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NVIDIA allegedly showing new MacBooks to staff - Page 3

post #81 of 131
so... will that make bootcamp totally useless then? assuming not using intel's chip=no windows installation?
post #82 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by killamike View Post

so... will that make bootcamp totally useless then? assuming not using intel's chip=no windows installation?

I don't understand that. All Apple would have to do is provide the chipset drivers in an updated Boot Camp. Windows does work on non-Intel chipsets.
post #83 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by gluzd View Post

From what I read online, people did try putting over 4GB into a Intel 965 MacBook but only 4GB were used by the system. Everything above 4GB was ignored. There are limitations in other non-chipset hardware areas, as I understand.

This is a Windows limitation. A Mac OS laptop would be able to use the full 8 Gigs.
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post #84 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnny Mozzarella View Post

If the world is coming to an end, might as well get a sweet rig while I still can.

If I am the only human with a MacBook post-apocalypse, I will rule the world!

MacBook Pro: Apocalypse Edition

Proud AAPL stock owner.

 

GOA

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post #85 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post

MacBook Pro: Apocalypse Edition

Until the battery ran down and then he would have a canoe anchor and no more power.
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post #86 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by Virgil-TB2 View Post

This is a Windows limitation. A Mac OS laptop would be able to use the full 8 Gigs.

No, it is not a Windows limitation, just a 32-bit limitation. Intel's PM/GM965 nothbridge (which Apple currently uses) is limited to 4GB of RAM (even though it has a 36-bit memory controller). But M965 is two generations old now, and Apple needs to catch up.

Actually, M965 should work with 8GB (the desktop version of the chip does), but I don't think any laptop manufacturers properly supported it in the BIOS (or EFI, in Apple's case).

I guess the point is, an Apple laptop with a modern MCH (be it from Intel or Nvidia) and no EFI limitations will be able to use 8GB of RAM. Maybe even 16GB of RAM.
post #87 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by Virgil-TB2 View Post

This is a Windows limitation. A Mac OS laptop would be able to use the full 8 Gigs.

post #88 of 131
I've been holding out for an imac refresh, which if the original road map continues to be correct, is due in November. And I really hope that - whatever they do to the form factor (likely not much), that the imac will be at least the equal of the new portables - I'd like an upgraded intel CPU (at least montevina) and if true for the portables, the Nvidia graphics chips capable of handling Crysis etc. So I'll be checking out what does or does not happen Oct 14 with a lot of interest and waiting my turn.
post #89 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by iijuanii View Post

I think the best laptop design they've released was the 12" powerbook.

I agree. If Apple did a similar design in Intel, and with a plastic enclosure to deliver superior WiFi reception & transmission, we would then have the perfect Mac notebook!
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post #90 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by iijuanii View Post

i definitely agree with you. I want the more portable computer but i also want professional power.
i dont understand why other people dont get this point




Indeed they are made for the every day consumer, but*, There are professionals such as myself who need a smaller notebook and must be very portable. The power can be put into the macbooks without a doubt. Apple for some reason doesnt want to put another small pro model out.

for the record. I think the best laptop design they've released was the 12" powerbook.

Yes, I know a number of engineers who made the switch because they liked the 12 Powerbook.

But, I would imagine that Apple discontinued it because generally, it wasn't selling well.

Of course, modern Macbooks are much more powerful than the old 12" Powerbooks, so that part isn't a problem. The gpu in the old Powerbook wasn't that hot by todays standards either (and not THAT great by the standards of the day). I'm not even sure if it was any better than the on die graphics of Intel's current chipset.

And really, unless one is doing 3D, it's not all that important.
post #91 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

Yes, I know a number of engineers who made the switch because they liked the 12 Powerbook.

But, I would imagine that Apple discontinued it because generally, it wasn't selling well.

Of course, modern Macbooks are much more powerful than the old 12" Powerbooks, so that part isn't a problem. The gpu in the old Powerbook wasn't that hot by todays standards either (and not THAT great by the standards of the day). I'm not even sure if it was any better than the on die graphics of Intel's current chipset.

And really, unless one is doing 3D, it's not all that important.

I know that everytime I see a 12" PB I wish I had one with Intel guts. In airports, they are not uncommon to see, but most people have Intel machines these days it seems.

