New MacBook case leaks question FireWire's future - Page 6

The size difference issue is maybe paranoia, since the difference in volume between the two is 10.75% (very accurate estimation applebook! ) for just 8% more mass for the MBP, but the difference in price is not:

entry level MB: 1000 euros
entry level MBP: 1800 euros

This is 80% more!

No, it is not a proof, but you have to keep in mind that musicians is not the kind of people that would easily spend the amount of money required for a MBP. Especially if there is an option like the MB as we know it today.

You know damn well that rabid Mac users will accept and defend whatever Apple does. So what's the harm if Apple makes a laptop with a modular drive bay? Mac users will just turn around and praise it like they do with everything else that Apple does:

There will be no video iPods.

Apple will never switch to Intel processors.

Even those Mac users proclaiming the death of optical drives would still buy the new MacBooks, even though internal optical drives come standard in them. You know it's true.

Page 47 ("Signal Cable Assembly Sets"):
R&D Accomplishments
1/1/2008-3/31/2008
3) Developement to Apple's Mini Displayport

Looks like that answers all the questions. Folks, we aren't going to see a DVI port...nope, we will be seeing a Mini-Displayport. Now maybe at Macworld, SJ will be introducing new Cinema Displays featuring mini Displayport About time to upgrade them. Also, this report frequently brings up "Halogen free" cables for Apple mice, keyboards and powercords. Any thoughts, or is this just more of Al Gore getting his way?

Making the optical drive an external option would have the following effect on the specs:
- lower price
- lighter weight
- smaller footprint
- better battery life


I'm sending this from my MacBook Air connected to an external monitor in extended desktop mode.


Redesigning the MacBook Air's case to accommodate a more easily removable battery would require either making the battery smaller or making the MacBook Air thicker and heavier. I prefer the battery as is. I hope 4GB will soon be an option at purchase, but Apple will not add removable RAM to the MacBook Air.

I STRONGLY disagree with leaving out FW ports on macbook (and on any product).
Apple is evolving backwards for some time, have you noticed?

NO BUY for the new MB if no FW ports. Period.

I hear you, though there are some whispers about Firewire over Ethernet ports. No one knows though what Apple will do. Tomorrow is the day...

Very bad move if no Firewire on the MacBook.

Most of you writing here have only mentioned using video cameras with Firewire. Have you forgotten about backing up your internal boot drive to an external drive.

There are two types of computer users Those who have lost data and those who will.

USB 2.0 is so far inferior to Firewire when it comes to reading and writing data it becomes laughable when real life comparisons are made. Check out Barefeats comparison FW vs USB read write test http://www.barefeats.com/usb2

If Firewire is dropped completely from the Consumer laptops it simply means that Apple has investigated the usage of FireWire amongst average consumers and come to a conclusion that they don't use it. They use USB peripherals and USB drives.

Since FireWire fucked up with their inconsistency with port design lost a great deal of average consumers and peripherals to the USB side that has had the same port ever since its introduction. I prefer Firewire though, and I'm sad to see it's being neglected on both the Air and MacBooks. Since it's a must have for me. Bad Apple. Bad Firewire.

Will people stop crying about the firewire thing.

Jesus Christ!

There are more important things in the world.

You guys are talking like Apple just kidnapped your 5 years old daughter.

Here are my poll results:

what about the mac mini, mac pro, cinema displays, perhaps new keyboards, iLife 09, iWork'09, and they will have undoubtedly have some other product that we have no idea about. What about that mac tablet ? Plus how about the mystery 'product transition' that apple talked about?

Hey,
does anyone know if there is such thing as wireless FW? if so, that may be what they are doing. Apple is a very practical company, they know what they're doing, and there is definetly a logical explanation for the missing firewire. Plus, keep in mind that those photos might be prototypes, or even fake. But just keep in mind that apple is a company- that many people call and most of us believe- that is 50 years ahead of the industry.

I believe you're correct, which would require that to be a DisplayPort design and leaving the tape a greater mystery.

