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GS downgrades Apple, says new product at Macworld unlikely - Page 2

post #41 of 88
Quote:
Originally Posted by wizard69 View Post

I'm no fan of GS but lets face it folks Apple is way over priced and sooner or later investors will realize that. Especially investors with balls as there are a lot of true bargains out there for people to sink money into. I just don't see an appreciation in Apples value in the short term, that no matter what sort of product the deliver. There simply are better opportunities for those that still have investment cash to put into the morass that is wall street.

.........
Frankly the mentality of the recession seems to be driven by the same fools that are whining about global warming. ......

Dave

I just do not know how to respond..... ????? Over priced???? true bargins??????

Yeah, How about this for an idea,.... Buy Microsoft before all of its money is gone. ?????

Maybe some financial investment company stock cause they all know what they are doing???

Or some GM stock ... before they declare bankruptcy next month.????

And yes you are right, everything is right in the world nature wise. We can over polute, over fish, dump toxins....... and none of it will ever come back to haunt us or our children.

PS check out Brownsville texas. They have been dumping toxins in Mexico across the boarder and guess where all that crap groundwater is going.???????? Want to buy some land in Brownsville??? Dave???



Just a thought.
en
post #42 of 88
GS - Isn’t that the company that Paulson was the CEO of ???

Isn’t Paulson the guy guy who said the economy was robust and strong just before it tanked?

Didn't GS risk and debt go over the top during his tenure?

What credibility does GS have?

What motive does it have for downgrading a winner just before earnings???

Maybe anyone covering a stock should be barred from trading it…..
post #43 of 88
Quote:
Originally Posted by bertyao View Post

i thought steve jobs say you have to innovate during recession. i assume that means release new products?? or do you innovate now and then wait for economy to improve then release it.

No, Steve's master plan will be to introduce "The Box"!

What's in this box?

Something every consumer wants and every envious competitor will spend gobbs of R&D money to produce their version of "The Box"! Only, it will be a figment of Steve's innovation magination. No Apple R&D dollars spent, just the pretense of another highly acclaimed Apple product that it's competitors will spend themselves into bankruptcy imitating when making their "killer" product.

And as the competitor's gasp for their last financial breath, Steve will pull the plug and Apple will take over the world! (insert mad scientist laugh here).

Who would have thought, Steve, the REAL Dr. Evil! Only Steve has MOJO, yeah baby, yeah!

Ten years ago, we had Steve Jobs, Bob Hope and Johnny Cash.  Today we have no Jobs, no Hope and no Cash.

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Ten years ago, we had Steve Jobs, Bob Hope and Johnny Cash.  Today we have no Jobs, no Hope and no Cash.

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post #44 of 88
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

In particular, Bailey noted ongoing chatter of a "an upcoming touch-screen tablet," but said "it seems that this product is still in the development stage and will probably not be launched until the middle or back half of 2009."

To sum up, his analysis is based on hanging around forums like AI. That's funny.

I agree with the above post, Apple's touch interface has been a huge success. For sure, they will use it in bigger format products. Touch is the future!

Will thay launch a tablet in Jan? Who knows?

Seems like Apple prefers to launch the biggest innovation at MW (am I right?). A tablet would be comparable to iPhone in terms of innovation. So, if not now, they would like to wait until next MW. That would be a bit late, when HP has already launched a product. If HP is ready, others could have tablets ready over the next 6-9 months.

Apple late to the touch tablet party when they probably had a 3-5 years head start? Seems strange.

Keeping my fingers crossed,

Daniel

iPhone 4

iPad (1st gen)
13" MacBook Pro (late 2009)

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iPhone 4

iPad (1st gen)
13" MacBook Pro (late 2009)

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post #45 of 88
Quote:
Originally Posted by echosonic View Post

AMEN, the only thing these epic tools have the ability to see any more are their own colon walls.

Apple is the onyl current safe haven as far as I am concerned.

