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Seinfeld, Gates 'connect' with regular folks in new Microsoft ad - Page 3

post #81 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by Virgil-TB2 View Post

At the risk of getting political yet again, a good example would be the Iraq war. Two people can look at this same "heap of facts" and one can think (logically) that it was a foolish unethical endeavour unlikely to do anything but make things worse, whereas the other can look at it and see it as a great idea because they are basing their assessment on subjective immaterial things like religion, country, etc.

Sorry, it's not nearly as cut and dry as you'd like to think. In fact you're already applying your built in bias to your statement and your claims of it being "foolish" and "unethical" are, in fact, still opinions. Also, the claim of making things "worse" is comical at best, depressing at worst. 1) You have no idea what the world would be like if we hadn't gone over so to claim it would be worse is you claiming to know what things exist in an alternate universe (if there is such a thing) and 2) how would you define "worse"? There haven't been any terrorist attacks on US soil since 7 years and 1 day ago so "factually" speaking it's "better."

As far as the ads go - It's like a rejected scene from Seinfeld which, I guess means it's still kinda funny (to me) but it's a few years too late. I think this entire campaign is just about trying to clean up the image of MS - hence why they aren't actually pushing Vista, or anything else for that matter. They just want people to think MS isn't that bad of a company.
post #82 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by Virgil-TB2 View Post

Hey thanks for the insult and for putting words in my mouth etc. when I tried as hard as I could not to do the same and apologised for any untoward offence as well. You may infer all kinds of things out of what I said, but that's a subjective journey you are on all by yourself. .............................

I'm sorry if you took offense or thought anything I said was meant as an insult. I was only stating facts, that any objective, educated, person could see were correct... and only an irrational person would think in another way....


(oh by the way, you act like your talking to one person, when its multiple people replying back to you...)
post #83 of 147
Let's not forget that Apple isn't always right either!! And I love my Mac.
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post #84 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by Virgil-TB2 View Post

...but especially with political side of the argument (because the factors are a lot simpler) ...

Without commenting on your choice of computers or candidates (I like Obama, too), the fact that you think the factors of deciding which candidate to choose to be President of the United States are simpler than than the factors in selecting a computer to purchase is very disturbing to me. It suggests that your decision is based more on emotion than on the details of each candiate's positions and policies, and that derails your "only rational choice" argument (rational choices are based on facts, not emotions). We elected our last President based on emotion (fear), and we know how that turned out. Let's not make the same mistake again!

By all means, vote for Obama; but don't do it because he gives good speeches or because you hate the current Administration. Do it because you've studied his proposals. Not just that he wants to change things, but how he wants to change them. And if after all that you still think buying a computer is a more complex decision, might I suggest you have someone else making your computer purchases for you.

Edit: Ok, I guess I commented on your choice of candidates...oops. (Oh, and...GET A MAC!!)
post #85 of 147
For me I applaud Microsoft for their work. For one thing, when do you see Steve Jobs in an apple ad?
post #86 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nanotech View Post

For me I applaud Microsoft for their work. For one thing, when do you see Steve Jobs in an apple ad?

He is too busy running a company that produces really good stuff.
post #87 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nanotech View Post

For me I applaud Microsoft for their work. For one thing, when do you see Steve Jobs in an apple ad?

Unlike Gates, Jobs hasn't retired, yet I see Jobs' influence in every Apple ad.
post #88 of 147
Ok,so it's obviously a free for all on this thread to give a polital speech or two.
The US is in much worse shape due to the unfettered greed of very wealthy,very bad Republican mass murderers. Obama would not have killed those one million Iraqis',that's change you can believe in!! God bless the troops though.
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post #89 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nanotech View Post

For me I applaud Microsoft for their work. For one thing, when do you see Steve Jobs in an apple ad?

Care to elaborate on what "work" you're referring to exactly? Is it necessary for a company figurehead to be in the company's ads?
post #90 of 147
Really enjoyed this second ad! Funny, quirky and original. Much more advanced than the blatant Vista sucks message to which we are used. As has been said enough, there is no need for them to mention Windows, I don't see why people expect them to after seeing the first ad. Damage control of brand perception seems to be much higher on the agenda.

I like how they're developing the characters, and while it's hard to get the main plot at the moment, there's one thing the ads do for sure, and that's leave me wanting to see more. The Mac vs PC ads stopped doing that long ago, and i've only ever seen any of them once as they will never screen on tv in nz, whereas I hope these ms ones do.

All of the unfaltering ms/vista hate is just unhealthy. Personally I'm really happy to have vista boot camped on my mbp, and I have fewer issues with it than I do with Leopard!