Give me a notebook I can put in a jacket pocket and I will buy today. Release a 10" and I will still buy one. A 12" MBP would be killer too. At this point, I just want something smaller than my MB 2.4 GHz.
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post #92 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by gluzd View Post

From what I read online, people did try putting over 4GB into a Intel 965 MacBook but only 4GB were used by the system. Everything above 4GB was ignored. There are limitations in other non-chipset hardware areas, as I understand.

Sometimes the only problem is the pin-out in the memory sockets. Manufacturers don't always use all the pins for the higher order modules for various reasons. Sometimes, in portables, it's because of power consumption. In desktops, it's often because newer higher density chips weren't out at the time the machine came out, or they were much too expensive, and so the manufacturer hadn't been able to test for them.
post #93 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacRonin View Post

If you were the last person on the planet, you could scavenge batteries from all the other MacBooks in the world.

Or you could get a generator and run it off of all the fuel sitting in the tanks at the gas stations around the world.

Or you could set up a solar system to charge your batteries.

Or you could set up a wind turbine, or a water turbine…

Or, or, or…

I am sure if you were the last person on the planet, you could find a way to provide power for your electronics for the rest of your (lonely) life…

And if you could, what would you use it for, games, to while away the years in between trying to find food?
post #94 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by aplnub View Post

I know that everytime I see a 12" PB I wish I had one with Intel guts. In airports, they are not uncommon to see, but most people have Intel machines these days it seems.

Give me a notebook I can put in a jacket pocket and I will buy today. Release a 10" and I will still buy one. A 12" MBP would be killer too. At this point, I just want something smaller than my MB 2.4 GHz.

Yeah I like my 12" PB too, it's very convenient. But I would take that thought one step further and ask Mr. Jobs to kindly reintroduce the Duo, it was the best notebook system I've ever used.
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post #95 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

Yes, I know a number of engineers who made the switch because they liked the 12 Powerbook.

But, I would imagine that Apple discontinued it because generally, it wasn't selling well.

Of course, modern Macbooks are much more powerful than the old 12" Powerbooks, so that part isn't a problem. The gpu in the old Powerbook wasn't that hot by todays standards either (and not THAT great by the standards of the day). I'm not even sure if it was any better than the on die graphics of Intel's current chipset.

And really, unless one is doing 3D, it's not all that important.

I get what your saying. But my point is that today they have the technology to make a 13" MBP with all the power. I don't want a plastic mb. It doesn't appeal to me. I was considering buying a mb and upgrading to 4gb ram 250gb hard disk 2.4 ghz for $1700. Way cheaper (better?) then base pro, but I'll gladly pay more for for a backlit keyboard, graphics, and clean sleek aluminum.


Quote:
Originally Posted by aplnub View Post

I know that everytime I see a 12" PB I wish I had one with Intel guts. In airports, they are not uncommon to see, but most people have Intel machines these days it seems.

Give me a notebook I can put in a jacket pocket and I will buy today. Release a 10" and I will still buy one. A 12" MBP would be killer too. At this point, I just want something smaller than my MB 2.4 GHz.


I don't know about a MVP that fits an a pocket. 12 13 inches is good for me. I want a descent screen. But I want something smaller than a 15" mbp
post #96 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mazda 3s View Post

I don't think that PA Semi/Apple even has a license to produce chipsets for Intel processors. AFAIK, only NVIDIA and SiS have licenses for producing Intel-based chipsets. And AFAIK, PA Semi has no experience with building a competent, ATI/NVIDIA-class mobile graphics processor.

So your comment has little cred.


Nvidia didn't receive a license to use Nehalem or chipsets from there moving foward because Intel wants access to SLI.

Watch the announcements from Apple and Intel on chipset licensing agreements.
post #97 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by mdriftmeyer View Post

Nvidia didn't receive a license to use Nehalem or chipsets from there moving foward because Intel wants access to SLI.

Watch the announcements from Apple and Intel on chipset licensing agreements.

For what it's worth, Nvidia claims that it does in fact have a QPI license to make Nehalem chipsets, and that it is just skipping the high-end for a generation to focus on mobile and integrated graphics stuff.

