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Nokia, Apple iPhone to lock horns at last on Thursday

post #1 of 99
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After remaining near-silent as iPhone and other touchscreen cellphones took control of the high-end media phone business, Nokia on Thursday will try and reclaim what was once its own with its first touchscreen cellphone.

Given its first real preview in a Czech leak last week, Nokia's 5800 XpressMusic is believed by multiple sources to be scheduled for an October 2nd launch at a special Nokia press event that should also play host to fuller details of the cellphone maker's Comes With Music unlimited mobile music strategy.

The handset at first blush is cosmetically similar to iPhone but, in theory, should outclass the Apple-made communicator in several key respects: a 640x360 screen, a 3.2-megapixel camera and video capture on the 5800 will all outperform its rival while 3G, GPS and Wi-Fi put it on an equal footing in other areas. Apple's device is limited to a 480x320 display and a two-megapixel camera so far capable only of taking still photos.

And while the Nokia hardware will allegedly lack any significant built-in storage of its own -- instead opting for the usual microSD card slot of most phones -- the 5800 will be one of Nokia's few four-digit phones to sport a full smartphone platform. Where the company's other XpressMusic devices use the feature-limited Symbian Series 40, the new model is said to carry Series 60 and so would support the same class of third-party apps as those for the N95 and other Nokia challengers to iPhone, although many of these programs may need to be modified to support the touchscreen.

The Finland-based manufacturer is also counting on price as a selling point. In July, a company spokesperson insisted that the then-unnamed phone would be priced below its competitors, which in the iPhone's case would demand a sub-$200 price tag.

Nokia's 5800 XpressMusic. | Image credits: Mobil.cz.

A fall launch for the 5800 comes at a critical moment for Nokia, which has lately begun to feel the heat from iPhone 3G and other cellphones eating away at its core market. A statement released earlier in September by the cellular giant warned that it would bleed market share in the summer after "aggressive pricing" from competitors stole some of the company's thunder.

The company has declined to name those challengers but is generally thought to have pinned some of the blame on Apple, whose dramatic $200 price cut helped spur sales for customers that might have otherwise have bought one of Nokia's models.

At the time, the firm also mentioned delays in producing an important mid-range phone that some now believe is the 5800 XpressMusic.

Nokia has often positioned itself as aloof to Apple's presence in the cellphone industry, which so far doesn't include lower-cost devices and is outshadowed by Nokia's much wider lead of the total market. Even so, the company has been feeling pressure at the higher end of the phone spectrum, as Apple has already risen as high as third place among smartphone vendors after a year on store shelves.
post #2 of 99
It looks thick!
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post #3 of 99
"The handset at first blush is cosmetically similar to iPhone but, in theory, should outclass the Apple-made communicator in several key respects: a 640x360 screen, a 3.2-megapixel camera and video capture on the 5800 will all outperform its rival while 3G, GPS and Wi-Fi put it on an equal footing in other areas. Apple's device is limited to a 480x320 display and a two-megapixel camera so far capable only of taking still photos."


Consumers don't care about the actual screen resolution, as long as it looks good is all that matters (and the iphone looks fine). A higher megapixel camera on the iphone would be nice, but not a deal breaker. Video capture..ehh, again not necessary, but would be a welcome addition.

What these reviews fail to realize is that looks, functionality, and ease of use reign supreme over technical details like resolution. Just cause it looks good on paper doesn't mean it is better.

So any information on the software that will be on the computer, if any? Music store, videos? Battery life? Multitouch is what makes the iphone so great, just look at the google phone- although its browser is a step up from others, the navigation of a page is so clumsy, it's embarrassing compared to the iphone.

The reason it will be priced low is because it doesn't have any memory! You fail to really mention that at all as a key factor in purchasing...hmmm 16 GB of memory or a carry around a couple SD cards...
post #4 of 99
It looks fugly.

On a side note, I just got an iPhone a week ago and I'm honestly beating myself why on earth did I not buy one sooner
post #5 of 99
So how much does a 16GB microSD card cost?
post #6 of 99
Quote:
Originally Posted by nagromme View Post

So how much does a 16GB microSD card cost?

