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How low can McCain go? - Page 2

post #41 of 280
post #42 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by FloorJack View Post

You kinda skipped the ad where Obama tried to hang a racist misquote from Limbaugh on McCain. Talk about a lie?

McCain, Obama Mislead on Immigration





Of course in a pro-obama WaPo blog it's burred at the end of the page with no fancy you tube link. Go figure.

Oh that Obama can go oh so low.

So not having even seen the ad you take the word of the WP only at times when it serves your purpose, but otherwise ignore the larger issue of McCain's proven immigration track record?

Quote:
INTERVIEWER: "You voted for the construction of the wall between Mexico and the United States..."
JOHN MCCAIN: "I didn't vote for an...I am not sure what you are talking about, but we can secure...our borders with walls and/or fences in urban areas, and then virtual fences, vehicle barriers.
INTERVIEWER: "But, you did vote for the wall."
MCCAIN: "I didn't vote for an...I don't know what you are exactly what you are referring to."

Quote:
But he (McCain) changed his position in 2006 as he prepared for his presidential bid, and voted for a law that was focused almost exclusively on keeping illegal aliens out. The law stipulates that a large stretch of the new wall would be built in McCain's home state of Arizona.

They called him Flipper! Flipper! ...
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post #43 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by @_@ Artman View Post


More banal personal attacks from Democrats.
post #44 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mystic View Post

More banal personal attacks from Democrats.

But wait, there's more!



Of course, this satire, as was the other one.

Well, sort of.

Get a sense of humor Mystic.
post #45 of 280
Are you saying that you think this is funny?


I don't find it funny at all. I find both vile and hateful.
post #46 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mystic View Post

Are you saying that you think this is funny?


I don't find it funny at all. I find both vile and hateful.

Though I laughed at first, it was more thought provoking. It was a representation of what the right-wing media was portraying the Obamas to be. It was patently false of course, but some people have such thin skin these days.
post #47 of 280
Artman's posts can't possibly be construed as anything else but satire.

Your satirical example was on the cover of a national magazine.

To some that believe Obama to be Muslim, it could be construed by these people that the portrayal, cartoon or not, legitimizes their belief.

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/09/21/op...ristof.html?hp
Quote:
A Pew Research Center survey released a few days ago found that only half of Americans correctly know that Mr. Obama is a Christian. Meanwhile, 13 percent of registered voters say that he is a Muslim, compared with 12 percent in June and 10 percent in March.

More ominously, a rising share now 16 percent say they arent sure about his religion because theyve heard different things about it.

Apathy as an excuse?
Why the rise in the belief Obama is Muslim?
Why isn't it ominous that those not sure are willing to be swayed?
Quote:
John Green, of the Pew Forum on Religion and Public Life, says that about 10 percent of Americans believe we may be in the Book of Revelations end times and are on the lookout for the Antichrist. A constant barrage of e-mail and broadcasts suggest that Mr. Obama just may be it.

Comforting thought.
post #48 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by screener View Post

Artman's posts can't possibly be construed as anything else but satire.

Your satirical example was on the cover of a national magazine.

To some that believe Obama to be Muslim, it could be construed by these people that the portrayal, cartoon or not, legitimizes their belief.

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/09/21/op...ristof.html?hp

Apathy as an excuse?
Why the rise in the belief Obama is Muslim?
Why isn't it ominous that those not sure are willing to be swayed?

Comforting thought.

Racists. Racism.
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post #49 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by franksargent View Post

Racists. Racism.

I either read a link posted here or elsewhere where it's described as acceptable racism.

I stated my beliefs weeks ago that the US is still a racist society, just not as blatant about it.

By spreading the lie it enables people conflicted about voting for a black man the excuse and rational to not vote for him.
post #50 of 280
In case anyone is interested Obama and McCain will be interviewed on 60 min. tonight at 7:00 pm.

http://www.aintitcool.com/node/38417
Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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post #51 of 280
post #52 of 280
post #53 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by screener View Post

I either read a link posted here or elsewhere where it's described as acceptable racism.

I stated my beliefs weeks ago that the US is still a racist society, just not as blatant about it.

By spreading the lie it enables people conflicted about voting for a black man the excuse and rational to not vote for him.

