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How Will They Slime Obama? COMPETITION!

post #1 of 283
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There is an election coming up for Most Powerful Person in the World, and Barack Obama is going to be covered in GOP-snot in an attempt to see that he doesn't win. In this thread we post our predictions of how and say 'I told you so!' after the fact.

I was reading Brian Eno in Wired talking about the election, before the Democratic nominee was decided. Here is the link. Obama is going to have to fight the most vehement, venomous campaign of disinformation, he say. En bref:

Quote:
I thought the change of a mood in the country would enable Clinton to take a strongly liberal position and not have to apologize for it. She hasn't done that, because she dare not. She knows the knives are out for any sign on her part that she'll be "softer" than McCain — because she's trying to play him at his own game, instead of coming up with a different one.

As it turns out, it's Obama who is playing the different game. I hope that he will be the democratic candidate. I would be thrilled if he became the president. However, I think he will be cut to ribbons by the most disgraceful campaign any of us will ever have witnessed. He has to be discredited, and he will be, somehow.

I think he's probably right, going on past... oh, who am I kidding? He's definitely right. There are no depths to which they won't stoop because he really means it, he has a chance of winning, and John McCain is nearly 110 years old.

So, here are my predictions (eventually we should make this poll and decide rules and stuff. I'll buy the prize.)

1: They will go for his wife. They've begun by describing her as 'angry' and 'unpatriotic'. This is just the beginning; she'll be a liar, a fraud, a militant uppity nignog, probably a criminal. I bet you.
2: Obama will be in the pocket of lobbyists. Oh yeah. Go for the strengths. It will be 'But can Obama speak out against his own backers?'
3: Obama will be more left wing than Leon Trotsky. He wants to nationalise air and rain.
4: Obama will be a bad leader. 'He can't lead his party!/family!/sub-committee! Do we trust him to run the country?'

What are your suggestions? How low will they go, what will they say? Or will the attack machine... somehow just... forget that he's black and... OH SHIT

5: They will exploit racial tensions, animosity and misunderstanding in a very despicable way.
post #2 of 283
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hassan i Sabbah View Post

What are your suggestions? How low will they go, what will they say? Or will the attack machine... somehow just... forget that he's black and... OH SHIT

5: They will exploit racial tensions, animosity and misunderstanding in a very despicable way.

I think this will be the big one, honestly. Though, Obama is smart and realizes this. He's already started a counter-offensive by pretending he dances like a white man. I predict his next move will be to make a point of saying 'ask' a lot in his speeches, and not pronouncing it 'ax.'
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post #3 of 283
Even the slimiest of attacks can't change how cool that fist-bump was, however.
post #4 of 283
#1 and 5 with a single stone. The racial tensions will all be about his wife, his ex-pastor, people he has been on the lecture circuit with, people who gave him their endorsement, whether he asked them to give it or not...

He will be attacked through other people. But not directly, about who exactly Barack Hussein Obama is and what he stands for (besides "change").

And they will also attack "Change" as though they can honestly deny he would do more to change what's wrong in Washington than any other candidate, according to insignificant things like... you know... his stance on the issues... his plans and promises... you know that stuff that never matters as much as "French-looking" or "$200 haircut" or "Bitter wife" or "One o' the boys".
post #5 of 283
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hassan i Sabbah View Post

There is an election coming up for Most Powerful Person in the World, and Barack Obama is going to be covered in GOP-snot in an attempt to see that he doesn't win. In this thread we post our predictions of how and say 'I told you so!' after the fact.

I was reading Brian Eno in Wired talking about the election, before the Democratic nominee was decided. Here is the link. Obama is going to have to fight the most vehement, venomous campaign of disinformation, he say. En bref:



I think he's probably right, going on past... oh, who am I kidding? He's definitely right. There are no depths to which they won't stoop because he really means it, he has a chance of winning, and John McCain is nearly 110 years old.

So, here are my predictions (eventually we should make this poll and decide rules and stuff. I'll buy the prize.)

1: They will go for his wife. They've begun by describing her as 'angry' and 'unpatriotic'. This is just the beginning; she'll be a liar, a fraud, a militant uppity nignog, probably a criminal. I bet you.

He's put his wife out there to campaign and talk issues, and she's fair game. She's made inflammatory statements, statements that make some question her patriotism, etc.

Quote:


2: Obama will be in the pocket of lobbyists. Oh yeah. Go for the strengths. It will be 'But can Obama speak out against his own backers?'

I don't know about in the pocket of lobbyists, but he does come from the most corrupt political machine in the country. Is Rezko not fair game by the way?

Quote:
3: Obama will be more left wing than Leon Trotsky. He wants to nationalise air and rain.

Uh..except he is just that liberal. He's left wing in every sense of the term. He wants to "remake America" --and that's in his OWN words.

Quote:

4: Obama will be a bad leader. 'He can't lead his party!/family!/sub-committee! Do we trust him to run the country?'

I haven't heard this one, but he doesn't have executive experience of any kind.

[quote]

What are your suggestions? How low will they go, what will they say? Or will the attack machine... somehow just... forget that he's black and... OH SHIT

Quote:

5: They will exploit racial tensions, animosity and misunderstanding in a very despicable way.

Right...because the Democrats haven't been doing that for years! He attended a church for 20 years that is clearly racist and anti-American in its views. He's been friendly with racists and one avowed terrorist. But yeah, it's Republicans that are going to "exploit racial tensions." What an utter load of shit.
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post #6 of 283
I don't think they'll slime him, except to point out how liberal he is. As for race, they wont play that either. But you can bet you wont see a Republican outreach to West Virginians dissuading them he's not Saddam Hussein's Wahabi stepson who loaded the truck that went into the Marine barracks in Beirut and toasted 9/11 with Jewish blood.

