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Apple pushing Safari downloads on Windows users

post #1 of 115
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In an apparent bid to rapidly gain share of the online browser market dominated by rival Microsoft, Apple is leveraging its vast iTunes install base to recommend that Windows users also download and install the latest version of its Safari web browser.

To date, Apple has sold over 100 million iPods, the majority of which have gone to Windows users who subsequently must install the company's iTunes software for synching files between their PCs and the digital media players. As part of iTunes, Apple also installs its Software Update mechanism on the Windows-based machines to notify users of iTunes updates, in addition to updates to its QuickTime media software required for several iTunes functions.

It now appears that the Cupertino-based company aspires to use the advantage presented by the Software Update mechanism to muscle its way further up the browser charts at the expense Microsoft's Internet Explorer and other third-party Windows browsers.

"Earlier today, Apple released the Safari 3.1 Web browser for Mac OS and Windows XP/Vista. A couple hours later, Apple Software Update popped up on my daughter's Sony VAIO, offering Safari 3.1 for download," noted Microsoft Watch's Joe Wilcox. "I didn't recall seeing an earlier version installed on the laptop. And I made no mistake: The Apple updater offered installation of new software, not something that had been there before. Whoa."

Windows users receiving the notification are greeted with Apple's marketing pitch alongside the download option, which reads: "Safari for Windows is the fastest and easiest-to-use web browser for the PC. It displays web pages faster than any other browser and is filled with innovative features -- all delivered in an efficient and elegant user interface."



In a statement released Monday alongside the release of Safari 3.1, Apple said the browser loads web pages 1.9 times faster than the current version of Internet Explorer and 1.7 times faster than Firefox 2.0. But when it comes to install base, Safari is world's behind.

According to NetApplications, the Apple browser maintains an approximate 5.7 percent share of the market, a distant third to the well established presences of both FireFox and Internet Explorer, which hold a 17.2 percent and 74.8 percent share, respectively. But like FireFox, Safari is slowly eating away at Internet Explorer's commanding lead. Its share has risen nearly a full percentage point over the past twelve months, while the Microsoft browser has shed about 5 percent of its share.

Meanwhile, Apple is also contending on a second front in its charge towards supremacy in the browser market, to which it has witnessed more immediate success. Its iPhone and iPod touch -- both of which ship with a mobile version of Safari -- have served to springboard the company to the top of the US mobile browser rankings in a mere eight months, according a recent report from Ireland-based StatCounter.

But Wilcox, who credits Apple with wisely leveraging its resources to infiltrate Microsoft's territory, questions how well the fledging Safari browser will hold up amongst a PC world proliferated by trojans, viruses and other rogue tactics that threaten to disrupt the stability of Windows systems.

"Safari is fairly new to Windows and has yet to really show that it has can muster the security to withstand the associated attacks," he wrote. "Mac OS X is a quaint neighborhood where little Safari was safe. By comparison, Windows is a gang-ridden ghetto: life is survival, and it's tough going."
post #2 of 115
...I'd install Firefox, not Safari. Not yet, anyway.

[QUOTE=AppleInsider;1231876]In an apparent bid to rapidly gain share of the online browser market dominated by rival Microsoft, Apple is leveraging its vast iTunes install base to recommend that Windows users also download and install the latest version of its Safari web browser.
post #3 of 115
Quote:
Originally Posted by mdcat View Post

...I'd install Firefox, not Safari. Not yet, anyway.

Whys that?

Also, Gruber mentioned this as "interesting", yet to me it seems obvious.
post #4 of 115
The latest version of Safari does not let me write capitals in my Gmail without always jumping to the subject box.

It is pretty annoying as I have to write my messages in Pages and copy paste them to Gmail.

I haven't lost my mind just yet
post #5 of 115
Saw this yesterday. While I can't blame them for trying to leverage their trojan horse, I don't like this kind of sneaky install at all. It does tell you what it's going to do, but for most users, a little more explanation is necessary for them to know what is happening.
post #6 of 115
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

...Microsoft Watch's Joe Wilcox. "I didn't recall seeing an earlier version installed on the laptop. And I made no mistake: The Apple updater offered installation of new software, not something that had been there before. Whoa."

But Wilcox, who credits Apple with wisely leveraging its resources to infiltrate Microsoft's territory, questions how well the fledging Safari browser will hold up amongst a PC world proliferated by trojans, viruses and other rogue tactics that threaten to disrupt the stability of Windows systems.

"Safari is fairly new to Windows and has yet to really show that it has can muster the security to withstand the associated attacks," he wrote. "Mac OS X is a quaint neighborhood where little Safari was safe. By comparison, Windows is a gang-ridden ghetto: life is survival, and it's tough going."

With phrases like...

"a PC world proliferated by trojans, viruses and other rogue tactics that threaten to disrupt the stability of Windows systems."

