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Who's Running the Sleazy Campaign?

post #1 of 39
9/16/08 at 3:43pm
Thread Starter 
McCain or Obama?

Here's Obama's recent "honor" ad. Wow. "Vile?" What happened to "change!?"

Here's Obama's campaign claiming Carly Fiorina said McCain couldn't run a corporation: This is the ad version.

This is what she actually said.

Here's the ad claiming McCain can't use a computer and is "out of touch."

But...whoops. McCain doesn't use a computer because of his war injuries.

and the accusations that McCain ran a dishonest ad about Obama supporting for Kindergarten students? Well gee..look at the text of the bill:

Source: http://article.nationalreview.com/?q...2I2MGY=&w=MQ==

Quote:
What, specifically, was the bill designed to do? It appears to have had three major purposes:

The first, as Ronen indicated, was to mandate that information presented in sex-ed classes be factual, medically accurate, and objective.

The second purpose was to increase the number of children receiving sex education. Illinois existing law required the teaching of sex education and AIDS prevention in grades six through twelve. The old law read:

"Each class or course in comprehensive sex education offered in any of grades 6 through 12 shall include instruction on the prevention, transmission and spread of AIDS."

Senate Bill 99 struck out grade six, changing it to kindergarten, in addition to making a few other changes in wording. It read:

Each class or course in comprehensive sex education in any of grades K through 12 shall include instruction on the prevention of sexually transmitted infections, including the prevention, transmission and spread of HIV.

So who's running the "sleazy" campaign here?

I know this: Obama cannot win this game. Why? Because it damages his Change and Hope® brands. He's supposed to be above it all, whereas McCain is "old Washington." Double edged sword, I guess.
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post #2 of 39
9/16/08 at 4:30pm


McCain doesn't use a computer because of war injuries? Funny, how on earth does he use a much smaller Blackberry then? Give me a break.

Rick Davis, campaign manager:He actually is, he always is grabbing people's Blackberrys on the bus. In fact, no reporter's Blackberry is safe from his prying eyes. He loves to tool around on the internet, he especially loves the videos that get produced that usually poke fun at him. I think that's his most entertaining part of the internet.

Mr. McCain: I use the Blackberry, but I don’t e-mail, I’ve never felt the particular need to e-mail. I read e-mails all the time, but the communications that I have with my friends and staff are oral and done with my cell phone





Love to debunk the rest of your post, but I just don't have the time.
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post #3 of 39
9/16/08 at 4:37pm
McCain quite obviously.
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Every eye fixed itself upon him; with parted lips and bated breath the audience hung upon his words, taking no note of time, rapt in the ghastly fascinations of the tale. NOT!
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post #4 of 39
9/16/08 at 5:08pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by franksargent View Post

McCain quite obviously.

Maybe you should ask Karl Rove.......

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post #5 of 39
9/16/08 at 5:32pm
Why did you skip the entire "age appropriate" phrase about the sex education thing? It appears you are trying to deceive the readers of this thread by this omission.

There is not one lie or distortion in the "Honor" ad. No one (except you, apparently), not even right wing commentators, thinks the McCain Sex Education ad was factual.

The answer to your question: John McCain.

And the claim that McCain doesn't send emailds because of his injuries is complete bullshit. He doesn't send email "because he's never felt the need to".
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post #6 of 39
9/16/08 at 5:57pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by tonton View Post

Why did you skip the entire "age appropriate" phrase about the sex education thing? It appears you are trying to deceive the readers of this thread by this omission.

There is not one lie or distortion in the "Honor" ad. No one (except you, apparently), not even right wing commentators, thinks the McCain Sex Education ad was factual.

The answer to your question: John McCain.

And the claim that McCain doesn't send emailds because of his injuries is complete bullshit. He doesn't send email "because he's never felt the need to".

Ya gotta love SDW, he truly believes without question.

This thread doesn't even warrant a response but the pics of McCain using a Blackberry are telling,
multitasking to boot.
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post #7 of 39
9/16/08 at 6:12pm
I find it hilarious that the only person proven to be unable to run HP in this story is Carly Fiorina.
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post #8 of 39
9/16/08 at 6:13pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by tonton View Post

Why did you skip the entire "age appropriate" phrase about the sex education thing? It appears you are trying to deceive the readers of this thread by this omission.

There is not one lie or distortion in the "Honor" ad. No one (except you, apparently), not even right wing commentators, thinks the McCain Sex Education ad was factual.

