Apple releases iPhone Software Version 1.1.4 - Page 3

Originally Posted by bbatsell

No it should not.

Originally Posted by bbatsell

No it should not.

Originally Posted by gmon750

Like it or not, Apple continues updates/upgrades to iPhone software because the $$ it receives from the subscriber revenue - and not hardware sales - allows (motivates??) Apple to continue improving its product.

Originally Posted by CoolHandPete

"supersedes" should be spelled "supercedes".

Originally Posted by sapporobaby

Name one instance where someone blamed Apple for a third party application exposing an iPhone vulnerability. Just one.

Originally Posted by numetheus

there wouldn't be many examples because Apple has been on top of it. But people WOULD if they werent proactive. We know this because lots of people did just that with Microsoft. And their answer was to release more timely updates rather than waiting for the next service pack. If they leave the platform open to malicious attack, then the popularity of iPhone would go down the tube. Remember most people don't think of iPhone as a computer, they think of it as a snazzy iPod that happens to be a phone. They love it because it is what it is and it works. On a computer people expect that malicious software exists. They don't expect that from their phone though. Keeping it bottled up is the best thing they can do. You better believe that if there were tons of exploits because apple left it open, then people would attack the platform like crazy, moreso than any other device due to its popularity. This would frustrate people more than it would make a few people happy.

Originally Posted by gmon750

Like it or not, Apple continues updates/upgrades to iPhone software because the $$ it receives from the subscriber revenue - and not hardware sales - allows (motivates??) Apple to continue improving its product.

So if their updates causes the freeloaders, hackers, slackers, and whiners more headaches and complaints as to why they can't partake in a support feature for free - and without problems - as opposed to only those that actually pay for the privilege... it sucks to be you.

I dont' think the SDK bandwagon will make it any easier in certain aspects. If Apple opens it up more to development similar to how it was with Palm back when, more power to them and I would be first to sign up as I see nothing but a positive impact by that move.

But the same mantra will still apply. Don't bitch about wanting something for free that everyone else has to pay for. Apple doesn't continue the R&D for the iPhone simply because it's cool. They are no different than any other company that needs to make money.

I've been an Cingular->AT&T customer for 10+ years. Are they perfect?? Far from it. All the other providers are not perfect either. But I've been relatively happy with them. Is it right that AT&T is the exclusive provider? History will be the judge of that. Do I bitch about not having a Lamborghini as an everyday car? No. So if the iPhone is not available for whatever reason in your town/state/country/planet/whatever, that is just life. If you can hack it up enough to get it to work, kudos to you. But don't expect an easy ride from Apple. You own the hardware, but not the OS software. Get over it.

Let the flamebaiting begin (again).

Originally Posted by solipsism

Good answer. Welcome to AI.

Originally Posted by numetheus

there wouldn't be many examples because Apple has been on top of it. But people WOULD if they werent proactive. We know this because lots of people did just that with Microsoft. And their answer was to release more timely updates rather than waiting for the next service pack. If they leave the platform open to malicious attack, then the popularity of iPhone would go down the tube. Remember most people don't think of iPhone as a computer, they think of it as a snazzy iPod that happens to be a phone. They love it because it is what it is and it works. On a computer people expect that malicious software exists. They don't expect that from their phone though. Keeping it bottled up is the best thing they can do. You better believe that if there were tons of exploits because apple left it open, then people would attack the platform like crazy, moreso than any other device due to its popularity. This would frustrate people more than it would make a few people happy.

Originally Posted by numetheus

So Apple can't just update their product and fix bugs they find without people going into conspiracy theory mode and saying its only done to lock out hackers? People will whine if they don't fix bugs, but will also whine if they DO, because we think they are simply patching the jailbreaks?

Originally Posted by sapporobaby

I don't exactly buy that as Symbian has a much larger installation base and it we are not inundated with attacks. Also that totally ridiculous argument that "rouge" applications could bring down an entire IN cell network and the kool aid drinkers believed it. Apple wants to maintain control of the money and they do it via advertising knowing that gullible people will buy it. I have no problems with a signing process similar to Symbian, but without all of the so-called consumer protection that Apple tries to sell.

Originally Posted by numetheus

Symbian for the most part is bottled up. It is a proprietary architecture with development made through its SDK. Development for Symbian for the most part happens within certain confines. iPhone on the other hand is extremely different because it uses a Unix style kernel, which, if not bottled up, is very well known to hackers and other people wishing to attack it. The fact that it is a well known architecture (Unix) makes it more imperative that it is locked up.

The way it SHOULD work is (just like Symbian) that software development needs to happen within the confines specified by Apple through the SDK. And the only way to keep those "boundries" (tokeep malicious developers from crossing them) is to bottle it up. Otherwise you will get boatloads of problems (again, because it uses a powerful and well known back end).

