Apple introduces Penryn-based MacBooks and MacBook Pros - Page 4

MBP

What I Like:

4GB of Ram is now only $400 for people dumb enough to buy it from Apple instead of NewEgg

The graphics cards are improved.

The upgrade to a 7200rpm drive is now only 50 bucks instead of 150 it was previously.

New Multi-Touch Trackpad

What I Don't Like:

The upgraded MBP 15" doesn't come with the 2.6GHz as standard. Now it's a 250 buck upgrade for 100 Mhz?

No magnetic latch

Lack of some more usb drives on 15"

No LED 15" screens [Edit: My bad, they are ]

The Apple Remote is now 19 bucks I'll just use my old one

am happy to say apple Corrected the mistake it had on its UK website
the 15 inch: 2.5GHz and 17 inch: 2.5GHz now states
"NVIDIA GeForce 8600M GT graphics with 512MB SDRAM"
while 15 inch: 2.4GHz states:
"NVIDIA GeForce 8600M GT graphics with 256MB SDRAM"

Keep in mind that the extra costs of duties, complying with regulation, as well as extra taxes on businesses, and a much higher cost of living on the Apple employees there in distribution, service and support, all lead to a higher price. The last time I looked at Apple's finance sheets, Apple makes less margin in Europe despite the higher prices.


Have you broken one? I've not really heard of people breaking them. I think it would be nifty to have a maglatch, but I just don't see the existing one causing problems.


I hardly think that those features & services is worth $300, especially not for $100 worth of product. I've never heard of a stick of RAM actually damaging a computer.

Did you consider the cost of the multi-touch trackpad hardware and software? Did you consider that perhaps Apple was giving the remote away before to promote Front Row? Did you consider the cost of the processors? While the price is the same model over model for 1000 units it's possible Apple isn't getting as good a deal from Intel as before because of the weakened economy which has forced Apple to purchase less than before. I can't say any of this is true or false, I'm just wondering if you considered anything else before you made your claim?

The keyboard has been updated. New backlighting and dedicated media keys.

Nice list (and you weren't whiney about iy), but the processor choices are inline with the previous prices per 1000.

•

http://forums.appleinsider.com/showt...55#post1216455

This is the second time on this thread people have said there is no LED 15" screens.

From Apple's page:

15-inch MacBook Pro

15.4-inch (diagonal) antiglare widescreen TFT LED backlit display with support for millions of colors; optional glossy widescreen display.

Come on -- get it right.

If I'm not mistaken (and I'm not since I just checked the UK site where it points the fact out quite clearly), your prices include some pretty ugly taxes and the ones in the US explicitly *do not* (taxes are added during checkout for US buyers). Don't blame Apple for that one.

Your price before taxes is 1360.85 GBP which works out to $2,692.30 USD (of course we're working on getting that down to peso levels so check back later...).

You're whining about their pricing, and pointing at a 19 buck remote that almost nobody uses.
You're not just a little girl..... you're a cry-baby too.

This sentence is fine.


This one resorts to name calling. Best to lay off the name calling 'round these here parts.

These threads are always hilarious.

- For those lamenting "no case redesign", specifically what redesign do you want (except the magnetic latch)?

You do realize that this thread would have been four times as long already if there HAD been a case redesign - people would all be arguing about the things that were redesigned....

- The combo drive is for schools, and a normal marketing device to get you to buy the next most expensive model.

- No, extra money for 100 mHz is not worth it. Apple always does this to allow those who want "Top Of The Line" to have something to buy. Just realize what the reason is and forget about it.

- Why do you care what the RAM upgrade prices are? Again, this is for people who want a "fully loaded" model and can afford not to worry about the price.

And finally, those claiming that there are "PCs" that have more features and cost less, step forward and show them.

$1999. Macbook Pro 15" 2.4GHz / 2GB / 200GB 5400RPM / 256MB Vram
$2499. Macbook Pro 15" 2.5GHz / 2GB / 250GB 5400RPM / 512MB Vram

Am I the only one that is going to bitch about a $500 difference between the 2 15" macbook pros? $500 for 256mb vram, 100mhz, and 50gb of harddrive? Are you kidding me?