The answer to your question: John McCain.

And the claim that McCain doesn't send emailds because of his injuries is complete bullshit. He doesn't send email "because he's never felt the need to".

Really....show me the money. Let's see the bill. Then show how "age appropriate" negates the part of the bill I posted.
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post #9 of 39
9/16/08 at 6:14pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by screener View Post

Ya gotta love SDW, he truly believes without question.

This thread doesn't even warrant a response but the pics of McCain using a Blackberry are telling,
multitasking to boot.

So...he can use a computer then? I see. Well that makes the ad better then!
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post #10 of 39
9/16/08 at 6:15pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gilsch View Post



McCain doesn't use a computer because of war injuries? Funny, how on earth does he use a much smaller Blackberry then? Give me a break.

Rick Davis, campaign manager:He actually is, he always is grabbing people's Blackberrys on the bus. In fact, no reporter's Blackberry is safe from his prying eyes. He loves to tool around on the internet, he especially loves the videos that get produced that usually poke fun at him. I think that's his most entertaining part of the internet.

Mr. McCain: I use the Blackberry, but I dont e-mail, Ive never felt the particular need to e-mail. I read e-mails all the time, but the communications that I have with my friends and staff are oral and done with my cell phone





Love to debunk the rest of your post, but I just don't have the time.

Read the article as quoted in the link I posted.

Quote:
McCain gets emotional at the mention of military families needing food stamps or veterans lacking health care. The outrage comes from inside: McCain's severe war injuries prevent him from combing his hair, typing on a keyboard, or tying his shoes. Friends marvel at McCain's encyclopedic knowledge of sports. He's an avid fan - Ted Williams is his hero - but he can't raise his arm above his shoulder to throw a baseball.

Cough.
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post #11 of 39
9/16/08 at 6:51pm
the blackberry is a small cell phone with a keyboard...

basically, either way you cut it the ad was stupid -- mccain uses his blackberry to send what amounts to emails...
"In a republic, voters may vote for the leaders they want, but they get the leaders they deserve."
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post #12 of 39
9/16/08 at 7:16pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by hardeeharhar View Post

the blackberry is a small cell phone with a keyboard...

basically, either way you cut it the ad was stupid -- mccain uses his blackberry to send what amounts to emails...

That's what I'm saying. The ad is completely false.
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post #13 of 39
9/16/08 at 7:31pm
McCain threw out the first pitch of the seventh game of the 2001 world series.
http://www.baseball-almanac.com/ws/yr2001ws.shtml
Says something about his arm.
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post #14 of 39
9/16/08 at 8:37pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by SDW2001 View Post

That's what I'm saying. The ad is completely false.

completely?

hardly...
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post #15 of 39
9/16/08 at 8:56pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by SDW2001 View Post

Read the article as quoted in the link I posted.

Cough.

It's obvious from numerous pictures that what the article said about McCain's "limitations" is complete BS. Do yourself a favor and just stop. Please.
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post #16 of 39
9/16/08 at 9:12pm
McCain can type on a blackberry. He can use an ergonomic keyboard, or one designed especially for him (he has enough money to make one). He can use voice entry.

The real reason he doesn't send emails is because he doesn't think it's important.

The real reason he doesn't know how to go online by himself is because he doesn't think it's important.

I don't think he knows what's important for this country.
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post #17 of 39
9/17/08 at 2:44am
Quote:
Originally Posted by tonton View Post

I find it hilarious that the only person proven to be unable to run HP in this story is Carly Fiorina.

Bingo. Right on target.
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post #18 of 39
9/17/08 at 5:29am
Stephen Hawking can use a computer. POW victim card rejected.

McCain physically can, but doesn't understand them.
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post #19 of 39
9/17/08 at 5:40am
Quote:
Originally Posted by groverat View Post

Stephen Hawking can use a computer. POW victim card rejected.

McCain physically can, but doesn't understand them.

Steven Hawking can use a specially adapted computer at a slower rate of speed than most people would care to choose but since he has no other choice in the matter, he uses it.

McCain physically can, does understand them and makes technology choices that he feels are more efficient for him. So when you send him an email on a topic he will read it and call you back versus typing or texting.

Stephen Hawking cannot call you back on a cell phone and gee, guess what, no one is calling him an idiot for making choices that best fit his limitations.

