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Next-gen MacBook shipments begin ahead of 'sharp ramp' - Page 7

post #241 of 288
Hi,

This is my first post here, and I'm from Portugal!!

I'm a PC user for about 20 years now. and I'm thinking on taking the big step and change to MAC machine, MBP.
The primary use I give to my PC's is on running 3D mechanical Software, Solidworks and other CAD software, but I use most of the MS office programs and of course, surfing on the NET, Email, etc. ...
why am I thinking MAC....
1 - Good Integration of Hardware components
2 - Stable OS, to use with everything except de 3d CAD software I need to run
3 - Current version working in dual boot can Run Windows XP or Vista, even better that a normal/good PC would. So people say... I never have the opportunity to see one MAC running windows in action.

I have some questions to make for you guys.

- Is possible to use the touchpad like in a windows laptop without the right botton?
- It's possible that apple can change so much the current hardware so that windows cannot run natively on a MAC machine? People are saying that apple will change to another chipset manufacturer with some proprietary chips.

Another big issue is, I have to buy one machine until the end of October, not even a day more. and I'm not buying the current one, because I think you should by always the last model for a lot of reasons I don't want to discuss here. BUT, that's a great shot in the dark, because other company's, I don't know about apple, use this first buyers has "TESTERS" for their hardware, and that very dangerous, because a good MBP can reach easily a lot more than 2000 EUROS. Does apple ever done that With there computers ( forget the iphone )

Please give me your opinions, and sorry for the English ....
post #242 of 288
Quote:
Originally Posted by jrui View Post

- It's possible that apple can change so much the current hardware so that windows cannot run natively on a MAC machine? People are saying that apple will change to another chipset manufacturer with some proprietary chips.

Apple wouldn't dare. Half the "switchers" would throw their Macs away.
post #243 of 288
Quote:
Originally Posted by FuturePastNow View Post

Half the "switchers" would throw their Macs away.

Could you identify these folks for me, I wanna go around and collect their 'useless' Macs when they do so
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post #244 of 288
post #245 of 288
Quote:
Originally Posted by jezThomp View Post

Is this the new macbook?


it is not, its just another mockup it says so o the site that posted it. looks pretty though. especially with the dock on the trackpad.
post #246 of 288
Quote:
Originally Posted by jrui View Post

I have some questions to make for you guys.

- Is possible to use the touchpad like in a windows laptop without the right botton?
- It's possible that apple can change so much the current hardware so that windows cannot run natively on a MAC machine? People are saying that apple will change to another chipset manufacturer with some proprietary chips.

Haven't posted here in a very long time.

To see how the multi-touch pad works, go here: http://www.apple.com/macbookpro/features.html and click on the graphics of the touch pad swipes. That will open a window that shows brief videos of all the multi-touch moves.

As far as Apple changing hardware so windows can't run, I highly doubt that. They have gained market share because a lot of people need the ability to run windows as well. I know a lot of business people who bought Mac laptops only because of that capability. Apple knows that is a BIG selling point. Besides, with Intel they are constantly out on the leading edge with technology. I run Windows using VM Fusion, myself, when I have to and can do so successfully even on a slower Mac Mini.

Generally Apple produces good hardware from the beginning. Few problems for most people, but when problems do come up they are pretty good about fixing them quickly. Most problems are software, not hardware related.

Good luck with your purchase and welcome.
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post #247 of 288
thanks for all the replays!


I only hope that the new MBP come out until the end of October.

One more question, What about the gloss and the traditional matte screen ? Is the gloss worth a try? even with all the reflection problems?
post #248 of 288
Quote:
Originally Posted by jrui View Post

What about the gloss and the traditional matte screen ? Is the gloss worth a try? even with all the reflection problems?

It's really just a matter of taste. I find the gloss screen on my MacBook Air tolerable. I would prefer matte. If you'll often be using it outdoors, then get matte.
Mac user since August 1983.
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post #249 of 288
IMO, the symmetrical shape of the current MBP and MacBook look way better than a fatter Air. We all like the Air's shape because it is so thin, but thicker versions of the same wedge shape is hideous, IMO.

