Where Does the GOP Find These People? - Page 2

Originally Posted by vinea

The linkage is minimal...but it won't be good for Obama anyway.

Originally Posted by jimmac

Maybe because it's kind of a nonissue.

Holy Christ! A man running for President is friends with an actual terrorist (who says he wishes he committed more terror in his day) and it's a non-issue!??!?!

Originally Posted by SDW2001

Minimal? He's admitted having a friendly relationship with him. He served ona board with him. He's spoken at events with him.

Jesus! Put things in perspective!

You have heard the phrase : " Making something out of nothing "

So like you think he and Obama are going to blow something up tomorrow?

Our fearless leader is still friends with the family of the guy who plotted 911! I'd be more worried about that!

And he IS president! That didn't seem to bother you.

Originally Posted by SDW2001

Holy Christ! A man running for President is friends with an actual terrorist (who says he wishes he committed more terror in his day) and it's a non-issue!??!?!

Day in and day out I go about my business, I hang out with my kids and my grandchildren, take care of the elders, I go to work, I teach and I write, I organize and I participate in the never-ending effort to build a powerful movement for peace and social justice; now and then (and unpredictably) I appear in the newspapers or on TV with a reference to my book Fugitive Days, a memoir of the revolutionary action and militant resistance to the Viet Nam War—the years of miracle and wonder—and some fantastic assertions about what I did, what I said, and what I believe. The other night, for example, I heard Sean Hannity tell Senator John McCain that I was an unrepentant terrorist who had written an article on September 11, 2001 extolling bombings against the U.S., and even advocating more terrorist bombs. Senator McCain couldn’t believe it, and neither could I.

“We did the right thing” was taken again and again to be evidence of an obtuse refusal to apologize, proof that my various wrong-doings had not been adequately recognized. I’ve failed to fess up, I’m told, and my transgressions, then, are enduring, on-going. Without a full-throated confession, whole-hearted and complete, uncomplicated by fact or detail or even by my own interpretations, and then, without the crucial detail, saying the words, “I’m sorry,” something vital is missing.

Originally Posted by SDW2001


That is a lie.

The programme also revealed that Bush and his father received fees from Carlyle Corporation -- a little known company that became one of America's largest defence contractors -- in which the bin Ladens held a stake, which was sold off after the September 11 terror attacks.

The programme said it had obtained evidence that the FBI was on the trail of bin Laden family members living in United States before, as well as after, the terrorist attacks.

For six years, John O'Neill was the FBI's leading expert on Al Qaeda. He warned of it's reach.
He warned of it's threat to the U.S. But to the people at FBI headquarters, O'Neill was to much of a maverick, and they stopped listening to him.
He left the FBI in the summer of 2001 and took a new job as head of security at the World Trade Center.

But in fact, the Bush-Carlyle relationship began eight years earlier when the Carlyle Group put George W. Bush on the board of one of its subsidiaries, Caterair, in 1990. In 1993, after the Bush-Quayle administration left office and George H. W. Bush and James Baker were free to join the private sector, the Bush family's relationship with the Carlyle Group began to become substantive. By the end of that year, key figures at the Carlyle Group included such powerful Bush colleagues as James Baker, Frank Carlucci, and Richard Darman. Because George W. Bush's role at Carlyle had been marginal, the $1.4 billion figure includes no contracts that predated the arrival of Baker, Carlucci and Darman at Carlyle. With former Secretary of Defense Carlucci guiding the acquisition of defense companies, Carlyle finally began making real money from the Saudis, both through investments from the royal family, the bin Ladens and other members of the Saudi elite, and through lucrative defense investments.[4]

The bin Ladens Great Escape
How the U.S. helped Osama's family leave the country after 9/11.

Michael Isikoff also argued there was nothing extraordinary about the evacuation of the Saudis because the Tampa airport had reopened. Unger disagreed, noting, "Commercial aviation slowly resumed on September 13, but at 10:57 am that day, the Federal Aviation Administration issued a Notice to Airmen stating that private aviation was still banned. Three planes violated that order and were forced down by American military aircraft that day. Yet the Saudis were allowed to fly on the ten passenger Learjet. … The Tampa to Lexington flight is vital because it required permission from the highest levels of our government. If it were just another normal flight, why would anyone go to a crisis-stricken White House to get permission for the Saudis to fly?"

Originally Posted by jimmac


I don't think I'm the one having the issue there, champ.



So just so I have this right: It's "nothing" that Obama is friendly with an avowed terrorist, one who bombed the Pentagon and NYC Police headquarters, etc?