That looks odd. Where'd you get the 200GB 5400RPM data from? Isn't the 200GB a 7200RPM drive?

true true, combo drive is hilarious indeed ... run and hide now ...

And the 2.5GHz proc has 6MB of cache instead of 3MB. Still, you make a good point, but if you work with graphics-intensive applications, the faster speed (including twice the cache), twice the video memory, and bigger hard drive (bigger hard drives are usually faster, everything else constant) could be worth more than $500 to you in the long run.

Hi! A quick one: I am new to Apple (not counting my Apple IIe beginnings anymore ), and I have been waiting for this(? hmmm) MBP 15" refresh to finally join the Apple community. Now this refresh comes with a larger graphic card option (512MB) memory...

QUESTION:
Besides the topic whether I would really need so much graphic power (probably not immediately), I am wondering whether the 512 vs. 256MB option will have a noticeable impact on a) battery life of the MBP (since battery life matters quite a bit to me); and b) whether these heat issues that scare the hell out of me would even be worse with the higher end graphic card?

Thanks so much for helping me with the last open question on pro/cons 256<=>512

Holy shit this is getting insane DVD is now going to be the dying format and the base macbook is still has a combo drive. What a fucking joke.

Oops, I looked and you're right. I sit corrected.

depends on what kind of work you are using. If you are using word, excel, chatting and web browsing, you hardly used 2gb of ram.

Dude, apple's plan is to erase all dvd. They just want everything online through itunes. Yes, there is HD in itunes. there are some free hd podcast. you might want to check it out

There is a perception that every laptop purchase should be accompanied by an extended warranty.

For sure, if you are going to be tugging it everywhere you go, is should be a major consideration. Equally, if you have the dropsies or you are not comfortable that somebody in the household is so inclined.

My recommendation otherwise, is based on my own experience with ton of Macs that I have personally owned. Never would have used it. However, my one laptop I gave my sister-in-law did. Actually it was her husband's fault.

Generally, I am of the opinion that if one were to go wrong, it will be in the first month and definitely you will be more that adequately covered in the normal first year warranty period.

Suggestion: Again it is your decision. But going for the year less a day is probably safe enough. Remember that you can purchase Apple Care later as long as you do so within the 1-year warranty period.

one piece of advice, if you are running heavy graphic programs, chance are you are not running it with battery.

that being said, i used the 256 vram, and if im running photoshop, it takes a lot of battery life. Btw, MBP is famous for having a low battery life. I would say with certainty, that it will be below your expectation.

Are you suggesting that the 2.2 to 2.4GHz Santa Rosa should cost more than the 2.4 to 2..5Ghz Penryn upgrade because the clockspeed is only half as much? If so, I've got a 3.0GHz Celeron I'll sell you for the same price as the 2.6GHz Penryn.

Intel price list

Can you offer good reasons why it needs to have a DVD burner in it? If I could get a MBP with a Combo drive, I would.

- The case could use a redesign: the hard drive should be replaceable without voiding your warranty, the keyboard is much better on the MacBook (I've owned both), it could use an aesthetic refresh, it heats up way too much, it's too big, heavy, clunky, and fragile (it's better than most competitors, but it could be considerably trimmed and that would be very valuable)

- That's absolutely right about the Combo drive

- The $2,499 one could be worth it to intensive graphics users (twice the video memory, twice the cache, slightly larger and faster hard drive), and, as you say, is to get more money out of price-insensitive customers

- You're right about the memory upgrades

- That's right about the better value PC wailers--show the money

The 15" screen have been LED since last June

1) I suppose you have a good point about expecting it for the next version as opposed to this one. It does make good sense, but that doesn't change wanting it on the MB at thie time.
2) I understand that the lower L2 was Intel's choice. I just wanted to know WHY, and if there will be an increase back to 4mb in the near future.
3) I run a MBP with Apple upgraded RAM, and a MB with G.SKILL RAM that I installed. Both work wonderfully. No complaints. My future RAM upgrades will be aftermarket unless Apple lowers their prices dramatically.

OK 2 more differences between low-end MBP and high-end MBP (15")

3mb l2 cache vs 6mb l2 cache
Double layer burner vs dual & double layer burner.