Called Time Machine overnight via wireless to my Time Capsule or in a pinch via GigE...which should be as fast or faster than FW400 in the real world given there's nothing but the mac plugged in directly to the Time Capsule.


"One disappointment in this area: the performance of the Maxtor OneTouch’s FireWire 400 port actually lagged that of its USB port in the Duplicate File and Low Memory tests, which is atypical in a hard drive. Seagate, Maxtor’s parent company, attributes the test results to new Leopard drivers that have improved the transfer rate of USB 2.0."

http://www.macworld.com/article/1318...onetouch4.html

Don't assume that just because you have a FW drive that it works any faster than it would using USB2.

Apple will be fools fools fools it if they remove Firewire 400 from the MacBook Pro...

For the people who actually use the MacBook Pro because they are pro's (i.e. not fanboys who want the fastest. fanciest toys, but only check their Hotmail on it) it's a big problem...Pro HD video cameras, some pro D-SLRs, Motu audio interfaces...

C'mon apple...don't be jokers. innit.

Quite so. But then Apple has to somehow keep the existing FW-bond functionality and ease of use of the Macintosh: target disk mode and easy account transfer between Macs. If they keep those, then any complain about data transfer performance at consumer level will look less important. Especially if the price is lower too.

But if removing FW means the two above are dead, and we are left with just USB for wired data transfer, then this would really be a big step back.

Well I record and play music almost every day and I'm not a pro (most people who play and record music are not).

The size and color issue is blown up out of proportion but the extra cost suddenly to buy a MBP is not.I live in europe So the prices surly differs from the US. but here the difference in price between a MB and a MBP is to big (there are a lot of interfaces that wont be discarded for a few years in the future that wont be connected to the next-gen Macbook).

I mean Most musicians I know use cheap but well functioning sound interfaces with firewire (as stated earlier in the thread USB just don't do recording as well as Firewire) on the cheapest 2GB computer possible that can run Logic Studio, Garage band and Reason and thats a MB. I think the first reason for mac being even more popular with musicians now is that you get a decent and easy to use audio recording/performing unit out of the box with garage band finally working sort of well (even if it still sometimes gets the hick ups if you are in a session with more then four or five audio tracks). Second thing is logic studio, you now can have full blown recording/arrangement/mastering/performing suit for a lot less than any other computer can if you buy a Mac. Third thing is that music stores actually are selling apple computers now and promote them to costumers a lot more then before (good work there apple).

Bottom line is that all the musicians I know and talk to would rather Spend the extra $500 or so on a new instrument, microphone or perhaps a multichannel firewire interface, not on a MBP with a lot of extra under the hood that they wont use.

Now even if I above argue that Firewire Is a big deal when it comes to audio recording and performing I don't say it's impossible or too painful without firewire. Apple needed the space/lower the cost or both on the MB and the logical thing to remove port vise would be the FW as it's not nearly as common in everyday use as the USB that is not a argument or a opinion, its a fact.

Cheers

Kristoffer


PS. sorry for the bad english but hey, it's a second language here.

Anybody worried that me might not see an updated 17-incher?

I haven't seen any photos of a 17-inch MBP yet, I wonder if Apple will update it later on?

Try this:

http://www.microcenter.com/single_pr...uct_id=0203724

Is the taped up hole not for the Magsafe adaptor?

Hey I use this port on my MacBook Pro to sync my iPod Photo. If there was only a Firewire 800 port, I'd have to buy an adapter to get back the functionality I already have!

It looks to have the symbole for a dual display on it, making it a Mini-DVI connector. The port size fits in-line with it, too.



I think the MagSafe will be at the very back-side of the case, like with all other Mac notebooks. Since it'll be the most used cable putting it up front doesn't make much sense. Now, what is that circular hole next to the taped port? I'm think it's an eject button for some Apple proprietary 3G/WiMAX addition.

You're probably talking about the next thing after 802.11n or a much faster, extended range Bluetooth... Not likely Apple will be announcing this on Oct 14, though.

Yes, gentlemen, if you have transferred anything between two Macs or PCs with GigabitEthernet, you won't go back to FW400.

Now most people will just get a "fast" USB2.0 drive of some description.