Strawman. Of course I don't think that. No one thinks that. What I do think is that it's perfectly appropriate to question the man's judgment for being friendly with a TERRORIST.



That is a lie.

Originally Posted by @_@ Artman

Click these links, don't worry SDW, your house won't explode.

William Ayers explains how and why his quotations in the reputed NYT article (and other media outlets) were taken out of context and were distorted.

Episodic Notoriety–Fact and Fantasy



I’M SORRY!!!! i think….



Also, being an old fart like me I vaguely recall the Weathermen and their nasty deeds. There was a documentary on it that explains their purpose and their acts of domestic terror. Of which in most cases caused only property damage. The only time lives were regrettably (luckily, depending on one's view of them) lost were their own when they blew themselves up constructing bombs. After that incident, the group quickly became disarrayed and split up, disavowed and gone from time.

The Weather Underground, 2002 documentary.

Whether the federal authorities overstepped their legal boundaries in pursuing the Weathermen doesn't matter, because I believe the charges against them were not unfounded. Neither do I condone their actions. But time heals emotional wounds and property damage. Ayers has no more ties with domestic terrorism and has become a Distinguished Professor of Education at the University of Illinois at Chicago, and a board of directors of the Woods Fund of Chicago, an anti-poverty, philanthropic foundation.

Get over your hate (or ignorance) and move on to more relevant topics.

Originally Posted by jimmac


BIN L-A-D-E-N.



I'm just asking. The Bin Laudens were also partners when " W " was head of an oil company.

Check it out for yourself. I know you porbably don't want to believe it but this was even in the movie " Fahrenheight 9 /11 ". Now you might not agree with Moore's conclusions but the facts are there.

Sorry if you don't like it but you started this.

In the interval between Moore's triumph at Cannes and the release of the film in the United States, the 9/11 commission has found nothing to complain of in the timing or arrangement of the flights. And Richard Clarke, Bush's former chief of counterterrorism, has come forward to say that he, and he alone, took the responsibility for authorizing those Saudi departures. This might not matter so much to the ethos of Fahrenheit 9/11, except that—as you might expect—Clarke is presented throughout as the brow-furrowed ethical hero of the entire post-9/11 moment. And it does not seem very likely that, in his open admission about the Bin Laden family evacuation, Clarke is taking a fall, or a spear in the chest, for the Bush administration. So, that's another bust for this windy and bloated cinematic "key to all mythologies."

Originally Posted by SDW2001

"I know you porbably don't want to believe it but this was even in the movie " Fahrenheight 9 /11 "




http://www.slate.com/id/2102723/ Linky.

You know, I almost can't believe you're actually still repeating the tired "Bush and bin Laden's family" thing, then trying to claim it's the same as Obama personally being friends with an actual terrorist. Wait...yes I can. It's you.

Originally Posted by SDW2001

Pardon me, but you're effing kidding me, right? HE STILL THINKS THEY DID THE RIGHT THING. He thinks using terrorism to end the war was regrettable and not something he is proud of...but he STILL THINKS IT WAS RIGHT. The man is a terrorist. And you think because he's a "distinguished professor" and doesn't bomb crap anymore, it's A-OK.

Mother of God.

Originally Posted by @_@ Artman

It has to stop.

Originally Posted by Jubelum

Now, Artman, you're being a little nuts here.
We could just surrender what is left of the republic... \

RUSH: That's what we're trying to do. You don't bring them together. We don't bring people together. That's not how this country works. We defeat our political adversaries so that they're in the minority.

Originally Posted by @_@ Artman

[CENTER]

Screw the World! Riot in Denver! [/CENTER]

We don't burn our cars. We don't burn down our houses. We don't kill our children. We don't do half the things the American left does.

Originally Posted by jimmac

Nice opinion piece from Slate.

Like I said the facts are there no matter what conclusions you draw.

Well then you admit that he had dealings with the Bin ladens?

I have many links in case you don't.

And there's nothing tired about it. Well nothing older than say the Obama Ayers thing. You seem to thing if there's wrong doing it fades with age. Kind of like the satute of limitations.

And about the Bin Laudens I'm sure they're all just a bunch of down home people much different than that one infamous family member right?

All I'm saying is the kind of connection you're trying to make between Obama and Ayers is just as questionable.

As a matter of fact there are a lot of other questionable things one could bring up about our president's dealings but I'll refrain for now.

Like I said you're the one who started this.

Originally Posted by @_@ Artman

Bill Moyers interviews the Reverend Jeremiah Wright.

