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Joe Biden - Subprime Vice President - Page 4

post #121 of 143
Quote:
Originally Posted by vinea View Post

Mkay...but it makes the appearance of Smoke if you know what I mean. Then we can infer Fire from said Smoke...

Actually, I really am not pointing at any one person here. It just seems like a general trend for how these things go.

Although I will point out that they have successfully annoyed you guys enough that one of you have been banned already.

So Conservatives 1 Liberals 0.

Or did I miss a banning?

mydol or whatever it's screen name was. But not banned in this particular thread, if that's what you meant in the current tense.
Every eye fixed itself upon him; with parted lips and bated breath the audience hung upon his words, taking no note of time, rapt in the ghastly fascinations of the tale. NOT!
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Every eye fixed itself upon him; with parted lips and bated breath the audience hung upon his words, taking no note of time, rapt in the ghastly fascinations of the tale. NOT!
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post #122 of 143
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by franksargent View Post

Just debt? Right there you show your true colors. Half an argument is no argument at all! \

I noted that those forms excluded many types of assets.

See how that works? No? Thought so. Hammer nail, Hammer nail, Hammer nail, ...

Bring it home Frank. Come on buddy. Link to the source that shows this pension could somehow be bought or sold to get rid of these debts and thus ought to be counted against them. Show how that government form is full of crap and how we are all deluded because we took that form at face value.

Hammer away buddy, hammer away.

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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post #123 of 143
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post

Bring it home Frank. Come on buddy. Link to the source that shows this pension could somehow be bought or sold to get rid of these debts and thus ought to be counted against them. Show how that government form is full of crap and how we are all deluded because we took that form at face value.

Hammer away buddy, hammer away.

Crap? Your word, AGAIN?

I already did, house, cars, boat, etceteras. Did you even bother to read the forms?

See how that works? No. Thought so. Hammer nail, hammer nail, hammer nail, ...

And since you appear to know more about the Biden's finances then the Biden's themselves, tell us what their credit report says?

I'm waiting ...
Every eye fixed itself upon him; with parted lips and bated breath the audience hung upon his words, taking no note of time, rapt in the ghastly fascinations of the tale. NOT!
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Every eye fixed itself upon him; with parted lips and bated breath the audience hung upon his words, taking no note of time, rapt in the ghastly fascinations of the tale. NOT!
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post #124 of 143
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by franksargent View Post

Crap? Your word, AGAIN?

I already did, house, cars, boat, etceteras.

See how that works? No. Hammer nail, hammer nail, hammer nail, ...

This is because most conservative (not party but financial) definitions do not include your primary residence as an asset. An awful lot of people are learning that very lesson right now which is why the subprime word is suddenly one everyone is familiar with.

Likewise most people do not consider cars, boats, etc. to be assets either.

An asset is something that increases in value and puts money in your pocket. Calling your car or golf clubs an asset is the type of definition that makes people with almost $200k in personal loans feel good about what they squandered their money on.

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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post #125 of 143
Quote:
Originally Posted by franksargent View Post

mydol or whatever it's screen name was. But not banned in this particular thread, if that's what you meant in the current tense.

Ah...I forgot about that.
post #126 of 143
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post

This is because most conservative (not party but financial) definitions do not include your primary residence as an asset. An awful lot of people are learning that very lesson right now which is why the subprime word is suddenly one everyone is familiar with.

Likewise most people do not consider cars, boats, etc. to be assets either.

An asset is something that increases in value and puts money in your pocket. Calling your car or golf clubs an asset is the type of definition that makes people with almost $200k in personal loans feel good about what they squandered their money on.

Sorry but you are wrong there. They have value. No debate there. Next.

Oops, you dropped house off that list? Why? Now were're splitting hairs? Why?

I wonder how long the Biden's have been at their current residence or home, or how many homes they've lived in over the years? You know like moving from one home to one other home.

Somehow, don't ask me how, but somehow, I don't believe that the Biden's have ever purchased a home at subprime rates. Don't ask me how, but I suspect it has to do with their ages and that he's been a senator for ~36 years now.

We've come full circle with your misrepresentation of Biden as being subprime being without providing a shread of evidenct to substantiate that claim.

Not one iota, not a single shard, absolutely nothing to support your subprime title.
Every eye fixed itself upon him; with parted lips and bated breath the audience hung upon his words, taking no note of time, rapt in the ghastly fascinations of the tale. NOT!
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Every eye fixed itself upon him; with parted lips and bated breath the audience hung upon his words, taking no note of time, rapt in the ghastly fascinations of the tale. NOT!
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post #127 of 143
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by franksargent View Post

Sorry but you are wrong there. They have value. No debate there. Next.

Oops, you dropped house off that list? Why?

No problem. Declare yourself right as many Americans did during the last housing bubble. If you can finance it then you deserve it. I'm buying the wreckage right now for cents on the dollar. It must have "value" if they will loan so much on it right?

Your primary residence isn't an asset because it doesn't put money in your pocket. Ask all those folks who bought too much or bought no matter the numbers if their "asset" saved them when the bill came due. It didn't. Get sick, lose a job or even be underemployed for a while and that "asset" will eat them alive.

