staff/nate.ar...3-webmail-woes

There is a serious security issue as well, though I can't seem to find the reference right now.


That's ok... I don't use YahooMail. I'm a Gmail and Hotmail guy (had the Hotmail acct from before Microsoft bought the company).

And Ars Technica overall really liked Firefox 3.0b3:

I'm extremely impressed with Firefox 3 beta 3. I've been using the nightly builds for quite some time now, and I'm convinced that Firefox 3 is very close to being ready for widespread adoption. There are still a number of minor issues, but I suspect that they will be resolved very soon. Firefox 3 delivers massive improvements over Firefox 2 in almost every conceivable way, particularly in the areas of performance and memory overhead. Users who want to give beta 3 a try can download it from Mozilla's web site.

http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post...-3-beta-3.html

I've just completely given up on Safari... it's so bad that it makes my entire system unresponsive when its futzing up... can't even bring up the Force Quit for the longest time, or anythhing else.

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post #176 of 312
Quote:
Originally Posted by TBaggins View Post

That's ok... I don't use YahooMail. I'm a Gmail and Hotmail guy (had the Hotmail acct from before Microsoft bought the company).

And Ars Technica overall really liked Firefox 3.0b3:

I'm extremely impressed with Firefox 3 beta 3. I've been using the nightly builds for quite some time now, and I'm convinced that Firefox 3 is very close to being ready for widespread adoption. There are still a number of minor issues, but I suspect that they will be resolved very soon. Firefox 3 delivers massive improvements over Firefox 2 in almost every conceivable way, particularly in the areas of performance and memory overhead. Users who want to give beta 3 a try can download it from Mozilla's web site.

http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post...-3-beta-3.html

I've just completely given up on Safari... it's so bad that it makes my entire system unresponsive when its futzing up... can't even bring up the Force Quit for the longest time, or anythhing else.

.

It's a G-Mail problem too. The article mentioned that as well.

I can't understand why you are having such problems. I have to assume that there is some corruption in your system that's doing this to you. Your problems are much more than most people seem to be having.
post #177 of 312
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

It's a G-Mail problem too. The article mentioned that as well.

I can't understand why you are having such problems. I have to assume that there is some corruption in your system that's doing this to you. Your problems are much more than most people seem to be having.


Don't know what to tell ya, Mel... I've been using GMail on Firefox 3.0b3, with no issues significant enough for me to notice as of yet.

Far as my system being corrupted, well, doesn't seem to be-- Safari (and the very similar WebKit) is the only app that's been giving me problems.

My feelings towards Safari are summed up thusly:




Yo! I'm DONE with you!



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post #178 of 312
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

Ah, you young whippersnapper, I started out with Pong in college.

My sources inform me that *you* invented Pong.
post #179 of 312
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

It's a G-Mail problem too. The article mentioned that as well.

I can't understand why you are having such problems. I have to assume that there is some corruption in your system that's doing this to you. Your problems are much more than most people seem to be having.

Nope, it's not an isolated problem. Webkit has serious issues with memory leaks and overhead and it's about time that Apple started to do something about it. It happens on both my machine and my GF's.

Do use use Safari or any other webkit-based browser? How long has it been running? Check out the "real memory" column of Activity Monitor to see how much memory it's using.
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post #180 of 312
It's official. Toshiba made the announcement early this morning (U.S. time). They're stopping production and will finish up by the end of March. So much for the official corporate line yesterday that the rumors were false and that no decision had been made.
post #181 of 312
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

It could be that with really fast pipes, such as what Verison will be serving up in the next few years, with at&t following, we may not need to store anything locally, except for portable viewing, and maybe not even then.

Verison is planning 150Mb/s. They also have upgrade plans for a 1Gb/s speed.

With that, downloading even 1080p with decent compression (or none!) would take under a minute.

You misunderstand. That's exactly what the article says the ISPs don't want. They're claiming their networks are stressed, even with a relatively small number of heavy users today. Imagine if everybody did it. If you want to be able to download hundreds of gigabytes or even terabytes of data a month, they're going to make you pay for that. No local storage would be their worst nightmare. They'd have to keep transferring the same large movie files over and over again if you want to watch it more than once. They're not testing bandwidth caps, tiered pricing and packet shaping for no reason. Read the article, don't just skim it. Note where it says:

Quote:
Consumer advocates say that it’s only a matter of time before average high-speed Internet users get slapped with the label “hog.”

And that's at today's speeds.
post #182 of 312
Quote:
Originally Posted by Akac View Post

The fact is the Xbox is still the better gaming device - and that's what its point is. I bought a PS3. For Bluray movies only. I haven't bought a single game for it and never plan to. Its my top-of-the-line Bluray player. The 360 is the better game system. So its not what will happen to the 360 - its what will happen to the 360 HDDVD player. It will die.