The Economist echoed something I heard Stewart quip a couple of weeks back -- we've got a real chance of cutting the crap and hammering out some real 'stick with shit on both ends' issues.

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Why not just have a Obama/McCain ticket, McCain could be the vice president, call off the election, and spend all that money on roads and schools?

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and in that lies not liberation but alienation, the cutting off from things as they really are. --...

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post #7 of 283
Bookmark this page.

You know you'll need it.

Because since SDW WILL NEVER provide credible citations, we'll need all the ammo Obama supporters can get.

Now Snopes is not the end all be all of credibility either, but it's a start.
post #8 of 283
Quote:
Originally Posted by SDW2001 View Post

He's put his wife out there to campaign and talk issues, and she's fair game. She's made inflammatory statements, statements that make some question her patriotism, etc.

So question the issues she brings up.

No one questions another Presidential candidate's (or his family's) "patriotism" in good faith. It's insincere right-wing political correctness. Anyone who honestly raises these questions isn't the sharpest tool in the shed.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SDW2001 View Post

Uh..except he is just that liberal. He's left wing in every sense of the term. He wants to "remake America" --and that's in his OWN words.

You have no idea what Trotskyism is.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SDW2001 View Post

I haven't heard this one, but he doesn't have executive experience of any kind.

As opposed to all the executive experience that Senator McCain has in comparison.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SDW2001 View Post

Right...because the Democrats haven't been doing that for years! He attended a church for 20 years that is clearly racist and anti-American in its views. He's been friendly with racists and one avowed terrorist. But yeah, it's Republicans that are going to "exploit racial tensions." What an utter load of shit.

More right-wing political correctness.

Wright isn't the slightest bit "anti-American." Frankly it's dissappointing that you consider rhetoric slightly removed from boilerplate liberal sociopolitical criticism "anti-American." Am I anti-American, SDW? I happen to agree with much of what Wright says.
post #9 of 283
Don't worry, Sherri Palmer can defend herself..

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post #10 of 283
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Originally Posted by @_@ Artman View Post

Bookmark this page.

Yeah, that's my view of what's going to happen. McCain is going to take the high road, the media will fawn all over him for it, and the real negative campaign will involve all kinds of lies and photo-shopped images sent out over mass e-mail.
post #11 of 283
Quote:
Originally Posted by SDW2001 View Post

He's put his wife out there to campaign and talk issues, and she's fair game. She's made inflammatory statements, statements that make some question her patriotism, etc.



I don't know about in the pocket of lobbyists, but he does come from the most corrupt political machine in the country. Is Rezko not fair game by the way?



Uh..except he is just that liberal. He's left wing in every sense of the term. He wants to "remake America" --and that's in his OWN words.



I haven't heard this one, but he doesn't have executive experience of any kind.


Right...because the Democrats haven't been doing that for years! He attended a church for 20 years that is clearly racist and anti-American in its views. He's been friendly with racists and one avowed terrorist. But yeah, it's Republicans that are going to "exploit racial tensions." What an utter load of shit.

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post #12 of 283
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Originally Posted by franksargent View Post

[CENTER][/CENTER]

We're all Artman now.

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post #13 of 283
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post

We're all Artman now.


Hey. I wish I was an articulate, bright, clean, nice-looking, blue-eyed and blond haired Swede.
post #14 of 283
Isn't that Dolph Lundgren?

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Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post

Isn't that Dolph Lundgren?

Yes. Yes, it is.
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post #16 of 283
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post

Isn't that Dolph Lundgren?

Yes, and that's me, articulate, bright, clean, nice-looking midget on the left.
post #17 of 283
Quote:
Originally Posted by @_@ Artman View Post

Yes, and that's me, articulate, bright, clean, nice-looking midget on the left.

Who knew you were so adorable? And talk about a chick magnet!

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post #18 of 283
Hassan it really does not matter because Obama will be the next US President.

Who really cares how Obama is cast when it in the end will matter NOT.

Fellows
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post #19 of 283
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fellowship View Post

Hassan it really does not matter because Obama will be the next US President.

Who really cares how Obama is cast when it in the end will matter NOT.

Fellows

I agree. Obama has already been crowned by the media, and McCain is a pretty poor excuse for an alternative.

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post #20 of 283
Quote:
Originally Posted by SDW2001 View Post

He's put his wife out there to campaign and talk issues, and she's fair game. She's made inflammatory statements, statements that make some question her patriotism, etc.

According to the rules made up by my masters. They like the sound of the "fair game" meme because it starts to normalize their utterly amoral savagery.

Used your kids in a campaign ad? They're "fair game." Talked about overcoming illness as part of your biography? It's "fair game." Personal tragedy gets mentioned in your speeches? Fair game.

I trust that the same principal applies to McCain and we can start to speculate openly about how he collaborated with the Vietnamese to save his own ass. Or so says this email, prove that he didn't.

Quote:
I don't know about in the pocket of lobbyists, but he does come from the most corrupt political machine in the country. Is Rezko not fair game by the way?

Cool, more fair game! By all means, let's make the election about the candidates associates and campaign personnel. Let's talk about the Keating 5 and Phil Graham and lobbyists.

Fair game fair game fair game fair game!

Quote:
Uh..except he is just that liberal. He's left wing in every sense of the term. He wants to "remake America" --and that's in his OWN words.

Rather than just tossing about false scare quotes, what, specifically are the policies that Obama advocates that are so shockingly "liberal"? Maybe you could limit yourself to the ones that don't have broad support based on polling, since I know you don't to raise the specter of a country overrun by Trotskyists.