16GB ones are US$75. They are only just starting to ship.

8GB ones are US$30. These are very widely available.
post #7 of 99
So I have to buy the phone, and then go and buy an additional SD card, the phone should come with 8 or 16 gigs like another phone I know.
post #8 of 99
Quote:
Originally Posted by city View Post

It looks thick!

So? Thin does not always mean better-
It has a 3.2 megapixel camera!
It can capture video!
Also how long will the battery last? Is it replaceable? Thinness is not always the thing.
post #9 of 99
Quote:
Originally Posted by Adjei View Post

So I have to buy the phone, and then go and buy an additional SD card, the phone should come with 8 or 16 gigs like another phone I know.

You mean the phone that can't capture quicktime video!
And removable memory is a plus- you can swap cards/save files, etc.
post #10 of 99
Quote:
Originally Posted by teckstud View Post

And removable memory is a plus- you can swap cards/save files, etc.

I've still don't see why that is a plus. Why not have a wireless file sharing feature like the iphone? (AirSharing).
post #11 of 99
Quote:
Originally Posted by PatsFan83 View Post

I've still don't see why that is a plus. Why not have a wireless file sharing feature like the iphone? (AirSharing).

The same reason that people use more than one card for a digital camera- you can replace them whenever without needing your computer. Lfor example: if you take a long video and want to keep it but are low on space- you swap it with a new one, etc.
post #12 of 99
Quote:
Originally Posted by teckstud View Post

You mean the phone that can't capture quicktime video!
And removable memory is a plus- you can swap cards/save files, etc.

What are you on about, why do I have to spend money for something that should been included from the jump, I don't have any 8 or 16 gig cards lying around.
post #13 of 99
Quote:
Originally Posted by Adjei View Post

What are you on about, why do I have to spend money for something that should been included from the jump, I don't have any 8 or 16 gig cards lying around.

?? The same reason why you have to spend $80 if your battery dies and you can only get your manufacturer to fix it- what other phone has that pitfall? Replaceable cards are a plus- sure it would be great it it had large memory built it but it's not something to whine about because it doesn't.
post #14 of 99
Quote:
Originally Posted by Adjei View Post

So I have to buy the phone, and then go and buy an additional SD card, the phone should come with 8 or 16 gigs like another phone I know.

No, most carriers will bundle the cards with the phone. (INSIDE the same box)

Nokia does this for most carriers already for their S60 handsets.
post #15 of 99
Quote:
Originally Posted by Adjei View Post

What are you on about, why do I have to spend money for something that should been included from the jump, I don't have any 8 or 16 gig cards lying around.

You won't need to spend extra money unless you want more than 8 or 16GB space. The carriers will bundle memory cards, as they do already for this class of device.
post #16 of 99
People are quick to point out the shortfalls of the iphone but then praise the lack of memory built in as some sort of innovation because I can change cards, I mean that's supposed to be a good thing ?

What if I loose mine, am I supposed to keep on purchasing them over and over again ?
post #17 of 99
Quote:
Originally Posted by teckstud View Post

?? The same reason why you have to spend $80 if your battery dies and you can only get your manufacturer to fix it- what other phone has that pitfall? Replaceable cards are a plus- sure it would be great it it had large memory built it but it's not something to whine about because it doesn't.

xxxxx
post #18 of 99
Quote:
Originally Posted by Adjei View Post

People are quick to point out the shortfalls of the iphone but then praise the lack of memory built in as some sort of innovation because I can change cards, I mean that's supposed to be a good thing ?

What if I loose mine, am I supposed to keep on purchasing them over and over again ?

How do you loose it if it's in the phone? You don't need multiple cards- it's merely an option.
post #19 of 99
Quote:
Originally Posted by Adjei View Post

People are quick to point out the shortfalls of the iphone but then praise the lack of memory built in as some sort of innovation because I can change cards, I mean that's supposed to be a good thing ?

What if I loose mine, am I supposed to keep on purchasing them over and over again ?