Quote:
The DECtalk DTC01 voice synthesizer he uses, which has an American accent, is no longer being produced. Asked why he has still kept it after so many years, Hawking mentioned that he has not heard a voice he likes better and that he identifies with it. Hawking is said to be looking for a replacement since, aside from being obsolete, the synthesizer is both large and fragile by modern standards. However, as of present, finding a workable software alternative has been difficult. In Hawking's many media appearances, he appears to speak fluently through his synthesizer, but in reality, creating the text is a tedious drawn-out process. Hawking's setup uses a T9-like entry system, which only requires the first few characters in order to auto-complete the word, but as he is only able to use his cheek for data entry, constructing complete sentences takes time. His speeches are prepared in advance, but having a live conversation with him provides insight as to the complexity and work involved in his responses. During a TED talk, a posed question took 7 minutes to answer.[21]

The reality is a bit more complex than the talking point.

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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post #20 of 39
9/17/08 at 5:51am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by hardeeharhar View Post

completely?

hardly...

Yes, completely. He can use a computer and he does know how to send e-mail. False. False, and false.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Gilsch View Post

It's obvious from numerous pictures that what the article said about McCain's "limitations" is complete BS. Do yourself a favor and just stop. Please.

Are we really going to play the pictures game? Is this like the picture of Bush looking through the binoculars with the lens caps on? Seriously...that's the basis of your position?

Quote:
Originally Posted by tonton View Post

McCain can type on a blackberry. He can use an ergonomic keyboard, or one designed especially for him (he has enough money to make one). He can use voice entry.

The real reason he doesn't send emails is because he doesn't think it's important.

The real reason he doesn't know how to go online by himself is because he doesn't think it's important.

I don't think he knows what's important for this country.

You don't know that. There are lots of reasons for a high ranking politician not to use e-mail (guess how many e-mails President Clinton sent in his terms?) You also don't know that he "can't go online" by himself. You know that he doesn't very often. What the hell does that have to do with running the country?
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post #21 of 39
9/17/08 at 5:55am
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post

Steven Hawking can use a specially adapted computer at a slower rate of speed than most people would care to choose but since he has no other choice in the matter, he uses it.

McCain physically can, does understand them and makes technology choices that he feels are more efficient for him. So when you send him an email on a topic he will read it and call you back versus typing or texting.

Stephen Hawking cannot call you back on a cell phone and gee, guess what, no one is calling him an idiot for making choices that best fit his limitations.



The reality is a bit more complex than the talking point.

I don't understand why Stephen Hawking is relevant. I haven't met Stephen Hawking, but John McCain is no Stephen Hawking.

John McCain can throw out the first pitch at a World Series Baseball game.

John McCain can write an email, easily and efficiently.

The argument that John McCain does not write emails because he is crippled beyond the capacity to be able to do so easily is a bold-faced lie.

The fact, which John McCain admitted, is that he doesn't write emails because he doesn't think it's important.
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post #22 of 39
9/17/08 at 6:20am
Quote:
Originally Posted by tonton View Post

I don't understand why Stephen Hawking is relevant. I haven't met Stephen Hawking, but John McCain is no Stephen Hawking.

John McCain can throw out the first pitch at a World Series Baseball game.

John McCain can write an email, easily and efficiently.

The argument that John McCain does not write emails because he is crippled beyond the capacity to be able to do so easily is a bold-faced lie.

The fact, which John McCain admitted, is that he doesn't write emails because he doesn't think it's important.

Have you met no one with a single bad joint? It doesn't mean it can't be done but if a choice exists that allows them to avoid the pain they will make it. Also one time is not the same thing is repetitive motion. McCain can throw out A pitch, but couldn't pitch an inning or likely even to multiple batters.

This link notes McCains limitations and did so in 2000 before it became the Obama talking point. It hits on pretty much every talking point sent forth by the Obama campaign that has been mentioned here.

It contains this link which goes to a Forbes article from 2000 noting the following.

Quote:
In certain ways, McCain was a natural Web candidate. Chairman of the Senate Telecommunications Subcommittee and regarded as the U.S. Senate's savviest technologist, McCain is an inveterate devotee of email. His nightly ritual is to read his email together with his wife, Cindy. The injuries he incurred as a Vietnam POW make it painful for McCain to type. Instead, he dictates responses that his wife types on a laptop. "She's a whiz on the keyboard, and I'm so laborious," McCain admits.