Thank you for stating what is obvious to gamers yet seems to be obtuse to those who aren't. [breathes a sigh of relief]

Geez people why do you think the HD DVD drive was an add-on? An add-on Blu-Ray drive can just as easily be made. Either way it has nothing to do with gaming.
post #183 of 312
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post


But please don't try to tell people that the PS3 didn't sell as well as it should have because of BD, the format, as you are implying! ...Price, yes. Format, no.

Actually wasn't the price higher because of the BD format? So it can still be said that BD was the reason it didn't sell well.

Quote:
Now that the price has dropped to just $50 more than the 360, sales have jumped, and are actually higher than the 360. It's a far better value.

As a Blu Ray player, yes. As a gaming machine, almost but not quite.

The better selection of games and XBox Live still makes the XBox 360 a better gaming console for any serious gamer. Many people own both, but those that pick one in the console gaming community still prefer an Xbox 360.
post #184 of 312
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrjoec123 View Post


...Which doesn't bode well for the XBox 360, which is already suffering badly. With a drive that will essentially be useless soon for movies, it just lost its main competitive edge over the Wii, and it no longer compares in features to the PS3.

Quote:
Originally Posted by petermac View Post

What now becomes of M$ Xbox 360? Do they release a Xbox 180, do the U turn and make a Xbox with BluRay. Xbox's die so fast there will be market space for a replacement. Also, does this news also make the Playstation the media/gaming centre of choice. I heard of some nice integration work being done with Xbox and AppleTV. Now, I believe Apple is in a position to bundle a BluRay player into Apple TV and allow me to lose one box from under my Sharp Aquos.



post #185 of 312
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

I have to assume that there is some corruption in your system that's doing this to you. Your problems are much more than most people seem to be having.

I suggest using a classic OS X troubleshooting technique. Create a new user account and try Safari under that. If it works well, it's not the browser, but something wrong in your original user account.
post #186 of 312
Quote:
Originally Posted by TBell View Post

Give me a break. The consumers didn't decide anything. Besides the Blue Ray player that was included with the Sony PS3, hardly any stand alone players were even sold. Fact is, far more HD players were sold as stand alone units then Blue Ray players. Do a Google search, the margin was something like 4 HD players for every 1 Blue Ray player. Granted, the PS3 made the numbers seem lopsided in the other direction. Strange really, as hardly anybody I know has used the DVD player build in the PS2 as their DVD player. People buy games systems to play games, not watch video. Including the Blue Ray players in Sony PS3s to determine total amount of players sold is kindof like including cell phones in the sale of MP3 players to suggest Nokia is really the most successful maker of music players. If anything, the Blue Ray player is just a mere afterthought in a consumer's decison to buy the PS3.

Moreover, even with the PS3 sales included, the number of Blueray players in the wild is peanuts compared to standard DVD players. Certainly, not enough to decide the victor considering the sales of HD content is almost relatively non existent compared to typical DVD sales (again do a Google search).

Make no mistake, studios and retailors decided the victor. Consumers will inadvertently support whatever format is hand feed to them because they eventually will not have a choice. Most consumers are to ignorant to know the difference. Here big studios were paid big dollars to support a particular format. Do a Google search, recently both Fox and Warner were paid hundreds of millions of dollars to go with Blue Ray. Consumers are not going to buy into a format that doesn't have any content.

Which brings us to my next point. Retailors wanted a winner selected because it cost more money to support multiple formats. They had to buy movies for both formats, stock players for both, and divide advertising costs. Companies like Best Buy, Walmart, Blockbuster, and Netflix could care less what consumers were selecting, as the sales were almost non existent. They merely wanted a winner. They picked the camp with the most studio support. Afterall, they are in the business of selling content.

Blue Ray might have benefits. However, HD for consumers was the more open format. Like everything Sony does, DRM was the primary thought behind Blueray.

Probably the only thing in your diatribe that has any validity.
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post #187 of 312
Quote:
Originally Posted by TBell View Post

Which brings us to my next point. Retailors wanted a winner selected because it cost more money to support multiple formats. They had to buy movies for both formats, stock players for both, and divide advertising costs. Companies like Best Buy, Walmart, Blockbuster, and Netflix could care less what consumers were selecting, as the sales were almost non existent. They merely wanted a winner. They picked the camp with the most studio support. Afterall, they are in the business of selling content.

