Apple's unibody MacBook: the review - Page 2

I've never seen USB 2 run faster than FW400, on a Mac Pro or not.

Where are you getting that from? Apple's consumer laptops (the MacBooks and iBooks before them) have had Combo Drives for years, which simply lack the ability to write DVDs, not CDs.

Oops, my mistake.

Firewire has a dedicated controller that handles the traffic and therefor can handle data speedier and better.. USB on the other hand uses the main CPU for that..

Firewire can also be used in a same way SCSI can be used. you can attach a firewire cable to an (offline) computer and access the harddisk inside (and also boot from). it has presence in the backplane of some computing systems. Although this is not possible on windows machines as far as i know.

Apple should have kept a firewire 800 port on their new laptop series for the normal macbooks!!
this is stupid, "hey, if you still want to use your old camera, buy a $2000 laptop, we at apple are the best and should go back to windows if you don't like it.."
and then you ask yourself why apple has such a great cross-margin in their quarter results...

The MBP's are too expensive and consumer laptops nowdays start at $600 and almost offer the same tech specs, with firewire! Apple wake up!

Yeah, honest mistake. I used to think they were read-only drives as well.

The MacBooks (and the PowerPC iBooks before them) never shipped with FW 800, so it makes very little sense to expect Apple to introduce such a thing on their consumer laptops when FW 400 has obviously been a flop with the majority of those who buy MacBooks: students and Windows switchers who never used Firewire to begin with.

Of course there's always going to be a $600 piece of crap Windows laptop with a ton of ports, legacy and otherwise. Apple's clearly not interested in competing in that profitless market...because they're outpacing the industry 4 to 1 selling well made, future-forward, fairly minimalist premium computers.

I can agree to skip the old FW400, but why not promote FW800 in stead and still keep old (cons/semi/pro) users happy?

USB previously won because of the license fee involved with FW. This is their 2nd change
How else do you wanna enforce a popular computing standard to start with..

If anyone doesn't yet appreciate this difference, consider: I can hook my sony mini-DV camcorder to my f/w equipped MB and operate the camcorder from the computer. For capturing video, editing from segment-to-segment as you go, that's invaluable. It's really a loss i can't imagine how to replace (other than, of course, keeping my MB or buying a new MBP; in the first case apple loses a customer; in the second i lose (by gaining) 3/4 lb of light and lose (by gaining considerably on the footprint. (granted, add'l features, too, with the MBP; but for those for whom the MB would be just good enough--in fact, great--if it had sustained the f/w it already had in the prior iteration, that's a pretty painful difference, especially since the CPU speed doesn't increase and the price does). It's both a practical loss and a value equation loss. IMHO.

Given current economic circumstances, and with Apple's long tradition of adding features/reducing prices, i think the present example of reducing features and increasing prices is ill advised. I hope i'm wrong; as a consumer, i know i'm ill-served by the decisions.

Well, what's keeping Apple from swapping out something else in favor of FW 800 in a future MacBook? They very well could if they marketed FW 800 as something that would make sycing your iPhone or iPod way faster than USB 2.0. Remember, they dropped FW 800 on the original MacBook Pro and then brought it back in the next iteration. USB 2.0 ain't gonna last forever, we both agree on that. Perhaps Apple's working on a new standard. Regardless, at the moment it's clear they are done with FW 400 as it's advantage in speed, which is all any average consumer would care about, is now pretty much gone thanks to faster USB 2.0 on the new MacBooks.

They've been promoting an alternate standard and the mass market has rejected it; Apple even helped by dropping syncing over Firewire on recent iPods and the iPhone from day one. All Firewire was doing was costing Apple money. I have to admit, it's sad to see a superior interface bite the dust, but I doubt this will be the last we see of custom Apple interfaces.

Hah, look at Mini DisplayPort, for starters. Now even the MacBook Air can output to a 30" Cinema Display at full 2560x1600 resolution!

I first heard this term (and I suspect this is it's origin) in reference to the old IBM PC Jr. My Dad ran IBM mainframe computers for stock brokerages back in the 1960s and 1970s. His first home computer was the "light" version of IBM's first PC, marketed as the PC Jr. It came with a keyboard not unlike Apple's current design. At the time it was widely derided as the weakest link in the IBM product, not unlike the puck mouse in later years with Apple. Anyway, IBM was so shaken by the criticism that it replaced what was being called the "chiclet" keyboard with a conventional one. I believe it shipped them free of charge to PC Jr. owners. By the way, I love the chiclet keyboards that come with new iMacs.