(Speculation is that NV just got the license too late to introduce a competitor to X58)
post #98 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by iijuanii View Post

I get what your saying. But my point is that today they have the technology to make a 13" MBP with all the power. I don't want a plastic mb. It doesn't appeal to me. I was considering buying a mb and upgrading to 4gb ram 250gb hard disk 2.4 ghz for $1700. Way cheaper (better?) then base pro, but I'll gladly pay more for for a backlit keyboard, graphics, and clean sleek aluminum.

Of course they do. It isn't a matter of being able to do it. They likely think there isn't a large enough market.

The fact that Apple produced such a machine in the first place shows they were interested in the possibility of that segment of the market.

But, unless they can be convinced that it's viable, they won't do it again.

The Macbook can do everything it has to, and if a smaller machine doesn't come out again, I don't know how to convince Apple to change their minds. Somehow, there have to be enough people telling Apple they want one, for them to bother. People on the forums aren't enough.
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post #99 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by JeffDM View Post

I don't understand that. All Apple would have to do is provide the chipset drivers in an updated Boot Camp. Windows does work on non-Intel chipsets.

Quote:
Originally Posted by killamike View Post

so... will that make bootcamp totally useless then? assuming not using intel's chip=no windows installation?

Yeah, Boot Camp just needs to have all those drivers, nVidia chipset, network, RAID, etc. have different drivers for laptop and desktop. In PC land, it's actually quite complicated finding all the right drivers, even for Windows XP.

The good news is that Apple provides you all the Boot Camp drivers. Bad news: hard to use other drivers if you wanted to experiment.
post #100 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by FuturePastNow View Post

No, it is not a Windows limitation, just a 32-bit limitation. Intel's PM/GM965 nothbridge (which Apple currently uses) is limited to 4GB of RAM (even though it has a 36-bit memory controller). But M965 is two generations old now, and Apple needs to catch up.

Actually, M965 should work with 8GB (the desktop version of the chip does), but I don't think any laptop manufacturers properly supported it in the BIOS (or EFI, in Apple's case).

I guess the point is, an Apple laptop with a modern MCH (be it from Intel or Nvidia) and no EFI limitations will be able to use 8GB of RAM. Maybe even 16GB of RAM.

Interesting points. I wasn't paying too much attention to PC laptops, but a quick look at Dell "gaming laptops" and I can't see any 8GB Vista Ultimate 64-bit options.

As I said previously, a MacBook Pro with 8GB of RAM, and that will go like hotcakes. During economic hardship is when people that really use their laptops can't afford to waste time or lose out on projects because they didn't have a few extra hundred bucks to get a powerhouse mobile platform. Might turn a few people away from getting Mac Pros to just equipping their staff with MacBook Pros with 8GB RAM.

The MacBook Pro heat problem has really improved, for the Penryn models you could run the two internal fans at say 5000 rpm at say 60% CPU load, and at room temperature the keyboard actually feels a little cool to the touch.

It's the MacBook Pro build quality that has been somewhat atrocious, and the aluminium styling, while making it as light as a MacBook, is prone to some painful bumps and dents... (If you had that happen to your MacBook Pro, you know what I'm talking about...)
post #101 of 131
What's the update on the maximum RAM each of these apps can access?

CS4 Photoshop
CS4 Illustrator
FCS2
Logic Studio 8

VMWare Fusion
Parallels Desktop
post #102 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by nvidia2008 View Post

What's the update on the maximum RAM each of these apps can access?

CS4 Photoshop.........2GB
CS4 Illustrator..........2GB
FCS2.......................2GB per application
Logic Studio 8.........2GB

VMWare Fusion.........2GB each 32 bit virtual machine / no limit on 64 bit virtual machines running x64 OS
Parallels Desktop......2GB per virtual machine
post #103 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ireland View Post

I think Apple should sell the 13" in 9 colors, just like the new nanos.

That would be a HUGE differentiator, and can you imagine a '1984' redux ad campaign to launch them? All those 'grey' PC laptops sitting in the audience, and here comes COLOR!

The sad thing for Apple, potentially, is that this launch is coming at a time of almost unprecedented belt-tightening by the worldwide consumer. While I will likely be one of the buyers (since this will be my first-ever Mac notebook, rather than an 'upgrade'), I don't know if Apple can count on a hugely robust sales effort...no matter how awesome & cool these new MacBooks turn out to be. There will no doubt be many people waiting on the sidelines to see if that $1,000-$2,000 they would spend on that MacBook is going to have to pay for a mortgage payment instead.
post #104 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisNH View Post

The sad thing for Apple, potentially, is that this launch is coming at a time of almost unprecedented belt-tightening by the worldwide consumer.