And .... where did I say I believe that any malicious program would bring down the entire network? That is for the most part not possible, UNLESS most iPhones were infected with a smurfing trojan and all activated at one time in a DOS (Denial of Service) attack against something on the Internet. Which, is possible but not probable.

Originally Posted by macrumors

No applications yet, but with 1.1.4, if you drag/drop a bookmark from page 1 to page 2, then press and hold it for 2 seconds, an horizontal line appears dividing the page in two, the upper has the title "Applications", the bottom part has the title "Bookmarks". Dragging th icon or realising it will make the titles disappear.
\

Originally Posted by numetheus

So Apple can't just update their product and fix bugs they find without people going into conspiracy theory mode and saying its only done to lock out hackers? People will whine if they don't fix bugs, but will also whine if they DO, because we think they are simply patching the jailbreaks?

Originally Posted by numetheus

Symbian for the most part is bottled up. It is a proprietary architecture with development made through its SDK. Development for Symbian for the most part happens within certain confines. iPhone on the other hand is extremely different because it uses a Unix style kernel, which, if not bottled up, is very well known to hackers and other people wishing to attack it. The fact that it is a well known architecture (Unix) makes it more imperative that it is locked up.

The way it SHOULD work is (just like Symbian) that software development needs to happen within the confines specified by Apple through the SDK. And the only way to keep those "boundries" (tokeep malicious developers from crossing them) is to bottle it up. Otherwise you will get boatloads of problems (again, because it uses a powerful and well known back end).

And .... where did I say I believe that any malicious program would bring down the entire network? That is for the most part not possible, UNLESS most iPhones were infected with a smurfing trojan and all activated at one time in a DOS (Denial of Service) attack against something on the Internet. Which, is possible but not probable.

Originally Posted by sapporobaby

Survey says: not exactly true. I have Symbian programmer friends and they laugh at the way Apple passes down a decree and people simply swallow it hook line and sinker. They program in an environment where the ability to write malicious code exists but where is this code. Symbian come in two flavors and there is still no viable virus attacks that have crippled thousand or even tens of phones. Apple is no more secure than Symbian in this respect. Into the realm of opinion I think that Apple is simply using this as a way to control content distribution and in the end profits. However being that Apple has not invited me to any internal briefings, my opinions are no more valid than yours.

As for the network crashing thing, sorry that it appeared I applied that to you. It was meant to those here in general that continue to believe this network crashing app lie that Apple and AT&T put forth. No offense to you there and my bad if it appeared this way.

Originally Posted by sapporobaby

Survey says: not exactly true. I have Symbian programmer friends and they laugh at the way Apple passes down a decree and people simply swallow it hook line and sinker. They program in an environment where the ability to write malicious code exists but where is this code. Symbian come in two flavors and there is still no viable virus attacks that have crippled thousand or even tens of phones. Apple is no more secure than Symbian in this respect. Into the realm of opinion I think that Apple is simply using this as a way to control content distribution and in the end profits. However being that Apple has not invited me to any internal briefings, my opinions are no more valid than yours.

As for the network crashing thing, sorry that it appeared I applied that to you. It was meant to those here in general that continue to believe this network crashing app lie that Apple and AT&T put forth. No offense to you there and my bad if it appeared this way.

Originally Posted by numetheus

As a matter of fact, the Symbian OS model goes like this:

5. UI Framework model
4. Application Services Layer
3. OS Services Layer
2. Base Services Layer
1. Kernel Services & Hardware Interface Layer

A symbian developer does not have general access to get to or tinker with code in layer #1 and #2. In iPhone with Unix, we can .... and that knowledge is readily available if you know Unix. The PROBLEM is this ... code executed in Unix, without being executed in a root jail (or sandbox?) has access to the real root and everything underneath. This is potentially bad since the root password of all iPhones are exactly the same. HINT: ITS ALPINE.

Originally Posted by sapporobaby

Alpine? As in the stereo or in yodeling country? That is pretty dumb though. I thought Apple took steps with 1.1.2 or 1.1.3 to change the way applications run. Not sure but I know that the current 3rd party applications had to all be re-written to take advantage of the new file structuring. Not a programmer so I do not know the terms, but I am sure you heard about this.

Originally Posted by numetheus

Yeah. LOL I was surprised the first time I got into there. You can actually log in as root (Unix superuser) using the SAME password that every iPhone has (alpine). Anyway I was able to do work just like I would any other Unix server after installing the toolchain. Full C compiler and everything. The last mobile phone I was able to do this with was my Sharp Zaurus back in the day .... that one was Linux based. Anyway end result is you can work with the OS like you could any computer, and screw it up just as bad because the root account password is predictable. LOL

And, in case people don't know the term jailbreak ill explain: The root file system is like the C\ in your Windows computer. In Unix, everything exists off of this root, and once you see the "real" one, you have access to absolutely everything including the kernel and all configuration files. Since Unix keeps all configuration in files rather than a registry, you can see how this is bad. When we create for example, an FTP server, in Unix, we don't like people to be able to see our real root to gain access to all of those system files, directories, and configuration ... so we create a sort of FAKE root. When people log in using FTP (or any service using this fake root), they think they are at the top of the tree, when in reality they are not. To equate this in Windows it is like you creating a folder and somehow telling the system that this new folder IS drive C\. I don't know how you would do this in Windows though ... im a Unix/Linux guy. Anyways, this fake root is called a root jail because it prevents access outside of this specified directory. So, jail breaking is kind of like expanding the confines of what users can access. This "confine" in the original implementation does not provide access to anything! Especially the launcher!

