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The AI vice-prez office pool - Page 3

post #81 of 207
Quote:
Originally Posted by BRussell View Post

And Biden referred to Obama as "Barack America." I guess that's better than Obama bin Laden though.

Oh.....that wasn't a slip.

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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post #82 of 207
Quote:
Originally Posted by e1618978 View Post

So he is a Who fan, what is wrong with that?

I'll tip my hat to the new constitution
Take a bow for the new revolution
Smile and grin at the change all around me
Pick up my guitar and play
Just like yesterday
Then I'll get on my knees and pray
We don't get fooled again

Yes I've thought of that myself.
Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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post #83 of 207
Quote:
Originally Posted by addabox View Post

I like the desperation behind needing, so very badly, to fixate on simple slips of the tongue in the hope that it will distract us from noticing that McCain frequently doesn't seem to know what the hell is going on.

There's a pretty big difference between occasionally getting a word wrong and being vague on the particulars of how the world works. Iran? Iraq? al Qaeda? Sunni? Shia? Rich? Poor? Prosperity? Recession? Houses?

It'll be fun to watch some folks around here breathlessly report every time Obama says "cake" when he means "pie", certain that his "gaffes" are dooming his campaign, while remaining strangely unruffled by the next time McCain can't tell our enemies from our allies.

Exactly! Once again as many have said here we've heard a lot of negative press about the democrats. Why the hell would we want to vote for McLame?

Some reasons please.
Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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post #84 of 207
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank777 View Post

Maybe not significant in terms of overall electoral math, but it's clearly a snub.



That's "final" shot. And you haven't gotten the joke.

1. Hillary runs ad claiming Obama isn't ready to answer the phone at 3am. Biggest ad of her campaign.
2. Hillary clearly lobbies for Vice-Presidential slot on Obama's ticket.

3. Obama deliberately releases news of VP choice...at 3am. Absolutely priceless.

And you really think this is significant?
Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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post #85 of 207
Thread Starter 
Yeah that seems like quite a stretch. Do you really believe that was a dig at Hillary frank777?
post #86 of 207
Quote:
Originally Posted by BRussell View Post

Yeah that seems like quite a stretch. Do you really believe that was a dig at Hillary frank777?

And weren't they forced into sending the text earlier than they wanted because of media leaks? I thought they had intended to send it Saturday morning.

I haven't been paying too much attention though.
A good brain ain't diddly if you don't have the facts
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A good brain ain't diddly if you don't have the facts
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post #87 of 207
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flounder View Post

I thought they had intended to send it Saturday morning.

3:00 AM is Saturday morning.

Not sure I believe in coincidences (especially in this realm). Seems deliberate. I don't really care though.
post #88 of 207
Quote:
Originally Posted by sslarson View Post

3:00 AM is Saturday morning.

Not sure I believe in coincidences (especially in this realm). Seems deliberate. I don't really care though.

Yes, shockingly enough, I'm aware of what AM means. Obviously, however, that was not the gist of my post.

And I agree about not really caring. It just doesn't seem deliberate to me.
A good brain ain't diddly if you don't have the facts
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A good brain ain't diddly if you don't have the facts
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post #89 of 207
Was it 3am est or pst? If it was pst then that would be morning back east.

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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post #90 of 207
Quote:
Originally Posted by BRussell View Post

Yeah that seems like quite a stretch. Do you really believe that was a dig at Hillary frank777?

The smart money would say that Obama would really avoid ticking off the Clintons any more.

But the 3am release of the VP announcement is not a coincidence.
This is a campaign run by professionals, that parse every word and sentence for potential danger.

And the campaign was certainly not forced into a release at 3am, and deliberately chose to miss the Friday night news cycle.
I think it's clearly a dig.
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The evil that we fight is but the shadow of the evil that we do.
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post #91 of 207
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank777 View Post

Yes it was funny. It's also significant that he used the VP choice to take a final shot at Hillary.

Well.... it was a pretty original thought, I'll give you that.......

eye
bee
BEE
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post #92 of 207
Thread Starter 
So the buzz is about Alaska gov. Sarah Palin for veep now. I think that's going to be scary to lots of Democrats.
post #93 of 207
Quote:
Originally Posted by BRussell View Post

So the buzz is about Alaska gov. Sarah Palin for veep now. I think that's going to be scary to lots of Democrats.