People feel they need a computer, so if they feel they need a new one they will justify it. During these economic falls you have to sell harder so having vibrant colours and a new case design would be a smart move as it will help pull people away from getting a different brand that may be a little cheaper.

There is also something to be said for comfort purchases but that logic is completely lot on me. All I know is that I've read that the states lotteries are growing as people are wasting their hard earned money on the worst odds in gambling.
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post #105 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacRonin

If you were the last person on the planet, you could scavenge batteries from all the other MacBooks in the world.

Or you could get a generator and run it off of all the fuel sitting in the tanks at the gas stations around the world.

Or you could set up a solar system to charge your batteries.

Or you could set up a wind turbine, or a water turbine

Or, or, or

I am sure if you were the last person on the planet, you could find a way to provide power for your electronics for the rest of your (lonely) life

Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

And if you could, what would you use it for, games, to while away the years in between trying to find food?

...don't forget the time required to deal with the cannibalistic zombie problem that always seems to accompany "last-man-in-the-world" scenarios.
post #106 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by PB PM View Post

Thats not really good news. If you look in the PC world, Nvidia chipsets are known for running extremely hot, and as being less reliable than Intel chipsets.

Think about what having Apple Engineers working with Intel did for them. Apple wouldn't turn out a product without putting it through the paces first, that's more along the lines of ACER.
post #107 of 131
Good cripes, Nvidia as a chipset!?!??

-hope it's not the 700 series.

I can haz video lockups?
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post #108 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by nvidia2008 View Post

Interesting points. I wasn't paying too much attention to PC laptops, but a quick look at Dell "gaming laptops" and I can't see any 8GB Vista Ultimate 64-bit options.

As I said previously, a MacBook Pro with 8GB of RAM, and that will go like hotcakes. During economic hardship is when people that really use their laptops can't afford to waste time or lose out on projects because they didn't have a few extra hundred bucks to get a powerhouse mobile platform. Might turn a few people away from getting Mac Pros to just equipping their staff with MacBook Pros with 8GB RAM.

The MacBook Pro heat problem has really improved, for the Penryn models you could run the two internal fans at say 5000 rpm at say 60% CPU load, and at room temperature the keyboard actually feels a little cool to the touch.

It's the MacBook Pro build quality that has been somewhat atrocious, and the aluminium styling, while making it as light as a MacBook, is prone to some painful bumps and dents... (If you had that happen to your MacBook Pro, you know what I'm talking about...)

Here is a guy running 8GB of RAM in his Thinkpad T61, which is identical to the Macbook Pro from a chipset perspective. If the current MBP is limited to 4GB, that is an artificial limitation created by Apple.
post #109 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by FuturePastNow View Post

Here is a guy running 8GB of RAM in his Thinkpad T61, which is identical to the Macbook Pro from a chipset perspective. If the current MBP is limited to 4GB, that is an artificial limitation created by Apple.

He also blogged about putting the 4GB modules in a MBP. It works fine. You just have to have a new enough version (late 2007, I think) to address more than 4GB total.

The problem lays with the cost and availability. I can only find 200-pin SO-DIMM 667MHz RAM for notebooks. There is no faster DDR2 RAM or any DDR3 RAM for the newer machines yet. On top of that, the price will set you back almost as much as the notebook cost.

As for Apple not "supporting" it, selling it or listing it as an option, has never meant that it won't work. They often have better specs than they officially support.
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post #110 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

He also blogged about putting the 4GB modules in a MBP. It works fine. You just have to have a new enough version (late 2007, I think) to address more than 4GB total.

Well, how about that. I didn't poke around on his blog. You could probably run 16GB on it, if it had four slots.
post #111 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by FuturePastNow View Post

Well, how about that. I didn't poke around on his blog. You could probably run 16GB on it, if it had four slots.

I was actually doing a search on Google for people that had tried it when his blog came up on top. I think the current chipset will technically allow for 32GB, though I'd wager that,like the pre-Santa Rosa chipsets, some of the addressing would go to the GPU and system so you could use a full 32GB for the actual RAM..