The card goes inside the phone. If you lose your phone, you need to purchase another one. You can claim it on your phone or home contents insurance.

Losing any phone is no different...
post #20 of 99
Quote:
Originally Posted by teckstud View Post

How do you loose it if it's in the phone? You don't need multiple cards- it's merely an option.

This should be something that should be built in like in other phones, what if I take out the card and misplace it ? This is a step back, not a step forward.
post #21 of 99
It also comes with unlimited music for the life of the device, and you can download music over the air. There were rumors of Apple doing this a while ago.

The phone has no built-in memory, but instead has bundled 8 or 16GB cards (depending on carrier).
post #22 of 99
Quote:
Originally Posted by Adjei View Post

This should be something that should be built in like in other phones, what if I take out the card and misplace it ? This is a step back, not a step forward.

The only reason you would take out the card is to give it 32GB or more of music, which you can't do on the iPhone.
post #23 of 99
Quote:
Originally Posted by Adjei View Post

This should be something that should be built in like in other phones, what if I take out the card and misplace it ? This is a step back, not a step forward.

Once you put the card in, it has 16GB built in. If i never told you it had removable memory, you would never know.
post #24 of 99
MultiTouch?

Didn't think so..
post #25 of 99
Removable memory cards is a huge advantage.
post #26 of 99
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

The handset at first blush is cosmetically similar to iPhone but, in theory, should outclass the Apple-made communicator in several key respects: a 640x360 screen, a 3.2-megapixel camera and video capture on the 5800 will all outperform its rival while 3G, GPS and Wi-Fi put it on an equal footing in other areas. Apple's device is limited to a 480x320 display and a two-megapixel camera so far capable only of taking still photos.

18 months after Apple's announcement of the iPhone, and Apple's hardware is still looking very competitive. I see Apple merely reacting to new hardware offerings with new system software that must be waiting in the wings. New GPS software, video recording software, enhanced BT stack.

Next year, I expect another incremental HW upgrade - but I don't foresee any major departure from the current model.
post #27 of 99
the Nokia phone is likely to do very well in Asia and with the iPhone's current problems, Nokia may do even better.....
post #28 of 99
Quote:
Originally Posted by bsenka View Post

Removable memory cards is a huge advantage.

Question on the SD card-- is the data fully encrypted? Can anyone take the card out and read it, or is it protected from that kind of abuse?
post #29 of 99
It's funny the most overlooked part on the iPhone lately is the touch screen itself. I guess because it's not seen as a feature, but just the most basic human interaction with the phone. Having a capacitance multitouch screen crushes all these other recent offerings from competitors with their old school pressure sensitive, non multitouch screens.

For me the touch screen alone makes up for other shortfalls that aren't really that important to me, but would be nice like the better camera, etc.
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post #30 of 99
Quote:
Originally Posted by dizzy13 View Post

It's funny the most overlooked part on the iPhone lately is the touch screen itself. I guess because it's not seen as a feature, but just the most basic human interaction with the phone. Having a capacitance multitouch screen crushes all these other recent offerings from competitors with their old school pressure sensitive, non multitouch screens.

For me the touch screen alone makes up for other shortfalls that aren't really that important to me, but would be nice like the better camera, etc.

...and the Apple operating system!
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post #31 of 99
Quote:
Originally Posted by retroneo View Post

It also comes with unlimited music for the life of the device, and you can download music over the air. There were rumors of Apple doing this a while ago.

The phone has no built-in memory, but instead has bundled 8 or 16GB cards (depending on carrier).

But what happens when the phone is useless and I want to get a new phone, what happens to all that music ?
post #32 of 99
Quote:
Originally Posted by grayum View Post

the Nokia phone is likely to do very well in Asia and with the iPhone's current problems, Nokia may do even better.....

