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iPhone 3G clarifications: battery life, GPS, office apps - Page 2

post #41 of 145
I bought the first iPhone last July. The release of the 3G iPhone seemed more like a Mac Mini processor upgrade. Overall, I'm very pleased with the app store and the firmware update. I'm still extremely happy with my first generation iPhone, however, the iPhone 3G is a great entry point for people disciplined enough to wait for the 2nd generation.

I'll be curious to see how pleased people are with their iPhone upgrade after a couple months. Is it worth the higher monthly rate?

It seems like a LOT of complaints about this one - perhaps expectations were set pretty high after the first launch.
post #42 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post

Apple is getting stupider about communicating it's product details... does it, or does it not have full GPS capability? It's really a simple question.

Apple is also really missing a huge opportunity by not including a higher-priced version of the iPod touch with GPS. Personally, I would buy two of them today if they had that additional functionality.

more stupid
post #43 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

I

I'd actually prefer to have 3G settings that allow to choose which apps or types of apps I can have use 3G and which I prefer use GSM. FOr instance, when I'm using Safari or iTunes Store app I would like it to initialize the 3G, but if they are closed to turn it off automatically.

That's the best idea for this yet. I don't know of any technical reason why that couldn't be done.

I wonder if it's possible for a third party app to do this. There may be a limitation for that though.
post #44 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by NanoAkron View Post

I want to see it done intelligently. So if you go into a non-3G area, the 3G radio switches off automatically. DUH.

Or as you say, certain apps with high data needs use 3G, others don't - or maybe there's a popup like with GPS services.

Or the 3G radio only turns on when you need to download something to the phone? The 'push' is run as a simple 'ping' to the server over the GPRS/EDGE network and if there's something to be 'pushed', 3G radio powers up, transmits and then powers back down?

How about automatically turning off the 3G radio when wireless is in use?

These are things that can be sorted out in software, with only minimal user interaction, that would greatly extend the battery life - smart 3G switching.

I can see that most of you don't understand anything about 3G as used in the iPhone. It is not just a data connection. The 3G is used for both voice and data. So if you turn off 3G you have no voice connection either.

Using 3G for voice results in much better call quality as well, as many have noticed with the iPhone 3G. But this is only because W-CDMA (or UMTS as it is correctly called) provides much better codecs for the voice signal than previous GSM networks did.

In the old iPhone, GSM was the voice layer and GPRS provided a packet switched layer on top of that. EDGE is just an extension to GPRS with higher data rates. In the iPhone 3G UTMS provides both the voice and data layer in one. So you can't disable data without cutting voice as well.

Also if you go from an area outside of the UMTS coverage your phone will automatically drop down from 3G to GSM+EDGE. There is no way to just use UMTS for data and GSM for voice.

Its just a shame that in the US you have such crap coverage with UMTS. One other thing that is important is that the network controls to a large extent your battery life. If the network is not configured properly or has poor coverage you will burn through your battery extremely fast because the phone doesn't get told to reduce the transmitter output power.
post #45 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post


Beware of 3rd-party car chargers. The 3G iPhone no longer works with many power adapters. It also no longer charges via FireWire, which I've been using for extra power cord for years. I don't know why they changed this but the fact that the large brick power adapter has been replaced by a very small and light A/C adapter. Did they move the AC/DC conversion into the device itself?


I think the new brick is a switching adapter, which is more expensive, but lighter and more compact. Good move.

I am also trying to find a way to charge in my car... I often take long drives and will need to recharge. For now, am AC->DC adapter will hold me over. Apple's online store says a few chargers work... it seems the speaker systems might not work.

 

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post #46 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by justflybob View Post

I must be rather slow on the uptake here, but I was really surprised that there doesn't appear to be any way to view Numbers/Excel or Pages/Word docs, or even PDF docs on the iPhone 3G.

If I am wrong on this, would someone please point me in the right direction?

Much obliged.

A small application called FileMagnet (available for 5 Dollars) solves currently half of your problems, the developer assured me to add support for Keynote/Powerpoint and Numbers/Excel soon (http://magnetismstudios.com/FileMagnet/). Although you need a dedicated uploader to send files to the iPhone, I find it quite promising and more comfortable than to send every required file by e-mail.
post #47 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by jodyfanning View Post

I can see that most of you don't understand anything about 3G as used in the iPhone. It is not just a data connection. The 3G is used for both voice and data. So if you turn off 3G you have no voice connection either.