... or it's just that the media is sensing trouble in Obama's earthly heaven, and wants to be able to blame his possible loss on racism, rather than his moronic policy positions and affiliations. Obama and his Democratic party are the only ones bringing race into this election. Time after time after time. He's constantly repeating "they're going to tell you A, B, and C"- but McCain and the GOP are not saying A, B and C. Obama not only is using a strawman, but a racist strawman.
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post #54 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jubelum View Post

... or it's just that the media is sensing trouble in Obama's earthly heaven, and wants to be able to blame his possible loss on racism, rather than his moronic policy positions and affiliations. Obama and his Democratic party are the only ones bringing race into this election. Time after time after time. He's constantly repeating "they're going to tell you A, B, and C"- but McCain and the GOP are not saying A, B and C. Obama not only is using a strawman, but a racist strawman.

I'd like you to provide an example of where Obama accused McCain of some racist strawman.
post #55 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jubelum View Post

... or it's just that the media is sensing trouble in Obama's earthly heaven, and wants to be able to blame his possible loss on racism, rather than his moronic policy positions and affiliations. Obama and his Democratic party are the only ones bringing race into this election. Time after time after time. He's constantly repeating "they're going to tell you A, B, and C"- but McCain and the GOP are not saying A, B and C. Obama not only is using a strawman, but a racist strawman.

Uh, Obama brought race into this election when he tossed his black ass into it. And he knew it, would have to put up a defense against the lies and stupidity.

And the reason McCain or the GOP won't say A, B or C is because the effect would be devastating. McCain knows he can't use the race issue because of the "Black Baby of 2000" (created by another GOP opponent, mind you).

Because I believe that Obama's "A, B's and C''s" are in defense of his race and in matters where he had to spin (YES HE DOES SPIN! SHOCKER!), especially with the Reverend Wright shit.

Yet right now, I don't know where to go with this reply. Because I really haven't gotten exactly what you are saying yet. You sometimes sound like Glenn Beck when I read your posts...

better than posting a silly picture tho' right?

Quote:
Originally Posted by BRussell View Post

I'd like you to provide an example of where Obama accused McCain of some racist strawman.

Yes, do you?
post #56 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by BRussell View Post

I'd like you to provide an example of where Obama accused McCain of some racist strawman.

Did you miss the "he doesn't look like the other presidents on the currency" and "oh, did I mention he's black" and all that? Really?

Those are occasions where BHO is creating a massive strawman... claiming "they are going to say this and going to say that..." but THEY ARE NOT SAYING THOSE THINGS. He's stating that he's going to be attacked on racist grounds, though there is no evidence of anything like that coming from McCain. He's trying to get victim points for something that he's not actually encountering from his opponent, and in the process, he's calling his opponents racists.
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post #57 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jubelum View Post

Did you miss the "he doesn't look like the other presidents on the currency" and "oh, did I mention he's black" and all that? Really?

Oh, your so like, June 2008 dude.

Quote:
Blah blahblahb-b-bbblah....he's calling his opponents racists.

PROVE IT. Show me where and when Obama used the word racist against any of his opponents.
post #58 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jubelum View Post

Did you miss the "he doesn't look like the other presidents on the currency" and "oh, did I mention he's black" and all that? Really?

Those are occasions where BHO is creating a massive strawman... claiming "they are going to say this and going to say that..." but THEY ARE NOT SAYING THOSE THINGS. He's stating that he's going to be attacked on racist grounds, though there is no evidence of anything like that coming from McCain. He's trying to get victim points for something that he's not actually encountering from his opponent, and in the process, he's calling his opponents racists.

No, I didn't miss Obama saying that about the currency. Did you miss the McCain attack ad from a few weeks earlier where they put Obama's face on the currency? The definition of a straw man would have to include McCain actually NOT doing what was alleged.

And that's just the official McCain campaign...
post #59 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by dollarcollapse View Post

Maybe he's been studying the Republican electioneering manual.

I rest my case.
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post #60 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by @_@ Artman View Post

PROVE IT. Show me where and when Obama used the word racist against any of his opponents.

wow... that's where we're going to set the bar... acutally using the word? I'll keep that in mind.

Let me make sure I have this straight... Obama is not making any accusation or allusion when he tells us that Republicans are going to say racist things? (Though they have not?) He's not trying to paint his opponents as racists, even though they have not done any of the things that he claims they "are going to" do that qualify them as racists?

That's awesome. You, as a political candidate, can respond to attacks that have not come, paint your opponents as racists, though they have not done anything that you are anticipating, and then have your surrogates invoke the name of Willy Horton?

