Another setback for Teh Global Warming™ - Page 9

No. Why would the duration matter? You're grasping here.

Why do you keep talking about me and what I'm grasping at? Did you not say that a 24-minute fire changed the course of US environmental policy?

And then I asked a question, which you did not answer.

Yes, a 24 minute fire (30 by some accounts) did change the course of environmental policy. If it has been longer, or shorter, would not have made much of a difference when it came to the headline. And the headline helped pass the Clean Water Act... which I have already characterized in positively *glowing* terms.

I do not need convincing that companies will dump until they are made not to. Some companies are just that way. And thank God they get dealt with.

Awesome, I'm in a sig!

Jub, I'm sorry I lumped you with that idiot MaxPariah. My mistake. A) I jumped off the deep end a bit, cuz that's my style. B) I was half-joking, particularly regarding your liberal quote. It was late at night and I was making jokes with myself. Isn't that what this place, especially Political Outsider is for?

Is your main point against climate change legislation based on scientific uncertainty? I am a subscriber to the precautionary principle, I'll leave it at that. I'm by no means qualified regarding climate science. I perceived a broad attack on environmental protection coming from Max and I felt obligated to answer. I will also consider your point regarding scientists' arrogance. While I try to simply go by the facts, and it is a fact that environmental protection in most cases is very immediately beneficial for people by any objective measure, I will consider your thoughts going forward.

Max, what are your thoughts?

I appreciate your post... true character on display. I'm sorry as well for slamming the door a little hard in my response. I should have been more constructive. I do believe that the climate is changing. I have little doubt about that. I just have issues with believing that it is completely human-caused. There's water vapor. Solar output. Documented pre-industrial swings in climate. I don't think it is a "crisis"- and if it is, it is not one that humans can solve. But that is just what little old me thinks.

As far as environmental regulation: we need it. I swim and kayak in the same water as my liberal, Prius-driving neighbors. I love the Texas Hill Country when I can get out there, and we all have a stake in keeping it nice. I worked with my friends in the local outdoorsmen's association to get a serious fine passed for dumping of any kind in our watershed. And it has helped, especially with glass and styrofoam in the river. I want my grandchildren to enjoy paddling that river decades from now.

The Clean Water Act and Clean Air Act were/are good things. Industry does need to be reigned-in. I guess the problem I have is when enviro-hysteria sets in and it becomes the jumping off point for regulating anything that the self-appointed braintrust claims is in need of regulation. That amount of power over others is seductive. It is a fertile garden for a control freak empowered by "scientific consensus" that no one dares question.

Should we strip mine the entire planet? No. Should we work in vain to try and make sure it never changes? Not worth it- it has before us, and will long after we're gone. We cannot stop it anyway. We should take care of our planet, do things that are sensible... like recycling, encouraging development of alternative energy, and cleaning up the significant messes we've already made. It just causes a great amount of suspicion with me when I look at the Usual Suspects who have a new schtick with the same old goals... more taxes, and greater government control. No sane person wants a polluted environment. But there is a point at which there is skepticism about if things like Carbon Taxes, banning incandescent light bulbs, remote control thermostats in our homes, unreachable CAFE standards, and international treaty control over our daily lives are really going to do anything to the global temperature. I mean, we're 93 million miles from a really, really big heater that we don't control the thermostat on.

All we hear is this is melting this is warming!
When in fact it`s time for the Money Men to line their pockets once more, Oil $148 a barrel!! yes the very same Stuff that was only $18 a Barrel not long ago, the mega Rich ARAB`s are Dancing doing the Sand Dance!
But we hear the words Hybrid Cars they have had that technology for years but the Man has to be seen to be doing something to help our dear Planet, but as the Stocks and Shares are low in Hybrid Cars at the momment the Rich are Vacuuming-up the Shares and then when they hit $30 from 50cents they will do more dancing.
How much more "Green Tech have the ARAB`S BOUGHT and hid them away like the Dead Sea Scrolls.
But all the dancing will Stop when they find-out that nothing is going to happen to The World what is happening now is Mother Nature having a change but she will be back to normal when she is ready just like any Woman but our ARAB`S don`t understand Women that WHY they ALWAYS want a Boy when one of many wife's give birth

Where is the ice?

http://edition.cnn.com/2008/TECH/sci....ap/index.html

And I wanted to make some tea...

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/7585645.stm

Of course the world is getting cooler.

Sea ice is one thing. Shelf ice is another.

You guys ever read/hear about global dimming. I saw it on Nova ... scary stuff.

I saw that episode, too. Those pics from space of the pollution wafting out of Europe and going to Africa, and the implication that European pollution changed air and surface temps, which changed weather patterns, which caused the Ethiopian famine in the 80s....chilling.

Polar bears resort to cannibalism as Arctic ice shrinks