I hope that Apple keeps the new designs symmetrical, but this is unlikely. Hey, if Apple does change "wedge" it up, I'll have more emotional reasons to keep my MBP and not lust after better specs
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post #250 of 288
Quote:
Originally Posted by apple4life07 View Post

I wonder how "aggressive" the entry-level price will be. I'm hoping they start these at $999.


Actually, if you look around in places like Best Buy, you will find that even $999 is high for a good entry-level notebook computer.
Quality notebook manufacturers like HP, Dell, and Sony are now offering excellent notebooks well below that ($999) price line.
I bought a $699 HP notebook with Vista that is an excellent performer with no real compromises.

Or this: HP Pavilion dv7t Core 2 Duo 2GHz 17in Laptop (3GB/320GB/Blu-Ray/8-Cell) $938.99 Free Ship, Oct. 1 8 AM from "HP Home" on Wednesday, Oct. 1.

And this: Dell E Series Latitude E5500 Business Laptop 15.4in Core 2 Duo 2.0GHz 1GB/160GB $614 Free Shipping at Dell Small Business

I know, I know . . . . these are not Macs. But for those who must consider cost, these new Windows notebooks are an attractive alternative.

I just hope that, with these new notebooks, Apple can be a successful player in this increasingly competitive marketplace. Please don't misunderstand, I am pulling for Apple, and the company has done well in the notebook arena in the past, but the world is changing fast. I just hope Apple will keep up . . . or better yet, get ahead with a new price line on the next generation of notebook computers.
post #251 of 288
Quote:
Originally Posted by John French View Post

Bingo. When hard drive space gets below 5 GB OS X slows down. Free up some HD space and maybe upgrade your ram a little bit.

Yeah, I've been doing that. I've deleted or off loaded (onto my time capsule) all non-essential files and applications. I've started cleaning up my music collection - deleting repeat songs, low sound quality files, and stuff I never listen to, but still.......

I looked into RAM and HD upgrades. With all the doom and gloom in the financial markets, I'm considering doing that before plunking down for a brand-spanking-new one.

We'll see, what this new 'aggressive' price point is. I really only need the machine for DJing and web surfing. I just wish Apple would make the announcement already!
post #252 of 288
$699? It probably has an older Merom or Conroe CPU or even a Pentium Dual-Core (EWW!!!!!!) and lots of missing features.
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post #253 of 288
Quote:
Originally Posted by lugesm View Post

Actually, if you look around in places like Best Buy, you will find that even $999 is high for a good entry-level notebook computer.
Quality notebook manufacturers like HP, Dell, and Sony are now offering excellent notebooks well below that ($999) price line.
I bought a $699 HP notebook with Vista that is an excellent performer with no real compromises.

I know, I know . . . . it is not a Mac. But for those who must consider cost, these new Windows notebooks are an attractive alternative.

I just hope that, with these new notebooks, Apple can be a successful player in this increasingly competitive marketplace.

In spite of the tone of your post, Apple is successful in the laptop marketplace. \
post #254 of 288
Quote:
Originally Posted by zinfella View Post

In spite of the tone of your post, Apple is successful in the laptop marketplace. \

Apple has increased its share in notebook market by like 100%

No, those sub $1000 Windoze laptops are not attractive alternatives at all. Most of them don't even have great specs either. The only laptops that I'd even consider are some of the higher end Vaios and the XPS.
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post #255 of 288
Quote:
Originally Posted by applebook View Post

Apple has increased its share in notebook market by like 100%

No, those sub $1000 Windoze laptops are not attractive alternatives at all. Most of them don't even have great specs either. The only laptops that I'd even consider are some of the higher end Vaios and the XPS.

You know, I usually don't look at the amount of posts a member has made since the metric is mostly useless, but your post made me look at how many you have. I don't know if you actually believe what you've written or are simply a troll, but you're way off.

Sub $1000 Windows laptops are useful, and often have better specs than comparable MacBooks: ExpressCard slots, USB ports, and video cards come to mind (I'm looking at you, non-pro MacBook). As for the issue of "usefulness"- it is tricky, as what might be useful for you might not be so for others. I'm perfectly aware of the growth the Mac is experiencing when compared to the PC industry, etc, etc. What the market place tell us today is that people prefer those machines to Macs by a very large margin. Period.

