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Inside the new MacBooks: FireWire, USB, and the NVIDIA Controller - Page 2

post #41 of 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChibiR View Post

Thanks for the input! Very glad to hear that this is actually a working solution for backups and some streaming. I was afraid that my potential plans (which would ultimately look a lot like your setup) would have snail speed. Then I guess I'll keep the Mini as my base station and let it handle the attached drives while I get a regular MB. And some time later maybe a Time Capsule to spice things up a bit.

Keep in mind that if you use your mini as your base station (I assume you mean as your wireless router) that unless you've upgraded your mini it will only have wireless G, which will be much slower than N. Also, last time I looked into it, a software base station like that does not have all of the security options you'd get with a hardware router.
post #42 of 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hal 9000 View Post

Just got one yesterday after the folks at the Apple Store showed me that they use USB 2 booting for repairs. Tried it at home and it worked. Having to format the external drive and reinstall the OS was a pain though.... Thanks to Carbon Copy Cloner this is somewhat easier.

I guess the only really interesting aspect about Target Disk Mode that is not addressed by USB booting is migration. Guess I´ll have to depend on transfering my files to an external disk and then retransfering to my new Mac. Bummer!

My point is that the critical issue -REPAIRS- can be tackled by booting from an external USB drive.

Thanks for the info on USB Booting.

Migration is now handled by Ethernet or Wifi as well as Firewire.
post #43 of 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by YTV View Post

Get back in your cube before Steve walks by.

Are you upset that Apple went with a more powerful Nvidia chip instead of two less powerful Intel chips, or was that a compliment?
When a company stops chasing profit and start chasing the betterment of their products, services, workforce, and customers, that will be the most valuable company in the world.
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When a company stops chasing profit and start chasing the betterment of their products, services, workforce, and customers, that will be the most valuable company in the world.
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post #44 of 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by StuBeck View Post

Am I the only one who thinks its a bit awkward to be talking down about Intel hardware, while using that as the example for switching to Nvidia, in the same week that Apple has mentioned Nvidia video cards have been a problem in the past?

I expect that that specific Nvidia problem- which was a manufacturing defect- has been corrected. Which doesn't help anyone who has a machine with the defective GPU, but it shouldn't mean anything to buyers of the new Macbooks.
post #45 of 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by silverpraxis View Post

Are you upset that Apple went with a more powerful Nvidia chip instead of two less powerful Intel chips, or was that a compliment?

I think he's suggesting that anyone who actually likes the new Macbooks must be in Apple's employ.
post #46 of 59
I just wanted to say... OMFG the MacBooks come with DDR3 1066mhz RAM!! Even on the entry-level Aluminium MacBook.
post #47 of 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by zunx View Post

FIREWIRE FOR REPAIRS. Via Target Disk Mode. That is absolutely needed on both MacBook Air and MacBook. NO FIREWIRE, NO PURCHASE.

If you can't think of half a dozen ways to fix it without target disk mode... well, I hope you don't call yourself a computer tech.
post #48 of 59
Hey! Where is original article?

http://www.appleinsider.com/articles...ontroller.html

http://www.appleinsider.com/articles...nch_imacs.html

These links point to the same article about new iMacs!
post #49 of 59
No mention of the Firewire Chip in the MBP. Is it the industry benchmark for reliability Texas Instruments chip or the cheap widely recognized problematic and vastly incompatible Agere chip? Is it on a PCIe bus or still dumped on a PCI bus?

Meh why do I care anyway, Ill never touch hardware with NVidia Chipset's again anyway, i've learned many a painful lesson in the past. I just hope this current design choice is an interim quick fix until Intel's Nehalem Core i7 debuts.
post #50 of 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by Leonard View Post

Thanks for the info on USB Booting.

Unfortunately USB in this situation is a backward a$$ed step which is unlike Apple who normally engage more forward and progressive solutions. Firewire based external storage has never been considered being in the Pro domain, i'd like to know who decided to come up with that BS (which has appeared in the last few days) anyway. I've always laughed at my mate copying 500gig of data to his external USB drive on his PC laptop while Windows's file copy dialog progress showing remaining time of 2 days. The same 500 gig on Firewire 800 would take 3-4 hours in a case that cost 80 dollars. Is that in the realm of Pro (how ever that is defined now days), laughably a resounding NO. Why is it backward? Firstly USB 2 has never been useful for anything other than keyboards and mice, printers etc and now possibly USB flash sticks. There is still a bridge chip process that data needs to pass through adding to the pi$$ poor performance of USB 2. If Apple were to take the same initiative as it did with DisplayPort why couldn't they have dropped an eSATA port on the machine (gee the chipset even provides it), it is a far better candidate for external storage and simpler to implement TDM than even Firewire (direct interface no bridge chip) as that is its sole purpose. Sure it can't be daisy chained or do bus power like FW (Yet tho that is in the process of ratification as we speak) but nor can USB and the data R/W is approx 4X that of USB..