If stocks were still more about dividends rather than churn and driving the stock price that would be a nice return to a more true asset class as well. This is in part of why Buffet has gone to buying businesses instead of buying stocks.

Assets put money in your pocket. It is the truest definition.

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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post #128 of 143
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post

No problem. Declare yourself right as many Americans did during the last housing bubble. If you can finance it then you deserve it. I'm buying the wreckage right now for cents on the dollar. It must have "value" if they will loan so much on it right?

Your primary residence isn't an asset because it doesn't put money in your pocket. Ask all those folks who bought too much or bought no matter the numbers if their "asset" saved them when the bill came due. It didn't. Get sick, lose a job or even be underemployed for a while and that "asset" will eat them alive.

If stocks were still more about dividends rather than churn and driving the stock price that would be a nice return to a more true asset class as well. This is in part of why Buffet has gone to buying businesses instead of buying stocks.

Assets put money in your pocket. It is the truest definition.

You are referring to liquid assets? I'm talking about all assets. See how that works?

Net worth is the sum total of all assets and all liabilities.

I've been through both Chapter 7 and Chapter 13, so I know what are assets and what are liabilities.

You don't get to decide what is and what isn't an asset, try as you might.

Sorry, I win, and you lose.

Game over.
Every eye fixed itself upon him; with parted lips and bated breath the audience hung upon his words, taking no note of time, rapt in the ghastly fascinations of the tale. NOT!
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Every eye fixed itself upon him; with parted lips and bated breath the audience hung upon his words, taking no note of time, rapt in the ghastly fascinations of the tale. NOT!
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post #129 of 143
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post

This is because most conservative (not party but financial) definitions do not include your primary residence as an asset.

Given that this is often the largest single asset in middle income families I think that this is a dubious assertion when it comes to computing personal wealth. Especially since it IS counted against you if you owe a mortgage.

Quote:
An awful lot of people are learning that very lesson right now which is why the subprime word is suddenly one everyone is familiar with.

Only folks who couldn't normally qualify for a mortgage in the first place.

Quote:
Likewise most people do not consider cars, boats, etc. to be assets either.

Homes are not in the same category.

Quote:
An asset is something that increases in value and puts money in your pocket. Calling your car or golf clubs an asset is the type of definition that makes people with almost $200k in personal loans feel good about what they squandered their money on.

Yes, and a house qualifies. A $1.3M+ house for certain.

http://maps.google.com/maps?q=http:/...22864&t=k&om=1

Pensions, retirement funds, etc too when calculating net worth. Especially one you get as a Senator.

The fact is the guy seems pretty clean. His retirement planning is covered by his pension plan that is easily supplemented by speaking engagements. Not quite like Tom DeLay. Didn't he come in poor and emerge as a millionaire?

The life insurance loans are nothing. They sound like full life, which are crappy to begin with and he's just surrendering the value that they pay out at death to pay for the premiums.

The only real loan of note is the line of credit in the 100K+ range and frankly that's likely just from being a Senator. I'd be surprised if other Senators didn't keep a line of credit open.

That said, he still strikes me as a weak VP choice, foreign policy experience or not.
post #130 of 143
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post

Your primary residence isn't an asset because it doesn't put money in your pocket. Ask all those folks who bought too much or bought no matter the numbers if their "asset" saved them when the bill came due. It didn't. Get sick, lose a job or even be underemployed for a while and that "asset" will eat them alive.

Except that he doesn't list a mortgage as a liability and his house is worth $1.3M.
post #131 of 143
OMG it's all so confusing!! Is Biden bad with money? WE'LL NEVER KNOW!

Shit, now I have to vote for McCain.
Gangs are not seen as legitimate, because they don't have control over public schools.
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Gangs are not seen as legitimate, because they don't have control over public schools.
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post #132 of 143
Quote:
Originally Posted by midwinter View Post

OMG it's all so confusing!! Is Biden bad with money? WE'LL NEVER KNOW!

Shit, now I have to vote for McCain.

A whole thread devoted to nothing. Or something. Or nothing. Or ... \

Partial net worth numbers that are accurate to plus/minus $300K allows one to draw no definitive conclusions with regard to someone's total net worth.

Categories: $0 to $1,000, $1,001 to $15,000, $15,001 to $50,000, $50,000 to $100,000, $100,001 to $250,000, ...

And as we've seen, if one attempts an honest and full accounting of Biden's total net worth, he isn't subprime, has never been subprime, and will never be subprime.

What would Jesus do?
Every eye fixed itself upon him; with parted lips and bated breath the audience hung upon his words, taking no note of time, rapt in the ghastly fascinations of the tale. NOT!
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Every eye fixed itself upon him; with parted lips and bated breath the audience hung upon his words, taking no note of time, rapt in the ghastly fascinations of the tale. NOT!
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post #133 of 143
Quote:
Originally Posted by franksargent View Post

What would Jesus do?

Say something about camels and needles?
post #134 of 143
Quote:
Originally Posted by vinea View Post

Pensions, retirement funds, etc too when calculating net worth. Especially one you get as a Senator.