Quote:
Right...because the Democrats haven't been doing that for years! He attended a church for 20 years that is clearly racist and anti-American in its views. He's been friendly with racists and one avowed terrorist. But yeah, it's Republicans that are going to "exploit racial tensions." What an utter load of shit.

My masters have informed me that working on the behalf of minority rights or specifically targeting minorities during elections is racism on par with denying housing or employment to those minorities. I believe them with all my heart because I'm an empty vessel and incapable of or unwilling to attempt even the most basic calculations of context or history.

Which brings me to my vote for Master Slime: Obama is a "racist" who seeks to unfairly elevate his shiftless cohort.

We can at last have a frank conversation about "race", and admit that, despite all the vast generosity America has shown its black citizens, they have chosen to become a race of surly assholes-- a fact that can be discerned when you catch them talking amongst themselves.

Before this election is over, Obama will be Louis Farrakhan's Manchurian Candidate. And SDW will be absolutely sure that that doesn't represent "sliming" because, for him and his peoples, it will be objectively true.

The good news is that "his peoples" are a shrinking minority, and we may be reaching the point where we get to stand up as a nation, at last, and tell this ugly remnant to STFU.
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post #21 of 283
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post

I agree. Obama has already been crowned by the media, and McCain is a pretty poor excuse for an alternative.

I must say... The republicans have their work cut out for them and need to go back to the drawing board to re-discover what has historically given them success.

hint it is not closed door Dick Cheney energy task force meetings and PNAC influenced Neocon based policies and wars.

hint it is not running older candidates like Dole or in this case McCain.

I am serious when I say an Obama Presidency could be much better for the Republicans in the long term than a McCain Presidency.

Fellows
May the peace of the Lord be with you always

Share your smile, Have respect for others, and be loving to all peoples

Paul in Athens: Acts 17 : 16-34
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May the peace of the Lord be with you always

Share your smile, Have respect for others, and be loving to all peoples

Paul in Athens: Acts 17 : 16-34
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post #22 of 283
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fellowship View Post

I must say... The republicans have their work cut out for them and need to go back to the drawing board to re-discover what has historically given them success.

hint it is not closed door Dick Cheney energy task force meetings and PNAC influenced Neocon based policies and wars.

hint it is not running older candidates like Dole or in this case McCain.

I am serious when I say an Obama Presidency could be much better for the Republicans in the long term than a McCain Presidency.

Fellows

I agree. The much derided 'Ron Paul Republicans' are currently re-making the Republican Party from the ground up behind the scenes. We'll be too late for this election, but 4 years out of the White House will do everyone some good. Should be able to get rid of most of the evil neo-con remnants by then.

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post #23 of 283
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post

I agree. The much derided 'Ron Paul Republicans' are currently re-making the Republican Party from the ground up behind the scenes. We'll be too late for this election, but 4 years out of the White House will do everyone some good. Should be able to get rid of most of the evil neo-con remnants by then.

I still and always will have a tremendous level of respect for Paul. The man is not owned by anyone and speaks truth knowing he will be challenged by those who try to discredit him but not letting it get to him as the truth is on his side.

It really does show how badly wrong so many in the "republican" camp have gone when you compare them to Paul.

There used to be an advertising campaign where it was asked: "Where's the beef?"

My question is... "Where have all the republicans gone?"

Today they are sadly only republican in title far more often than not. Not so much in practice.

Fellows
May the peace of the Lord be with you always

Share your smile, Have respect for others, and be loving to all peoples

Paul in Athens: Acts 17 : 16-34
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Share your smile, Have respect for others, and be loving to all peoples

Paul in Athens: Acts 17 : 16-34
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post #24 of 283
Even Wall Street is hedging their bets, and a person wiser than me once said, "follow the money".

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post #25 of 283
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post

Even Wall Street is hedging their bets. And a person wiser than me once said, "Follow the money".

I read that story this morning and I still contend to Hassan...

Obama will be the next US President.

Fellows
May the peace of the Lord be with you always

Share your smile, Have respect for others, and be loving to all peoples

Paul in Athens: Acts 17 : 16-34
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post #26 of 283
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hassan i Sabbah View Post

There is an election coming up for Most Powerful Person in the World, and Barack Obama is going to be covered in GOP-snot in an attempt to see that he doesn't win. In this thread we post our predictions of how and say 'I told you so!' after the fact.

I was reading Brian Eno in Wired talking about the election, before the Democratic nominee was decided. Here is the link. Obama is going to have to fight the most vehement, venomous campaign of disinformation, he say. En bref:



I think he's probably right, going on past... oh, who am I kidding? He's definitely right. There are no depths to which they won't stoop because he really means it, he has a chance of winning, and John McCain is nearly 110 years old.

So, here are my predictions (eventually we should make this poll and decide rules and stuff. I'll buy the prize.)

Is there anyway of going after Obama that isn't "going to be covered in GOP-snot in an t attempt to see that he doesn't win." If for example I predict that they will go after him via a series of debates and townhall meetings to show how terrible he is when off-script and also having to discuss ideas instead of his "journey" would that be snot or just regular campaign stuff?

That said, here is what I think of your current predictions.

Quote:
1: They will go for his wife. They've begun by describing her as 'angry' and 'unpatriotic'. This is just the beginning; she'll be a liar, a fraud, a militant uppity nignog, probably a criminal. I bet you.

I think you are right that they will go after his wife and the main reason will be that he cannot disavow her or toss her under the bus as he has already done everyone else associated with him. Tony Rezko or Wright... well I can't believe they would act in that manner and I am so disappointed, almost as disappointed as I was in my grandmother, but under the bus they go.