If the news reports were to be believed, that's not what happened. When studios and retailers made their announcements that they were dropping hddvd, the reason they usually gave was that bluray disks outsold hddvd disks over the holidays by a huge margin (I believe I read 10 to 1).

Once studios and retailers dump a format, it finishes off the war. But consumers had a choice, and during the time that both were widely available (and hddvd players on sale for dirt cheap) consumers still chose bluray in a big way. And I'll bet ps3 had at least a minor hand in it.
post #188 of 312
Quote:
Originally Posted by minderbinder View Post

If the news reports were to be believed, that's not what happened. When studios and retailers made their announcements that they were dropping hddvd, the reason they usually gave was that bluray disks outsold hddvd disks over the holidays by a huge margin (I believe I read 10 to 1).

Once studios and retailers dump a format, it finishes off the war. But consumers had a choice, and during the time that both were widely available (and hddvd players on sale for dirt cheap) consumers still chose bluray in a big way. And I'll bet ps3 had at least a minor hand in it.

And that was a good marketing strategy by Sony in the Blu Ray/HD-DVD war. That was strategical part of the competition war between the 2 formats.
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post #189 of 312
It's over.

Toshiba just announced they are stopping manufacturing of HDDVD.

http://www.toshiba.co.jp/about/press/2008_02/pr1903.htm
post #190 of 312
Quote:
Originally Posted by minderbinder View Post

It's over.

Toshiba just announced they are stopping manufacturing of HDDVD.

http://www.toshiba.co.jp/about/press/2008_02/pr1903.htm

Nice find. I wonder if the HD-DVD campers can admit that it an obsolete format now?
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post #191 of 312
Quote:
Originally Posted by minderbinder View Post

It's over.

Toshiba just announced they are stopping manufacturing of HDDVD.

Just? Old news. Toshiba's news conference was at 5 p.m. Tokyo time, 3 a.m. Eastern time. I posted about that early this morning. Do try to keep up.
post #192 of 312
Quote:
Originally Posted by nvidia2008 View Post

My sources inform me that *you* invented Pong.

I wish!
post #193 of 312
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kolchak View Post

Just? Old news. Toshiba's news conference was at 5 p.m. Tokyo time, 3 a.m. Eastern time. I posted about that early this morning. Do try to keep up.

So now we are slamming people for posting news that is 9 hours old? AI didn't post an article on it and I had not read that so I'm quite glad minderbinder posted the link.
Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
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Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
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post #194 of 312
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. H View Post

Nope, it's not an isolated problem. Webkit has serious issues with memory leaks and overhead and it's about time that Apple started to do something about it. It happens on both my machine and my GF's.

Do use use Safari or any other webkit-based browser? How long has it been running? Check out the "real memory" column of Activity Monitor to see how much memory it's using.

I know about the memory leaks. But I often keep Safari running for days without any problems.

I was previously having problems with Safari crashing, but that went away with the second Flash update, and 10.5.1. I've nary a crash since then, and speeds seem to be alright.

As usual, some people have problems when othgers don't. That tells us that the problem is varied, and can't be relegated to one item. There must be more to it than that.

Remember that whenever Apple issues an upgrade, or even an update, some people have lots of issues, and others have none, or almost none. It isn't any one thing, but the interrelationship between several things that cause the problems. I believe the same thing to be true here as well.
post #195 of 312
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kolchak View Post

You misunderstand. That's exactly what the article says the ISPs don't want. They're claiming their networks are stressed, even with a relatively small number of heavy users today. Imagine if everybody did it. If you want to be able to download hundreds of gigabytes or even terabytes of data a month, they're going to make you pay for that. No local storage would be their worst nightmare. They'd have to keep transferring the same large movie files over and over again if you want to watch it more than once. They're not testing bandwidth caps, tiered pricing and packet shaping for no reason. Read the article, don't just skim it. Note where it says:


And that's at today's speeds.

Yes, I know. I just don't agree. Articles I've read in Science and otherwhere, where researchers are working on this, are saying that things will be changing in major ways. The people in this article are just concerned with the here and now, and are trying to keep the money in the corporate pocketbook.

But, that too will pass. remember all of the overbuilding that went on in the backbone industry just a scant few years ago? Remember how people were saying that they built way too much capacity? Remember how much of that capacity lay unused as "dark fiber"?

I'm not impressed at the isp's whining. They always whine. This increase in consumer speed will pace the build-up of the backbone which is continuall happening. Much of that "dark fiber" is being reclaimed, and will be put into use. More is being discussed.

Cisco just came out with routers that switch vastly more connections at much higher speeds than before, for this very eventuality.

By the time we see 150Mb/s in a good number of homes, the isp's will have far more bandwidth to allocate, as will individual sites. The same thing will be true when 1Gb/s comes out. Not to worry.