One limitation, illustrated in this example, is that you can't be on a GSM call and then go to Safari to check out movie times while having it connect to 3G without discoing the call in the process. You can't do any other network task while on a call with GSM either, unless you are WiFi connected. The other issue is that moving between GSM and UTMS and back will take about 4-6 seconds, in my testing, to reconnect to the carrier.

While both of these do not seem like something Apple would want to include, I would love to see a 3rd-party developer make an app that completes this task if Apple does not. The Jailbreak should be out within a week or two.

I use Safari more than any other network related service, and I do it spurts. I'll spend 10-30 minutes using the internet and then back in my pocket for a duration listening to music until a new email comes into read or i want to change my iPod playlist. I think these spurts would make the short network drop-off mostly unnoticeable when I leave an app like Safari Though accessing Safari would cause an initial delay as connects with 3G. The same goes for leaving Safari to immediately make a call, though I just timed this and I would have been reconnected before I finished location my contact.

Now, if you dialing a number from within Safari it would just connect you via 3G as it make little sense to disconnect there when you are clearly using the data and voice. Any minor delay will quickly be forgotten knowing that my battery usage will improve dramatically. Since I received my iPhone 3G yesterday I have been doing just that to preserve my fuel, but I've been going the manual route.



It always comes down to fuel. The iPhone is my Interceptor
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post #48 of 145
If your favourite sites has RSS feeds, use them instead of the full site. This will dramatically lower your data transfers and lowers the CPU usage because of simpler layouts to handle. Apple redirects any RSS link to their own (really nice) iPhone RSS reader without any problems.
post #49 of 145
Password entry modification: In 2.0, you can see the character you typed before it becomes a circle. Security yet I know what I actually was typing in the password fields!! Good stuff.
post #50 of 145
Regarding battery life there is something strange going on. For some reason quite a lot of the battery power is lost over night, even though the thing only lies there in "idle".

It seems that my apartment is on the edge of the 3G network, which could mean that the phone keeps "jumping" between 3G and GSM, and if so, that will eat into the battery for sure (I know that from experience with other phones).

Or maybe there is some traffic due to the "push"-functions..... even though the phone is just lying there....

I will let the battery run until the phone shuts off and then recharge. That helped my "old" iPhone.
post #51 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

Just click on the '+' in the bottom center of the Safari window.


Thank you. For some reason, it didn't strike me to try that. When using iPhone, I feel very much like I did when using a Mac for the first time back in 1985 -- although the entry fee is considerably higher than the $3.00 3 1/2-inch floppy I had to buy!

Quote:
Apple has become very accurate with their battery testing by using real world setting.


Beware of 3rd-party car chargers. The 3G iPhone no longer works with many power adapters. It also no longer charges via FireWire, which I've been using for extra power cord for years. I don't know why they changed this but the fact that the large brick power adapter has been replaced by a very small and light A/C adapter.

I got a Griffin "PowerJolt" car charger at the AT&T store, which the reps swore would work with iPhone 3G. It is also a smallish adapter for a car's cigarette lighter, but has a removeable USB to iPhone connector cable. I thought it good to have a spare floating around.

Quote:
Did they move the AC/DC conversion into the device itself?

That would be a question I'd like answered as well.
post #52 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

PS: Safari is crashing a lot for me on v2.0.

I had my first Safari crash this morning. Not only that, I found I couldn't backspace to correct a phone number while entering it on the AT&T website. Grrr.

Did I mention I prefer Camino as my main Mac OS X browser?
post #53 of 145
Has anyone here upgraded to MobileMe?

If you have, would you please comment on the look and feel of any Pages/Word, Numbers/Excel or Preview/Acrobat files are handled with the 3G iPhone? Pros and cons of how they look and what you can interact with would be great.
Pity the agnostic dyslectic. They spend all their time contemplating the existence of dog.
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post #54 of 145
Number of fixes Apple can do to optimize battery life:

* provide optional time interval (5, 15, 30 minutes, etc) for "pull" mails instead of default to push.
* provide quick access pop-up dialog to enable/disable network switching between different connection types when using software that required network access.
post #55 of 145
3g will still be actively looking for a signal so obviously it's gonna drain power.
After 3 netbooks from acer, toshiba, hp, I find contentment in my 11.6 MB Air. Hoping the 8-hr battery version shows up soon.
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post #56 of 145
It doesn't matter if the battery is best in its class as long as you can't swap it/replace it.
As the NY TImes reported on Saturday - " Until Apple put's in a replaceable battery, the iPhone will remain a toy rather than a tool."
post #57 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by justflybob View Post

Has anyone here upgraded to MobileMe?