I want to add my voice to the chorus of the disappointed: no firewire, no 13" for me. I'm on my second 12" g4 powerbook and will continue to wait for an ultra-portable that gives me the same flexibility. Or: throw in the towel and opt for a 15" Macbook Pro.

Most Sony Notebooks have HDMI so you can easily plug the laptop to any HD Flat screen. Also the Vaio Z series (which is a 13.1 inch blu ray capable notebook) has a native 1600 by 900 screen res.

I wouldn't say a couple years, but just until writable optical drives could be added.



They added a lot to the MB, while only removing a single port interface that goes unused by the vast majority of MB users. Something that will get less used since over half their customers are Switchers.

If you need to by a new Mac and must have FW, and you don't want the MBP for the reasons you mention above then their is no reason you can't buy a new $999 MacBook. They are quite capable machines and now $200 cheaper.



USB will survive for the foreseeable future since USB3.0 will use the same port interface and be backwards compatible to USB2.0. The problem with FW400 is that the port interface was abandoned when they designed FW800, luckily FW3200 will use the same port interface as FW800 so I'd think that FW800 port will survive on future Macs.



And now the new iPods and iPhone can't even charge over FW. I kept my old chargers and FW-30-pin iPod cables around because they charged so much faster than USB.

As for superior tech, this is fairly common in technology. Being vastly superior in one aspect doesn't mean it'll survive if it falls short in other areas. This includes pricing and marketing.


This is free, powerful, backwards compatible with HDMI, DL-DVI, offers HDCP, and is highly scalable. I think we'll see the entire industry moving to DP in record time and will maintain this tech for a long time.

HDMI is good for that, since most modern TVs have HDMI, but how many people ever plug their notebooks into their TV so they can watch movies? Why not just have a dedicated Blu-ray player, rather than use a very expensive computer with a very expensive Blu-ray drive to do it? Note that there is no evidence of a 9.5mm Blu-ray drive actually existing on the market and the price for the 12.7mm drives are priced well above it would cost to by a Blu-ray appliance for you HDTV.

I'm getting pissed of with people who consider no blu-ray is a deal breaker. Why don't you conduct a world survey on ALL Apple consumers, that will they pay more for blu-ray or they are happy with the DVD offering.
I can bet with you that MOST people would rather keep DVD then using Blu-Ray.
Besides the implementation of blu-ray is so slow, even after the HD war that I'm not even sure how long the format will last, this is not the same as how DVD came along and replaces CD.

Cool desktop picture is that a new one supplied with the MacBook?

I don't remember seeing that particular one before?

This is a nice product in keeping with Apple tradition... what I need is a coat pocket Mac with touch screen like the iPhone, full Mac OSX, no hard drive, WiFi + Blue Tooth, quad band GSM + EDGE + CDMA+ 3G for worldwide use with SIM for voice+data, no DVD/CD. No, I do not want it locked to a carrier or jailed to iTunes. USB Flash is so dirt cheap that if I want to watch a movie, I can rip from a few movies from a DVD to last during the trip. No keyboard.

This way, when I travel, in the US or outside, I do not have to carry a bulky laptop, bulky charger + adapter with wires, smartphone + charger+adapter with wires + car charger. Then if I do not want to get robbed by roaming charges, and $1-1.50/min I got to get a local phone + charger w/wires + car charger.

Apple certainly could charge top dollar... $1,500-2,000 or more would not be too bad for a hi end well designed product with function.

I can't find that image on my unibody MB.

No Firewire for my HDV Canon, no DVI adapter for my 24 inch Display, equals I do not need this computer. Apple took the lead in Firewire development?
The DVI adapter is over 100 US dollars in Japan. If you need it get it, I do not.

..............They praised the viewing angle?

I don't know even know what to say. The vertical viewing angle is an atrocity. I felt like I was playing limbo with the thing in the Apple store, trying to crouch enough so that the screen looked all right.

What is the point of that if only to further the decision to drop FW400 from the MB. The FW pendrive is $100 for a 1GB drive.

As for moving large amounts of data 802.11n and 1000BASE-T are great, fast solutions that allow for significantly decentralized setup. FW400 has its benefits, but being better than other methods in every way it is not.