I am under the impression that mobile chipsets are designed to support only 2 RAM bays, so you'd have to put 2x8GB sticks in the slots. If they do support more bays, does anyone like Alienware offer them for their gaming notebooks?
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post #112 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ireland View Post

"Everything must, and always does change my friend."

who said that?
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post #113 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by hezekiahb View Post

Think about what having Apple Engineers working with Intel did for them. Apple wouldn't turn out a product without putting it through the paces first, that's more along the lines of ACER.

Exactly what DID Apple's engineers do for Intel, rather than what we know Intel's engineers did for Apple?
post #114 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

He also blogged about putting the 4GB modules in a MBP. It works fine. You just have to have a new enough version (late 2007, I think) to address more than 4GB total.

The problem lays with the cost and availability. I can only find 200-pin SO-DIMM 667MHz RAM for notebooks. There is no faster DDR2 RAM or any DDR3 RAM for the newer machines yet. On top of that, the price will set you back almost as much as the notebook cost.

As for Apple not "supporting" it, selling it or listing it as an option, has never meant that it won't work. They often have better specs than they officially support.

Very often, Apple, and other companies, don't acknowledge what they haven't themselves tested. This goes way back. On my own 950, way back, Apple denied that 4 MB modules would work, only 2 MB modules. An engineer told me that Apple DID put the extra pins into the mobo. So I went and bought two 4 MB SIMMS and installed them. They worked well. But they cost a fortune. I was eventually able to put 64 MB RAM into the machine, even though Apple said that it would support 16.

But, at times that doesn't work.

My wife's B/W G3 only supported 256MB DIMMS. I tried a couple of 512MB modules, but the machine only saw the 256 from each. Not a limitation of the OS, which was 10.4, but of the machine.
post #115 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

I am under the impression that mobile chipsets are designed to support only 2 RAM bays, so you'd have to put 2x8GB sticks in the slots. If they do support more bays, does anyone like Alienware offer them for their gaming notebooks?

Dell's Precision "mobile workstations" and some gaming laptops (think Sager) have four memory slots, but they all use desktop processors and chipsets.
post #116 of 131
Do you think that MBP will be shown to the world launched the same day world wide?

Maybe October 14 2008, or maybe not
post #117 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ireland View Post

This is either untrue or an orchestrated leak.

Personally I think it's untrue, and we won't see any new MacBooks until Macworld.

I'm in an Applestore right now. I only went on to AI after an employee here who was hekping me with MacBooks suggested there might be an upgrade next week. S/he was telling me I might want to buy now, or wait for the next upgrade. I asked when MacWorld was, s/he said February (I think). I asked about the WWDC, s/he said it had happened earlier this past summer. Then s/he said there was a conference next week, implying the rollout of new products.

OK, I better get off before they come and take me to the back room for interrogation.
post #118 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ptrash View Post

I'm in an Applestore right now. I only went on to AI after an employee here who was hekping me with MacBooks suggested there might be an upgrade next week. S/he was telling me I might want to buy now, or wait for the next upgrade. I asked when MacWorld was, s/he said February (I think). I asked about the WWDC, s/he said it had happened earlier this past summer. Then s/he said there was a conference next week, implying the rollout of new products.

OK, I better get off before they come and take me to the back room for interrogation.

I hate to say it, but staff at Applestores know nothing in terms of what is coming up next.

The store CSM (stock manager, there is usually one person in each store that has full SAP access, and deals with every item that goes through the store), may have an inkling as they control stock levels and see what is expected in terms of inventory for the next month or so, but the Mac Specialists and Geniuses know nothing.
post #119 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marcus View Post

I hate to say it, but staff at Applestores know nothing in terms of what is coming up next.

The store CSM (stock manager, there is usually one person in each store that has full SAP access, and deals with every item that goes through the store), may have an inkling as they control stock levels and see what is expected in terms of inventory for the next month or so, but the Mac Specialists and Geniuses know nothing.

Not officially. But I wouldn't be surprised if even at Apple more people see the information then we would expect. Stock managers are just like everyone else. They talk to their friends in the store. Simple things such as, "Yeah, we're getting low on that model, and it doesn't look like any more will be coming in." That's enough for experienced employees to get the gist of what's happening.
post #120 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ptrash

I asked when MacWorld was, s/he said February (I think).

Macworld 2009 begins on the 5th of January 2009.
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