Clearly he cannot disavow or toss aside his wife so you are right that she probably is a good target to pick.

Quote:
2: Obama will be in the pocket of lobbyists. Oh yeah. Go for the strengths. It will be 'But can Obama speak out against his own backers?'

I see this one a bit different than you do. I think it will be an attempt to bludgeon Obama with his own values. I've tried the same on here and it doesn't work because Democrats... well they have no values.

Obama signed a pledge to take public financing during the general campaign if the opposing candidate did the same. It is clear McCain has credibility here since he fashioned the bill in the first place. However it isn't an issue that will gain McCain much since most Republicans do not like speech limits. Democrats claim that large amounts of money in the political process is corrupting and of course they won't care when the large amount of money is in the pockets of Obama. So it is a dead issue even if it is brought up.

Quote:
3: Obama will be more left wing than Leon Trotsky. He wants to nationalise air and rain.

If you call it a cap and trade carbon plan, they you really aren't far off. The problem of course is that McCain isn't far off either here. So I don't see how much can be gained from it with regard to Republican votes going to McCain or slicing Democratic or Independent voters off from Obama.

Quote:
4: Obama will be a bad leader. 'He can't lead his party!/family!/sub-committee! Do we trust him to run the country?'

I think this a very valid issue to consider when picking a president. I don't think of it as "slime." Obama is from the Senate and doesn't have much executive experience. McCain might be able to use his military experience as a decent base to stand on here but can't really use the Senate bit either.

Quote:
5: They will exploit racial tensions, animosity and misunderstanding in a very despicable way.

I see this happening in reverse and that is because it already has been happening. We all didn't know that almost 50% of the Democratic party are backwards, small town bitter people clinging to their racist beliefs, but we know it is true now since that is what anyone who votes against Obama is called. McCain for all his flaws really doesn't seem to have this as one of them. There are a dozen things I can hate him for as a candidate but it really appears that he doesn't just want to rely on the Republican base or things of that nature. He can't and so he is trying to forge something new just like Obama. I think he has the decked stacked against him since people don't typically associate 72 year old men with being a change element. I think this is why McCain likely won't win.

I really think the best way to go after Obama is to show him for either the policies or the platitudes he happens to be. It is clear he was ducking debates with Hillary from about the middle of the primary on. Well he could claim that all the differences were know after a certain number of debates there. He cannot claim this with McCain. McCain is already proposing all manner of joint appearances. Townhalls, debates, trips to Iraq, etc. He wants things that get Obama off a podium and out of in front of a teleprompter.

A lot of the right blogs have been banging on his acceptance speech for phrases like this...

Quote:
"This was the moment when the rise of the oceans began to slow and our planet began to heal; this was the moment when we ended a war and secured our nation and restored our image as the last, best hope on Earth."

We voted for Obama and now the oceans will stop rising and the planet will begin healing. Of course anyone who mistakes such language for a messianic complex is just pursuing an "insanely retarded meme." But I suspect that when you get him away from the teleprompter and podium the unquestioning charisma might not allow such thinking and statements to go unchallenged. Obama appears to have a hard time thinking on his feet, and McCain for all his flaws and also occasionally weird deliver appears to think pretty well on his feet. So I think this is where he will try to take the campaign.

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post #27 of 283
At least Hassan knows the flaws in the Dem candidate.

(There's no WAY we'll see DNC snot-bucket tactics this time around... sure.. no way at all... )

Obama is very accomplished. Just look.
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post #28 of 283
"Street organizer"

Hassan asks; they deliver.
post #29 of 283
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post

Is there anyway of going after Obama that isn't "going to be covered in GOP-snot in an t attempt to see that he doesn't win." If for example I predict that they will go after him via a series of debates and townhall meetings to show how terrible he is when off-script and also having to discuss ideas instead of his "journey" would that be snot or just regular campaign stuff?

Nope, that would be debate on the merits. I think you know that's not what we're talking about, but props for trying to demean the whole idea that sliming is possible, right out of the gate.

Quote:
I think you are right that they will go after his wife and the main reason will be that he cannot disavow her or toss her under the bus as he has already done everyone else associated with him. Tony Rezko or Wright... well I can't believe they would act in that manner and I am so disappointed, almost as disappointed as I was in my grandmother, but under the bus they go.

Clearly he cannot disavow or toss aside his wife so you are right that she probably is a good target to pick.

Ya'll sure do like the "under the bus" thing. It gets repeated so metronomically, you'd almost think the phrase had been carefully selected and disseminated as a matter of strategy. But probably every single right wing blogger and pundit on the planet came up with it independently.

At any rate, it serves an admirable purpose: having demonized an Obama associate, he has the choice of being made into a virtual surrogate for whatever dreadfulness is in play, if he stands pat, or being an expedient monster, if he "throws them under the bus."

It's a terrifying sight, all the broken and bleeding people Obama has left in his wake, their lives utterly destroyed because Obama callously engineered their crushing.

Quote:
I see this one a bit different than you do. I think it will be an attempt to bludgeon Obama with his own values. I've tried the same on here and it doesn't work because Democrats... well they have no values.

Always good to have a conversation with a thoughtful, level headed chap.

Quote:
Obama signed a pledge to take public financing during the general campaign if the opposing candidate did the same. It is clear McCain has credibility here since he fashioned the bill in the first place. However it isn't an issue that will gain McCain much since most Republicans do not like speech limits. Democrats claim that large amounts of money in the political process is corrupting and of course they won't care when the large amount of money is in the pockets of Obama. So it is a dead issue even if it is brought up.

