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History has been made - Page 3

post #81 of 151
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post

This chart is way, way off. Paul is more "authoritarian" than Gravel? Someone's been smoking crack.

Those charts are pretty much shit categorically.
To be worth anything IMHO, they need to be issue-by-issue.
"Stand Up for Chuck"
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"Stand Up for Chuck"
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post #82 of 151
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post

This chart is way, way off. Paul is more "authoritarian" than Gravel? Someone's been smoking crack.

It is off. Rudy is more to left of McCain. I'd put Obama more to the left of Edwards.
post #83 of 151
I'd put Nader to the right of Tancredo.*
post #84 of 151
I'm not sure how authori/liber-tarian Nader would be. He strikes me as the type of person that would regulate so much that the government would reach into every aspect of life.
post #85 of 151
Quote:
Originally Posted by mydo View Post

I might say African-German but then the "black" guy I know from Holland had his parents come from Suriname. I don't even try to guess.


In the future we'll all just be gray, like aliens.


Thor! Buddy!!!
post #86 of 151
Quote:
Originally Posted by midwinter View Post

You know, my gut reaction is to say "yeah! I agree!" and then I start thinking about the long line of non-white PMs in Britain, non-white presidents in France, non-white chancellors in Germany, non-white presidents of Italy....

The Netherlands? Switzerland? The nordic countries? Eastern Europe?

Are there ANY industrialized countries in the West that have elected a leader who was not of the majority race/ethnicity?

With that said, I certainly hope America's image abroad changes. I get tired of pretending to be a Canadian when I'm across the pond.

Well the history of USA en Europe is not exactly the same. The equal rights for black and white in USA are not so old (just a few decades).
Of course France, germany or any other european country are not perfect at all and this is not the subject.
I just found that the symbolism of a black bi racial president will be great. Of course only politic is important, but Obamas can take advantage of it's symbolism, especially for foreign politic.
post #87 of 151
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Powerdoc View Post

Well the history of USA en Europe is not exactly the same. The equal rights for black and white in USA are not so old (just a few decades).
Of course France, germany or any other european country are not perfect at all and this is not the subject.
I just found that the symbolism of a black bi racial president will be great. Of course only politic is important, but Obamas can take advantage of it's symbolism, especially for foreign politic.

Powerdoc I don't care which skin color you have, which continent you live within.

Powerdoc you RULE!

Fellows
May the peace of the Lord be with you always

Share your smile, Have respect for others, and be loving to all peoples

Paul in Athens: Acts 17 : 16-34
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May the peace of the Lord be with you always

Share your smile, Have respect for others, and be loving to all peoples

Paul in Athens: Acts 17 : 16-34
Reply
post #88 of 151
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fellowship View Post

Powerdoc I don't care which skin color you have, which continent you live within.

Powerdoc you RULE!

Fellows

Thanks
Yes I don't care either about skin color, or countrie, but I think that Obama is the best candidate, to embody a new US foreign policy. Many people outside USA still represent this country as an imperialist and somewhat racist and slavery countrie (it's untrue, USA is multicolored and multicultural, while europe did not understand, that she is becoming this way). What best proof to give to the rest of the world that it is untrue : the fact that Obama is elected demonstrated that US citizen doesn't care at all about the skin color of their president. In my book, that will be huge.
Note also, that this is only possible with Obama, because Obama said that he is not the candidate of black people or any other ethnic group, he is the candidate for the presidence of USA, in order to represent any US people.
I don't follow much, US politic, but I just found this message great. That's said I still think that Bush foreign politic is a disaster.
post #89 of 151
Quote:
Originally Posted by Powerdoc View Post

I just found that the symbolism of a black bi racial president will be great. Of course only politic is important, but Obamas can take advantage of it's symbolism, especially for foreign politic.

Absolutement.
Gangs are not seen as legitimate, because they don't have control over public schools.
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Gangs are not seen as legitimate, because they don't have control over public schools.
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post #90 of 151
Powerdoc I'm sure Obama sounds great to people outside the US for many in the US his talk now doesn't match his actions of the recent past. Obama talks about being "post racial" but come to find out his long time church is into "black liberation theology" and he has staff members from NOI. He tries to play that he is apolitical but then you look at the record and it's straight southside Chicago politics. Says he can work bipartisan but never has.