At the risk of offending many people I'd say, the time has come. USB2.0, FW800 or GigE. I love FW400, but it's time has come.

So many of the new HD consumer cameras use USB now... I hate it, but, whady'a going to do about that...

Why the F*K has nobody come out with a standardised FW800~esque~USB3.0~esque thingy? USB 2.0 as it is, is pretty crap when it comes to supplying power. Endless looking for hubs, etc. etc. nonsense.

Can't they make a USB3.0 spec, that people will follow, with enough juice to drive, a nice fast 7200rpm portable drive???

Oh, and here's a brilliant idea, I believe FW came up with it, a long, long time ago... DAISY CHAINING. Did somebody along the way forget about that when they went ape-sh1t crazy with USB? You need like five million ports on your PCs nowadays. WTF? Is it a power draw issue when you daisy chain USB?

Yeah, remember ADC? It was sort of the precursor to HDMI

There were at least 2 or 3 monitors out of about 150 I was looking at last week that had a DisplayPort connector. I think we'll probably see more in 2009 but like the ones I saw, most will likely be high end monitors.

My damn heart sunk into my stomach when I learned that 1394a has been stripped from these new MacBooks. External hard drives & camcorders can no longer be bus powered - start toting extra power adapters! Great - more weight to carry. USB is such a PITA.

What a disappointment, I have been waiting for mid-October for months to buy a new laptop. The MBP's are too huge to schlep around the planet, 15" just doesn't cut on the airline seat back tray, and now, the MB's are too stripped down, meaning even more weight must be lugged. I am totally bummed out.

I need a whole new travel strategy. That Fujitsu miniature is starting to look good, and that bums me out even more...

FW800 to FW400 9-pin to 6-pin cable FTW? Sorry to hear that, hopefully the 15" has lost a bit of weight.

I think what we're seeing is the industry-wide Mini-DVI, not a Mini-DisplayPort which doesn't appear to exist. For starters, I don't think Apple could use a Mini-DisplayPort name in any such way; instead they would have to make their own port type and use their own naming convention (Mini-ACD?). Secondly, DisplayPort is already small enough that there is no need to have a a 'mini" version, unlike DL-DVI which is quite large and bulky for a notebook.

PS: The use of Mini-DVI on these 15" Mac notebooks leads me to believe that Apple will be offering a 15" MacBook, probably with an IGP for those (like me) who find the Intel X4500 perfectly suitable for doing all graphic related tasks. I would hope that the MBPs will be using DisplayPort or HDMI for both the speed and and the svelte size of the connector.

PPS: ~28 hours until we find out for certain.

I agree with you. I find myself using FW less and less on my notebooks. In fact, since I have all intel gear now I don't even worry about FW. I have some FW800 drives from my iMacs but that is it. I am curious why we don't have esata. That is speed.

I'm using bus-powered USB hard disk drives. Essentially every 2.5" USB portable is bus-powered.

What's with all the apologists here? If I'm buying a $1000 MacBook, I want it to have FireWire. So FireWire is on its way out, you say, most peripherals have USB anyway, and only professionals need it and they will choose a "Pro" MacBook over the normal MacBook. What kind of crap talk is that? There is a huge crowd of people who have invested in FireWire peripherals. This is not a small "professional" crowd. While Apple is focussing on new-to-Mac users now, the longtime Mac users who want to buy a new computer is still big. And Apple needs the loyal base. Apple is just screwing them over. There is a huge crowd of people who have bought DV and HDV cameras that work only over FireWire (on the Mac, anyway). These cameras may only be one year old. Heck, you can still buy consumer HDV camera's from Sony and Canon, and these need FireWire. So Apple just screws them over. Heck, Apple even sells Final Cut Express for these people who use HDV, and also sells Logic Express. These are targeted at normal consumers who want to do a bit more. So these people with a HDV and DV camcorders, or home enthusiast musicians using these apps are screwed when they want to buy an entry level Mac notebook? They should just buy an iMac or an even more expensive MacBook Pro, you say? Because what's a couple more hundreds of dollars for these people anyway, right?