How well will this phone do in Japan, people tend to overate these Nokia phones, after all the rave the Nokia N95 got, after using on here in Canada on Rogers, I was shocked at how awful it is to use, even though it's loaded with all these features I couldn't even find half of them, and the phone looks like a brick..
post #33 of 99
I would like to see e2e (edge to edge) screen design in iPhone 4G. This will increase the current screen size of 3.5" to almost 5". The home button can be put at the right hand side and the earpiece can be put higher on the rim edge.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jittery jimmy View Post

18 months after Apple's announcement of the iPhone, and Apple's hardware is still looking very competitive. I see Apple merely reacting to new hardware offerings with new system software that must be waiting in the wings. New GPS software, video recording software, enhanced BT stack.

Next year, I expect another incremental HW upgrade - but I don't foresee any major departure from the current model.
post #34 of 99
Is it an iPod, NO? End of story!
post #35 of 99
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

a 640x360 screen ... [whereas] ... Apple's device is limited to a 480x320 display

Which means the Nokia has a marginally superior screen hardware-wise, but what the article fails to mention is the iPhone has a significantly superior display system because of its software. The simple fact is, most people are not educated enough to understand the sophistication and value built in to OS X. In this case, we're talking about rendering and animation. It will be obvious to consumers that the iPod looks much better, regardless of pixel specs. Nokia remains years behind Apple. The market will figure this out soon enough, but right now the difference is unclear to most people.
post #36 of 99
OK, I thought I was an apple taliban, but now I get angry with you guys.

The choice of replacing a 16GB card with a 32, 64, 128 one (as they become available and cheap) is a GOOD thing. Some day the 16gigs of your iPhones might feel too little.

What might NOT be good is the bulkiness of the Symbian 60, maybe the thickness of the phone. Some people think the iPhone is too big, how big will this Nokia be compared to the iPhone?

People like features. If the Nokia states more features on the package, more people might buy it than the iPhone. Not all people know what a great GUI and user experience is (before they try)
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post #37 of 99
Quote:
Originally Posted by PatsFan83 View Post

Consumers don't care about the actual screen resolution, as long as it looks good is all that matters (and the iphone looks fine). A higher megapixel camera on the iphone would be nice, but not a deal breaker.

As long as it looks good is all that matters but as screen resolution goes up programs on phones just look better and better. Just look how the resolution on phones has changed over the last 5 years, each time it goes up you think it looks loads better and really good. But then another phone comes out with even higher resolution that looks even better.

I've always thought the screen resolution will be Apples biggest problem with the iPhone, bot because its bad at the moment, just because there are now thousands of web apps and apps on the apple store built to that resolution making it an issue when it needs to be upgraded.

As for the camera, I know a lot of people that used to use their phones as cameras only to get an iPhone and moan that the cameras not good enough. Apple really should upgrade it in the next version. Being able to take photos and upload them to sites is a big thing and right now the iPhones camera just isn't good enough and is years out of date.
post #38 of 99
2MP isnt that bad. It isnt great by todays standards but its not that bad. Infact wasnt there a poll taken some time ago from Flick which showed iphone users blogged pics to flickr ahead of other phones?
post #39 of 99
Quote:
Originally Posted by ThinkAdrian View Post

OK, I thought I was an apple taliban, but now I get angry with you guys.

The choice of replacing a 16GB card with a 32, 64, 128 one (as they become available and cheap) is a GOOD thing. Some day the 16gigs of your iPhones might feel too little.

What might NOT be good is the bulkiness of the Symbian 60, maybe the thickness of the phone. Some people think the iPhone is too big, how big will this Nokia be compared to the iPhone?

People like features. If the Nokia states more features on the package, more people might buy it than the iPhone. Not all people know what a great GUI and user experience is (before they try)

Right and I guess the iphone will stay at 16 gigs forever, I mean people are here trying to spin this as a good thing, something which should be included in the beginning, but oh I get to replace the cards, that's actually good.
post #40 of 99
Quote:
Originally Posted by bavlondon2 View Post

2MP isnt that bad. It isnt great by todays standards but its not that bad. Infact wasnt there a poll taken some time ago from Flick which showed iphone users blogged pics to flickr ahead of other phones?

These phones just include a bunch of features don't even use or have a had time figuring how to use them, but I guess to some people that's all that matters, a list of features.
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