If you have, would you please comment on the look and feel of any Pages/Word, Numbers/Excel or Preview/Acrobat files are handled with the 3G iPhone? Pros and cons of how they look and what you can interact with would be great.

I have MobileMe. iPhone v2.0 can already read all those file types without needing MM. Just email it to yourself.

Quote:
Originally Posted by HFU View Post

Number of fixes Apple can do to optimize battery life:
* provide optional time interval (5, 15, 30 minutes, etc) for "pull" mails instead of default to push.

They already do this. You don't have to use Push, or you can pick and choose which items you want Push to work with.
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post #58 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by jodyfanning View Post

I can see that most of you don't understand anything about 3G as used in the iPhone. It is not just a data connection. The 3G is used for both voice and data. So if you turn off 3G you have no voice connection either.

Your response isn't all that clear either. With 3G off, you still have a 2G voice connection, not NO voice connection. A 3G voice connection is higher quality, but 2G may be good enough if you're trying to conserve power.
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post #59 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by teckstud View Post

It doesn't matter if the battery is best in its class as long as you can't swap it/replace it.
As the NY TImes reported on Saturday - " Until Apple put's in a replaceable battery, the iPhone will remain a toy rather than a tool."

That is such hyperbole.

I'd like to see how many people have extra batteries for their phones?
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post #60 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by teckstud View Post

It doesn't matter if the battery is best in its class as long as you can't swap it/replace it.
As the NY TImes reported on Saturday - " Until Apple put's in a replaceable battery, the iPhone will remain a toy rather than a tool."

Given that portable battery packs that recharge the internal battery via the dock connector for the iPod and iPhone 1.0 have been available, I'm sure they'll be one soon for iPhone 3G.
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post #61 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by mark2005 View Post

Given that portable battery packs that recharge the internal battery via the dock connector for the iPod and iPhone 1.0 have been available, I'm sure they'll be one soon for iPhone 3G.

Patiently awaiting for Mophie to release an updated JuicePack. Hopefully it doesn't interfere with GPS.
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post #62 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by teckstud View Post

It doesn't matter if the battery is best in its class as long as you can't swap it/replace it.
As the NY TImes reported on Saturday - " Until Apple put's in a replaceable battery, the iPhone will remain a toy rather than a tool."

Well, I hate to say the NYT is wrong, but I have put my iPhone to real work. Today I prepared a mock presentation while I was at lunch in order to test the device.

- took the photos I needed (camera)
- mind-mapped the presentation(Zeptopad)
- emailed the photos and mindmaps to a colleague
- received additional info from said colleague in a mail message
- called several people involved
- checked info on the Net
- adjusted my schedule
- made sample recordings of the presentation parts
- checked the weather forecast for the day and location of the presentation
- checked the location of the hall in Maps
- reserved a room online
- reserved a hotel room
- checked train schedules
- drew a map to the hall in Zeptopad and mailed it to the attendees
- used Band to work on a jingle to use as BGM during the presentation

That is real work, and my iPhone allowed me to do it without carrying a rucksack (MBA) on a 90 degree day.

When I got home, I synced the photos into my MacPro, reworked things in Keynote and Amadeus Pro, then put the presentation together.

The iPhone is no toy (well, it can be used for fun, too). If you know how to utilize it, it can be a fantastic tool.


---
Oh, and about the battery:
My old cel phone had a swappable battery. I never once swapped it and never bought a spare. Instead, I bought a cheap AA batt pack. AA batteries are available everywhere, so you can keep talking even after a spare would have died. I was also in the habit of always charging my phone when possible. Same with my iPhone. I always have a waist bag to carry a water bottle; just tossed the USB cable and brick in there. They weigh nothing and the phone charges fast if needed. Waiting to get a car adapter...


---
PS, I managed to sneak in a game of Sudoku just before returning to work.

 

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Your = the possessive of you, as in, "Your name is Tom, right?" or "What is your name?"

 

You're = a contraction of YOU + ARE as in, "You are right" --> "You're right."

 

 

Reply
post #63 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by Booga View Post

Yes, please do lots of extra work for us and give it to us for free because we bought something from you once so now deserve all updates free until things are perfect.