"the security to withstand the associated attacks"

"Windows is a gang-ridden ghetto: life is survival, and it's tough going."

WOW! Makes me want to go out right away and buy a MS Windows PC!

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post #7 of 115
Vice versa too.

Had Safari beta on a work computer for testing reasons. Last week apple's software update "handily" installed iTunes and Quicktime on it as well, when they hadn't been previously installed.
post #8 of 115
Once PC people try Safari, Internet Explorer will be history in months. For me there is nothing like Safari: easy to use, fast and a pleasure to use.
post #9 of 115
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

"Mac OS X is a quaint neighborhood where little Safari was safe. By comparison, Windows is a gang-ridden ghetto: life is survival, and it's tough going."

I love this quote because it's so true! Where Windows is the "gang-ridden Ghetto", IE represents the crackheads and meth dealers.

Would any right-minded Apple owner use a Mac version of IE? I HIGHLY doubt it! The reality is that once you go Mac, you never go back. IE is not the only problem with PC's.

After having owned a MacBook for a while, and using XP at work, I was recently asked to fix a friends laptop running Vista. The OS is somewhat counter-intuitive and messy, analogous to the city government trying to "clean up the streets". I was shocked to see that even the basic functionality of the system tools were changed from XP to Vista.

Anyways.........
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post #10 of 115
I'm not sure. Safari for Windows takes an eon to launch for me. In other words - bad first impressions. I also don't like the large amount of gray at the top (double menu bar, it seems like). It could be a lot nicer looking. The browser experience is good but I think Windows people dislike the fact that it is too un-Windows like and I tend to agree - the change is too radical. Impostor like. I use Mac 95% of the time but I still find Safari on Windows just 'not right'. It should closer mimic a Windows way of working. Looks wise I think it should closer mimic the look of iTunes on Windows. Its a while since I looked at iTunes on Windows but I never thought it looked out of place.
At first I felt the same way with Firefox on Mac - the look and feel just didn't sit easy with me. The way Firefox displays things like text areas and radio buttons in web pages still makes me feel its not a comfortable fit (I do use FF a lot, but prefer Safari).
post #11 of 115
I'm with MDCat... I'd install Firefox.... I tried to make safari work out for me ... but it just didn't. Especially on eBay... holy crap. I almost wrote a hate note based on that one. If you notice, in their latest refresh of safari they have fixed, "picture rendering on auction websites" or something along those lines. Too late. I already switched and haven't had a hiccup with Firefox. Also a lot of secure sites don't support Safari... like when I go to check my Discover Card statement online or when I go to renew my FAFSA online. Besides all that, it crashed like it was its job. I just couldn't deal with a sub-par browser for a lifestyle that revolves around the internet. I know I'll probably get a lot of hate for this post, but this is just my honest experience with Safari. I still love Apple and think the world of them. Safari, however... I'm gonna wait a long time before reconsidering.
post #12 of 115
Quote:
Originally Posted by cameronj View Post

Saw this yesterday. While I can't blame them for trying to leverage their trojan horse, I don't like this kind of sneaky install at all. It does tell you what it's going to do, but for most users, a little more explanation is necessary for them to know what is happening.

While I support your thought, I am at a slight loss as to what information the normal user should see. I went back to the article and looked at the graphic that was posted and it appeared to me for the most part to be strait forward but I do spend allot of time on them.
post #13 of 115
Quote:
Originally Posted by fARGINaPPLES View Post

I love this quote because it's so true! Where Windows is the "gang-ridden Ghetto"

Best quote of the month, thus far, in my opinion =P

We had to include it, heh.

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post #14 of 115
Quote:
Originally Posted by HyteProsector View Post

I'm with MDCat... I'd install Firefox.... I tried to make safari work out for me ... but it just didn't. Especially on eBay... holy crap. I almost wrote a hate note based on that one. If you notice, in their latest refresh of safari they have fixed, "picture rendering on auction websites" or something along those lines. Too late. I already switched and haven't had a hiccup with Firefox. Also a lot of secure sites don't support Safari... like when I go to check my Discover Card statement online or when I go to renew my FAFSA online. Besides all that, it crashed like it was its job. I just couldn't deal with a sub-par browser for a lifestyle that revolves around the internet. I know I'll probably get a lot of hate for this post, but this is just my honest experience with Safari. I still love Apple and think the world of them. Safari, however... I'm gonna wait a long time before reconsidering.