Really? The guy that fashioned the bill and walked away from every principle when they became inconvenient is the one that has "credibility'?

Good. Hammer on this one. Make it the center piece. Please.


Quote:
If you call it a cap and trade carbon plan, they you really aren't far off. The problem of course is that McCain isn't far off either here. So I don't see how much can be gained from it with regard to Republican votes going to McCain or slicing Democratic or Independent voters off from Obama.

True, although I'm not understanding how cap and trade carbon plans and Trotskyism are ending up in the same neck of the woods. Is this Jubelum's influence?

Quote:
I think this a very valid issue to consider when picking a president. I don't think of it as "slime." Obama is from the Senate and doesn't have much executive experience. McCain might be able to use his military experience as a decent base to stand on here but can't really use the Senate bit either.

Agreed. Obama's relative lack of experience is a legitimate campaign issue, although the fact that their aren't too many jobs that qualify you for being President of the Freakin' US of A make it a weak one, IMO.

Quote:
I see this happening in reverse and that is because it already has been happening. We all didn't know that almost 50% of the Democratic party are backwards, small town bitter people clinging to their racist beliefs, but we know it is true now since that is what anyone who votes against Obama is called. McCain for all his flaws really doesn't seem to have this as one of them. There are a dozen things I can hate him for as a candidate but it really appears that he doesn't just want to rely on the Republican base or things of that nature. He can't and so he is trying to forge something new just like Obama. I think he has the decked stacked against him since people don't typically associate 72 year old men with being a change element. I think this is why McCain likely won't win.

Obama's going to campaign on the "vote for me or you're a racist dog" platform? Startling.

Quote:
I really think the best way to go after Obama is to show him for either the policies or the platitudes he happens to be. It is clear he was ducking debates with Hillary from about the middle of the primary on. Well he could claim that all the differences were know after a certain number of debates there. He cannot claim this with McCain. McCain is already proposing all manner of joint appearances. Townhalls, debates, trips to Iraq, etc. He wants things that get Obama off a podium and out of in front of a teleprompter.

A lot of the right blogs have been banging on his acceptance speech for phrases like this...



We voted for Obama and now the oceans will stop rising and the planet will begin healing. Of course anyone who mistakes such language for a messianic complex is just pursuing an "insanely retarded meme." But I suspect that when you get him away from the teleprompter and podium the unquestioning charisma might not allow such thinking and statements to go unchallenged. Obama appears to have a hard time thinking on his feet, and McCain for all his flaws and also occasionally weird deliver appears to think pretty well on his feet. So I think this is where he will try to take the campaign.

Dude. The "insanely retarded meme" thing was a passing shot. Let it go.

We'll see about unscripted debate. My impression is that he's been getting better, and that some of what his opponents like to characterize as stumbling could also be called "thoughtfulness", which, admittedly, has never been a characteristic much in demand by the electorate.

At any rate, the whole "Obama is helpless without a teleprompter" deal is manifestly untrue, and McCain, while affable, comes off as glib and is prone to say, um, untrue-ish things, when he talks off script. Also, he gets irritable and isn't very good at hiding it.

Be interesting to see how it plays out-- if Obama can't make a good accounting of his intentions in a non-scripted format it will certainly hurt him, but if McCain declares that Iran started WWII and starts throwing things when he's corrected, that not a huge asset either.
They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
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They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
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post #30 of 283
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post

Is there anyway of going after Obama that isn't "going to be covered in GOP-snot in an t attempt to see that he doesn't win." If for example I predict that they will go after him via a series of debates and townhall meetings to show how terrible he is when off-script and also having to discuss ideas instead of his "journey" would that be snot or just regular campaign stuff?

That's the second time this "meme" has been put forward, other than repeating it, what basis is there for this seemingly specious claim?

I'm trying hard to see it, given the number of debates the Democrats had, are you suggesting these debates were all scripted?

And why would Obama consent to a format that McCain thinks favors him?

Somehow, I like the idea of a debate format where Obama plays the part of Kennedy to McBush's Nixon.
Every eye fixed itself upon him; with parted lips and bated breath the audience hung upon his words, taking no note of time, rapt in the ghastly fascinations of the tale. NOT!
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Every eye fixed itself upon him; with parted lips and bated breath the audience hung upon his words, taking no note of time, rapt in the ghastly fascinations of the tale. NOT!
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post #31 of 283
Fox News:

"terrorist fist-jab"

Definitely bookmark this thread.
post #32 of 283
Quote:
Originally Posted by ShawnJ View Post

Fox News:

"terrorist fist-jab"

Definitely bookmark this thread.

Then, he slapped his raised palm against the raised palm of a supporter. We have no idea what he was attempting to signify with this oddly violent gesture, but one thing's for sure: that's not how they do it on Main Street.

If America ready for a crazy "hep cat" from "downtown" who speaks in "drug lingo" and "gang signs"? Lets discuss!

So, like, is Fox just pretty certain that its audience is entirely comprised of 110 year old white people?
They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
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They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
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post #33 of 283
This is interesting.

Over at TPM there's a story up about the "Secret Michelle Obama whitey whitey whitey" tape, citing a National Review article that seems to have traced the origin of that to a recent novel about a black candidate for president (in the book it is the candidate himself who WHITEY WHITEY WHITEY.

But I was really struck by a quoted passage from the book:

Quote:
He said, "You know, I had to put up with so much crap from Whitey when I was playing tennis back in the day, it was ridiculous. Real b****** stuff, too. Tennis racquets busted while I was in the shower, no towels, the worst locker, called n***** all the time, even by the help." He looked over at Osgood. "I'm telling you, Clarence, if I get elected president, I'm gonna act the way I'm supposed to act in front of the camera. Smile and dance like a good black man, do what I'm expected to do like a good boy. But behind the scenes, I'll f*** Whitey, and I'll f*** him good, I really will."