The Obamaiacs here think the election is wrapped up and "McCancer" doesn't stand a chance. I'm worried that over confidence and blinders to our canidate's weak points will leave us supine when November comes.
post #91 of 151
Quote:
Originally Posted by mydo View Post

Powerdoc I'm sure Obama sounds great to people outside the US for many in the US his talk now doesn't match his actions of the recent past. Obama talks about being "post racial" but come to find out his long time church is into "black liberation theology" and he has staff members from NOI. He tries to play that he is apolitical but then you look at the record and it's straight southside Chicago politics. Says he can work bipartisan but never has.

The Obamaiacs here think the election is wrapped up and "McCancer" doesn't stand a chance. I'm worried that over confidence and blinders to our canidate's weak points will leave us supine when November comes.

Um, first, where does Obama talk about being "post-racial?"

And second, "liberation theology" is a Catholic movement. Trinity UCC is not Catholic.

Third, I think every Obama fan here thinks the election will be *very* close.
post #92 of 151
Quote:
Originally Posted by ShawnJ View Post

Um, first, where does Obama talk about being "post-racial?"

Dig it. The top hits are conservative publications using the term. It's sort of like McCain being a maverick, I guess.

Quote:
And second, "liberation theology" is a Catholic movement. Trinity UCC is not Catholic.

Maybe mydo meant Black Liberation Theology?

Quote:
Third, I think every Obama fan here thinks the election will be *very* close.

I think Obama can pull 300+ electoral votes. Maybe 350.
Gangs are not seen as legitimate, because they don't have control over public schools.
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Gangs are not seen as legitimate, because they don't have control over public schools.
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post #93 of 151
Quote:
Originally Posted by midwinter View Post

Maybe mydo meant Black Liberation Theology

That's interesting.

I stand corrected!
post #94 of 151
From the church's web site.

http://www.tucc.org/talking_points.htm


I guess I'm not quoting Obama with "post-racial" but this NYT article sums it up.

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/02/12/us...=1&oref=slogin


Which I found from Huff-Po

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/jeff-c...-_b_86312.html


Obama is racial when he needs to get votes on the south side and then when he hits the national stage he's post racial. He's a chameleon like the rest.
post #95 of 151
Quote:
Originally Posted by mydo View Post

From the church's web site.

http://www.tucc.org/talking_points.htm

How horrible!

Quote:
To have a church whose theological perspective starts from the vantage point of Black liberation theology being its center, is not to say that African or African American people are superior to any one else.

African-centered thought, unlike Eurocentrism, does not assume superiority and look at everyone else as being inferior.

There is more than one center from which to view the world. In the words of Dr. Janice Hale, Difference does not mean deficience. It is from this vantage point that Black liberation theology speaks.

Truly antiAmerican!

Quote:
I guess I'm not quoting Obama with "post-racial" but this NYT article sums it up.

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/02/12/us...=1&oref=slogin

If Obama didn't claim it, then he ain't claiming it. The pundits are using it to talk about as the potential death of identity politics.



You should read the comments.

Quote:
Obama is racial when he needs to get votes on the south side and then when he hits the national stage he's post racial. He's a chameleon like the rest.

What does that mean? How is he "racial"? What do you mean when you say "racial"?
Gangs are not seen as legitimate, because they don't have control over public schools.
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Gangs are not seen as legitimate, because they don't have control over public schools.
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post #96 of 151
Blinders. Anyway he belongs to Trinity and hires NOI when he needs the votes and then toss them under the bus when he needs to get post racial. Discussion are easier when when we don't deny reality.


NYT helps out with a puff piece on Michelle. Thanks NYT.
post #97 of 151
Quote:
Originally Posted by mydo View Post

Blinders. Anyway he belongs to Trinity and hires NOI when he needs the votes and then toss them under the bus when he needs to get post racial. Discussion are easier when when we don't deny reality.


NYT helps out with a puff piece on Michelle. Thanks NYT.