Look forward to the next.
post #91 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by MartiNZ View Post

Really enjoyed this second ad! Funny, quirky and original. Much more advanced than the blatant Vista sucks message to which we are used.

That's where we have to agree to disagree.

Quote:
I like how they're developing the characters, and while it's hard to get the main plot at the moment, there's one thing the ads do for sure, and that's leave me wanting to see more.

Agreed, we disagree.

IMHO it's already clear where these ads are going: Gates & ex-company are more in touch with the average person (unlike Macs supposedly being for the elite); and Microsoft makes "great" products that help people get through their daily lives, by meeting their most fundamental and mundane needs... like the delivery of porn.
post #92 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by Virgil-TB2 View Post

Well "mundane," "ordinary," and "regular" here are all actually code words for "dumb." It is a negative, it's just dressed up in PC language.

Just as any smart, educated person would in the absence of any other driving factors pick a Mac over a PC, and Obama over McCain. There is no logical or "smart" argument that can be made for doing otherwise. You will also hear Mac users referred to as "sophisticated" users sometimes, which is similar code for "smart and capable."

These advertisements are a bit offensive to me, but they get away with it because they are aimed at folks that likely won't "get" the fact that they are kinda being made fun of. It's like MS is saying ... "Hey, your not so smart, your not rich, your life kinda sucks in many ways. So you're one of us!" (and should by association use MS products, which are made for folks like you.)

So I'm dumb because I am a libertarian and find that McCains views and policies go along more with what I would like more than Obamas views do?

It's also sad to see Mac users still thinking themselves above PC users just because we prefer OS X and the Mac experience. No wonder we were labeled Elitists.
post #93 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hands Sandon View Post

Ok,so it's obviously a free for all on this thread to give a polital speech or two.
The US is in much worse shape due to the unfettered greed of very wealthy,very bad Republican mass murderers. Obama would not have killed those one million Iraqis',that's change you can believe in!! God bless the troops though.


you forgot that Obama is going to resurrect the millions of iraqis and billions of others that Bush single-handedly killed.
post #94 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by doh123 View Post

you forgot that Obama is going to resurrect the millions of iraqis and billions of others that Bush single-handedly killed.

Don't you realize that making sick jokes about mass death is disgusting.Keep it to yourself in future.
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post #95 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hands Sandon View Post

Don't you realize that making sick jokes about mass death is disgusting.Keep it to yourself in future.

thats what you did... all i did was make joke about mass resurrections...
post #96 of 147
The big question this raises for me is...

did anyone actually have the patience to watch to the end of this nonsense?
post #97 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by MartiNZ View Post

Personally I'm really happy to have vista boot camped on my mbp, and I have fewer issues with it than I do with Leopard!

Completely negating everything you've said in one sentence.
post #98 of 147
And what's with all the off topic political garbage, I thought these threads were supposed to be about the articles.

Are the mods going to delete the crap, or are we just going to have to avoid this site until after the election?
post #99 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by minderbinder View Post

And what's with all the off topic political garbage, I thought these threads were supposed to be about the articles.

Are the mods going to delete the crap, or are we just going to have to avoid this site until after the election?

if you actually read any of it you'd see it was mainly about comparing "PC" vs Mac and Obama vs McCain.. and similarities (or lack thereof)
post #100 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

And I'm trying to look at this seriously, as a former Ad man, without making the usual Microsoft jokes.

Since when does doing techie work for an ad agency make you an "ad man"?

That spot was funnier than most sitcoms currently on the air, and if people can't recognize what MS is trying to accomplish with this campaign, they either have no sense of humor, or are just another M$ sux, Apple fan-boy.
post #101 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hands Sandon View Post

Don't you realize that making sick jokes about mass death is disgusting.Keep it to yourself in future.

Why don't you wait until you've been here a least a week before telling someone what to do?

post #102 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by wilco View Post

That spot was funnier than most sitcoms currently on the air, and if people can't recognize what MS is trying to accomplish with this campaign, they either have no sense of humor, or are just another M$ sux, Apple fan-boy.

The world must be ending because I'm actually agreeing with your statement.
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post #103 of 147
these MS ads are just so annoying and stupid. I'm not anti-MS, but c'mon...all that money ($300M) and all you can come up with is THIS?????
post #104 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by Magic_Al View Post

Are these "regular folks" who use Windows instead of Mac the same people who choose Leno over Letterman, and McCain over Obama? When did mundane become better than elite?