Welcome to cloud-cuckoo land.
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post #61 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by BRussell View Post

The definition of a straw man would have to include McCain actually NOT doing what was alleged.

What a leap... and what a low, low bar to throw out the term "racist." Obama lampooned a national symbol in his arrogance. McCain's ad took it to the rest of our national symbols. Claiming that putting his face on a dollar bill is explicit racism is rather desperate, IMHO. So, to answer your question, he did NOT do what was alleged, if you take Obama's characterization of it in it's own context.
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post #62 of 280
Sherman, set the WABAC machine to here in America in July of this year, where we'll rehash stale old stuff over and over again, we need to see that clueless hot headed grumpy old man John McCain.

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post #63 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jubelum View Post

What a leap... and what a low, low bar to throw out the term "racist." Obama lampooned a national symbol in his arrogance. McCain's ad took it to the rest of our national symbols. Claiming that putting his face on a dollar bill is explicit racism is rather desperate, IMHO. So, to answer your question, he did NOT do what was alleged, if you take Obama's characterization of it in it's own context.

So, Obama called McCain a racist? Oh, no he didn't, did he. The sequence of events is this:

1. McCain produces an ad with Obama's face on the currency and Mt Rushmore etc., saying "IS THIS WHAT WE WANT!"
2. Obama says "they're going to say I don't look like the other presidents on the money."

Therefore, Obama's statement is not a straw man.
post #64 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by BRussell View Post

So, Obama called McCain a racist? Oh, no he didn't, did he. The sequence of events is this:

1. McCain produces an ad with Obama's face on the currency and Mt Rushmore etc., saying "IS THIS WHAT WE WANT!"
2. Obama says "they're going to say I don't look like the other presidents on the money."

Therefore, Obama's statement is not a straw man.

And it was actually the McCain campaign that cried RACISM as loud as possible. What was it they said exactly, "Obama played the race card from the bottom of the deck." Funny how conservatives see the reality right in front of their face and yet willingly choose to lie about what they saw. Fascinating.
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post #65 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by Northgate View Post

And it was actually the McCain campaign that cried RACISM as loud as possible. What was it they said exactly, "Obama played the race card from the bottom of the deck." Funny how conservatives see the reality right in front of their face and yet willingly choose to lie about what they saw. Fascinating.

Jubelum's reply to my response to a response, fascinating.

Go back and read my response to Artman's response and maybe you'll see it's about the public perception of Obama being a Muslim.

How he morphed this into the media being in the bag for Obama is beyond me.
post #66 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by @_@ Artman View Post

Uh, Obama brought race into this election when he tossed his black ass into it.

*DING* *DING* *DING* *DING*



Pick one. No, Timmy, I said one. Don't spoil your dinner.
post #67 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by screener View Post

Jubelum's reply to my response to a response, fascinating.

Go back and read my response to Artman's response and maybe you'll see it's about the public perception of Obama being a Muslim.

How he morphed this into the media being in the bag for Obama is beyond me.

Well, I have a pet theory surrounding the Muslim thing. I think many many white folks simply cannot vote for a black man. I believe many of these people are like my father. From the 50's. From the south. There's a great amount of distrust to this day. I love my father, but he's glommed onto the whole "Muslim" thing. Even though he has racial tendencies deep down inside, he believes he doesn't (or he's been lying to himself about it).

Bottom line: most folks don't want to admit they won't vote for a black man so they find something else that's good enough not to vote for him. The Muslim rumors serve that purpose.
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post #68 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by Northgate View Post

Well, I have a pet theory surrounding the Muslim thing. I think many many white folks simply cannot vote for a black man. I believe many of these people are like my father. From the 50's. From the south. There's a great amount of distrust to this day. I love my father, but he's glommed onto the whole "Muslim" thing. Even though he has racial tendencies deep down inside, he believes he doesn't (or he's been lying to himself about it).

Bottom line: most folks don't want to admit they won't vote for a black man so they find something else that's good enough not to vote for him. The Muslim rumors serve that purpose.

Exactly the people I was talking about, about 20 posts ago.

Acceptable racism.
post #69 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by Northgate View Post

And it was actually the McCain campaign that cried RACISM as loud as possible. What was it they said exactly, "Obama played the race card from the bottom of the deck." Funny how conservatives see the reality right in front of their face and yet willingly choose to lie about what they saw. Fascinating.