You're absolutely correct a severe case of Rectal Octalitis. After my last post I did a little research and found that Goldman Sachs is ranked at the 14th in institutional ownership catagory for both Microsoft and Apple. At the end of last quater GS had sold down it's positions in both companies by 15.2% and 18.4% respectively bringing their institutional ownerships down to 1.28% and 1.10% respectively. So it will be interesting to see if they repurchase this QUARTER after they've depressed the price. Considering that Institutions own over 60% of both companies it's to their advantage and our detriment as individual equity investors. This type of information at Nasdaq.com and institutional holding for each equity you wish information on.
I feel that Apple should pay a decent Dividend and stick it all those who bailed and then maybe they will go to their financial advisors and move their accounts to someone who cares.
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KennDDS
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post #46 of 88
Who is goldman sachs to say what a company is worth or not? Those idiots got them selves into trouble just a couple months ago. Guess what company who was downgraded has and has had no debt, AAPL! I think those people are stupid for listening to some company. Do your own damn research and learn something. Apple is a solid company because of their ratios (except recently when theyve been affected by the retarded economy) and the debt and how they have their assets organized. I wish idiots would get out of the stock market and stop screwing it up.
post #47 of 88
Apple should use the downturn in the economy as the perfect opportunity to shore up/beef up its product lines (ahem, the mini), not introduce new ones. Bustling economies are when you unveil lavish state-of-the-art tech, not recessions, and I agree with earlier comments that to unveil a new product (like a netbook) now would be a mistake. That, and I just don't see netbooks pushing the edge of "mainstream" in the US as someone commented earlier. Maybe so in Japan, where mini portable notebooks have been the rage for many years, but not here. Hence that's why Steve and Apple are playing it cool on the sidelines for now- they're waiting to see which way the wind blows, and it changes pretty often. I agree with the general forecast by GS, and yes, I don't believe Macworld with be anything spectacular this year. I think Apple will be conservative and hunker down at least until mid summer of next year.
post #48 of 88
I wanna be a so-called analyst. I can just follow rumors and nuance and make up proprietary formulas that no one can examine and put out an investors' note to say not to buy something. When so many people disagree when looking at the same raw data, it means you're not coming to any worthwhile conclusions.

Knowing the cloak-and-dagger ways of Apple, why should we trust anyone with "inside info"? Just because factory checks say nothing is there, doesn't mean nothing will be announced. They could do another iPhone-style intro, where they mention it now and it's not ready until March or April.
post #49 of 88
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paladinkn00be View Post

Who is goldman sachs to say what a company is worth or not? Those idiots got them selves into trouble just a couple months ago. Guess what company who was downgraded has and has had no debt, AAPL! I think those people are stupid for listening to some company. Do your own damn research and learn something. Apple is a solid company because of their ratios (except recently when theyve been affected by the retarded economy) and the debt and how they have their assets organized. I wish idiots would get out of the stock market and stop screwing it up.

Right ON Paladinkn00be.

Apple has become a sure bet for traders and shorts. If long investors do their homework and research and stand by their convictions to hold long and if institutional investors want to get any clients to trust them, they should also once again engage in real investing and protect value and have some conviction, then Apple will really see it’s potential. Get rid of the shorts, hedge funds and unscrupulous brokers, invest for yourself in value and screw all the middle manipulators. It takes a lot but can be done if anyone wants anything to count on.
post #50 of 88
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paladinkn00be View Post

Who is Goldman Sachs to say what a company is worth or not? Those idiots got themselves into trouble just a couple months ago. Guess what company that was downgraded was and has had no debt, AAPL! I think those people are stupid for listening to some company. Do your own damn research and learn something. Apple is a solid company because of their ratios (except recently when they've been affected by the retarded economy) and the debt and how they have their assets organized. I wish idiots would get out of the stock market and stop screwing it up.

Recession = tightening of the wallet = bad for Apple. That's great that Apple has no debt, but speaking truthfully, a company that does not finance at least some degree of debt causes eyebrows to raise, and not in a good way. Debt is usually an indicator of growth, and one would expect that a company with Apple's profits would be financing debt. Also, the bad economy nabs Apple where it hurts- those who are looking to by computer electronics, and premium computers at that. If people/families are tightening their wallets, they are most likely to cut back on splurging for high-end product's like Apple's. I think that's the main reason behind the downgrade- gloom over Apple's current position.
post #51 of 88
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimzip View Post

Dude, if you write a book, I'm buying it.