Yes the same people who choose PC over Mac.... what's his name over Leno and what's his name over McCain.
post #105 of 147
sooooooooo lamo.
post #106 of 147
These ads are boring and uncreative. I'm shocked because I'm in advertising and when I heard that Microsoft hired ad gurus Crispin Porter + Bogusky I thought these ads were going to be a slam dunk winner. CPB does all the great Burger King, Mini and Truth ads.

If the intent is to 'counter' the Apple switch ads, they are are just not connecting.

Maybe they should have hired TWBA.
post #107 of 147
See this site for an interesting analysis of the ad:
http://www.tgdaily.com/html_tmp/cont...39294-118.html

Basically, the family Bill & Jerry are visiting is Apple
- the grandma is Steve Jobs ("She's been here for 12 years!")
- Apple is all about surface (Djon Mustard with Wine)
- but the products aren't new underneath (same as yesterday with Cheese on)
- there's basic stuff missing (no ketchup)
- and there's chewing gum in the food...

If you accept that then there are a couple of references to 'real'
- the grandma is 'real' but the daughter is 'not real'

The leather-whatever is about Jerry & Bill being accused of stealing something that they don't have an interest in....
- it's also about Apple's obsession with surface & packaging (leather, glass, aluminium etc)


Meanwhile the +ve spin is about M$ being about connecting people, and having lot's of good stuff in the future (both ads so far imply this)
- and the first ad depicts Bill, though he's a billionaire, as someone who cares about the basic details of products (in this case shoes, but by implication software)
- he's also shown giving a kid a lecture on programming...

Oh, and there's a whiff of financial scandal going on between the husband & wife....

- ouch!

Aparently, in the first add the Shoe store (Shoe Circus) is an Apple Store, the shoe that doesn't fit is a Mac, the shoe saleman is a 'Genius', as a Shoe Circus Clown Club Card Platinum member (Mac Buyer) you get Big Top Points (i.e. nothing of substance)

- ouch again!
post #108 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by samurai1999 View Post

See this site for an interesting analysis of the ad:
http://www.tgdaily.com/html_tmp/cont...39294-118.html

Yeah, the Ads are cute too.

But if it has to be explained like that, then it isn't effective.

It comes across more like what the surface of the Ad is showing. That they are visiting a not too bright family who are their potential customers.

That's the way most people will see it.

Sadly for MS, most people are not very good at subtlety.

Having been in that business (Ad) for a while early in my career, I'll tell that we were always told that the point must be made at the beginning, and in an obvious way.

Ads that aren't made that way often win awards, but are also not very effective. Many Ads won the Clio, but failed to sell product.

If they don't start talking about Vista soon, most people will never "get it".
post #109 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

If they don't start talking about Vista soon, most people will never "get it".

Actually, it looks like they've given up on Vista, and are promoting 'the future'.
post #110 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by samurai1999 View Post

Actually, it looks like they've given up on Vista, and are promoting 'the future'.

You can't sell the future.
post #111 of 147
MS campaign- $300 million bridge to nowhere!Thanks Jerry,but no thanks!
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post #112 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

You can't sell the future.

If it's the alternative to Microsoft's present, it's not like it could be any worse!

P.S. Sorry to everyone about my previous political comments, that was never my intention when I got on the forum, I just do not like people who think they are better than everyone else because of their own personal beliefs, regardless of the issue, and I allowed it to get the better of me. It won't happen again.
post #113 of 147
And here we have a classic example of the difference between talking about doing something and actually doing said thing. Talking about "connecting" is not the same thing as connecting.

What if they took the campaign funds and sent a portion of it to every user? At least, they'd have Money talks and BS walks on their side....
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post #114 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blah64 View Post

Wow. This is one of the best, most concise, most insightful comments on the differences between Apple and MS attitudes that I've ever read! And I've been a Mac user since 1984.

Apologies in advance for all the times I'm going to use this line in conversations over the coming years.

I'm seconding this opinion: GREAT line wbrasington! Think about selling it...
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post #115 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by tomkarl View Post

... and then those users will go and use their error ridden pc.

Come on, pal, i've had problems with OSX in the past 3 years that are on par, sometimes worse, than the problems I had on WIndows over the 10 years before that. Mainly involving "updates" that Apple seems good at distributing which miraculously reduce functionality. Can't we just put to rest this whole idea that microsoft products are more "error ridden" than apple? Do you own an iPhone?
post #116 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by samurai1999 View Post

See this site for an interesting analysis of the ad:
http://www.tgdaily.com/html_tmp/cont...39294-118.html

Basically, the family Bill & Jerry are visiting is Apple
- the grandma is Steve Jobs ("She's been here for 12 years!")
- Apple is all about surface (Djon Mustard with Wine)
- but the products aren't new underneath (same as yesterday with Cheese on)
- there's basic stuff missing (no ketchup)
- and there's chewing gum in the food...

