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Apple absent from universal phone charger push - Page 2

post #41 of 116
I hope Apple will adopt micro-USB for charging iPhones and iPods.
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post #42 of 116
Apple is not at all in the same situation as other mobile handset makers. The 30 pin dock connector is ubiquitous across all Apple's handheld devices, including 3rd party devices.

Other handset makers use entirely different connectors and voltage across different lines of their own phones. Its a complete quandary with them. I don't see the need to pull Apple into the need to clean up their mess. Apple has settled on an elegant solution that its used for years now.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mcarling View Post

I hope Apple will adopt micro-USB for charging iPhones and iPods.
post #43 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by hillstones View Post

The article forgot to mention that the universal charging method would be Micro-USB.

I'm not sure which article you read...

Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider

The GSMA and 17 mobile operators plan to develop a universal charging solution that would appear by January 1, 2012. Micro-USB will be the common charging interface.
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post #44 of 116
Apple will be on to wireless chargers by 2012.
post #45 of 116
The problem with micro-usb is that it is a new "standard" after mini-usb, and more importantly it is a single voltage solution. While 5VDC works well for a lot of things, it would be nice to have something closer to firewire where a higher voltage can be requested.
post #46 of 116
While we are standardizing on our charging interfaces, why not standardize on how we plug in to our power grid at the same time?

3-prong plugs are bulky and ugly and a pain in the butt to wire. If I were king, I'd start there. Then I'd let Apple design a really cool MagSafe style of universal connector for electronics.

The goals would be:

Easy insertion without even looking at the device
As close to zero friction as possible
As small as possible to perform all the functions needed yet fit on small devices
Durable & Efficient

Like USB, there may need to be a few iterations of the standard to fit special case or fulfill unusual requirements.

I've played with the MagSafe adapter and it's so cool and easy and functional that I can't believe someone isn't looking into this for other applications like the iPod. Plugging the 30-pin into an iPod touch is a little tricky. No margin for error. And it's even worse if you have a protective case for your touch.
post #47 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by jinx101 View Post

The only other beef I have is having to have my iPod Touch tethered to iTunes (which, can barely handle the load of music I have.. while every other program I use runs peppy, iTunes crawls at a snails pace). It would be much easier if you could dock, and then just copy music to it like a drive (like most other MP3 players). That, would be simplistic. Not having to use a bloated mandatory software package.

I've used iTunes on slow computers without issue. The problem with just copying files over is that it's harder to put automatic smarts into that. With iTunes, I have it set up such that each time I plug the device in, all the tracks that were played get swapped out for new ones.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bugsnw View Post

While we are standardizing on our charging interfaces, why not standardize on how we plug in to our power grid at the same time?

3-prong plugs are bulky and ugly and a pain in the butt to wire. If I were king, I'd start there.

Making them less bulky isn't going to make it any easier for the electrician to wire. It's not even that hard, it's a one-time five minute install and it's usually good for several decades. The prongs are spaced that far apart for good reason.
post #48 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by mcarling View Post

I hope Apple will adopt micro-USB for charging iPhones and iPods.

Extremely doubtful- it would cut into their own charger sales.
post #49 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by TenoBell View Post

Apple is not at all in the same situation as other mobile handset makers. The 30 pin dock connector is ubiquitous across all Apple's handheld devices, including 3rd party devices.

Other handset makers use entirely different connectors and voltage across different lines of their own phones. Its a complete quandary with them. I don't see the need to pull Apple into the need to clean up their mess. Apple has settled on an elegant solution that its used for years now.

Apple wil change it sooner than you think to an even different configuration just to make us buy new connectors/cable. It's already happened to the iPod and Macbooks like how many times now?
post #50 of 116
Has everyone seen the size of the Palm Pre wireless charger? It's not something I'd like to carry around on a regular basis.
post #51 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by Boer View Post

European Union is expected to make compatibility with a standard charger mandatory in few years. This makes perfect sense for customers, makers and the environment. This is also notably something a free market could never achieve.