Jimzip

I wrote a book about ten years ago and still have about 30 copies left. It was about misunderstood song lyrics and it wasn't just the right and wrong lyrics listed, I had editorial comments for each and every one. I sold them for ten bucks each plus $2.50 for Priority Mail shipping in the US.

How many copies do you want?
post #52 of 88
a few European newspapers printing pictures of a brand new iPhone today, with details including a 128gb drive, 2 cameras one for pics and one for vid conferencing and bigger battery capacity... source apparently, the infinite loop? That's one heavy rumor where someone already produced a picture of the new 4G iphone.
post #53 of 88
Quote:
Originally Posted by iReality85 View Post

Recession = tightening of the wallet = bad for Apple. That's great that Apple has no debt, but speaking truthfully, a company that does not finance at least some degree of debt causes eyebrows to raise, and not in a good way. Debt is usually an indicator of growth, and one would expect that a company with Apple's profits would be financing debt. Also, the bad economy nabs Apple where it hurts- those who are looking to by computer electronics, and premium computers at that. If people/families are tightening their wallets, they are most likely to cut back on splurging for high-end product's like Apple's. I think that's the main reason behind the downgrade- gloom over Apple's current position.

Check out the history from the early 2000s and see how Apple came out of that crash....
post #54 of 88
The question isn't if Apple has good long-term prospects, it is who has the best prospects. As for cash, Apple has slightly less on hand than Cisco... who will fare better over the next 12 months?

Sadly, it is reasonable to expect AAPL to have another year of negligible growth in share price-- unless there is a major driver for growth introduced. People still underestimate the iPhone's strength, but there is more and more competition in that market now. What will Apple do to get another leg up? What will Apple do to respond to areas of their product mix that will see a decline?

It isn't a case of "the end of the world is nigh," but people want safety right now.
post #55 of 88
Quote:
Originally Posted by iReality85 View Post

Recession = tightening of the wallet = bad for Apple. That's great that Apple has no debt, but speaking truthfully, a company that does not finance at least some degree of debt causes eyebrows to raise, and not in a good way. Debt is usually an indicator of growth, and one would expect that a company with Apple's profits would be financing debt. Also, the bad economy nabs Apple where it hurts- those who are looking to by computer electronics, and premium computers at that. If people/families are tightening their wallets, they are most likely to cut back on splurging for high-end product's like Apple's. I think that's the main reason behind the downgrade- gloom over Apple's current position.

Gloom is not data, nor is it logic. It's simply a feeling that the sky is falling. The financial world ought to be treated like the scientific world -- don't say anything unless you have data.

People will buy Apple, just like they'll buy anything else. Also, recall that Apple buyers tend to be higher-income individuals who may not be affected as much as the "average consumer" (whomever that is).
post #56 of 88
Quote:
Originally Posted by aaarrrgggh View Post

What will Apple do to get another leg up? What will Apple do to respond to areas of their product mix that will see a decline?

Just what they've done since the early 2000s ( or always) ..Innovate and excite and just stay on course.
post #57 of 88
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post

Apple is not going to introduce a radically new form factor or new line at this time. They will continue incremental product upgrades and add to iTunes services to minimize expenditures. There is no way a tablet will come out at this time. I guar-on-tee it.

I "feels" too early. I agree. They literally had too much to do. My gut says WWDC 2009 for the Mac touch demo + SDK.
Citing unnamed sources with limited but direct knowledge of a rumoured device - Comedy Insider (Feb 2014)
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Citing unnamed sources with limited but direct knowledge of a rumoured device - Comedy Insider (Feb 2014)
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post #58 of 88
Quote:
Originally Posted by Virgil-TB2 View Post

100% wrong as usual Spammy.

How dare you! Spam is a God around here.
Citing unnamed sources with limited but direct knowledge of a rumoured device - Comedy Insider (Feb 2014)
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Citing unnamed sources with limited but direct knowledge of a rumoured device - Comedy Insider (Feb 2014)
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post #59 of 88
Quote:
Originally Posted by minderbinder View Post

This headline is pretty misleading - they didn't say there wouldn't be new products, just no new product CATEGORIES. Big difference.