Hey look, there's that "toss under the bus" thing again. It's like crack.
They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
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They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
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post #98 of 151
Certainly Wright flat out asked Obama to toss him. Obama was right to do it. Obama remade himself for the national stage. That's politics and Obama is just like all the rest. Make no mistake. It's all a calculation.\
post #99 of 151
Quote:
Originally Posted by mydo View Post

Blinders. Anyway he belongs to Trinity and hires NOI when he needs the votes and then toss them under the bus when he needs to get post racial. Discussion are easier when when we don't deny reality.


NYT helps out with a puff piece on Michelle. Thanks NYT.

[CENTER]
Quote:
Discussion are easier when when we don't deny reality.

[/CENTER]

Hmm, just wondering what racist things you'll say next. Humor us all with more of your running commentary, it's kind of cute seeing you throw yourself under your own bus.
Every eye fixed itself upon him; with parted lips and bated breath the audience hung upon his words, taking no note of time, rapt in the ghastly fascinations of the tale. NOT!
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Every eye fixed itself upon him; with parted lips and bated breath the audience hung upon his words, taking no note of time, rapt in the ghastly fascinations of the tale. NOT!
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post #100 of 151
Quote:
Originally Posted by mydo View Post

Blinders. Anyway he belongs to Trinity and hires NOI when he needs the votes and then toss them under the bus when he needs to get post racial. Discussion are easier when when we don't deny reality.


NYT helps out with a puff piece on Michelle. Thanks NYT.

You didn't answer my question. What do you mean when you say "racial"? What do you mean when you say Obama is "racial" on the southside?
Gangs are not seen as legitimate, because they don't have control over public schools.
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Gangs are not seen as legitimate, because they don't have control over public schools.
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post #101 of 151
Quote:
Originally Posted by franksargent View Post


Hmm, just wondering what racist things you'll say next. Humor us all with more of running commentary, it's kind of cute seeing you throw yourself under your own bus.

And Nigel has run over himself!
Gangs are not seen as legitimate, because they don't have control over public schools.
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Gangs are not seen as legitimate, because they don't have control over public schools.
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post #102 of 151
Quote:
Originally Posted by franksargent View Post


Hmm, just wondering what racist things you'll say next. Humor us all with more of running commentary, it's kind of cute seeing you throw yourself under your own bus.

WFT are you talking (typing) about? What racist thing have I posted?
post #103 of 151
Quote:
Originally Posted by midwinter View Post

You didn't answer my question. What do you mean when you say "racial"? What do you mean when you say Obama is "racial" on the southside?

I did you're just not wanting to read the answer. If you want to get elected on the south side of chicago you have to join the right church with the right politics. "black liberation theology" is the right politics to get elected. If you want the support of NOI you have to hand over some jobs. It's politics. That obviously doesn't play well on the national stage so when you announce you senate race you get your long time pastor to stay home for press event.
post #104 of 151
Quote:
Originally Posted by mydo View Post

I did you're just not wanting to read the answer. If you want to get elected on the south side of chicago you have to join the right church with the right politics. "black liberation theology" is the right politics to get elected. If you want the support of NOI you have to hand over some jobs. It's politics. That obviously doesn't play well on the national stage so when you announce you senate race you get your long time pastor to stay home for press event.

So when you say "racial" you mean "goes to a church based on black liberation theology"?
Gangs are not seen as legitimate, because they don't have control over public schools.
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Gangs are not seen as legitimate, because they don't have control over public schools.
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post #105 of 151
Sure. And uses that base to get elected. No politician just goes to a church. There's votes in those pews!
post #106 of 151
Quote:
Originally Posted by mydo View Post

Sure. And uses that base to get elected. No politician just goes to a church. There's votes in those pews!

So when you say "post-racial" you mean that he is no longer going to that church? What, then, does it mean to go to that church?
Gangs are not seen as legitimate, because they don't have control over public schools.
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Gangs are not seen as legitimate, because they don't have control over public schools.
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post #107 of 151
Quote:
Originally Posted by midwinter View Post

So when you say "post-racial" you mean that he is no longer going to that church? What, then, does it mean to go to that church?