If you accept that then there are a couple of references to 'real'
- the grandma is 'real' but the daughter is 'not real'

The leather-whatever is about Jerry & Bill being accused of stealing something that they don't have an interest in....
- it's also about Apple's obsession with surface & packaging (leather, glass, aluminium etc)


Meanwhile the +ve spin is about M$ being about connecting people, and having lot's of good stuff in the future (both ads so far imply this)
- and the first ad depicts Bill, though he's a billionaire, as someone who cares about the basic details of products (in this case shoes, but by implication software)
- he's also shown giving a kid a lecture on programming...

Oh, and there's a whiff of financial scandal going on between the husband & wife....

- ouch!

Aparently, in the first add the Shoe store (Shoe Circus) is an Apple Store, the shoe that doesn't fit is a Mac, the shoe saleman is a 'Genius', as a Shoe Circus Clown Club Card Platinum member (Mac Buyer) you get Big Top Points (i.e. nothing of substance)

- ouch again!

That is the dumbest load of crap I've read so far.

"The grandma is Steve Jobs". Steven Jobs has been at Apple for more than 12 years. It's starting to sound like that review was written by someone in their 20's with no access to books.

"Apple is all about surface, but the products aren't new underneath" Is there an example for this? I can think of a few counter examples like the iPod, iPhone and Snow Leopard. Apple does indeed obsess over the surface of their products, but they do so about the "underneath" as well.

"Basic stuff missing" you can say about anyone's product including Microsoft's. The iPod has no built-in FM receiver - okay and Internet Explorer doesn't support Web 2.0 scripts.

"There's chewing gum in the food" - Laughing my ass off to whatever that's supposed to mean.

So the leather giraffe is somehow supposed to represent Microsoft being accused of stealing Apple's interface that they apparently have no interest in? Wow... this is really starting to sound like a review written by an misinformed youngster. Perhaps Microsoft has been accused of stealing Apple's "surface" because of the creepy similarities that sprout up - XP, Vista, Zune to name a few.

The ads being about Microsoft "having lots of good stuff in the future" is obvious and that is part of the problem. Microsoft can't really convince people that they have "really good stuff" now - because compared to their competition they really don't. Look back at the astroturfing Microsoft has done the past decade (see "Cairo") and you'll see that Microsoft has a penchant for always talking about what they will be doing in the "future" but never seem to have established plans for the here and now.

And the part about Bill being a billionaire but someone who "cares about the basic details of products" kinda sounds hypocritical. Isn't that being "surface"?

The whole shoe-circus is an Apple store part makes no sense whatsoever... that review is stupid.
post #117 of 147
Quote:
"In the competition between PCs and Macs, we outsell Apple 30-to-1. But there is no doubt that Apple is thriving,"

He fails to stated that it used to be 100's to 1
post #118 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by mwick View Post

He fails to stated that it used to be 100's to 1

Or that for every OEM copy of Windows sold they get $40 and for every Mac sold Apple gets an average of $1500 which puts Apple's profit at 10:1 for each pre-installed copy of the OS.
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post #119 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wally View Post

That is the dumbest load of crap I've read so far.

Thanks!



I'd say some of the Tdaily review makes sense (from the point of view of what M$'s message is, not necessarily the truthyness of the message)
- given that the advert is undoubtedly the expensive product of some very bright minds
- and important enough to warrant Bill G himself appearing (the 1st time ever in an ad?)
- and important enough to be the 1st item up on the M$ web-site

It's obviously intended to get people talking about it, and speculating about it's meaning
- and it has at least succeeded in that...
post #120 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by pooped View Post

well... the fact is that these ads are really badly made......

if this is to indicate an image perception of microsoft, the image I am getting is of a product that just doesn't work well. that runs awkwardly with glitches and misses the point.......

in contrast the upgrade from iWorks is more like a downgrade.
iMovie is completely unworkable. and iPhoto should take a look at Lightroom.
seriously, if this is the package that should show people how easy a mac is, they are going to drive them away..

WOW, starting now. :-) Talk about tooling and trolling, you almost had me fooled. NICE comment. You sound like a reasonable person, then at the end the "gottcha" about how Apple seems to be falling apart. Nice. And nice way to pull peoples attention away from the commercials and Vista.

Just a thought.
en
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