Apple also did this with iPod owners, when they ditched FireWire (12V) battery charging. Now the new iPods won't even charge with most of the sound docks, car stereo systems, and more. People have invested in their iPod system, and the Made for iPod logo doesn't mean anything. Apple has screwed them over. All these old, and even new iPod Docks are useless when you buy a new iPod. Heck, even Apple's own iPod HiFi system doesn't charge your new iPod anymore. Great! What you say: Just buy a new Dock? Or simply don't buy a new iPod? And buy a second hand on eBay when you do need a new one?

Some people can only buy one new computer. Say you have $1000-1199 to spend as a consumer. You can either buy a MacBook or an iMac. The price is about same. If you need a portable, you scrap the iMac. But you won't be getting FireWire for the same price? You have to buy an expensive Pro designated piece of equipment just to get that FireWire in a portable? I'm sorry, but these people who are saying that scrapping FireWire on the MacBook is something insignificant are just laughable to me.

Having said all of this, I do think that Apple could be introducing a combo Ethernet/FireWire port (S800T).

Actually, I use a 9pin to 6pin 1394 cable for most external drives with my BlackBook now.

It's not only the weight of the 15" (it is about half a pound heavier than the MB). It's the screen size. It just doesn't fit on the seat back tray, and I'm on a flight somewhere 4 or 5 times a week.

If you have a MBP and the person in front of you decides to put their seat back and snooze, your work is over for the rest of the flight. You're done. At least with the 13" you can keep working.

I was actually hoping for a 13" MacBook PRO without a DVD drive. Real, manly IO, big time storage capabilities & a hot-swappable battery. Instead, I get a laptop made for the teenage crowd.

I need a new laptop desperately. I waited too long for this October event. Since the MBP is too big to travel, and the MB is soon to be stripped of key functionality - since I must now live without that key functionality anyway, why not get something really travel friendly?

Left: Kensington Lock Slot, AC Power, VGA, LAN, 2 USB, Firewire, Headphone/Mic

Right: PC Card Slot, Optical Drive, 1 USB, Modem

...and it's only 2.9 pounds. Since it uses 2.5 SATA drives, I can plunk a 300 GB in there.

Formatted for Linux, it might be a nice travel companion. I dunno, I've always used MacOS, going back to an old PowerBook 140. But I've never seen their equipment get so stripped down before, it's a real bummer...

That looks like the symbol for a MINI-DVI port to me. Which also fits into the exact port size of Mini-DVI.

I actually think it would be possible to make a universal usb to firewire bridge if you do it at a system level. Everyone say it's impossible, but I think it's about effort, determination and smart software/hardware engineering. But I haven't heard of any one out today though. However this one pictured above is ONLY for connecting an NTSC DV camera. A separate version for connecting a PAL DV camera. That's how specific it gets. It gets messy with a lot of converters for special needs.

Intel 950 and X3100 CAN DO EXTENDED DISPLAY! HOWEVER they can only extend display in the native resolution of the main display.

What if these 2 case designs are for a 13" & 15" MacBook & we haven't even seen the Pros yet?

One more day to find out.

Yeah, early tomorrow morning, go to the Apple Store and read the sign "Sorry, we're closed, be back later".

That is not true (the second part of the above statement). The 950 and X3100 can extend the display to resolutions other than that of the main display.

Yea... NOW use the Mini-Note for about 4hrs then pull the MBP back on your lap. Wanna talk about feeling like a small kid again. I used my HP 2133 for about 3 days straight then pulled out the 13" macbook to get some work done in photoshop/iwork... My gosh did I feel like a 5yr old in size.

Nice, Ubuntu.... Nice...

DisplayPort is industry standard. Just because PC based systems don't come with them doesn't mean squat (aside from PC's are cheap POS). Displayport can run VGA, DVI, HDMI, and it's all Vid/Aud in one cable. It's also 1080i/p compatible and is capable of running OLED displays with 100% accuracy....

One thing that's not really mentioned much yet about DisplayPort is it's integrated USB connectivity for such things as Touch Displays and Display's with USB Hubs.