Oh god you are boring. Read the links.
post #108 of 151
Have you read Obama's book? An entire chapter is devoted to faith. Not bad reading, and provides a background in to what Obama thinks, not what his church thinks.

 

Your = the possessive of you, as in, "Your name is Tom, right?" or "What is your name?"

 

You're = a contraction of YOU + ARE as in, "You are right" --> "You're right."

 

 

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Your = the possessive of you, as in, "Your name is Tom, right?" or "What is your name?"

 

You're = a contraction of YOU + ARE as in, "You are right" --> "You're right."

 

 

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post #109 of 151
I don't read books by politicians. That's a complete waste of time. He's writing what he wants you to hear from him. Which may be what he actually thinks. But there is almost no way for any of us to know if what he writes is what he thinks. I think Obama is basically an honest guy but ... he is running for office.
post #110 of 151
Quote:
Originally Posted by mydo View Post

Powerdoc I'm sure Obama sounds great to people outside the US for many in the US his talk now doesn't match his actions of the recent past. Obama talks about being "post racial" but come to find out his long time church is into "black liberation theology" and he has staff members from NOI. He tries to play that he is apolitical but then you look at the record and it's straight southside Chicago politics. Says he can work bipartisan but never has.

The Obamaiacs here think the election is wrapped up and "McCancer" doesn't stand a chance. I'm worried that over confidence and blinders to our canidate's weak points will leave us supine when November comes.

1) Yes, there is contradictions between today speech, and previous declarations. Is this an evolution, or is it political (saying what you want to hear) ?

2) McCancer is the favorite according to many european experts in political analysis.
post #111 of 151
Quote:
Originally Posted by mydo View Post

Oh god you are boring. Read the links.

Woot! Shawn! It only took two posts for mydo to give me a "boring"!

Anyway, mydo, I want you to tell me what you mean when you say that Obama is "racial" when it is politically expedient. You keep talking about the politically expedient part. I want to know what, precisely, it means for Barack Obama to be "racial."
Gangs are not seen as legitimate, because they don't have control over public schools.
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Gangs are not seen as legitimate, because they don't have control over public schools.
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post #112 of 151
Quote:
Originally Posted by mydo View Post

I don't read books by politicians. That's a complete waste of time. He's writing what he wants you to hear from him. Which may be what he actually thinks. But there is almost no way for any of us to know if what he writes is what he thinks. I think Obama is basically an honest guy but ... he is running for office.

... that all politicians sh!t smells the same, and further that all people's sh!t smells the same. Is that your abstract from your thesis dissertation on human body waste products?

It would really help us all out if you could flush out your thesis dissertation some more with respect to McCain's aromatic sh!t and Obama's aromatic sh!t and how all this sh!t gets turned in to policy positions and campaign platforms, that in fact, bare no relationship to said oders coming from each man's bodily excretions,
Every eye fixed itself upon him; with parted lips and bated breath the audience hung upon his words, taking no note of time, rapt in the ghastly fascinations of the tale. NOT!
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Every eye fixed itself upon him; with parted lips and bated breath the audience hung upon his words, taking no note of time, rapt in the ghastly fascinations of the tale. NOT!
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post #113 of 151
In the "How will they slime Obama?" thread, I said something like "they'll make him into the Nation of Islam Manchurian Candidate."

Then I googled this NOI connection that Mydo keeps refering to, and: Holy. Fucking . Shit.

The first ten pages were nothing but right wing blogs frantically reinforcing one another about Obama's deep and abiding ties to same, based, as far as I can make out, on pretty much nothing more than proximity and race.

Oh yeah, it's going to be a great campaign.
They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
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They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
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post #114 of 151
Quote:
Originally Posted by addabox View Post

In the "How will they slime Obama?" thread, I said something like "they'll make him into the Nation of Islam Manchurian Candidate."

Then I googled this NOI connection that Mydo keeps refering to, and: Holy. Fucking . Shit.

The first ten pages were nothing but right wing blogs frantically reinforcing one another about Obama's deep and abiding ties to same, based, as far as I can make out, on pretty much nothing more than proximity and race.

Oh yeah, it's going to be a great campaign.