Therefore, to say that sub-$1000 Windows computers are useless is silly. And it's just downright moronic to ignore the emerging sub-notebook market: it's there, it's young, but it has the potential to literally get a Mac on every lap (or on many more laps). I think Apple is in a perfect position right now to compete in that market with a mini notebook that includes multi-touch on the display. Or it can be a tablet, no keyboard at all. If it's too difficult to type, grab a foldable keyboard.
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post #256 of 288
I'm not a troll simply because you cannot read. Where did I ever state that sub $1000 PC laptops were "usesless"? Do not put words into my mouth and then call me a troll. Your massive post count gives you the audacity to bash others (using misinformation), I suppose?
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post #257 of 288
Quote:
Originally Posted by applebook View Post

I'm not a troll simply because you cannot read. Where did I ever state that sub $1000 PC laptops were "usesless"? Do not put words into my mouth and then call me a troll. Your massive post count gives you the audacity to bash others (using misinformation), I suppose?

1)I believe you edited your post? Here's what it read when I replied to you:
Quote:
Originally Posted by applebook View Post

No, those sub $1000 Windoze laptops are useless. Most of them don't even have great specs either. The only laptops that I'd even consider are some of the higher end Vaios and the XPS.

So that's where you stated that they are useless - and then you changed it.

2) My massive post count... Why don't you read my last post more carefully. Specifically, the paragraph where I write about post counts. Let me show you:

"You know, I usually don't look at the amount of posts a member has made since the metric is mostly useless, but your post made me look at how many you have. I don't know if you actually believe what you've written or are simply a troll, but you're way off. "

Did you get that? mostly useless.

Therefore, I stand by my statement that after reading your post, its stupidity made me look at your post count. So you're the one that needs to learn how to read.

Even if in the far-fetched realm of me being delusional and somehow substituting "useless" for "not attractive alternatives at all", my statement still stands. The fact is that people vote with their money and so far, their vote has been to purchase more of the cheaper Windows PCs.

This doesn't mean that Apple should immediately slash prices in half in order to attain highest market share. It simply means that there exists an opportunity at points where Apple can differentiate its products and capitalize on such value-adding features/capabilities. I see this being done in low-margin, high-valume products such as netbooks/sub-notebooks, as stated in my previous post.

This is what I have in mind: to compete with the OLPC/Asus EeePC/Dell Inspiron 7/Lenovo S510/other netbooks/sub-notebooks, Apple can put multitouch to good use and tackle the problem from a completely different, thought-out approach: instead of making users type on a scaled-down, teeny, uncomfortable keyboard, remove the keyboard completely and put multi-touch to good use in a 5-7" form factor display. Include a few USB ports (maybe wireless USB?) and a display-out port, WiFi, ExpressCard, bluetooth, and an option for integrated broadband, and there you have a great alternative for the mini-notebooks, one that the PC makers can never match. If the user wants a "real" keyboard, sell foldable bluetooth keyboards.
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post #258 of 288
Quote:
Originally Posted by alexluft View Post

1)I believe you edited your post? Here's what it read when I replied to you:

If a post was edited, it gives the time at date of the last edit at the bottom of the post. There isn't one there, which means he didn't edit his post (unless he edited within a minute or two of posting, but since you replied over two hours later, that does not apply).

Also, if someone edits their post, and you've already quoted that post, the edit won't be reflected in the quote.

Edit: Like this!
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post #259 of 288
Quote:
Originally Posted by alexluft View Post


Therefore, to say that sub-$1000 Windows computers are useless is silly. And it's just downright moronic to ignore the emerging sub-notebook market: it's there, it's young, but it has the potential to literally get a Mac on every lap (or on many more laps). I think Apple is in a perfect position right now to compete in that market with a mini notebook that includes multi-touch on the display. Or it can be a tablet, no keyboard at all. If it's too difficult to type, grab a foldable keyboard.

alexluft -

My apologies for editing the quote from you above. I did not change your wording, just copied a part that makes a very important point . . . . the same point I was trying to make, but you did it more eloquently.