Anyway, what apple will be doing is opening up a very limited portion of the file system and access to libraries within that limited portion. The SDK will make it easier for programmers to utilize these libraries more easily and prevent them from having to enter other parts of the file system.

Im sorry if I am lecturing by the way ... I can't help it. I teach Linux courses at my college ... so lecturing is my life! LOL ;-)

Originally Posted by sapporobaby

Dude. You teach LINUX? You want to be my best friend? I can send you something from Finland as a down payment. I have decided to learn LINUX again. Which version would you recommend? Going on an old PC.

Originally Posted by numetheus

Yes. Ask me whatever and I'll find time to write up a lesson. I was going to put up an tutorial site with everything explained in laymans terms anyways. As far as which to use, it depends on how you want to learn it. Do you want to learn it to use it as a day to day operating system? Or do you want to learn Linux to learn it? That includes command line and everything that goes with it.

For people starting to learn it as a day to day OS I recommend Ubuntu. If you want to get your hands dirty and really learn it I recommend Arch Linux. It installs as a pure command line, forcing you to learn program names because you have to build it up from xserver to window manager to other programs. And all the while its easy to use package manager gets you going quickly so you don't have to learn everything at once such as source compiling and other stuff. You can graduate from Arch to Gentoo. And if you get that, you can handle most Linux related things. Going the Ubuntu route gets you going instantly with a complete GUI environment, but my experience with students says that makes you lazy and unwilling to learn other more manual ways of doing things. I personally like to do things without the blinders a fully installed distro like Ubuntu provides.

Originally Posted by FriendInMyPants

it doesnt add flash support does it? thats gonna open a new world to these devices

Originally Posted by GreaseMonkey

Think we are getting a bit off topic but...
numetheus, I would love to see a tutorial starting from command line and working up... I would even be willing to test your tutorials through the rough drafts.

Originally Posted by googleplex

Anyone else been getting two copies of every Yahoo email pushed to their iPhone since this update? I have, so I logged into Yahoo webmail to double check but there is only one of each...

Update: seems to be fine now, removed my account and let the IMAP emails resync.

Originally Posted by aclark19

Hasn't anyone noticed??

The problem of out-of-order text messages has been fixed!!

Originally Posted by tyrnight

didnt fix it on my iPhone

now im getting doubles and double sound notifiers, not at the same time.. odd

Originally Posted by gmon750

Like it or not, Apple continues updates/upgrades to iPhone software because the $$ it receives from the subscriber revenue - and not hardware sales - allows (motivates??) Apple to continue improving its product.

So if their updates causes the freeloaders, hackers, slackers, and whiners more headaches and complaints as to why they can't partake in a support feature for free - and without problems - as opposed to only those that actually pay for the privilege... it sucks to be you.

I dont' think the SDK bandwagon will make it any easier in certain aspects. If Apple opens it up more to development similar to how it was with Palm back when, more power to them and I would be first to sign up as I see nothing but a positive impact by that move.

But the same mantra will still apply. Don't bitch about wanting something for free that everyone else has to pay for. Apple doesn't continue the R&D for the iPhone simply because it's cool. They are no different than any other company that needs to make money.

I've been an Cingular->AT&T customer for 10+ years. Are they perfect?? Far from it. All the other providers are not perfect either. But I've been relatively happy with them. Is it right that AT&T is the exclusive provider? History will be the judge of that. Do I bitch about not having a Lamborghini as an everyday car? No. So if the iPhone is not available for whatever reason in your town/state/country/planet/whatever, that is just life. If you can hack it up enough to get it to work, kudos to you. But don't expect an easy ride from Apple. You own the hardware, but not the OS software. Get over it.

Let the flamebaiting begin (again).

A symbian developer does not have general access to get to or tinker with code in layer #1 and #2. In iPhone with Unix, we can .... and that knowledge is readily available if you know Unix. The PROBLEM is this ... code executed in Unix, without being executed in a root jail (or sandbox?) has access to the real root and everything underneath. This is potentially bad since the root password of all iPhones are exactly the same. HINT: ITS ALPINE.

Originally Posted by mbene12

prep for SDK release?

Originally Posted by gimlet-eyedKat

Have a look at Settings/Safari and scroll down to the bottom of the page. There's now a link called "Developer" and when you go there, the option to turn on "debug console". Interesting things happen when you have this on and browse webpages.