So in reality axing Firewire in the Macbook and trimming a port in the MBP while making excuses that it aint pro or its not used or needed is completely invented spur of the moment BS. invented. It was purely a cost cutting measure IMO. Obviously Apple does not consider anyone's time but their own as important. If they did their marketing muppets would've had a fantastic time dreaming up some spectacular eSATA data xfer rates and designing some colorful graphs.
post #51 of 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by FuturePastNow View Post

I expect that that specific Nvidia problem- which was a manufacturing defect- has been corrected. Which doesn't help anyone who has a machine with the defective GPU, but it shouldn't mean anything to buyers of the new Macbooks.

Obviously not but if NVidia's repeated glorious history of problem free chipset's rises to the occasion in these Apple machines then I suspect many fanboy's will have bought themselves a huge bag of jobsian hurt Time shall tell.
post #52 of 59
I did a side by side comparison in the Apple store of the 2.1 GHZ Macbook (Plastic)with INTEL chipset to the 2.4 GHZ Macbook with NVIDIA chipset. I also brought my MacBook along and it has the INTEL Chipset too.

I was able to demonstrate the the "Instant On" LED display on the NVIDIA chipset MacBook was actually much slower than the Intel Chipset.

The CPU usage was roughly the same when playing a Quicktime Movie in Safari, although I saw reports somewhere the NVIDIA was supposed to significantly reduce CPU demand.

Any Ideas as to "why" the instant on is painfully slow ?? Apple's online videos show a remarkable difference (faster) which is not experienced in the store.

Peter
post #53 of 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by Targon View Post

Obviously Apple does not consider anyone's time but their own as important. If they did their marketing muppets would've had a fantastic time dreaming up some spectacular eSATA data xfer rates and designing some colorful graphs.

In fairness, most Marketing muppets would only speculate on the positive demographic advantages of monetizing a reduced-cost SKU in a substantially impacted negative marketspace. Then they'd get the Communications droids to dream up specs and the pixel-grunts to design colorful graphs.
post #54 of 59
I bought a new MacBook 2.4ghz today and the Apple Store sales person did not think either USB port differed as the article mentioned. Also, in the article, I could not determine which USB port has the high powered feature -- is it the one closest to the LED Hinge, or the one farthest from the LED Hinge. And the article mentioned this was discussed in the Apple MacBook support documentation. I spent an hour at Apple's support site looking through various docs, searching etc., and could find no mention. Does anyone have a URL link to the specifics?

Thanks.
Roleigh
post #55 of 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by zinfella View Post

"FireWire does not slow the entire bus down to the speed of the slowest device attached."

Since when?

Since forever.

USB 2 will slow down to the speed of the slowest device in a chain, like USB 1.1.
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post #56 of 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by FuturePastNow View Post

If you can't think of half a dozen ways to fix it without target disk mode... well, I hope you don't call yourself a computer tech.

Using FireWire Target Disk mode is simply faster and easier than booting from a CD or DVD, for instance. There are plenty of ways that are doable, but require a bunch of dicking around.

FireWire TDM saves me time and headaches.
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post #57 of 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by marti124 View Post

I bought a new MacBook 2.4ghz today and the Apple Store sales person did not think either USB port differed as the article mentioned. Also, in the article, I could not determine which USB port has the high powered feature -- is it the one closest to the LED Hinge, or the one farthest from the LED Hinge.

Thanks.
Roleigh

I haven't used a new one yet to find out. On my computer its the port furthest from the hinge. You can simply plug in an iPod or any USB power peripheral an find out instantly.
post #58 of 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zauner View Post

Most of my gear from 2,5" harddiscs to cameras feature FW400. But even if I'd upgrade to the new MBP I would have to use an adapter, and would be stuck with this even-more-glossy-than-before screen. So I'll stick to my old MBP as long as possible and then...we'll see..

Seems that Apple only wants the machines used by students and for home entertainment.

I don't know ANY pro photographers that actually edit on a laptop, ANY laptop. If they don't transfer the images to a desktop for editing, then they use an external display hooked to the laptop, because laptop displays are not up to the challenge of editing images on a professional level. If anyone will notice, the new 24" LED lit ACD, due out next month is aimed at laptops.

All the laptop does is give them a general idea of each image capture, as it beats a tiny LCD screen on the back of the camera.
post #59 of 59
Target mode was one of the best things about being an Apple Tech. I'm so pissed about this and when the new machine that lack FireWire start showing up for me to support, I'll be more pissed

http://web.me.com/felixmendeldog/MacMan/Blog/Blog.html

-MacMan
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