Expecting a new product category every MWSF is too much anyway. Apple can get plenty of excitement, controversy (overall buzz) with a product update.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post

No kidding. Anyone who calls this the Second Great Depression ("Sloppy Second Depression"?) hasn't a clue in the world.

It is definitely hyperbolic, though the recession is still a serious matter, nowhere near depression.

Quote:
Originally Posted by crees! View Post

Ditto. I choose not to participate and am going on with business as usual.

I agree, provided that your idea of "business as usual" doesn't involve deficit spending, I think that's where a lot of financial instability comes from.
post #60 of 88
(( News Item: Goldman Sachs analyst downgraded shares of Apple to Neutral from Buy for the first time since July 20, 2006. ))

What a complete joke. Downgrading a stock such as Apple to "neutral" is a complete cop out by Goldman Sachs. This venerable institution needs to institutionalize some of its so called analysts who need some serious analysis themselves. Apple is doing extremely well across all their market segments and are so well placed when the consumer market rebounds in late 2009 that they make Microsoft, Dell and HP look like basket cases. When an investment analyst glosses over the truly incredible sales activities that a company such as Apple can deliver during a down market and only accentuate the negative...well let's just say I suspect that someone has a vested interest in "shorting" Apple stock. Let's hope that everyone well see through this brazenly thin justification for a smack down of Apple's stock.
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post #61 of 88
Quote:
Originally Posted by NeverInDoubt View Post

And I'd hardly call the Macbook Air a "major new product" either, in terms of sales potential, and Apple did just fine in 2008. I think the biggest risk for Apple in the short term is simply the bad economy which is going to hurt them, it's just a matter of how much.

I don't know what charts you're looking at but Apple has a 52 week high of 202.96 and it closed today at 94.75. I would call that "just fine" and neither do the stock holders.
post #62 of 88
Quote:
Originally Posted by cuppingmaster View Post

Gloom is not data, nor is it logic. It's simply a feeling that the sky is falling. The financial world ought to be treated like the scientific world -- don't say anything unless you have data.

Well what exactly do you think Wallstreet is then? Just because gloom (human sentiment) is not scientific data does not make it any less relevant to market conditions. Wallstreet is nothing more than buying and selling based on future prospects. These prospects are indeed generated through "data," but how do you think this data arises? It is a collective reflection of the feelings and emotions of countless buyers and sellers. Wallstreet is at times calm, and at times erratic, which just so happens to coincide with the human psyche very well. I ask, why is it that AAPL is a relatively volatile stock? What actions by Apple have warranted AAPL's degree of volatility? My bet is that it has more to do with the fickle, buy-and-sell-on-a-whim nature of AAPL owners (like the ones who dump 30% of their stock at the mere mention of Jobs catching the flu, or who increase their stake by 30% because he IS giving that keynote address at Macworld). The financial world is anything but scientific, because humans, who create such things as "economics," are anything but predictable.
post #63 of 88
Quote:
Originally Posted by bertyao View Post

i thought steve jobs say you have to innovate during recession. i assume that means release new products?? or do you innovate now and then wait for economy to improve then release it.

I think you innovate ways to bring down costs, and improve your lineup. I just don't think you launch new, world-changing products during a downturn. If they don't sell well at first, anything innovative will be declared a failure before it has a chance to prove itself.
post #64 of 88
I for one hope we at least see an iLife '09 upgrade.
post #65 of 88
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaine_Michael View Post

I for one hope we at least see an iLife '09 upgrade.

What specifically are you missing that needs upgrading?
post #66 of 88
Quote:
Originally Posted by iReality85 View Post

Well what exactly do you think Wallstreet is then? Just because gloom (human sentiment) is not scientific data does not make it any less relevant to market conditions. Wallstreet is nothing more than buying and selling based on future prospects. These prospects are indeed generated through "data," but how do you think this data arises? It is a collective reflection of the feelings and emotions of countless buyers and sellers. Wallstreet is at times calm, and at times erratic, which just so happens to coincide with the human psyche very well. I ask, why is it that AAPL is a relatively volatile stock? What actions by Apple have warranted AAPL's degree of volatility? My bet is that it has more to do with the fickle, buy-and-sell-on-a-whim nature of AAPL owners (like the ones who dump 30% of their stock at the mere mention of Jobs catching the flu, or who increase their stake by 30% because he IS giving that keynote address at Macworld). The financial world is anything but scientific, because humans, who create such things as "economics," are anything but predictable.