Real world tests transferring images from CF/SD cards on some photography sites indicate that USB 2 card readers are not as fast as Firewire ones.


"In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice. In practice, there is."

Yogi Berra

You're missing the point. It's not about speed but the whole nature of the interface which was designed specifically to support video and audio. DV and HDV camcorders all use FireWire exclusively. For example, you can connect two cameras together with a FireWire cable and make a straight digital copy without needing a computer. It's not like hard drives which have USB and FW interfaces that you can use more or less interchangeably. For video USB simply isn't an option.

There's also the problem that the new MacBooks lose FireWire target mode. And Apple could have used the much smaller 4 pin FW connector if physical space was the issue.

I am equally tired of people who need FireWire not realising that they are in a distinct minority.

I'm also tired of people who need FireWire going on and on about it's "removal" when in fact we are only talking about one single product in a range of products, all the rest of which have FireWire.

I'm also tired of the endless comparisons where people point out that FireWire is better than USB. Anyone who knows anything about the technologies involved can agree with that, but that still has absolutely nothing to do with whether or not it should have been included on the MacBook in addition to the MacBook Pro, the iMac, the Mini, and the MacPro.

You guys are all arguing apples and oranges.

It looked like pretty guarded praise to me. How is it compared to the previous model?

this is exactly the same situation me and a LOT of friends are in.
we all came to that same conclusion, we are not buying now.
some of them were actually seriously saying that they would buy windows machines, and this is not so radical as it might seem to some users here, because if you are the kind of user that needs firewire, you need it to connect your hardware for software that works the same on either mac or windows, so the switch wouldn't be life-changing.


it is NOT about speed at all, just look at points 2, 3, 4 and 5 of the next post, this is exactly what you would need it for.
not all computer users are spec-whores, some of uss are actually looking for usability instead of just benchmarks..




all of this is a clear explanation of what firewire means to those who really USE it.
not to transfer your illegally downloaded \\movie from one drive to another, but for real work, for things where it makes a difference in performance, not a difference in speed.

if YOU don't need firewire, please don't assume 99% of computer users don't need it, so keep your insulting suggestions to yourself. for those of us who do need it, it imposes a serious problem. most of us could maybe put off buying a new laptop now, but the more time you give us, the more we'll get used to the idea of using our software on a windows OS.
if the macBook pro is either too big or too expensive for you (or both), a switch is easier made than we'd want to.
(and yes: 2" more might make a huge difference: in the back of the tour bus/ van, the little desk in the train, the reserved place on stage, next to the soundboard/lightdesk, and many, many more places the size difference is real problem for some).

Looking at apple-history.com, it was about 2 1/2 years from first introduction of iMac before a writable optical drive was available for it.

i'm with Steve Jobs on this one, every time I look at the new Macbook, I poop a little. Its beautiful.

MacTracker shows February 2001 before a CD-RW was included, and then I think it was only an option, so 2.5 years is right. That was by far a bigger PITA than the removal of FW400.

I think most would agree that the new MB is a fine machine, but lost versatility without Firewire. Most complaints would probably disappear if they could add it on their own dime, for example via an expresscard slot.

I would also second the comment about limited viewing angles, but then I am comparing to an old Powerbook.

You're right. I considered the previous Macbook's screen to be a joke. I suppose I just find this one's maddeningly crippled.

I think the people defending the dropping of Firewire are the same people who used to say Firewire is a key advantage of owning a Mac.

I think Apple should have lowered the price of the MBP, especially if it's the only option for Firewire. There's really not much difference between it and the MB anymore and dropping FW was done to justify the higher price of the Pro.

Apple has traditionally courted a demographic that needed/used FireWire: creative content producers. Whether those be semi-pro wedding videographers, dads who like making home movies, students doing class projects, weekend bands, etc. People likely to own FireWire devices and use them, but not be able to afford/justify the cost of a Pro machine.

Now, that demographic may have been a small percentage of actual users, but it was a demo Apple liked to claim and tout. Now Apple appears to be chasing "switchers": people fed up with the pain of Windows. That is a much larger target market, but includes far fewer "creatives". It includes a lot of casual computer users who can't keep up with anti-virus software installs, DLL conflicts, driver weirdnesses, etc. i.e. novice or unsophisticated computer users. People who use the Web, do email, and not much else.