Sure. But then again, the Dems get scared of anyone with actual executive experience.
The evil that we fight is but the shadow of the evil that we do.
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The evil that we fight is but the shadow of the evil that we do.
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post #94 of 207
I don't think the Democrats, especially VP candidate Joe Biden, are scared of anyone this time around.
post #95 of 207
Quote:
Originally Posted by BRussell View Post

So the buzz is about Alaska gov. Sarah Palin for veep now. I think that's going to be scary to lots of Democrats.

No way.

This is just something to create news and get the spotlight off Obama's incredible night.
post #96 of 207
I think he'll pick Joe Biden.



(Hey, if it ain't broken, why fix it?)
post #97 of 207
Well he just picked Palin.

I can't wait for the VP debate!

Quote:
Update: Anthony makes a good point in comments, saying that Palin's "selection could be used to attack McCain for being disingenuous when he says Obama lacks the experience to be commander-in-chief." It would be a bit hard to center the campaign on experience when you're a 71-year-old man putting an Alaska governor with two years in office a heartbeat away from the presidency. In any case, today is a travel day for me, so if McCain nastily decides to announce while I'm on a plane, consider this a McCain VP open thread.
post #98 of 207
Thread Starter 
It's a very high-risk, purely political choice. Obviously McCain wants an attention-grabbing choice, but she's so unknown and untested that she could easily turn out to be another Dan Quayle.

Also, I bet there will be something kinda jarring about them together - this old fart and this young woman. They don't seem like a team.
post #99 of 207
It doesn't seem like a particularly strategic pick other than to rebut the historic significance of yesterday.

The Republicans are capable of some pretty mystifying mental jujitsu, but it's going to raise some eyebrows if the McCain camp keeps raising the "inexperience card." Really? You're putting a small-state (pop wise) Governor who's been in office for a year and a half a heartbeat away from the Presidency when the top of the ticket is a 70+ year old two-time cancer survivor?
post #100 of 207
Was the gambit here that McCain hopes to lock in the disappointed Hillary supporters, thinking they'll vote for just any woman on any ticket?

I don't know know much about this Palin, but at first blush I get a strong feeling that McCain just killed off whatever chance he had of winning this election. The experience argument against Obama? Gone. The votes from people who won't vote for a black man, many of whom are likely to be as sexist as they are racist? Gone.

Maybe this move shifts a few more independents McCain's way, but my gut feeling is that this strategy just isn't going to work out.
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We were once so close to heaven
Peter came out and gave us medals
Declaring us the nicest of the damned -- They Might Be Giants          See the stars at skyviewcafe.com
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post #101 of 207
It's clear they are trying to pick up any bitter undecided Clinton supporters still smarting over Obama's nomination.

edit: What shetline said.
post #102 of 207
Nothing against Palin but "is she tough enough" for the job?

I believe women can do any job a man can do including being the President of the United States of America.

But, Palin?

We all knew Hillary was tough enough no doubt about it.

But, Palin?

Wow... I am speechless that McCain would choose someone with a mere 2 years experience in a state house and from a state with virtually no population.

I am not sure she qualifies for prime time if the unthinkable were to happen to old John...



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Share your smile, Have respect for others, and be loving to all peoples

Paul in Athens: Acts 17 : 16-34
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May the peace of the Lord be with you always

Share your smile, Have respect for others, and be loving to all peoples

Paul in Athens: Acts 17 : 16-34
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post #103 of 207
The most sexist assertion today on that Scarborough show was that Biden might have to treat Palin with kid gloves during the debate because she's a woman.
post #104 of 207
Quote:
Originally Posted by ShawnJ View Post

You're putting a small-state (pop wise) Governor who's been in office for a year and a half a heartbeat away from the Presidency when the top of the ticket is a 70+ year old two-time cancer survivor?

That small state govenor took on corruption from established Republican interests and beat them into the ground.
McCain is possibly thinking that Cheney's neo-cons will have to be rooted out and slapped down hard.

Quote:
Originally Posted by shetline View Post

Was the gambit here that McCain hopes to lock in the disappointed Hillary supporters, thinking they'll vote for just any woman on any ticket?