Sure, market conditions can be based on whimsy, smoke, and mirrors. But then why analyze anything? Imagine a CEO saying he/she "had a feeling" about a product that was tanking and wouldn't pull it. He'd be ousted by the board. The investors may indeed lick their finger and stick it into the sky, but the analysts ought not do the same. They're supposed to be advising investors based on REAL data to temper the investors from doing the above, not egg them on.
post #67 of 88
Quote:
Originally Posted by bertyao View Post

i thought steve jobs say you have to innovate during recession. i assume that means release new products?? or do you innovate now and then wait for economy to improve then release it.

I feel, the tough times are *when* you bring your A game. All that R&D and skunkworks stuff, time to polish it and set it loose on the world.

I personally feel this downgrade is GS wanting to influence the share price downwards.

My prediction, is that Apple won't go for something as "radical" as the tablet yet during this time.

However, they've got two angles.

The first, which is more likely, is the netbook. This is the space in-between the iPhone 3G and the MacBook Air. There is a gap here in which a product can be introduced that is:

1. Unlikely to cannibalize product sales of Apple offerings which are more or less expensive
2. Delivering a product which has potential for sales growth particularly during recession
3. Leveraging popularity of iPhone 3G while spreading the risk of new product introduction


Hence, I believe there will be an Apple "netbook" of some sort. Because, as above:

1. The netbook sits comfortably between the iPhone 3G and the MacBook Air. It complements and enhances the Apple ecosystem.

2. There is evidence that consumers are interested in this space, and simply want a portable computing device that is cheaper than a 13" laptop. There is evidence that this trend can carry people/market/Apple through the haze and poor sentiment during the recession, at least a bridge for 6 months into the tablet/ other kickass stuff in the later part of 2009.

3. The netbook can be sold not through Apple Mac channels but through iPhone 3G channels. Having 3G broadband built in, there is a good opportunity of AT&T, for example, partnering even more with Apple by delivering a "subsidised" Apple netbook with built-in 3G access. This model can be extended throughout the world, thus balancing the effects of recession in different countries. This netbook can be rolled out progressively like the iPhone 3G to various countries.

The second, is, of course, the xMac (desktop upgradeable Mac). Which I think is very unlikely.


My other views are as follows:

A. Apple itself invests a significant amount of money into Macworld. To not introduce a significant product would be a big waste of time, money, organisation, and especially, a big waste of important media attention.

B. The January-April time frame is usually, relatively, the lowest period of sales after the successful holiday season. Apple would need a good stimulus, an injection of fresh confidence, if you will.

C. A new Apple netbook, refreshes to the iMac (Nvidia chipset), and possibly announcement of a 30" LED cinema display, AppleTV update, would be a strong kickstart to surviving a tough year.

D. Consolidation is an option, and there will be cost cutting, but the very nature of the Apple business means that for at least January to April, there needs to be some "boost" in the Apple ecosystem, then as the state of the global economy becomes more clear, in April they can start to look at product refreshes, new iPhone 3G model, preparation for the tablet.

E. This will probably be one of Steve's last great accomplishments before he steps down in a few years. Spearheading and growing an endeavour far beyond anyone's expectations, through, in recent history, two major US recessions.
post #68 of 88
Quote:
Originally Posted by iReality85 View Post

Recession = tightening of the wallet = bad for Apple. That's great that Apple has no debt, but speaking truthfully, a company that does not finance at least some degree of debt causes eyebrows to raise, and not in a good way. Debt is usually an indicator of growth, and one would expect that a company with Apple's profits would be financing debt. Also, the bad economy nabs Apple where it hurts- those who are looking to by computer electronics, and premium computers at that. If people/families are tightening their wallets, they are most likely to cut back on splurging for high-end product's like Apple's. I think that's the main reason behind the downgrade- gloom over Apple's current position.