One of my relatives is publishes one of the GOP whisper campaign email newsletters. My mother forwards them to me. I have *never* been able to track down his sources. It's amazing. Normally, you'd expect it to gathered from littlegreenfootballs or redstate or freerepublic, but no. This stuff is coming from somewhere else. In almost every one I've seen, he's become increasingly insistent upon an argument that Barack HUSSEIN* Obama is a "stealth Muslim."
Gangs are not seen as legitimate, because they don't have control over public schools.
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Gangs are not seen as legitimate, because they don't have control over public schools.
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post #115 of 151
Quote:
Originally Posted by midwinter View Post

One of my relatives is publishes one of the GOP whisper campaign email newsletters. My mother forwards them to me. I have *never* been able to track down his sources. It's amazing. Normally, you'd expect it to gathered from littlegreenfootballs or redstate or freerepublic, but no. This stuff is coming from somewhere else. In almost every one I've seen, he's become increasingly insistent upon an argument that Barack HUSSEIN* Obama is a "stealth Muslim."

Oh God, it's all coming back to me.

First, the ludicrous attacks that seem so outlandish they don't merit a response. But they keep getting repeated, until they're getting mentioned on mainstream news outlets. Which is used as "evidence", which reinforces the feedback loop, and pretty soon Newsweek is doing a cover story on Obama's Muslim Problem, or Time has a cover with Obama and Louis Farrakhan's heads in stark black and white and the text "A DREAM BETRAYED"

And you keep thinking, "No, no way, this is too stupid, how are we possibly even talking about this, have we all gone mad?"

And then SDW tells us we can't handle the truth, and Trumptman quietly snickers, and DMZ says something vehement and unintelligible in multiple font sizes.

And then the headaches start. The black, blood dimmed headaches.
They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
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They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
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post #116 of 151
Quote:
Originally Posted by addabox View Post

Oh God, it's all coming back to me.

First, the ludicrous attacks that seem so outlandish they don't merit a response. But they keep getting repeated, until they're getting mentioned on mainstream news outlets. Which is used as "evidence", which reinforces the feedback loop, and pretty soon Newsweek is doing a cover story on Obama's Muslim Problem, or Time has a cover with Obama and Louis Farrakhan's heads in stark black and white and the text "A DREAM BETRAYED"

And you keep thinking, "No, no way, this is too stupid, how are we possibly even talking about this, have we all gone mad?"

And then SDW tells us we can't handle the truth, and Trumptman quietly snickers, and DMZ says something vehement and unintelligible in multiple font sizes.

And then the headaches start. The black, blood dimmed headaches.

Yep, except you left out the bit about how the "rough beast, its hour come at last / Slouches toward Bethlehem to be born."
Gangs are not seen as legitimate, because they don't have control over public schools.
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post #117 of 151
Quote:
Originally Posted by midwinter View Post

Yep, except you left out the bit about how the "rough beast, its hour come at last / Slouches toward Bethlehem to be born."

I wish the fucker would get born already, or slouch on down the road, because this shit's been going on for way too long.

And for the sake of verisimilitude I should probably amend the above to say that, rather than quietly snicker, Trumpt will explain how it is that it's actually the Democrats that are stomping on the face of truth and reason, and we're just projecting.
They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
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They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
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post #118 of 151
Quote:
Originally Posted by addabox View Post

I wish the fucker would get born already, or slouch on down the road, because this shit's been going on for way too long.

Well, this ain't no country for old men.
Gangs are not seen as legitimate, because they don't have control over public schools.
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Gangs are not seen as legitimate, because they don't have control over public schools.
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post #119 of 151
Quote:
Originally Posted by @_@ Artman View Post

Here...



Is it me, or does this look like honesty too? I like honesty.

Yeah yeah. Real nice pic of a "terrorist fist jab" there Artman. Well, that's fox news's description of it anyways. I swear. You couldn't make sh*t like that up if you tried.

Terrorist fist jab

post #120 of 151
Quote:
Originally Posted by midwinter View Post

Well, this ain't no country for old men.

Even though we, too, are fastened to a dying animal.

Hey, maybe that could be McCain's new campaign slogan. Kind of a downer, sure, but bold.
They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
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They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
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