Yeah, I mean everyone understand that, with 80% white and 10% black in the country, the last thing Obama wants is for race to be an issue. It's just a political reality for his campaign to be "post-racial." Not that he doesn't take that role naturally, but the idea that he just can't wait to inject race is pretty absurd even from a realist point of view.
post #70 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by Northgate View Post

Well, I have a pet theory surrounding the Muslim thing. I think many many white folks simply cannot vote for a black man. I believe many of these people are like my father. From the 50's. From the south. There's a great amount of distrust to this day. I love my father, but he's glommed onto the whole "Muslim" thing. Even though he has racial tendencies deep down inside, he believes he doesn't (or he's been lying to himself about it).

Bottom line: most folks don't want to admit they won't vote for a black man so they find something else that's good enough not to vote for him. The Muslim rumors serve that purpose.

I think that's pretty insightful.

And apart from the he-said she-said of campaigns, does anyone really believe that race isn't an issue at all, I mean for some voters? I'm sure Obama is getting some votes partially because of his race, and I'm sure he's losing some. Is that really some kind crazy belief?
post #71 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by BRussell View Post

I think that's pretty insightful.

And apart from the he-said she-said of campaigns, does anyone really believe that race isn't an issue at all, I mean for some voters? I'm sure Obama is getting some votes partially because of his race, and I'm sure he's losing some. Is that really some kind crazy belief?

Well, I think "we" are having a sane rational discussion about race in this campaign. But those with the guilty consciences are screaming at the top of their lungs about how horrible all this is. Or they're screaming that they themselves aren't allowed to discuss it. Or something. Whatever it is, they're PISSED OFF about it. Their rhetoric shows it. I suspect the feigned outrage is simply a device to keep "race" in the discussion for as long as possible.

I agree. It does Obama no good to inject race into the campaign. However, he cannot let unfettered racial undertones premeate the campaign without addressing them otherwise he looks weak. And maybe that's what Republicans want. They want him to look weak. So what do they do? They bait him with Obama on the money ad. And when Obama reacts to that ad (in a non-racial way), the McCain campaign got what they wanted...an opening. Pure. Political. Calculated.

What's amazing is that some folks on these boards don't believe it's a game plan. They believe it's "real." And not only do they believe it's real, they believe it's diabolical as well.

And at the end of the day there's folks like you and me who are sitting here scratching our heads wonder what the fuck just happened!
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post #72 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mystic View Post

Are you saying that you think this is funny?


I don't find it funny at all. I find both vile and hateful.

Well.

Let's look at it several ways:

(1) It wasn't intended to be "vile" and "hateful." It's the cover of a popular liberal magazine.
(2) Its readers don't interpret it that way. They are "in" on the joke, a satire of the right-wing's worst slime they throw at him.
(3) What's left is your perception. Given what you know about the magazine's intentions and its audience, do you still hold the same view? Why?
post #73 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by Northgate View Post

Well, I have a pet theory surrounding the Muslim thing. I think many many white folks simply cannot vote for a black man. I believe many of these people are like my father. From the 50's. From the south. There's a great amount of distrust to this day. I love my father, but he's glommed onto the whole "Muslim" thing. Even though he has racial tendencies deep down inside, he believes he doesn't (or he's been lying to himself about it).

Bottom line: most folks don't want to admit they won't vote for a black man so they find something else that's good enough not to vote for him. The Muslim rumors serve that purpose.

Ding ding ding!
post #74 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by Northgate View Post

Bottom line: most folks don't want to admit they won't vote for a black man so they find something else that's good enough not to vote for him. The Muslim rumors serve that purpose.

Yep. Totally agree. A good friend of mine would be a good example. She was actually considering sitting out this election until the Reps came up with pet Palin.

Then it happened. It was like Palin was the miracle she had been praying for and she changed completely. (Sort of like the 180 some who don't want to be perceived as far right do when the usual far right suspects show up on a thread.) You know who you are.

Anyways, shortly after the R convention, my friend in full ecstasy mode said to me that she "had a problem" with Obama having a muslim name.

I called her BS. I told her she had a problem with BO being black. No reply. I don't really need neanderthal friends like that. \
post #75 of 280
But...but... he's NOT black!