The most important thing for Apple in 2009 is to push the value angle as much as possible. A lot of people argue that Apple has a "high-end, luxury" aspect. This is alright, because, from a global perspective, Apple is a coveted, well-regarded brand.

The upper class (and super-rich, but let's just talk about the upper class) around the world will continue to purchase and use Apple products simply out of the necessity to maintain status during this time. Imagine if you were an upper-class socialite or businessperson. You show up one day with a cheap Nokia, Dell, when you used to have a decent Mac and iPhone, and your social and business status will take a big dive.

Now, the "value" aspect. This is the next key element. Lets say I am a student, consumer, worker or family considering my "IT needs" in 2009. Of course, I have a tighter view of my budget and am trying to reduce spending.

Let's say in 2009, I need to get a laptop. It's a given. I have no choice. Sure, I can go for Dells that are "half the price", but this is where specs, and the price myth come into play.

Anyone that is really in a financial jam, should be looking seriously at Macs. Seriously. Because you need value, support, ability to continue to both earn an income and relax when needed to maintain your overall mental health. We know Apple is going to cut its gross profit margins in 2009, so Apple's offerings in terms of value of software, specifications, design and ease-of-use, can still capture the imagination and deliver on what the global middle-class needs.

Just go ahead and price out a Dell 13" laptop. Once you include Windows, software, graphics, well, the MacBook comes up pretty strong from a price perspective. That and most PC laptops, their screens are really not that bright. I don't know how many PC laptops really use LED backlighting.

Ah, and the coup de grace... How many netbooks have LED backlighting?

Oh, lastly, the environmental angle. For a segment of the market, these are the people that will say, something is f*ked up in the world today. The environment, and this financial mess. Isn't it time I took a step now to make a difference? Isn't it time, instead of having so many lattes each day, I use that cash to get a Macbook instead of a Dell, and start to feel different, be more productive, be more fulfilled, and be more reassured that there is no mercury, and aluminium and glass are realistically very recyclable.
post #69 of 88
One more thing... Apple needs to continue its global push.

It remains my firm belief that the failure of the US auto industry is due to its naive, inward thinking. It caters and depends way, way too much on the domestic economy.

If there were more US cars in Europe, Asia, at least a fraction of the popularity of the Mercedes, BMW and Audi, I think the US auto industry would not be as totally screwed as it is now. I've said it many times, think for a moment about how many GM SUVs, Mustangs or Cadillac CTS' you see in any country outside the US and you will be really shocked. Now think about how many Audis, BMWs and Toyotas you see outside of Europe and Japan. Notice the difference?

Apple's message, products and innovative nature are inherently attractive on a global scale.

There are many, many markets many Americans would scoff at, that, if marketed to efficiently, can offer a strong "buffer" for Apple during the tough times because the recession does not affect major and minor economies in all the same way.

Even in Europe, many users and Apple resellers would argue that the UK and Europe is atrociously neglected by Apple HQ. What about Asia then?

Apple can, and now more so than ever, needs to successfully enrich its global efforts.
post #70 of 88
Quote:
Originally Posted by nvidia2008 View Post


The upper class (and super-rich, but let's just talk about the upper class) around the world will continue to purchase and use Apple products simply out of the necessity to maintain status during this time. Imagine if you were an upper-class socialite or businessperson. You show up one day with a cheap Nokia, Dell, when you used to have a decent Mac and iPhone, and your social and business status will take a big dive.

Do you really think it's about class???
post #71 of 88
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ireland View Post

How dare you! Spam is a God around here.

I am?

Proud AAPL stock owner.

 

GOA

 

Get the lowdown on the coming collapse:  http://www.cbo.gov/publication/45010

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Proud AAPL stock owner.

 

GOA

 

Get the lowdown on the coming collapse:  http://www.cbo.gov/publication/45010

Reply
post #72 of 88
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacOldTimer View Post

I don't know what charts you're looking at but Apple has a 52 week high of 202.96 and it closed today at 94.75. I would call that "just fine" and neither do the stock holders.