For business people who have notebook computers purchased by their companies, the lower cost Windows machines hold little attraction. However, for much of the world out there, the unique design features of the Macintosh are highly desirable. But, not everyone is on an unlimited budget . . . especially young people in high school and college. It is my hope that Apple will be able to offer, feature-for-feature, a new set of portables competitive with the sub-$1K Windows machines and at a price that will appeal to this youth market. The future lies there.
post #260 of 288
It comes down to this:

1. People realize laptops are not expensive toys. They are real tools where the quality of the tool translates into more income.

2. More people are realizing that paying $2000 for a laptop instead of $800 is well justified if you need high productivity which requires better specs on the laptop, instead of having two computers: a slow laptop for mobility AND a desktop at the office.

3. People are waking up to the fact that the difference between a $2000 macbook pro and a $2000 windows laptop (or $1000 macbook and $1000 windows laptop) is not just about looking cool and pretty but its about higher productivity. This is because of Leopard, which is designed so to maximize user time producing work and minimizing time maintaining the computer. In windows is not designed with this frame of mind. It is designed to be compatible with anything written in the last 30 years, which is inherently counterproductive because the gains in compatibility are more than offset by losses in efficiency.

So the conclusion is that the $2000 macbook pro is a bargain compared to the $2000 windows laptop simply because Leopard is ~ 10 years beyond and above Windows Vista or XP or anything else for that matter.
post #261 of 288
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tauron View Post

So the conclusion is that the $2000 macbook pro is a bargain compared to the $2000 windows laptop simply because Leopard is ~ 10 years beyond and above Windows Vista or XP or anything else for that matter.

Leaving the OS out of it, other PC vendors tend to charge considerably more for Apple for equivalent HW as you get to the higher-end machines. Whether it's because they aren't buying in the same volume as Apple since they have so many models and an average sale price half that of a Mac or figure they can make up their entry level losses with their higher tier machines or a combo of the two I don't know.
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post #262 of 288


Alex, you have been outed as a low-life troll. I changed absolutely NOTHING. If I had changed anything, there would be a "last edited" post script on the bottom of my post.

All of your "points" are based on a refutation of a statement that I never even made. In fact, no one else here has either.

Get a life and stop fabricating things.



What a trolling loser.
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post #263 of 288
Quote:
Originally Posted by alexluft View Post

1)

Therefore, I stand by my statement that after reading your post, its stupidity made me look at your post count. So you're the one that needs to learn how to read.

Hey, genius, my reference to your low post count is simply a jab at your ridiculous assertion that I'm a troll because my post count is low, but then again your logic and basic reading skills are lacking...I mean, missing.

Now crawl back into your little cave, trollie.
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post #264 of 288
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

Leaving the OS out of it, other PC vendors tend to charge considerably more for Apple for equivalent HW as you get to the higher-end machines. Whether it's because they aren't buying in the same volume as Apple since they have so many models and an average sale price half that of a Mac or figure they can make up their entry level losses with their higher tier machines or a combo of the two I don't know.

The second one. Companies like Dell and HP subsidize their cheap consumer PC sales with business, workstation, and "gamer" PC sales, which I assure you are not low-volume.
post #265 of 288
Quote:
Originally Posted by FuturePastNow View Post

The second one. Companies like Dell and HP subsidize their cheap consumer PC sales with business, workstation, and "gamer" PC sales, which I assure you are not low-volume.

Define high-volume in comparison to Apple? Apple has 2 sizes of their pro machines with only 3 Intel CPU choices, They also only have 1 pro workstation with only 3 Intel CPU choices. With a 70% dominance in the consumer market where gaming aren't commonly sold and double the average price for their PCs, it seems that Apple does do much higher volume for select HW over the other vendors.
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post #266 of 288
Quote:
Originally Posted by applebook View Post

\t

Alex, you have been outed as a low-life troll. I changed absolutely NOTHING. If I had changed anything, there would be a "last edited" post script on the bottom of my post.

All of your "points" are based on a refutation of a statement that I never even made. In fact, no one else here has either.

Get a life and stop fabricating things.



What a trolling loser.

Hey, that's kinda mean. I didn't call you any other names besides troll, did I? Or do really want to play the name game?