Or any government employee with 36 years of federal service under their belt.

For example in Biden's case his high 3-year average is $165.2K.

His CSRS (an assumption I know, but I believe a good one for anyone with over 12 years of CSRS service prior to FERS (meaning you'd have to be brain-dead to switch in the first place as CSRS was a much better deal for the older age brackets)) annuity will be 68.25% of this or $112.75K/year, if/when he passes his surviving spouse would receive 55% of that or $62K/year.

Of course Dr. Biden will also collect her own annuity, but assuming both make it into their mid-80's, Joe's annuity alone has a present net worth of ~$3M (COLA's are built into the annuity of course).
Every eye fixed itself upon him; with parted lips and bated breath the audience hung upon his words, taking no note of time, rapt in the ghastly fascinations of the tale. NOT!
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Every eye fixed itself upon him; with parted lips and bated breath the audience hung upon his words, taking no note of time, rapt in the ghastly fascinations of the tale. NOT!
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post #135 of 143
Quote:
Originally Posted by vinea View Post

Say something about camels and needles?

Agreed, we may not agree on Biden the candidate, but the saying does seem appropriate here for a Roman Catholic like Biden;

[CENTER]
Quote:
...I tell you the truth, it is hard for a rich man to enter the kingdom of heaven. Again I tell you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God.

[/CENTER]
[LEFT]
Good one.[/LEFT]
Every eye fixed itself upon him; with parted lips and bated breath the audience hung upon his words, taking no note of time, rapt in the ghastly fascinations of the tale. NOT!
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Every eye fixed itself upon him; with parted lips and bated breath the audience hung upon his words, taking no note of time, rapt in the ghastly fascinations of the tale. NOT!
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post #136 of 143
So the assertion is that Joe is in quite poor / tenuous financial shape, yes?

If that assertion is correct, then Obama / Obama's vetting team must have either

A.) not discovered this

or

B.) didn't think it mattered enough to affect the decision to choose Joe.

So, which of these two is it? Or is there some third, more likely reason?
A good brain ain't diddly if you don't have the facts
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A good brain ain't diddly if you don't have the facts
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post #137 of 143
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by vinea View Post

Except that he doesn't list a mortgage as a liability and his house is worth $1.3M.

The form exempts listing housing. It also exempts listing mortgages. That is why we are having this discussion.

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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post #138 of 143
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by franksargent View Post

You are referring to liquid assets? I'm talking about all assets. See how that works?

Net worth is the sum total of all assets and all liabilities.

I've been through both Chapter 7 and Chapter 13, so I know what are assets and what are liabilities.

You don't get to decide what is and what isn't an asset, try as you might.

Sorry, I win, and you lose.

Game over.

I'm talking about all assets. See how that works.

Bragging you have been through bankruptcy twice means that {insult deleted}

Finally you are welcome to show how your creditors were able to touch your pension to recoup their debts each time you filed.

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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post #139 of 143
I suggest to elect Arpagon (See Moliere) as vice president*. He is at the light he manage his own money the perfect guy for the jog.

For the record, Bush junior, was not the perfect busisnessman ...


As Moliere is not very popular in USA, you can replace Arpagon by uncle Scrooge. You will get the idea
post #140 of 143
Still waiting for a thread about why we should vote for McCain that doesn't only focus on what is bad about the other side.

Is there anything good to say about McCain?

 

Your = the possessive of you, as in, "Your name is Tom, right?" or "What is your name?"

 

You're = a contraction of YOU + ARE as in, "You are right" --> "You're right."

 

 

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Your = the possessive of you, as in, "Your name is Tom, right?" or "What is your name?"

 

You're = a contraction of YOU + ARE as in, "You are right" --> "You're right."

 

 

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post #141 of 143
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bergermeister View Post

Still waiting for a thread about why we should vote for McCain that doesn't only focus on what is bad about the other side.

Is there anything good to say about McCain?

Apparently not!
Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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post #142 of 143
The reason to vote for McCain, except for the conjecture that he will support a "conservative" approach to war ("cowboy politics"), taxes ("trickle-down"), gun-control ("from my cold, dead hands"), abortion ("baby killing!!!") etc., and the fact that he's not Obama.

So other than the war, taxes, gun control and abortion, if we know nothing else about the candidates, those who are not swayed by those partisan positions have a choice:

Vote for Obama because he's not Bush.
Vote for McCain because he's not Obama.

Um... after the last eight years, seems like a no-brainer to me.

Then we look at the issues.

Obama will cut taxes for the middle class more than McCain will (and the IBD link does not prove otherwise).

Obama will attempt to use diplomacy before military.

McCain will continue the ideal to "fight them over there" even if no fighting at all is really necessary.

Obama will make it a crucial mission to reform health care from the ground up.

McCain will probably do nothing about the current health care system.

Then it's pretty clear who will be our next president if Americans are smart.

But... I have learned over the past two elections never to underestimate the stupidity of the American voter.
post #143 of 143
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bergermeister View Post

Still waiting for a thread about why we should vote for McCain that doesn't only focus on what is bad about the other side.

Is there anything good to say about McCain?

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