I think this shows that McCain does understand electoral calculations.
Hillary's hard-core might stay home, but they were never going to vote GOP anyway.
The evil that we fight is but the shadow of the evil that we do.
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The evil that we fight is but the shadow of the evil that we do.
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post #105 of 207
I think this was a dumb move, but we will see... Any of the other more experienced female politicians would have been better...
"In a republic, voters may vote for the leaders they want, but they get the leaders they deserve."
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"In a republic, voters may vote for the leaders they want, but they get the leaders they deserve."
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post #106 of 207
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank777 View Post

That small state govenor took on corruption from established Republican interests and beat them into the ground.
McCain is possibly thinking that Cheney's neo-cons will have to be rooted out and slapped down hard.

...who's under investigation for corruption?

post #107 of 207
Quote:
Originally Posted by BRussell View Post

It's a very high-risk, purely political choice. Obviously McCain wants an attention-grabbing choice, but she's so unknown and untested that she could easily turn out to be another Dan Quayle.

Also, I bet there will be something kinda jarring about them together - this old fart and this young woman. They don't seem like a team.

I agree. It is sort of like a youngish black man and an irish guy so old he is astonished to discover the young black man is clean and articulate.

A little reminder for those that don't remember....

Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post

Obama: I have no idea and frankly, don't care.
McCain: I'm pulling for Sarah Palin. I think she would by far, be the best choice. It would earn my vote.

This mean John McCain just earned my vote. It also means I WIN!

I want a star and a cookie now.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ShawnJ View Post

Well he just picked Palin.

I can't wait for the VP debate!

Yes because the point to drive home is that if it doesn't qualify someone to be a heartbeat away, then they certainly shouldn't have the job in the first place.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ShawnJ View Post

It doesn't seem like a particularly strategic pick other than to rebut the historic significance of yesterday.

The Republicans are capable of some pretty mystifying mental jujitsu, but it's going to raise some eyebrows if the McCain camp keeps raising the "inexperience card." Really? You're putting a small-state (pop wise) Governor who's been in office for a year and a half a heartbeat away from the Presidency when the top of the ticket is a 70+ year old two-time cancer survivor?

So I guess the argument would be that representing Delaware is some big state experience? I'm all for these arguments. They disqualify three and qualify one. That would leave McCain standing alone.

Quote:
Originally Posted by shetline View Post

Was the gambit here that McCain hopes to lock in the disappointed Hillary supporters, thinking they'll vote for just any woman on any ticket?

I don't know know much about this Palin, but at first blush I get a strong feeling that McCain just killed off whatever chance he had of winning this election. The experience argument against Obama? Gone. The votes from people who won't vote for a black man, many of whom are likely to be as sexist as they are racist? Gone.

Maybe this move shifts a few more independents McCain's way, but my gut feeling is that this strategy just isn't going to work out.

Of course there is always the possibility that America isn't the insanely sexist and racist place you imagine and that the pick will give him a huge bounce because she represents being an outsider, is another fresh new face that will learn while the experience hits the grounding running on day one. That she represents a historic first with regard to being vice-president if McCain wins.

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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post #108 of 207
But the ONLY reason he picked her is because she's a woman. I wonder how long before he calls her a trollup and a cunt.
post #109 of 207
Wow...very typical of McCain...with our economy flailing...don't choose someone with vast experience in fixing major corporations, is eloquent, presidential, and has a proven brilliant ecomomic mind in Governor Romney...choose a governor, who happens to be a woman in an attempt to appease and garner votes of disenfranchised Hillary supporters. While sounds like decent theory on paper, I believe the execution of this will backfire because...

1) Hillary supporters aren't typically your anti-abortion, NRA-supportive, conservative folk.

2) Hillary supporters I imagine won't flock to a candidate simply based on gender. (Some will but most wont for the reasons in #1)

3) You've just put in a highly inexperienced (both on the federal level and from a foreign policy perspective) candidate a step away from the presidency in the event that you croak McCain.

Not smart at all. Congratulations John McCain, you've solidified my choice in Obama for '08 with you purely political move (as shetline accurately described).

Prepare to lose handily in Bob Dole proportions McCain.
post #110 of 207
Thread Starter 
Come on people, being the runner-up Miss Alaska 1985 isn't her only qualification to be president.
post #111 of 207
Thread Starter 
I just can't decide whether the better analogy to this pick is Harriet Miers or Dan Quayle.
post #112 of 207
Blatant grab at Hillary supporters. It might work.