At least that what many windows developers did. Year back when I used windows I used to get a version for WinMob for free if you buy the Windows version! The least Apple can do it not charging $9.99 when you already paid $99.99 for the family pack desktop version. Furthermore, I really doubt the iPhone version, if developed, will be full feature version.
post #64 of 145
The battery does not even get you through the day. I have been eagerly awaiting this phone and have been extremely disappointed at battery life. In addition, calls drop when switching between 3G and EDGE networks...very frustrating
post #65 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by TequilaKatz View Post

The battery does not even get you through the day. I have been eagerly awaiting this phone and have been extremely disappointed at battery life. In addition, calls drop when switching between 3G and EDGE networks...very frustrating

That is the nature of the beast for all cell phones. Go into Settings » General » Network and toggle the 3G switch. You'll see that has to disconnect one and then connect to the other, which takes several seconds. A call can't be maintained. If you know you are on the edge of carrier switch from UMTS to EDGE you might as well keep it on EDGE.

As for the battery, are you upset that it isn't long enough or that Apple's claims are wrong? Have you done tests that match Apples testing to determine the duration?
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post #66 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

They already do this. You don't have to use Push, or you can pick and choose which items you want Push to work with.

Thanks! I got to try more settings on my end to find optimal combination.
post #67 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

That is the nature of the beast for all cell phones. Go into Settings » General » Network and toggle the 3G switch. You'll see that has to disconnect one and then connect to the other, which takes several seconds. A call can't be maintained. If you know you are on the edge of carrier switch from UMTS to EDGE you might as well keep it on EDGE.

As for the battery, are you upset that it isn't long enough or that Apple's claims are wrong? Have you done tests that match Apples testing to determine the duration?

I have informally tested over the last few days. Fully charged battery went out on me at 3pm yesterday with no WiFi and GPS locator off. It was mostly emails and phone calls...limited phone calls. Today it has made it until 7:30 with no WiFi, GPS locator on and moderate email and phone usage before it gave out. I am in a major city where 3G coverage is supposed to be strong and thorough but that does not seem to be the case.
post #68 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by sholmesbk View Post

my GF and I both bought iphones on friday night....
Overall very impressed with just about everything.... a little problem with some of the apps.... apple told me that they are experiencing some bugs with certain ones running together on the same phone?? but surely will be addressed soon.
but my question is with the GPS capabilities... about 4 out of 5 times I can't get a solid blue dot. With both phones side by side, my girlfriends seems to immediately find her current location, while mine has me somewhere in a 2 block radius?? I work in Manhattan and Live in Brooklyn. Have tried the GPS on WIFI/EDGE/3G yet that doesn't seem to make a difference either.... and I should have excellent coverage here in NYC, at least as good as its going to get in the US.. I would assume....

SO... Anyone else feeling like their GPS isn't acting as "snappy" as it should, or not living up to the other reviews you are reading???? tips would be much appreciated...will probably visit the Apple store when everyone else gets theirs and the lines die down.

Like any GPS receiver, it works best outdoors, not indoors. The device works best when it has direct line of sight with the satellites. The GPS receiver has nothing to do with Edge, 3G, or WiFi. It is a separate receiver. I would assume in NYC and all the surrounding buildings, it would be tough to get a good satellite signal.
post #69 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by teckstud View Post

It doesn't matter if the battery is best in its class as long as you can't swap it/replace it.
As the NY TImes reported on Saturday - " Until Apple put's in a replaceable battery, the iPhone will remain a toy rather than a tool."

Well that is a complete load of shit. The battery can be replaced, just have Apple do it. After two or three years, you would probably want to upgrade to the next version of the iPhone anyway. Do they feel the same about the MILLIONS of iPods sold? My iPhone is definitely a tool, regardless of the battery being user accessible.
post #70 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by hillstones View Post

Well that is a complete load of shit. The battery can be replaced, just have Apple do it. After two or three years, you would probably want to upgrade to the next version of the iPhone anyway. Do they feel the same about the MILLIONS of iPods sold? My iPhone is definitely a tool, regardless of the battery being user accessible.

I think he means specifically swapping it so he can extend the usefulness of the device, not replacing an aging battery.