I guess it really does matter how late I stay up and post. Need to go to sleep earlier next time then post in the morning when I'm reading straight. I actually don't know where the "usefulness" word came from.

But in all seriousness, I realize that it would say that you would've edited your post. I just could swear that it read "useless".

In any case, all of my "points" are still valid. Saying "useless" (as you obviously did not), is just as close to the extreme that you used - "not attractive alternatives at all". If you could, please explain to me how my "points" don't hold up. In fact, I think I'll do it for you. What I will do here is take my reply to your original post on this page and substitute the word "useless" with "not attractive alternatives at all". Here we go:

Quote:
Originally Posted by alexluft View Post

Sub $1000 Windows laptops are useful, and often have better specs than comparable MacBooks: ExpressCard slots, USB ports, and video cards come to mind (I'm looking at you, non-pro MacBook). As for the issue of being"not attractive at all"- it is tricky, as what might be "attractive" for you might not be so for others. I'm perfectly aware of the growth the Mac is experiencing when compared to the PC industry, etc, etc. What the market place tell us today is that people prefer those machines to Macs by a very large margin. Period.

Therefore, to say that sub-$1000 Windows computers are "not attractive at all" is silly. And it's just downright moronic to ignore the emerging sub-notebook market: it's there, it's young, but it has the potential to literally get a Mac on every lap (or on many more laps). I think Apple is in a perfect position right now to compete in that market with a mini notebook that includes multi-touch on the display. Or it can be a tablet, no keyboard at all. If it's too difficult to type, grab a foldable keyboard.

Quote:
Originally Posted by applebook View Post

Hey, genius, my reference to your low post count is simply a jab at your ridiculous assertion that I'm a troll because my post count is low, but then again your logic and basic reading skills are lacking...I mean, missing.

Now crawl back into your little cave, trollie.

You seem to really be in love with extremes: not attractive at all, missing, lacking. And you still have the nerve to make the above statement, which makes no sense at all. Moreover, I just showed you above - by replacing the words I accidentally misread - that my point is still valid and still holds true. So how are "my logic and basic reading skills lacking/missing"?

If you want to talk about trolling, let's take the discussion outside of this forum so we don't take up space doing the chicken fight. I'd be glad to email with you and define troll for you, as it clearly doesn't represent anything I have posted (except for the honest mistake of thinking you said "useless"). As far as I know, all of my posts have been thoughtful, insightful, and helpful. You can even check my tech blog in my sig to see that I'm a great Apple fan. If you'd like, PM me and call me a troll, but it's clearly not the case and I'd like this to be the end of our trolling convo/name-calling. Agreed? Oh, and this time, please try and not post your answer in two different posts. It's really unnecessary and a waste of space.

Now that that's done with, I'd like to get back to the topic at hand: I think that Apple will introduce a low-spec, low-cost MacBook to go along with the tough economic times we are facing/entering. I see many people purchasing the ~$300-500 mini notebooks from Dell/Lenovo/HP/Asus, etc. They're cheap, very portable, and get the job done. And that's with Windows. We all know how much Apple can innovate with MultiTouch in such a small form factor.

Having tried some of the aforementioned mini notebooks, I can say that for me it's almost impossible to use the teeny tiny trackpads and smaller-than-normal keyboards on such machines. Therefore, I don't believe that the trackpad/keyboard interface is the way to go in such a small fort factor. I see Apple releasing this MacBook with a 3-6" MultiTouch screen, an Atom processor, and a few USB ports. No keyboard, no mouse. All screen. Like I said before, if the user has trouble typing on the multi-touch screen ala iPhone (I don't have trouble, but some people might), then use a bluetooth keyboard mouse. Come home, plug it into an external monitor, and work away.

I think that Apple simply can't ignore the mini notebook market, especially in these turbulent economic times. I think that they are the only company with enough brains and creativity, however, to really make the best use of such a small device.
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post #267 of 288
Actually, troll, without even have to read your post, I can already tell you that for me to state that I find no attractive alternatives is nowhere near the same as your claim that I stated that cheap PC laptops are "useless." Even a Pentium II 400MHz Dell from the 90s is still "useful."