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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post #23 of 39
9/17/08 at 6:55am
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post

Have you met no one with a single bad joint? It doesn't mean it can't be done but if a choice exists that allows them to avoid the pain they will make it. Also one time is not the same thing is repetitive motion. McCain can throw out A pitch, but couldn't pitch an inning or likely even to multiple batters.

This link notes McCains limitations and did so in 2000 before it became the Obama talking point. It hits on pretty much every talking point sent forth by the Obama campaign that has been mentioned here.

It contains this link which goes to a Forbes article from 2000 noting the following.




McCain's inability to use a computer is irrelevant to his ability to govern.

Why are we even having this discussion?

Oh, I see, we're in a computer forum discussion group devoted to politics.

Quote:
It hits on pretty much every talking point sent forth by the Obama campaign that has been mentioned here.

What talking points from the Obama campaign are you referring too?

Be specific, since I am completely unaware of said talking points from "the Obama campaign."

EDIT: Your link has two http\\\ in it.
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post #24 of 39
9/17/08 at 7:03am
Quote:
Originally Posted by franksargent View Post

McCain's inability to use a computer is irrelevant to his ability to govern.

Why are we even having this discussion?

Oh, I see, we're in a computer forum discussion group devoted to politics.



What talking points from the Obama campaign are you referring too?

Be specific, since I am completely unaware of said talking points from "the Obama campaign."

EDIT: Your link has two http\\\ in it.

Obama ran an ad on this issue and has been pressing it in the media. I'm pretty sure a link to this ad was in the OP.

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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post #25 of 39
9/17/08 at 7:36am
Quote:
Originally Posted by SDW2001 View Post

Yes, completely. He can use a computer and he does know how to send e-mail. False. False, and false.

There was more to the ad, SDW...

In fact, almost half the ad isn't commenting on McCain's self-defined inability to use a computer...
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post #26 of 39
9/17/08 at 8:06am
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post

Obama ran an ad on this issue and has been pressing it in the media. I'm pretty sure a link to this ad was in the OP.

I can find many links about the ad, but I can't find the ad in and of itself.

Why is that important?

I want to see this ad unfiltered through the eyes/voices of others.

I can't seem to find this particular ad on the Obama campaign website.

Could someone here post a direct link to this ad?

TIA
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post #27 of 39
9/17/08 at 12:37pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by SDW2001 View Post

Are we really going to play the pictures game? Is this like the picture of Bush looking through the binoculars with the lens caps on? Seriously...that's the basis of your position?

Well, the pictures obviously destroy the really weak argument that you borrowed from a newspaper article from years ago bout poor old McCain.

"poor little McCain can't use a computer because of his war injuries"....*

*use of much smaller keyboards like those of cellphones and Blackberrys not included. Goal posts may be moved at any time upon arrival of new talking points.

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post #28 of 39
9/17/08 at 12:41pm
Quote:
McCain physically can, does understand them and makes technology choices that he feels are more efficient for him.

Excellent, thanks for destroying SDW's pathetic argument.
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post #29 of 39
9/17/08 at 2:35pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gilsch View Post

Well, the pictures obviously destroy the really weak argument that you borrowed from a newspaper article from years ago bout poor old McCain.

"poor little McCain can't use a computer because of his war injuries"....*

*use of much smaller keyboards like those of cellphones and Blackberrys not included. Goal posts may be moved at any time upon arrival of new talking points.


Do any of the pics show McCain typing on these smaller keyboards?

I don't own a Crackberry, but on my phone I have my email and messages set to auto-show when they arrive. I just dismiss them after I have read them with one button.

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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post #30 of 39
9/17/08 at 3:51pm
If somebody can use the buttons (even just one) on a cell phone, they can use a computer... there are plenty of assistive devices that are easier to use than a cell phone button.

This is no longer an argument over "can he" in a physical sense but it now becomes "can he" in an actual sense assuming physical capability is there and I think the answer is he doesn't see the value (he said he prefers voice) and chooses not to use computers to a greater extent.

It is amazing to what lengths people will go to to defend this guy. The goalposts on every topic change at random depending upon the needs of the moment.

The photo says it all. He has the physical ability.

 

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You're = a contraction of YOU + ARE as in, "You are right" --> "You're right."

 

 

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Your = the possessive of you, as in, "Your name is Tom, right?" or "What is your name?"

 

You're = a contraction of YOU + ARE as in, "You are right" --> "You're right."