Just to clarify, is the gist of your message that the beta version of Safari for Windows had some bugs, while you expected the beta to be release quality?
post #15 of 115
The only reason I use IE on parallels is to access my bank site, I can access it using safari and firefox but I cannot do anything other than view statements. Firefox is fine but I hate how slow it is to start and load pages. I believe most Windows users don't like Safari because they are not used to the browser's theme, they are used to XP or Vista theme. I have to agree with them because when I ran Safari under windows it does not fit, just like running an XP program under Leopard using Parallels Coherence, it looks awful. The average person care more about the look, feel, and compatibility. I don't know why many websites are only designed to be best viewed on IE!
post #16 of 115
Quote:
Originally Posted by zunx View Post

Once PC people try Safari, Internet Explorer will be history in months. For me there is nothing like Safari: easy to use, fast and a pleasure to use.

There is no way that Safari is ever going to become popular on Windows. It's okay on the Mac, but the user interface feels nothing like any other Windows app and it just feels totally out of place on Windows.

This tactic of installing it via Software Update is more aggressive and sneakier than anything we've ever seen by Microsoft. It's essentially a virus when distributed this way. Boo Apple!
post #17 of 115
[QUOTE=djdj;1231919]There is no way that Safari is ever going to become popular on Windows. It's okay on the Mac, but the user interface feels nothing like any other Windows app and it just feels totally out of place on Windows.

Maybe Apple's idea is to get Windows users used to the Mac interface, the easier to make it for them to switch to a Mac!
post #18 of 115
Quote:
Originally Posted by djdj View Post

This tactic of installing it via Software Update is more aggressive and sneakier than anything we've ever seen by Microsoft.

You can't possibly be serious... as if Microsoft has never aggressively and sneakily pushed anything out through Windows Update? Wow.
post #19 of 115
Kick @$$!!!
post #20 of 115
When Safari was first released for Windows last year I gave it a try: bloatware was my best description of the program. To be true, iTunes on Windows isn't much better -- it's just not snappy. At the time I checked out the task manager and remember being unsurprised to find that Safari was using twice as much memory as Firefox. Can anyone report that this has changed (the amount of memory that Safari uses)?

And then there is the aesthetics of Safari in Windows -- "One of these things is not like the other things."
post #21 of 115
I use Firefox on both my PC and the Mac and refuse to waste time on anything else. I'm surprised that Apple would push Safari onto Windows users. Is that a first step to drafting PC users onto Macs?
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post #22 of 115
It is a good strategy to demo the apple user interface with Safari to PC user; however, there are websites that cannot be displayed in Safari. Besides the security issues, I think Apple engineer should work at the compatibility in next and future revision. I try to use Safari every time a new update pops up, but I keep switch back to IE after I get into some financial websites does not even support Safari.
post #23 of 115
I'd rather Apple dump Safari and just pre-package Camino with Mac OS X.

For that matter, they can dump iWork also and dedicate those development resources towards contributing to the OpenOffice Aqua project.
post #24 of 115
Quote:
Originally Posted by djdj View Post

This tactic of installing it via Software Update is more aggressive and sneakier than anything we've ever seen by Microsoft. It's essentially a virus when distributed this way. Boo Apple!

How about distributing a browser that can't be uninstalled?
post #25 of 115
Quote:
Originally Posted by djdj View Post

This tactic of installing it via Software Update is more aggressive and sneakier than anything we've ever seen by Microsoft. It's essentially a virus when distributed this way. Boo Apple!

You're forgetting the "Genuine Advantage", which is not an advantage for the user. So, no, Microsoft has done done a lot worse. At least Safari doesn't threaten to cripple your computer if something isn't quite right.
post #26 of 115
Quote:
Originally Posted by djdj View Post

There is no way that Safari is ever going to become popular on Windows. It's okay on the Mac, but the user interface feels nothing like any other Windows app and it just feels totally out of place on Windows.

This tactic of installing it via Software Update is more aggressive and sneakier than anything we've ever seen by Microsoft. It's essentially a virus when distributed this way. Boo Apple!

I assume you are kidding ... right?

As more Windows users try a Mac type app such as iTunes and now safari it makes them realize what an ugly interface they have suffered thus far.
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post #27 of 115
Just trying it out, seems nice but there are two things keeping me on firefox.

- I like having more screen space so I have moved the menu bar and tool bar onto one line
- I hate ads a windows safari adblock would be good
post #28 of 115
Quote:
Originally Posted by beaveyOne View Post

You can't possibly be serious... as if Microsoft has never aggressively and sneakily pushed anything out through Windows Update? Wow.

The guy you replied to had to have been being sarcastic ... surely???
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post #29 of 115
Quote:
Originally Posted by nacnud View Post

Just trying it out, seems nice but there are two things keeping me on firefox.

- I like having more screen space so I have moved the menu bar and tool bar onto one line
- I hate ads a windows safari adblock would be good

Safari does have an adblock plugin for Mac... but I guess there's not enought marketshare to develop it for windows quite yet.
post #30 of 115
Quote:
Originally Posted by djdj View Post

There is no way that Safari is ever going to become popular on Windows. It's okay on the Mac, but the user interface feels nothing like any other Windows app and it just feels totally out of place on Windows.