Get a life, troll. You are hallucinating.

Where is the ignore button?
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post #268 of 288
Quote:
Originally Posted by applebook View Post

Actually, troll, without even have to read your post, I can already tell you that for me to state that I find no attractive alternatives is nowhere near the same as your claim that I stated that cheap PC laptops are "useless." Even a Pentium II 400MHz Dell from the 90s is still "useful."

Get a life, troll. You are hallucinating.

Where is the ignore button?

Oh, it's easy to find, I set him on ignore awhile back, as life is too short to put up with nonsense.
post #269 of 288
This is getting ridiculous. Let's get back on topic children.
post #270 of 288
Quote:
Originally Posted by zinfella View Post

Oh, it's easy to find, I set him on ignore awhile back, as life is too short to put up with nonsense.

What did he do to you? Claim that you wrote that the sky was green?

Thanks for heads up, BTW. I didn't know that there actually is an ignore list in the control panel.
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post #271 of 288
Seriously. we need more from the rumor mill, or an invite to the event. GRRRRR I dont know if i can take it anymore. I need a new lappy486 stat...
post #272 of 288
I just popped into a reseller and the chap said that MacBooks are being launched in the next couple of weeks, and MBPs a couple of weeks after that. He didn't know anything else...

Seems odd to launch them seperately...
post #273 of 288
Quote:
Originally Posted by TimothyWimothy View Post

I just popped into a reseller and the chap said that MacBooks are being launched in the next couple of weeks, and MBPs a couple of weeks after that. He didn't know anything else...

Seems odd to launch them seperately...

Resellers are all under an NDA, so you believe what you like. October 14th is not that far off.
post #274 of 288
quick question about future macbooks... when do the next ones after montevino upgrade come out? I can't recall the name of the chip at the moment but I know it starts with an N (sorry) Is it supposed to sometime mid january? Also is that upgrade supposed to be a larger jump than this upcoming one we expect within the next few weeks? thanks a lot!
post #275 of 288
Quote:
Originally Posted by mcl116 View Post

quick question about future macbooks... when do the next ones after montevino upgrade come out? I can't recall the name of the chip at the moment but I know it starts with an N (sorry) Is it supposed to sometime mid january? Also is that upgrade supposed to be a larger jump than this upcoming one we expect within the next few weeks? thanks a lot!

Just to be clear, Montevina is a chipset and Nehelam is a CPU. So, Apple is currently using Santa Rosa chipsets with Penryn CPUs. The next machines will use Montevina chipsets with Penryn CPUs. After that, it will Montevina chipsets with Nehelam CPUs.

As for the arrival of Nehalam, it should occur later this year of early next year, but that will be for server and workstation-grade CPUs. Notebook-grade won't happen for about a year.
Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
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Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
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post #276 of 288
I really do hope they up the graphics power of the macbook. I was not happy with my 2.0 core duo gaming power. Or I might have to pick up a used macbook pro.
macbook 2.0 core duo 1GB ram 60GB HD
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macbook 2.0 core duo 1GB ram 60GB HD
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post #277 of 288
thank you for clearing that up!!
post #278 of 288
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

Just to be clear, Montevina is a chipset and Nehelam is a CPU. So, Apple is currently using Santa Rosa chipsets with Penryn CPUs. The next machines will use Montevina chipsets with Penryn CPUs. After that, it will Montevina chipsets with Nehelam CPUs.

As for the arrival of Nehalam, it should occur later this year of early next year, but that will be for server and workstation-grade CPUs. Notebook-grade won't happen for about a year.

It's not sure that Apple will use the Montevina chipset at all: there rumors about switching to an nvidia chipset with much more powerful integrated graphic. That would be great for MacBooks.
will be what it's going to be
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will be what it's going to be
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post #279 of 288
Can anyone update the rumours/educated guesses on when the new macbooks will hit the stores? The waiting after 4 months is becoming unbearable!

thnks!
post #280 of 288
Quote:
Originally Posted by palple View Post

It's not sure that Apple will use the Montevina chipset at all: there rumors about switching to an nvidia chipset with much more powerful integrated graphic. That would be great for MacBooks.

That is exactly what I am hoping for. PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE
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