I heard the same complaints when broadband first came out, and the average site was running 1 to 3 1.54Mb/s lines, and the backbone was just 1Gb/s.

We're far past that now, with many sites having several Gb/s capacity, and the backbone is running at several Terab/s.

There will always be times when home capacity outstrips the isp for a short while, but then it catches up. Let them bitch. Those who refuse to upgrade will fail, which is as it should be.
post #196 of 312
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kolchak View Post

Just? Old news. Toshiba's news conference was at 5 p.m. Tokyo time, 3 a.m. Eastern time. I posted about that early this morning. Do try to keep up.

By "just" I meant this morning. I'm sure it has been mentioned elsewhere, but it hadn't yet on this thread.
post #197 of 312
Quote:
Originally Posted by 4metta View Post

Actually wasn't the price higher because of the BD format? So it can still be said that BD was the reason it didn't sell well.

If you carefully read my post you would see what I wrote about that.

But, you're putting it backwards, saying that the format itself was to blame, when it wasn't, it was just the price, which was also a result of the expensive Cell inside.

Both have been dropping in price rapidly.

Try to understand that the DVD players in both the 360 and Wii cost the manufacturers about $5. That price won't drop anymore. No advantage there. The cpu for the Wii is cheap as well, just an upgraded PPC from the Cube.

The 360's 3 core PPC is more expensive, but less than the Cell, and the R&D costs were much less as well.

What this all means is that the PS3 price can continue to drop much more than the rivals, while making a profit.

In addition, given the time they've had to work on it, gaming companies have said that the tools provided have finally matured. They were pretty rough at launch, and that contributed to the game delays later on. but this is behind them, and more games are arriving.

We can see that the PS3 is outselling the 360, and both reasons account for that. As a game machine, and as a player.

Quote:
As a Blu Ray player, yes. As a gaming machine, almost but not quite.

The better selection of games and XBox Live still makes the XBox 360 a better gaming console for any serious gamer. Many people own both, but those that pick one in the console gaming community still prefer an Xbox 360.

I've found it to be very interesting that for the past year, the anti-PS3 and Sony camp has alternately said that while the PS3 was a better player, it was an inferior game machine, then, despite it being a better game machine, it was an inferior player.

I've also read ad nausium that it sold because it was a player, but not as a console, and that it sold because it was a console, but not as a player.

I do wish people would make up their minds!

We will see, over the next year, that games for the PS3 will be out in numbers, and that as game companies get more used to the machines, the graphics and gameplay will be better than that of the 360, if even just by a little, at first.

As a player, I also find it interesting that home theater designers, and installers, according to the home theater magazines, much prefer BD, and in the form of the PS3.

I'm buying one as soon as the new player becomes available, so that I can decide which one to get. Meanwhile my friends have brought theirs over to try out. Games, even though they are first generation, still look spectacular.
post #198 of 312
Quote:
Originally Posted by 4metta View Post


I agree with both of those posts.

MS possibly made a fatal decision in not including HD-DVD as a built-in. They could have sucked up the extra losses. Hell, they lost $1.2 billion for the first five years on their games division since the first XBox came out, EVERY YEAR.

Also, the well publicized failures of the 360's is well known. The fix MS has supposedly incorporated has been doubted to actually fix the problem. This is costing MS a whopping $1.3 billion in announced losses just to take care of warrantee costs for that problem alone. Estimates is that it may be too low, as it assumes a 16.5% failure rate, where estimates of that failure rate are that it is at least 30%, and that eventually may include ALL 360' s out there.

Meanwhile, the PS3 is acknowledged to be rock stable.
post #199 of 312
Quote:
Originally Posted by minderbinder View Post

It's over.

Toshiba just announced they are stopping manufacturing of HDDVD.

http://www.toshiba.co.jp/about/press/2008_02/pr1903.htm









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Cut-copy-paste, MMS, landscape keyboard, video-recording, voice-calling, and more... FINALLY
To the 'We Didn't Need It' Crowd/Apple Apologista Squad : Wrong again, lol
Thanks for listening to your...
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Cut-copy-paste, MMS, landscape keyboard, video-recording, voice-calling, and more... FINALLY
To the 'We Didn't Need It' Crowd/Apple Apologista Squad : Wrong again, lol
Thanks for listening to your...
Reply
post #200 of 312
Quote:
Originally Posted by Royboy View Post

Probably the only thing in your diatribe that has any validity.

The only thing that was more open was the lack of region codes. But, Bd has fewer than DVD currently has, and are not being used to this date. Even so, almost no one cares about that anyway.
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