As I said in my earlier post, I think this is the template for running down Obama--to whisper, email, allude to, coyly reference, spray paint and have surrogates overtly state that Obama has a secret: that as a black man he harbors a terrible grudge against white America (because, truth be told, they all do), and his presidency will involve a lot of "pay back.'

Obama doesn't have to do or say anything in particular, because this is predicated on the idea that deeply held resentment is simply a condition of being black. WHITEY WHITEY WHITEY.
They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
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They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
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post #34 of 283
Quote:
Originally Posted by addabox View Post

Then, he slapped his raised palm against the raised palm of a supporter. We have no idea what he was attempting to signify with this oddly violent gesture, but one thing's for sure: that's not how they do it on Main Street.

If America ready for a crazy "hep cat" from "downtown" who speaks in "drug lingo" and "gang signs"? Lets discuss!

So, like, is Fox just pretty certain that its audience is entirely comprised of 110 year old white people?

... common practice in the dart leagues I played in (e. g. white trailer trash fun times), simply because it's quicker than a hand shake, or as a silent "attaboy."
Every eye fixed itself upon him; with parted lips and bated breath the audience hung upon his words, taking no note of time, rapt in the ghastly fascinations of the tale. NOT!
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Every eye fixed itself upon him; with parted lips and bated breath the audience hung upon his words, taking no note of time, rapt in the ghastly fascinations of the tale. NOT!
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post #35 of 283
The FT has an article on this today:

Quote:
McCain fires opening shots in media war
By Andrew Ward in Washington
Published: June 6 2008 19:11 | Last updated: June 6 2008 19:11
John McCain, the Republican presidential candidate, launched his first television advertisement of the general election campaign on Friday, highlighting his record as a Vietnam war hero even as his party unleashed attacks against Barack Obama, the presumptive Democratic nominee.

The contrasting messages provided an early hint of the good cop, bad cop strategy planned by Republicans ahead of Novembers election, with Mr McCain promising to run a broadly positive campaign, while his party takes a more aggressive approach.
....

The Republican National Committee yesterday launched a website www.meetbarackobama.com packed with attacks against the Illinois senator.

One video shows clips of Hillary Clinton and other former Democratic rivals voicing doubts about Mr Obamas qualifications to be commander-in-chief during the party primaries.

Another highlights Mr Obamas ties to Tony Rezko, a Chicago real estate developer and former friend who was convicted on corruption charges this week.

http://www.ft.com/indepth/uselections2008

In our desire to impose form on the world we have lost the capacity to see the form that is there;
and in that lies not liberation but alienation, the cutting off from things as they really are. --...

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In our desire to impose form on the world we have lost the capacity to see the form that is there;
and in that lies not liberation but alienation, the cutting off from things as they really are. --...

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post #36 of 283


Maybe we can get Barbara Billingsley to translate...
"Stand Up for Chuck"
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"Stand Up for Chuck"
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post #37 of 283
Quote:
Originally Posted by addabox View Post

This is interesting.

Over at TPM there's a story up about the "Secret Michelle Obama whitey whitey whitey" tape, citing a National Review article that seems to have traced the origin of that to a recent novel about a black candidate for president (in the book it is the candidate himself who WHITEY WHITEY WHITEY.

But I was really struck by a quoted passage from the book:

As I said in my earlier post, I think this is the template for running down Obama--to whisper, email, allude to, coyly reference, spray paint and have surrogates overtly state that Obama has a secret: that as a black man he harbors a terrible grudge against white America (because, truth be told, they all do), and his presidency will involve a lot of "pay back.'

Obama doesn't have to do or say anything in particular, because this is predicated on the idea that deeply held resentment is simply a condition of being black. WHITEY WHITEY WHITEY.

I'm going to copy/paste this whole National Review article to see, so that no one, no one misses this:

"Friday, June 06, 2008

BARACK OBAMA

Why Does the Michelle Obama Tape Rumor Match a 2006 Novel?

Sometimes, this rumor of this alleged tape of Michelle Obama denouncing “whitey” sounds like something out of a clichéd political thriller novel.

Actually, it sounds exactly like something out of a clichéd political thriller novel. Specifically, Stephen Frey’s The Power Broker, published in 2006 by Ballantine Books.

A major plot line of the novel is the presidential campaign of Democrat Jesse Wood, aiming to be the country’s first African American president — “Wood was handsome, smart, charismatic, and being mentioned increasingly often in the press as someone who could unite a twenty-first century America growing more, not less, racially and economically divided.” (p.35)

He’s a U.S. Senator from New York and former senior partner at a prestigious law firm. His backers include “some of the old Black Panthers.” He wants to make Puerto Rico a state, and a recurring figure in his campaign is a controversial minister from Philadelphia called “Jefferson Roundtree.”

And by page 130, his opponents find a videotape that could ruin his candidacy…

Quote:
The camera focused on Wood, who was standing with Clarence Osgood, Stephanie Childress, and another man.

“Who is that guy?” Johnson asked, taking a sip of soda. He’d known Osgood and Stephanie for a while so they were familiar to him right away. “He looks so damn fa-“ Johnson banged the sofa. “Now I remember. That’s Jefferson Roundtree, that activist minister from Philly.”

“Nut job from Philly is more like it,” Forte said. “We don’t want Jesse anywhere near him now, don’t want Jesse seen with him at all because he scares the crap out of whites. But he served his purpose here,” Forte added quietly.