Why does it have to need one? It should have one simply because DVD burners are just so damn cheap, there's no excuse not to have one included. They are nickel and diming their customers.

And at the VERY least, they should offer an upgrade option on the base model for $30 or so, instead of requiring the buyer to spend $200 more and get other features they may not care about.

...Huh?

I was expecting a new keyboard and a mag-latch at least.

---
Thanks for your feedback! Let me get a little more precise on what I am looking for:

Q1: I would be using the new MBP 15" in mobile setting (all things equal). Usually "mobile" would mean "no heavy lifiting" on graphics as you pointed out entirely right:
>> Would the simple fact of 256 (vs. 512MB graphics) suck less on my battery, and I could count with about 3-4 hrs (web/office)? (vs. less than 3hrs with the 512 option?)

Q2: Would the 256MB produce less heat when barely used, compared to the 512? Or is there no difference to be expected when used similarly?

Q3: ..and that one actually stems staright from your advice: would heavy lifting drain a 256MB 15" MBP more than the 512, or less?

Thanks again for all feedback!!

The 15" models have the exact same Superdrive. The 17" model has a slightly faster one.

Because it doesn't cost Apple any more to include a superdrive than a combo drive. They could easily include one at the same price point. It's just a stupid marketing tactic. People have been duped into thinking there is some financial incentive for Apple to do this. I was at Best Buy the other day and there was not a single laptop in the $500 to $800 price range that had a combo drive. They all had DVD+/-RW drives as standard. That's right, standard and for as little as half the cost of the MacBook as well.

While I don't think there is a device that will solve everyone's needs so complaining will happen. Some of the stuff I am hearing is ridiculous. Yes the MacBook didn't see as many changes as the Pro, but it was just updated in November. Apple just wanted to get it on Penryn with the MacBook Pro. Can you imagine how many people would complain if the MBP was Penryn and the MB wasn't? As fas as having a combo drive goes, that's the base model and as one person pointed out, it's the one that goes to all the schools.

As to the MacBook Pro complaints, those people probably aren't in the market for a new MBP, whereas me and a lot of others are finally making the switch from a G4 PowerBook to an Intel Mac. That's at least a 4 year wait. I really doubt the .1GHz makes that much difference and I personally couldn't justify the extra dough for the 512VRAM, but I'm also running a 128MB ATI in my powerbook so I am getting quite the advance. If you already have a C2D Macbook Pro, this update probably isn't for you. For people wanting a new case...I think carbonfiber may be out of everyone's price range at the moment. What do you want to see? New keyboard and magnetic latch? Then the next release may be for you.

This was really for people who have to have every single model and those who have been waiting a LONG time to make the switch from Core Duo (not C2D) or a G4, or those looking to switch. If you're already in the game, sit on the bench a little longer and let the rookies take a few hits.

Sorry you're right. I thought I saw a white line dividing them. For those that don't know there IS a difference between double layer and dual layer. Double layer is DVD+R DL, Dual Layer is DVD-R DL.

The magnetic latch is what most people are referring to when suggesting a case redesign. That is the main issue. There is also the slide out hard drive replacement and modern keyboard. All of these improvements are available on the lower-end MacBook. Otherwise it would remain the same for the most part. Maybe slightly thinner with more rounded edges.

MacBook Pro includes the latest NVIDIA graphics processors

I thought that the 8800M was the "latest" NVIDIA graphics processor for laptops. The previous generation of MBP's already had the 8600M, but with only 256MB video ram max.

Who knows what kind of performance difference there is between the 8600M and 8800M ?

Ian \

Just don't buy extra RAM from Apple. OWC has 4GB for about $100. At that price, just max it out anyways.

And how exactly does that excuse an apple laptop with a DVD burner costing $1299 when PCs for less than half that price include it? And even if you think a $1099 model with no DVD burner is acceptable (which I personally find laughable), how do you excuse a $200 charge to get the burner (which includes other options which the user may or may not need)?

I'd love to see apple do a cheaper, more stripped down model for schools. But it should be more like $599-799. These days, $1099 isn't a budget machine, it's a midpriced one, and the features should live up to the price. Overall they do, but the omission of superdrive is absolutely glaring.