There were plenty of external battery packs that made for a better option, IMO, than having to turn off your device, take off the back insert a new battery and turn it back on to get service.
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post #71 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by TequilaKatz View Post

The battery does not even get you through the day. I have been eagerly awaiting this phone and have been extremely disappointed at battery life. In addition, calls drop when switching between 3G and EDGE networks...very frustrating

5 hours talk time using 3G would not get anyone through the day. I don't know what you are complaining about. If you don't like it, get a Treo, those only last for 3 hours of talk time! The battery specs were clearly disclosed a month before the iPhone was released. If you want longer battery life, turn off the 3G feature, since you don't really need it for making phone calls. You can use the 3G for surfing the internet, then use Edge for everything else.
post #72 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by TequilaKatz View Post

I am in a major city where 3G coverage is supposed to be strong and thorough but that does not seem to be the case.

It would be nice to have an app that could use the GPS to see the cell tower transmissions you have around you, whether it be UTMS/EDGE or coverage or no coverage. Probably not a practical app for the work involved, but it might help you out.
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post #73 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by jodyfanning View Post

I can see that most of you don't understand anything about 3G as used in the iPhone. It is not just a data connection. The 3G is used for both voice and data. So if you turn off 3G you have no voice connection either.

Using 3G for voice results in much better call quality as well, as many have noticed with the iPhone 3G. But this is only because W-CDMA (or UMTS as it is correctly called) provides much better codecs for the voice signal than previous GSM networks did.

In the old iPhone, GSM was the voice layer and GPRS provided a packet switched layer on top of that. EDGE is just an extension to GPRS with higher data rates. In the iPhone 3G UTMS provides both the voice and data layer in one. So you can't disable data without cutting voice as well.

Also if you go from an area outside of the UMTS coverage your phone will automatically drop down from 3G to GSM+EDGE. There is no way to just use UMTS for data and GSM for voice.

Its just a shame that in the US you have such crap coverage with UMTS. One other thing that is important is that the network controls to a large extent your battery life. If the network is not configured properly or has poor coverage you will burn through your battery extremely fast because the phone doesn't get told to reduce the transmitter output power.


Moi Jody. Spot on explanation.
post #74 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by jodyfanning View Post

I can see that most of you don't understand anything about 3G as used in the iPhone. It is not just a data connection. The 3G is used for both voice and data. So if you turn off 3G you have no voice connection either.

No, if you turn off 3G, you simply have no 3G speed data access or the "improved" call quality of the 3G network. Voice and data service will be maintained - just via EDGE/GSM.
post #75 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by parksgm View Post

No, if you turn off 3G, you simply have no 3G speed data access or the "improved" call quality of the 3G network. Voice and data service will be maintained - just via EDGE/GSM.

A bit of clarification might be in order here. You can not run voice and data at the same time over EDGE/GSM. To test this, make a call then try and open up a web page. It will not work, however with 3G/UMTS it is possible. So in effect, Jody was correct.
post #76 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by mdriftmeyer View Post

more stupid

Oh, think different.....ly....
post #77 of 145
Apple is trying to say that copy and paste, a function that quite likely over 90% of the computing population uses at lease once a day, somehow missed Apple's priority list for the past year?

Mr Joswiak - why don't you avoid using copy and paste for a week on your computer as an experiment and then see where Apple might prioritize this feature going forward?

BT voice dialing is also very important - I know Apple wants people to keep pulling their iPhone out to dial so they literally get maximum product exposure, but the convenience and safety of voice dialing is also sorely missing, I believe.
post #78 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by sapporobaby View Post

A bit of clarification might be in order here. You can not run voice and data at the same time over EDGE/GSM. To test this, make a call then try and open up a web page. It will not work, however with 3G/UMTS it is possible. So in effect, Jody was correct.

It's nice that you're trying to cover for him, but it's clear that's not what he meant, though, now he may say it was.
post #79 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by palegolas View Post

If your favourite sites has RSS feeds, use them instead of the full site. This will dramatically lower your data transfers and lowers the CPU usage because of simpler layouts to handle. Apple redirects any RSS link to their own (really nice) iPhone RSS reader without any problems.

More importantly most major sites have a mobile version which is designed for the smaller screen and uses less complex graphics so they are faster to load.
post #80 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by thrang View Post

Apple is trying to say that copy and paste, a function that quite likely over 90% of the computing population uses at lease once a day, somehow missed Apple's priority list for the past year?

Mr Joswiak - why don't you avoid using copy and paste for a week on your computer as an experiment and then see where Apple might prioritize this feature going forward?

He said it was lower on the priority list than other features that Apple wants to put in. Also they are likely experimenting with copy and paste touch UI vs the touch UI of other functions. Once Apple picks the UI they are stuck with it.
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