“Boy, it’s a nice clear shot of Jesse-”

“Shh! Here it is, here it is.” Forte picked up the remote and turned up the volume.

The camera panned in on Wood’s handsome face as he turned to Roundtree. “Yeah, that Jew from CNN was such a pr***,” Wood said, smirking, “asking me about my voting record on civil rights.”

“You got it, brother,” Roundtree agreed heartily. “Like any cracker should have the nerve to ask you about that.”

Osgood and Stephanie nodded.

Then there were a few muffled words, but nothing audible…

[skipping over a few paragraphs of the bad guys discussing where to send the tape]
Quote:
“It won’t be necessary believe me,” Forte interrupted again, pointing at the screen. “Keep watching.”

There was more muffled chatter, then Wood held his hands up.

He said, “You know, I had to put up with so much crap from Whitey when I was playing tennis back in the day, it was ridiculous. Real b****** stuff, too. Tennis racquets busted while I was in the shower, no towels, the worst locker, called n***** all the time, even by the help.” He looked over at Osgood. “I’m telling you, Clarence, if I get elected president, I’m gonna act the way I’m supposed to act in front of the camera. Smile and dance like a good black man, do what I’m expected to do like a good boy. But behind the scenes, I’ll f*** Whitey, and I’ll f*** him good, I really will.”

Later the tape is used for blackmail by an ally, and then the real badguy — a Texan who owns a giant oil company named Hewitt (sorry, Hugh) — gets his hands on the tape. The description of the appropriate timing of the release of the videotape on p. 237 will sound familiar to those tracking the rumors of the alleged Michelle Obama tape.

Quote:
Hewitt thought for a second. “I’m going to let Jesse win the nomination and let the public get used to him as the Democratic candidate. Give the country some time to get to know Jesse Wood, to start to like him. And they will because he’s a very likeable guy. Then I’m going to drop the bomb, after everyone’s started to like him. That way the clip will have maximum effect and people will be as angry as they can be. Whites and blacks. Whites for the obvious reason, blacks because they’ll feel like he let ‘em down.”

Now. Either author Stephen Frey is clairvoyant, writing this book in 2006. Or this is one of the all time amazing coincidences. Or whoever started this rumor got the idea from a novel.

(The tape is kept secret by getting even more incriminating videotape of the badguys and creating a mutually-assured destruction pact. In a subsequent novel, we learn Wood won the election.)

This unimaginable coincidence, coupled with Larry Johnson's unnecessarily profane and unresponsive answer to David Weigel when he asked about contradictions in the description of what's on the tape, ought to drive a stake into the heart of this rumor.

Why is a conservative blogger putting this much effort into dispelling a rumor that, on paper at least, would hurt Obama? Because those who prefer a president besides Obama should not go through the summer and fall convinced that a magic-bullet devastating tape is going to appear as an October surprise to save the day.

Also, there are a lot of good reasons to vote against Barack Obama; but what people claim Michelle Obama says on a tape that no one can produce and no one has seen isn't one of them.


06/06 11:01 AM"

The bold is mine for emphasis...

Wow. The National Review has gotten a shred of respect from me for this. Don't lose it.

That website is like Karl Rove's wet dream, I don't think there are that many irrational Hillary supporters...maybe they're all mindfuck republican plants, who knows, moving on...

EDIT: Forgot that Weigel link...that's important too.
post #38 of 283
Quote:
Originally Posted by dmz View Post

The FT has an article on this today:



http://www.ft.com/indepth/uselections2008

I understand that he was a POW, but does that then make all POW's war heroes? Or are all combat pilots war heroes?

If every combat veteran receives a medal or commendation or citation, does that mean that all combat veterans are war heroes?

Does being an honorably discharged combat veteran make one a war hero?

Personally, I consider all those who serve in our military as heroes. In other words, I find McCain's service record no better or no worse than any other war veteran's.
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post #39 of 283
Quote:
Originally Posted by addabox View Post

Nope, that would be debate on the merits. I think you know that's not what we're talking about, but props for trying to demean the whole idea that sliming is possible, right out of the gate.

Well I had to check considering some of the mentioned predictions in the initial post were very valid criteria to use for selecting a president. If going after someone declaring they are going to be a good or bad leader when running for president is "slime" then we need a tighter definition.

Quote:
Ya'll sure do like the "under the bus" thing. It gets repeated so metronomically, you'd almost think the phrase had been carefully selected and disseminated as a matter of strategy. But probably every single right wing blogger and pundit on the planet came up with it independently.

Well you watch the guy do it several times and a phrase that matches the actions comes to mind. The fact that it does indeed come to the mind of many in the exact same fashion might be conspiratorial, or it might be a whole bunch of people describing the exact same actions they see.

Quote:
At any rate, it serves an admirable purpose: having demonized an Obama associate, he has the choice of being made into a virtual surrogate for whatever dreadfulness is in play, if he stands pat, or being an expedient monster, if he "throws them under the bus."

It's a terrifying sight, all the broken and bleeding people Obama has left in his wake, their lives utterly destroyed because Obama callously engineered their crushing.

I don't think anyone has said Obama is bad for tossing Wright, etc under the bus. However the deeper issue is that Obama never assumes any responsibility for knowing what those advocating for him are doing. He claims complete ignorance on it and then tosses away. We've already had the "he was my pastor for twenty years, baptized my kids, married my wife and I, was my spiritual sounding board and inspired one of my books but I really didn't know what the hell he was talking about" bit play in the very skeptical manner it should be treated. Thus we are all lining up for the "she is my wife, I have had two children with her, slept in the same bed as her, and shared a life with her, but I really didn't know what the hell she was talking about or believed" but so that the last strand of credibility can be severed even for the true Obamamaniac.