 

 

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post #31 of 39
9/17/08 at 5:16pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bergermeister View Post

If somebody can use the buttons (even just one) on a cell phone, they can use a computer... there are plenty of assistive devices that are easier to use than a cell phone button.

This is no longer an argument over "can he" in a physical sense but it now becomes "can he" in an actual sense assuming physical capability is there and I think the answer is he doesn't see the value (he said he prefers voice) and chooses not to use computers to a greater extent.

It is amazing to what lengths people will go to to defend this guy. The goalposts on every topic change at random depending upon the needs of the moment.

The photo says it all. He has the physical ability.

I guess the concept of repetitive stress injuries, arthritis, etc. is just made up crap. Clearly if someone can do it one time, even in mild pain then they can do it forever no matter the cost or trade-off and additionally if they don't make the choice someone else would deem best, then they must be an idiot.

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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post #32 of 39
9/17/08 at 7:24pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by SDW2001 View Post

Read the article as quoted in the link I posted.



Cough.

Where I work we have a Coach that has no hands and he manages to type and just about everything else. He doesn't let it slow him down.
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post #33 of 39
9/17/08 at 10:36pm
One of the greatest minds of all time:

Stephen Hawking



Read about what he can do:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stephen_Hawking#Computer

As I have said, if there is a will, there is a way, virtually regardless of the degree of immobility.

Stephen even flew on NASA's Vomit Comet!

 

Your = the possessive of you, as in, "Your name is Tom, right?" or "What is your name?"

 

You're = a contraction of YOU + ARE as in, "You are right" --> "You're right."

 

 

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Your = the possessive of you, as in, "Your name is Tom, right?" or "What is your name?"

 

You're = a contraction of YOU + ARE as in, "You are right" --> "You're right."

 

 

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post #34 of 39
9/17/08 at 11:38pm
Again, the reason McCain doesn't send emails has nothing to do with his disability. He even said so himself.

He just "never had the need to".

So stop with the disability strawman.
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post #35 of 39
9/17/08 at 11:48pm
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EhCLO3lNP6A
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post #36 of 39
9/18/08 at 12:41am
Quote:
Originally Posted by tonton View Post

Again, the reason McCain doesn't send emails has nothing to do with his disability. He even said so himself.

He just "never had the need to".

So stop with the disability strawman.


I realize that...it was in the 2nd post. However, some have continued to argue that he couldn't because of his disability.

If there is a will, there is a way. John McCain does not have the desire to use computers. That's fine. I don't agree with that attitude; he should at least know what is going on... Look at how Palin's email account got hit. Is the entire staff so incompetent regarding tech?

 

Your = the possessive of you, as in, "Your name is Tom, right?" or "What is your name?"

 

You're = a contraction of YOU + ARE as in, "You are right" --> "You're right."

 

 

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Your = the possessive of you, as in, "Your name is Tom, right?" or "What is your name?"

 

You're = a contraction of YOU + ARE as in, "You are right" --> "You're right."

 

 

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post #37 of 39
9/18/08 at 1:08am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bergermeister View Post

I realize that...it was in the 2nd post. However, some have continued to argue that he couldn't because of his disability.

If there is a will, there is a way. John McCain does not have the desire to use computers. That's fine. I don't agree with that attitude; he should at least know what is going on... Look at how Palin's email account got hit. Is the entire staff so incompetent regarding tech?

There's plausible speculation that the hit on Palin's email was a plant. The email was tailored, revealed to be "innocuous", and now has an excuse to be deleted, before investigators can get their hands on it. How convenient.
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post #38 of 39
9/18/08 at 6:44am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bergermeister View Post

One of the greatest minds of all time:

Stephen Hawking



Read about what he can do:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stephen_Hawking#Computer

As I have said, if there is a will, there is a way, virtually regardless of the degree of immobility.

Stephen even flew on NASA's Vomit Comet!

So since McCain doesn't take several minutes to painfully compose an answer to a question instead of making a one minute call, he is an idiot?

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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post #39 of 39
9/18/08 at 7:36am
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post

So since McCain doesn't take several minutes to painfully compose an answer to a question instead of making a one minute call, he is an idiot?

The old fellow can't painfully compose an answer to a question, period.

We now have learned that McCain thinks Spain is in Latin America.

The Pain in Spain Falls Mainly on McCain

UPDATE: After saying he would refuse to meet with the Prime Minister of Spain, McCain campaign backtracks and says they will meet with the President of Spain, a non-existent person.
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