I don't know how anyone with a soul could watch this interview and not think Jeremiah Wright is a great man.

Still waiting for S(o) D(amn) W(hat) to post some factual basis that Ayers is still a bomb toting terrorist sympathizer.

While we wait, I suggest others watch this interview.

Have a nice day.

Originally Posted by @_@ Artman

"WAS"

The sad fact is that you are the only one here who believes that and will not show anything he said (not out of context, mind you) he still supports domestic terrorism.

The only one here is you SDW and other people who believe this crap. Out of thirty odd people on this PO forum you're all alone. You stand alone on only a few and this one has no more legs to stand on.

Like I said, move on, this doesn't concern me anymore and neither it should you.

Sweet Holy Spaghetti Monster.

<rant>One other thing, Where Does the GOP Find These People? From the ones who support McCain. The same way the DNC stand up to a conniving bitch Hilary Clinton. Also to blame are the misinformed and misguided people who vote or support the corrupt inept clowncar of politicians we've had through the years. We have to stop being ignorant of the facts and aware of the lies. If we don't the whole political system will continue into this cycle. It has to stop.</rant>

Originally Posted by SDW2001

I think you mean Truthy Facts, like "Bush flew the bin Ladens out of the country." Of course, this is nonsense.

Phantom Flight From Florida
The hastily arranged flight out of Raytheon Airport Services, a private hangar on the outskirts of Tampa International Airport, was anything but ordinary. It lifted off the tarmac at a time when every private plane in the nation was grounded due to safety concerns after the Sept. 11 attacks.

Local and federal authorities will say little about the flight.

``It's not in our logs ... it didn't occur,'' said Chris White, spokesman for the Federal Aviation Administration's regional office in Atlanta.

In less than two hours, the Lear landed at the Blue Grass airport, where the passengers were met by Saudi security officials, Grossi said. He and Perez saw several private 747s parked on the tarmac with foreign flags on the tails and Arabic lettering on the sides.

"Three private planes violated the ban that day, and in each case a pair of jet fighters quickly forced the aircraft down," writes Unger. Yet the Saudi flight, he says, was allowed to travel undisturbed.

Vanity Fair suggests that that was the result of some sort of intervention by the Bush White House. But administration sources tell National Review they have looked into the matter and found no record of such a flight receiving any special permission to fly. The sources also say that charter aviation was allowed to resume on the morning of September 13, several hours before the Tampa-to-Lexington flight is said to have departed, which would mean that the plane, which Vanity Fair says was chartered, did not need any clearance to fly.

For example, a former FBI agent and a former member of the Tampa Police Department reportedly told Vanity Fair and the Tampa Tribune that they accompanied three Saudi men as bodyguards from Tampa, Florida, to Lexington, Kentucky, on a private jet on September 13.The FAA's ban on private aviation was not lifted until September 16,2001

I'm not aware of the others having terrorist ties...are you?

At least several members of the bin Laden family who had been in the United States may have been under examination by U.S. and other investigators.Vanity Fair reported that "secret FBI documents" describe a 1996 investigation of Abdullah and Omar bin Laden, who were associated with the American branch of the World Assembly of Muslim Youth, a charity that allegedly was involved in supporting terrorism.

These documents also reportedly show that the file on Abdullah and Omar was reopened on September 19,2001 ."I In addition, Vanity Fair reported that Khalil bin Laden had come to the attention of Brazilian authorities for "possible terrorist connections" and that he was on one of the post-September 11 evacuation flights out of the U.S.

Originally Posted by SDW2001

I think you mean Truthy Facts, like "Bush flew the bin Ladens out of the country." Of course, this is nonsense.



Loose and convoluted dealings...none with bin Laden himself. In fact, he has no real dealing with the family anymore. It's an extremely weak case. His family happens be prominent and own a large construction company. It's not surprising they may have been involved in business dealing with any number of US firms.


Your links aren't factual. They are Truthy.



And Obama has still not answered questions on it. How can that be? We're not talking about some loose associations. We're talking about a friendly relationship over a period of years...with the terrorist HIMSELF. I can't believe you'd think the two situations are comparable.



I'm not aware of the others having terrorist ties...are you?



No, it's not. It's clear as day. He has a friendly relationship with a terrorist...one who to this day thinks he did the right thing. Not the same at all. It would be like Bush being friendly with Osama bin Laden himself...or Timothy McVeigh, or whomever.