Oh... and he's the anti-christ.
post #76 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gilsch View Post

Yep. Totally agree. A good friend of mine would be a good example. She was actually considering sitting out this election until the Reps came up with pet Palin.

Then it happened. It was like Palin was the miracle she had been praying for and she changed completely. (Sort of like the 180 some who don't want to be perceived as far right do when the usual far right suspects show up on a thread.) You know who you are.

Anyways, shortly after the R convention, my friend in full ecstasy mode said to me that she "had a problem" with Obama having a muslim name.

I called her BS. I told her she had a problem with BO being black. No reply. I don't really need neanderthal friends like that. \

Kinda like The Lady DeRothschild saying she won't vote for him because he's "uppity"...sorry..."elitist". That's rich.
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post #77 of 280
I also love how Republicans (and so-called Libertarians) try to claim that no Republicans have said anything racial regarding Obama. Sure, none of the big nasty words have been used. That would be political suicide. But the subliminal stuff has been used repeatedly. Particular Southern expressions.

Who was that said, "That boy can't be allowed to have his finger on the button"?

Who was it that referred to Michelle Obama as Obama's "baby mamma", a hugely derogatory term used against black women?

Who was it that keeps referring to Barack as "disrespectful", which in the old south was a term used to describe affluent blacks when they didn't yield the road, or look white folks directly in the eye.

Weren't flyers sent out in New Jersey that stated, "Black Ruled Nations most unstable and violent in the world. The United States of America will be next! Why should we seal our fate by allowing a black ruler to destroy us?" Which party did that come from exactly?

Which congressman was it that said Obama was "uppity" and when told the term was considered derogatory towards Blacks, particularly Souther blacks, and the congressman didn't back down? I can't remember his name. He was definitely a Republican though.

Nope. No signs of race baiting here.
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post #78 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by Northgate View Post

I also love how Republicans (and so-called Libertarians) try to claim that no Republicans have said anything racial regarding Obama. Sure, none of the big nasty words have been used. That would be political suicide. But the subliminal stuff has been used repeatedly. Particular Southern expressions.

Who was that said, "That boy can't be allowed to have his finger on the button"?

Who was it that referred to Michelle Obama as Obama's "baby mamma", a hugely derogatory term used against black women?

Who was it that keeps referring to Barack as "disrespectful", which in the old south was a term used to describe affluent blacks when they didn't yield the road, or look white folks directly in the eye.

Weren't flyers sent out in New Jersey that stated, "Black Ruled Nations most unstable and violent in the world. The United States of America will be next! Why should we seal our fate by allowing a black ruler to destroy us?" Which party did that come from exactly?

Which congressman was it that said Obama was "uppity" and when told the term was considered derogatory towards Blacks, particularly Souther blacks, and the congressman didn't back down? I can't remember his name. He was definitely a Republican though.

Nope. No signs of race baiting here.

And just who called him "clean" and "articulate"?
post #79 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mystic View Post

And just who called him "clean" and "articulate"?

I have to admit that Biden gets the cookie for the first racial gaffe of this campaign...\

Yet, if one returns to it...

Quote:
"I mean, you got the first mainstream African-American who is articulate and bright and clean and a nice-looking guy," Biden said. "I mean, that's a storybook, man."

Biden issued a statement Wednesday afternoon, saying: "I deeply regret any offense my remark in the New York Observer might have caused anyone. That was not my intent and I expressed that to Sen. Obama."

Biden also spoke to reporters in a conference call Wednesday afternoon and said the remark was taken out of context.

"Barack Obama is probably the most exciting candidate that the Democratic or Republican Party has produced at least since I've been around," Biden said on the call. "And he's fresh. He's new. He's smart. He's insightful. And I really regret that some have taken totally out of context my use of the world 'clean.'"

Biden said he was referring to a phrase used by his mother.

"My mother has an expression: clean as a whistle, sharp as a tack," Biden said.

Obama, in a brief off-camera interview in a Senate hallway, said he thinks Biden "didn't intend to offend" anyone.

"He called me," Obama said. "I told him it wasn't necessary. We have got more important things to worry about. We have got Iraq. We have got health care. We have got energy. This is low on the list."

"He was very gracious and I have no problem with Joe Biden," Obama added.

...it is the most silly and least offensive of them all. Even I would be flattered by that comment. Obama was flattered? I guess so.
post #80 of 280
Who called him a "black boy"? Not a republican.
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