In the context of a worldwide recession, they're not doing too bad. One to two years is the generally agreed upon time frame for reasonable recovery for the world's economies right now... to be clear, I don't think Apple will hit 200 again for a long, long time.

Proud AAPL stock owner.

 

GOA

 

Get the lowdown on the coming collapse:  http://www.cbo.gov/publication/45010

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Proud AAPL stock owner.

 

GOA

 

Get the lowdown on the coming collapse:  http://www.cbo.gov/publication/45010

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post #73 of 88
Quote:
Originally Posted by dshel View Post

The Goldman Saks and Morgan Stanley downgrades came when Apple Stock was demonstrating some good strength. GS and MS are protecting their positions and those of related Hedgefunds on December Option Contracts. Their Analyst's opinions are based on self interest for their companies, and not on any intention to provide good information on Apple performance for regular investors. Apple is the most manipulated stock on the market! Where is the SEC?

You meen the same SEC that is investigating on Madoff's broker company since 1992 and wasn't able to digg up any wrongdoing?
I think all these reports of analysts have to be treated the same way as statistics: Don't trust any statistic until you faked it yourself!
post #74 of 88
Quote:
Originally Posted by breeze View Post

Do you really think it's about class???

I guess when I talk about the "upper class" and "status" this is more relevant in Asia, Middle East, Africa and South America. It should be noted that these markets are increasingly significant sources of revenue and profit for Apple.
post #75 of 88
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post

I am?

Ireland's just in love with you.
post #76 of 88
Quote:
Originally Posted by wizard69 View Post

I'm no fan of GS but lets face it folks Apple is way over priced and sooner or later investors will realize that. Especially investors with balls as there are a lot of true bargains out there for people to sink money into. I just don't see an appreciation in Apples value in the short term, that no matter what sort of product the deliver. There simply are better opportunities for those that still have investment cash to put into the morass that is wall street.

As to mac World it is likely something is coming. Obviously I don't know what, but I wouldn't be surprised to see a Mini replacement. In Apples case it is the product that they most need to have in salable condition if the economy does in fact get worst. The iMacs are likely not far behind but i think Apple has something special planned there.

The real question is just how bad is the economy. Personally I don't think it is that bad, all we have really seen is a collapse in the overheated housing market. This collapse was something that was going to happen sooner or later as to many markets where selling on speculation and speculation always leads to a market stress. If the economy was truly in depression then why is the bagel shop crammed pack every morning? Surely such is a luxury that people can and would cut back on if money was a problem.

Frankly the mentality of the recession seems to be driven by the same fools that are whining about global warming. In the same manner these people are fueling fear about the future to assure their political success. The biggest problem with either global warming or the recession crowd is that there are so many Americans so easily duped into believing that the favored mindset has the only handle on the issues. Sort of like the people that look at Apple as an invincible investment. It is just not rational to expect people to pour money into Apples stock when so many sweet options are cropping up. That by the way that isn't a negative against Apple just that the market is profoundly different than it was only a few months ago.


Dave

Apple's current market cap represents a 5% annual rate of return. In today's economy, with the low interest rate, that would be fine even for a non-growth company. Apple does show steady growth, so I wouldn't say it's overpriced.

Of course, if profits are to shrink, then they could be overpriced.
post #77 of 88
Quote:
Originally Posted by andyapple View Post

GS downgrading Apple? Pot calling the kettle black.

Agreed.

A junk status brokerage firm telling us how to view one of the most solid companies in the World on stability.

Classic.
post #78 of 88
Quote:
Originally Posted by mdriftmeyer View Post

Agreed.

A junk status brokerage firm telling us how to view one of the most solid companies in the World on stability.

Classic.

What's even more amazing is how much sway their word still carries... with (junk) investors.
post #79 of 88
Goldman Sachs just lost two billion for the quarter.
Hey, this Kool-Aid is delicious, what do you put in it?!
Reply
Hey, this Kool-Aid is delicious, what do you put in it?!
Reply
post #80 of 88
Quote:
Originally Posted by andyapple View Post

Goldman Sachs just lost two billion for the quarter.

They'll make it up on the idiots that sell on their downgrade after they buy the dip and watch Apple announce good earnings.
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