I've seen Safari on Vista, and I'll probably agree with you on this. Safari has a nice, clean interface. By comparison, IE7 is very cluttered. But its appearance just seems to jangle me in some way. The Mac people at Microsoft seem to put more effort into making their products fit into the visual scheme of its destination than Windows group at Apple do.

Quote:
Originally Posted by djdj View Post

This tactic of installing it via Software Update is more aggressive and sneakier than anything we've ever seen by Microsoft. It's essentially a virus when distributed this way. Boo Apple!

You're wrong here, though. This is not "more aggressive and sneakier than anything we've ever seen by Microsoft". Such a statement demonstrates a breathtaking ignorance of Microsoft's history. How about the infamous error message once upon a time that suggested Quicktime was causing problems, when it was doing no such thing, designed to scare people away from using Quicktime? What about "cutting off Netscape's air supply"?

And no, Safari is not "essentially a virus when distributed this way". That has to be the most inane thing I've read in a long, long time.
post #31 of 115
Just offered to load this afternoon - in France. Said "Nice trick !" and decided to download just to check on my PC for my blog and multi-platform tests for my blog. Smooth install, and all my URLs in FIREFOX were present and fully functional. Meanwhile I'll stay with FF on my MAC and PC.http://forums.appleinsider.com/image...ies/1smile.gif
post #32 of 115
I have had the Safari Beta on my work PC for some time, now. It's great. It brings the absolutely golden "find text" feature built into Leopard, which is used most notably in Mac Safari. That alone is worth the switch. There are still some websites that are broken in Safari but work in Firefox or IE, but if the user base for Safari increases, the number of these will diminish.
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post #33 of 115
Those who only tried the initial public 3.0.x Windows beta should give 3.1 a try. It is actually very snappy, and no longer does bizarre things like putting menus in the title bar. Also, if you turn the font smoothing down the font differences aren't as garish as they are by default. And being able to resize text entry areas and search using Safari's search is awfully nice.
post #34 of 115
Quote:
Originally Posted by djdj View Post

It's essentially a virus when distributed this way. Boo Apple!


OH the DRAMA! A virus, hahahaha.
post #35 of 115
Pop up blocker is in the preferences section under security, turn it on and the ads are gone. I've been using Safari on my pos windows machine at work and at least I can avoid IE which is the biggest pile of dung that I have ever seen.
post #36 of 115
[QUOTE=mdcat;1231923]
Quote:
Originally Posted by djdj View Post

There is no way that Safari is ever going to become popular on Windows. It's okay on the Mac, but the user interface feels nothing like any other Windows app and it just feels totally out of place on Windows.

WTF are you talking about?

I use Windows and Macs 50/50 and nothing is consistent in Windows so Safari isn't going to stand out in some bizarre way, other than maybe looking better than 90% of the apps you use in Windows. On Windows, the interface is all a massive jumble, nothing even remotely close to the level of consistency you see in OS X applications (which is mostly encouraged in Apple's programming tools like Interface Builder which makes it easy for developers to comply with a standard look.) Safari will come with its own look and interface concepts, exactly like every other Windows app out there.
post #37 of 115
Quote:
Originally Posted by polvadis View Post

I use Firefox on both my PC and the Mac and refuse to waste time on anything else. I'm surprised that Apple would push Safari onto Windows users. Is that a first step to drafting PC users onto Macs?


Actually it's probably more to the tune of getting people use to the same browser that's on the iPhone/iPT. The more people using Safari will also mean more web developers supporting Safari.
post #38 of 115
This is just plain stupid. This now opens the door for other companies to do the same in OS X and Apple won't be able to complain because they have done it.
post #39 of 115
Quote:
Originally Posted by djdj View Post

There is no way that Safari is ever going to become popular on Windows. It's okay on the Mac, but the user interface feels nothing like any other Windows app and it just feels totally out of place on Windows.

This tactic of installing it via Software Update is more aggressive and sneakier than anything we've ever seen by Microsoft. It's essentially a virus when distributed this way. Boo Apple!

While it's delivered through Apple Software Update, it's not as if it's marked as an update - it's marked as "New software is available for your computer." Then it gives you a description of what it is.

Your average Microsoft update is "Microsoft Product X Update #F23489749023"... or is something new (WGA, or the phishing filter tools, or something like that) being pushed as required update that you can't put on an ignore list.
post #40 of 115
Quote:
Originally Posted by lantzn View Post

Actually it's probably more to the tune of getting people use to the same browser that's on the iPhone/iPT. The more people using Safari will also mean more web developers supporting Safari.

I agree a100% ... [Shouting] Are you listening you morons that program the MLS system for Realtors that only works in IE? We use Macs and iPhones now and need Safari support! I am sick of having to run Windows for only one reason! [/Shouting]
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