Now, from a financial point of view, I don't begrudge Apple for chasing a larger demographic and positioning themselves (rightly) as the kinder gentler alternative to Windows. But in doing so, they have turned their backs on the creatives. And from a corporate culture & image point of view, I am disappointed by the move.

FireWire is used and needed by a LOT of Apple's old core market. By removing it from their newest entry level machine they have moved on to a new core market.

- Jasen.

Only the tape-based video cameras commoony have FW, and those are quickly being replaced.

As for entry level, the $999 MacBook is the entry level Mac notebook and it still has FW400. It's not the new case design, but it's great deal for a Mac notebook, especially if you have to have FW400.

2. Wrong. DV in real time has nothing to do with USB vs FW. DV was designed specifically for FW. The FW transfer rate is right for DV (which doesn't have temporal compression, so the data rate is huge). With HD, the video had temporal compression, so the data rate requirement is actually lower. You can transfer HD FASTER than real time through either USB2 or FW.
3. Both USB2 and FW can draw enough power from the port for 2.5" external notebook hard drives. (yes, I have one) USB2 doesn't have enough power to power a 3.5" external HD, but I don't know of any 3.5" FW HD which doesn't require extra power either.
4. True. However, a hub is really not that bad.
5. True on both points. However, you can do a peer-to-peer ethernet, so I don't know how much value peer-to-peer FW has. There is no replacement for Target Disk though.

So, of all the points people use to fight for FW, I see Target Disk as the only valid argument, which I haven't used for years (but I have used SCSI target disk mode ages ago, from the days of Powerbook 100).

That and audio devices. However, there is just more variability with USB audio interfaces than Firewire interfaces. Some USB ones are fine. The software driver just plays more of a part with USB than Firewire - so crappy drivers = crappy performance on USB hardware. Not all USB hardware has crappy drivers, though.

Also, this review misleads when insinuating that the backlight of the screen has anything to do with the viewing angle. Any perceived viewing angle improvement with the LED backlight is only due to higher lumen output. It is still a mediocre TN type LCD panel that is common on pretty much all notebooks these days.

I upgraded from a Penryn 2.4 Black Macbook to the new 2.4 aluminum, and the new Macbook is far and away a better value than the previous Macbook. In fact, the new 2.4 Macbook is such a good value that Apple had to raise the price $100, indicating that they weren't getting quite enough margin on these to make them comfortable. That right there should tell you that these are a good deal (especially when you order from the Education store).

The screen is a deal breaker for me......I cant be bothered with such poor viewing angles and contrast / black levels. Its really a shame.




That's just totally unacceptable to me. The new MacBook Air is looking far more appealing now....lighter, thinner, better screen, blazing SSD speeds compared to the conventional HDD, no more video stuttering, no more core shutdowns and no more overheating.

They are replaced but that does not mean that one may not need to access those tapes again. I have a ton of 'old' videos on such MiniDV tapes and still shoot on MiniDV. I have many that I have not had the time to capture to the computer, edit etc but they are still on tape. I will need to have firewire for a few years to come even if I buy a HDD or NAND based camcorder in the near future. For he same reason, I will need to keep my old MiniDV camcorder as well.

Wow, that's quite revealing. Thanks! I think it will just be an iMac for me, or possibly wait and see if the mini gets the new nvidia graphics.

UMMM HD is calssified as 720p, 1080i, 1080p

I must, because I know, disagree with you. If what your saying is true and they only have 768 line of horizontal resolution, then by all accounts they are TRUE HD 720p. Also, went to their website. Say's

* 13.1" Screen1
* 1366 x 768 or 1600 x 900 Resolution

Thats a true 1280 x 720 HD resolution. By that logic my brand new Panasonic 42" Plasma isn't an HDTV. Side note. Even at 42", at correct viewing distance you wouldn't be able to notice (with 20-20 vision) the difference between 1280 x 720 and 1920 x 1080.

Now of course they aren't "Full HD" 1080p, but that's beside the point. They are HD capable. Going even further, at 13.1" you wouldn't notice a single itty bitty difference (at normal viewing distance w/ 20-20 vision) between 720p and 1080p. Don't let psychosomatics play with you.

Back to the thread, FIREWIRE is a consumer interface, enough said. Not that I'd but one of these pieces of shit(ALUM macbook), they don't even come in black.

Not to take anything away from the Macbooks. They also sport a True HD 1280 x 800 resolution. Works great with my HD tuner