Quote:
Always good to have a conversation with a thoughtful, level headed chap.

Why thank you.

Quote:
Really? The guy that fashioned the bill and walked away from every principle when they became inconvenient is the one that has "credibility'?

Good. Hammer on this one. Make it the center piece. Please.

I think I was pretty clear that McCain doesn't have much if anything to gain from it.

Quote:
True, although I'm not understanding how cap and trade carbon plans and Trotskyism are ending up in the same neck of the woods. Is this Jubelum's influence?

No that was more addressed at the nationalize the air and rain comment.

Quote:
Agreed. Obama's relative lack of experience is a legitimate campaign issue, although the fact that their aren't too many jobs that qualify you for being President of the Freakin' US of A make it a weak one, IMO.

Didn't you promise to maim yourself if we ever agreed? I'm still waiting for the video of Shawn drinking his old beer so we can add you to the list.

Quote:
Obama's going to campaign on the "vote for me or you're a racist dog" platform? Startling.

Racist dog? No. Racist small town, religious, gun owning, backward, waiting for the jobs to come back and in the meantime voting agains their own self-interest because they are so bitter. Yes.

Quote:
Dude. The "insanely retarded meme" thing was a passing shot. Let it go.

Oh, but it rolls so nicely off the tongue.

Quote:
We'll see about unscripted debate. My impression is that he's been getting better, and that some of what his opponents like to characterize as stumbling could also be called "thoughtfulness", which, admittedly, has never been a characteristic much in demand by the electorate.

At any rate, the whole "Obama is helpless without a teleprompter" deal is manifestly untrue, and McCain, while affable, comes off as glib and is prone to say, um, untrue-ish things, when he talks off script. Also, he gets irritable and isn't very good at hiding it.

I didn't say he was helpless. I simply said that he performance isn't good enough to leave people happy and unquestioning which is what they seem to be after his speeches.

Quote:
Be interesting to see how it plays out-- if Obama can't make a good accounting of his intentions in a non-scripted format it will certainly hurt him, but if McCain declares that Iran started WWII and starts throwing things when he's corrected, that not a huge asset either.

Can McCain throw things? I thought he had limited ability to lift his arms?

Quote:
Originally Posted by franksargent View Post

That's the second time this "meme" has been put forward, other than repeating it, what basis is there for this seemingly specious claim?

I'm trying hard to see it, given the number of debates the Democrats had, are you suggesting these debates were all scripted?

And why would Obama consent to a format that McCain thinks favors him?

Somehow, I like the idea of a debate format where Obama plays the part of Kennedy to McBush's Nixon.

The basis is the fact that Obama clearly lost ground to Clinton after pretty much every debate. The other basis is the fact that Obama holds almost NO press conferences and the one he did hold regarding the Wright matter was very short, and he did very badly in it.

I didn't say the debates were scripted, merely that when Obama had to actually defend his ideas without a teleprompter, he didn't do very well in comparison to the other candidates.

As to why Obama would consent to a format that doesn't favor him, I am not saying he will. The thread is about how they will go after Obama and that is how I think they will go after him. I think McCain is establishing the desire to do this early so later he can talk about how long Obama has been ducking debates and townhalls as a talking point. I"m pretty sure they are already doing that for the last visit to Iraq. I saw something where someone was counting the days since Obama's last visit.

I'm sure you think that McCain will be a sweaty frumpy old man who can't remember where the camera is at, but while not the most charasmatic candidate ever, he clearly has media savvy and also has no problems dealing with press conferences and talking at length. You see McCain ON the Daily Show, On the Ellen Show, etc. Even when he knows he will be hit with some hard questions, jabs, or even jokes, he manages to handle them pretty well.

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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post #40 of 283
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post

The basis is the fact that Obama clearly lost ground to Clinton after pretty much every debate. The other basis is the fact that Obama holds almost NO press conferences and the one he did hold regarding the Wright matter was very short, and he did very badly in it.

I didn't say the debates were scripted, merely that when Obama had to actually defend his ideas without a teleprompter, he didn't do very well in comparison to the other candidates.

As to why Obama would consent to a format that doesn't favor him, I am not saying he will. The thread is about how they will go after Obama and that is how I think they will go after him. I think McCain is establishing the desire to do this early so later he can talk about how long Obama has been ducking debates and townhalls as a talking point. I"m pretty sure they are already doing that for the last visit to Iraq. I saw something where someone was counting the days since Obama's last visit.

I'm sure you think that McCain will be a sweaty frumpy old man who can't remember where the camera is at, but while not the most charasmatic candidate ever, he clearly has media savvy and also has no problems dealing with press conferences and talking at length. You see McCain ON the Daily Show, On the Ellen Show, etc. Even when he knows he will be hit with some hard questions, jabs, or even jokes, he manages to handle them pretty well.

[CENTER][/CENTER]

You are using McInsane's very weak speeches in relationship to Obama's excellent speaking abilities to drive this "so called" meme. And if he did lose ground to HRC, it happened when it didn't count, you know during the actual Democratic primaries.

just look at their two speeches on Tuesday night, even Faux Noise, universally panned McInsane's speech relative to Obama's speech.

Is it McInsane's media savvy or just McInsane as media darling. McInsain's weak attempt at "dumbing down" the debate format, is just that, dumb.
Every eye fixed itself upon him; with parted lips and bated breath the audience hung upon his words, taking no note of time, rapt in the ghastly fascinations of the tale. NOT!
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Every eye fixed itself upon him; with parted lips and bated breath the audience hung upon his words, taking no note of time, rapt in the ghastly fascinations of the tale. NOT!
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