I don't think her lack of experience counters McCain's same charge against Obama. After all in McCain's ticket the #1 person has a long career and the #2 person doesn't. In Obama's ticket the #1 person has a short career and the #2 person doesn't. McCain will point that out and voters will get it.

Other than a vagina I don't think she adds much to McCain's ticket. He didn't knock it out of the park with this choice. So that's good. I agree that putting an attractive (for politics) woman next to McCain does look a little creepy. Obama can get MoveOn and other 527s to act on that angle.


We'll see what's going to happen.
post #113 of 207
Quote:
Originally Posted by BRussell View Post

Come on people, being the runner-up Miss Alaska 1985 isn't her only qualification to be president.

Yea but she was a POW!
post #114 of 207
Quote:
Originally Posted by BRussell View Post

Come on people, being the runner-up Miss Alaska 1985 isn't her only qualification to be president.

What a sexist comment!

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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post #115 of 207
The fact that she's even now being investigated for using her office to punish her ex-brother-in-law during a nasty divorce from her sister, while serving as governor of the state with the most corrupt Republican party apparatus in the country (which is quite an achievement) doesn't strike me as a huge upside.

This really does seem to be kind of a desperation move, designed to shake things up and get some of the "old, tired and out of touch" off of McCain.

I expect to hear about how Palin is totally into texting and iTunes and all that internet whatchamacallit.

We can play little semantic games about who has the experience, but the fact remains that in Obama we have a candidate of enormous charisma who exudes confidence and know-how, with a running mate with an unassailable nuts-and-bolts resume. I don't think that even their enemies doubt that these guys are ready and capable of rolling up their sleeves and getting some work done, come January.

In McCain we have a candidate who exudes irritability and vagueness on the details, with little to talk about, apparently, beyond his status as a former POW and some childish sniping at Obama, who now has a running mate with almost no experience, no appearance of having even considered the big picture, and a built-in reminder of recent Republican tendencies towards using elected office as means for furthering personal agendas.

I do very much savor, however, the idea that, for Nick, being a historic, fresh-faced new comer is abruptly a good thing.
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post #116 of 207
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post

What a sexist comment!

It would be sexist, if someone said she was just a 1985 runner-up Miss Alaska. But I'm saying that would be wrong! There's definitely more to her than being 1985 runner-up Miss Alaska! I'm a feminist, trying to defend her against sexist attacks against her for being a runner-up Miss Alaska!

(BTW, I really hope you don't get banned for that post. )
post #117 of 207
What's really gonna be fun is what happens during the GOP convention, while Ron Paul holds his rally next door!

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post #118 of 207
Hmmmm, anti-choice hard liner, thinks creationism should be taught in Alaska schools, big oil patsy....

Yep, those Hillary voters are going to be lining up.
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post #119 of 207
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by addabox View Post

This really does seem to be kind of a desperation move, designed to shake things up and get some of the "old, tired and out of touch" off of McCain.

That's the real danger, that this becomes the media narrative: Biden is a solid choice that reflects well on Obama's seriousness, and Palin is a political hail-mary that underscores McCain's desperation.
post #120 of 207
Hunter over at dailykos puts it well:

Quote:
Like it or not, John McCain is a man who has not always been in the best of health. He's made "experience" the cornerstone of his campaign. So does he really believe -- does he really want all of us to believe -- that Palin is ready to be President of the United States, in the event something were to happen to him? Based on what?

I don't think it's a wrong choice, I think it's an unserious -- even fairly offensive -- choice. McCain isn't even officially his party's nominee yet, and he's already treating his presumptive office with disdain, and making executive decisions that seem like they've been phoned in or made in a panic.

Don't tell me it's his "brave" choice because she's a woman -- the Republican Party has many women more qualified for the Vice Presidency. I don't agree with them on issues, but they'd be more qualified. This choice is indeed akin to choosing Quayle -- it smacks of choosing someone because they won't get in the way, or because all the other potential candidates were too personally threatening. It's just a bad choice, period.

I think that's the thing that come across-- it just sort of seems like an unserious choice, not just because that it seems based entirely on political calculation, but because even that calculation is half-assed. It's like "Here, a winger for the wingers and a lady for the ladies. Happy now?"

As the right likes to say, it goes to judgement, and it suggests that in matters of judgement McCain doesn't really give a shit.
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