Actually, I'm not the one who started anything. You seem to believe that the indefensible can now be defended. It doesn't matter that he sat in the pew of a church with an anti-American, racist pastor for 20 year. It doesn't matter that the man baptized his children. It doesn't matter that he went to the million man march. It doesn't matter that his wife said "In 2008 America is a mean country." It doesn't matter that he's friends with a terrorist. It doesn't matter that he runs a campaign based on Change™ and Hope™ and then runs attack ads in PA. None of it matters, "because Americans are tired of this kind of politics."

If he means Americans are tired of questioning the associations and judgment of a potential POTUS, he's got another thing coming.

Originally Posted by SDW2001

Yeah, and Obama Christ will solve all of that. See, he's different. He understands us! He wants Change OMG I'm going to cum!

Originally Posted by SDW2001
Yeah, and Obama Christ will solve all of that. See, he's different. He understands us! He wants Change™ OMG I'm going to cum!

Originally Posted by addabox

I'm always struck by how this (pathetic strawman) closely mirrors that which is used to dismiss Apple products, particularly the iPhone.

The idea, of course, is to deprecate any salient reasons for preferring one thing over another as the product of mindless, irrational devotion.

That being the inverse of attributing the dislike of something to a witless, primitive animus that precedes thought or discrimination (i.e. "Bush derangement syndrome").

Hey, SDW, how great for you: everyone that disagrees with you is in the thrall of a compulsion! No discourse necessary! You just have to habitually point out how robotic and knee-jerk everyone is! Over and over and over again!

Originally Posted by jimmac

" Your links aren't factual. They are Truthy. "

Then what are yours? An opinion piece from a guy that doesn't like Moore?

Well one thing this tells me is that if your side is dredging the bottom for crap like this you must be worried.

I would be to. Your fearless leader has screwed his own party.

I was talking to a longtime friend who lives in L.A. yesterday. He used to be a Bush supporter ( like many ). He agreed with me that Bush has almost run this country into the ground. In our lifetime we've never seen a worse combination of mismangement.

And about McCain. Well we also agreed that this country can't take another 4 years of the same garbage or worse.

We need real change.

But as for yourself you'll never change.

You'll still be saying the same old thing when there's someone else in the Whitehouse ( not a republican ) and things are slowly starting to improve. Of course you'll blame it on something else or give the republicans credit somehow.

Oh! And by the way : " It doesn't matter that he sat in the pew of a church with an anti-American, racist pastor for 20 year. "

You forgot the " S " in Years! Plural not singular.

Originally Posted by midwinter

Impressive bit of hair-splitting there. He's a terrorist! I mean, not now, but he was! So he is! Does this logic mean that you're still a Santorum supporter?

Well, you gotta love a terrorist who sends a nice note telling everyone when and where the act of terrorism will occur How terrifying!

Agreed. He's out of jail. He's a contributing member of society. He doesn't blow things up.

Maybe you haven't noticed, but Bush is still wreaking havoc on the world.

That would be YOUR PARTY that did that. And Lott seems fairly ascendant these days.

Don't forget that horrible Republican Robert "KKK" Byrd!

Originally Posted by midwinter

Hey, it was your logic, not mine. But you might begin splitting those hairs a little better by asking what the difference is between a terrorism and murder.

And you still think invading Iraq was teh Awesome™. People can do that, you know. I mean, you're completely, utterly, wrong to think so, but hey. Thems the brakes.

You think Bush has been spreading love and rose-petals around the globe since 2003?

Pardon? The GOP turned on his ass like a pack of rabid dogs. Jesus. You'll argue anything, won't you?

Yup. That one.

Actually, I disagree with Bush in many areas. I'm just not going to blame him for things that he has nothing to do with.



Actually...and I want you to read carefully: I'm not worried at all. Obama will not win.



I think you meant "too."



Color me shocked: Another jimmac personal anecdote that is supposed to mean something, but doesn't.



I think you mean CHANGE™!!! And what change, specifically, will Barack Jesus Christ Obama bring? Ending This War™? Giving People Hope™? Oh...I'll take Universal Healthcare™ for $500, Alex!



Now that's just silly.



I'll give credit where it's due. And tell me, what policy does Obama favor that will "turn things around?" I'm curious.



See, that's what we call an ACTUAL TYPO. Posting "site" instead of "cite" is not a typo. Posting bin Lauden instead of "bin Laden" is not a typo.

Originally Posted by SDW2001

I think invading Iraq was the right thing to do at the time.

Originally Posted by SDW2001

I agree. Except it's not just from Bush...it's a bi-partisan effort. I happen to think it's stupid too. Don't get me wrong, the SDW iPhone fund loves it!