Yes and everyone in the world shall now speak only French just so we can all communicate with each other more clearly.

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post #52 of 116
We have a couple Nokia phones in the house and we use one universal (Nokia) charger for them all.
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post #53 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by GT500Shlby View Post

It's funny to see Motorola there. They were usually the worst offenders, even with micro-usb if you plugged a non-Motorola charger into the plug it would complain with a message and not charge, yet the Motorola charger would work in the other phone. Both were same voltage and amperage.

omg i thot i was the only one experiencing that! grr i hate how motorola has done that.
post #54 of 116
i suppose if you are into conspiracy you can look at it this way. It can also be asked, are connectors never supposed to change?

The iPod changed from the original firewire port to the dock connector. The dock connector may not have been feasible until 2003. Yes its likely with the introduction of USB 3 that the dock connector will have some changes.

The notebook power connection has only changed once in the past 10 years. Is it supposed to remain the same and not change with newer technology?

Quote:
Originally Posted by teckstud View Post

Apple wil change it sooner than you think to an even different configuration just to make us buy new connectors/cable. It's already happened to the iPod and Macbooks like how many times now?
post #55 of 116
There are lots of options for chargers outside of Apple. Apple doesn't own USB charging, and they license out the male dock connection.

Quote:
Originally Posted by teckstud View Post

Extremely doubtful- it would cut into their own charger sales.
post #56 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by teckstud View Post

Apple wil change it sooner than you think to an even different configuration just to make us buy new connectors/cable. It's already happened to the iPod and Macbooks like how many times now?

Apple have changed the 30 pin connector on the iPod ?? when did that happen?
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post #57 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by chabig View Post

I agree! Why let software handle the hard work. I want my next iPod/iPhone to have front panel switches and lights so I can manually set the bits in memory.

sarcasm is the highest form of intellect, and your post is the reason there is spit on my screen.

FUNNY!
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post #58 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone View Post

Yes and everyone in the world shall now speak only French just so we can all communicate with each other more clearly.

England is part of the European union, what language do you speak? is it English?

there is irony somewhere in there, but i doubt if you see it
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post #59 of 116
The original iPod in 2001 did not use the 30 pin dock connector. But that's like complaining that a PowerBook in 1998 did not have FireWire. It wasn't available yet.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Walter Slocombe View Post

Apple have changed the 30 pin connector on the iPod ?? when did that happen?
post #60 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by JeffDM View Post

Making them less bulky isn't going to make it any easier for the electrician to wire. It's not even that hard, it's a one-time five minute install and it's usually good for several decades. The prongs are spaced that far apart for good reason.

You literally have to think outside the box on this one. Wiring is not even close to elegant or efficient.

Take apart an outlet in your kitchen and look at the mash of wires back there. It's cumbersome, clumsy, inelegant and likely a safety hazard. There is much room for improvement.

I know it won't be done any time soon, but these are the things I ponder all the time.
post #61 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by bugsnw View Post

You literally have to think outside the box on this one. Wiring is not even close to elegant or efficient.

Take apart an outlet in your kitchen and look at the mash of wires back there. It's cumbersome, clumsy, inelegant and likely a safety hazard. There is much room for improvement.

I know it won't be done any time soon, but these are the things I ponder all the time.

So, you're actually thinking inside the box, not the face plate.

I've done some wiring. Have you seen the new outlet fixtures? They're not even that new, they've been around for a few years, insert straight, stripped wire, tighten screw. They're really quick, clean and easy. Installers can do it sloppily too, but there's not much good trying to escape that with better design. The old ones really were a pain where they expected you to make a loop out of the wire and screw the loop on.

I think part of your problem is the electrical code, you have to have the wiring stapled within a certain distance of the electrical box, and that's for safety so the weight of the wire doesn't work itself out. That doesn't leave much room for flexing so you can have enough cable to wire the outlet.

I suppose it could be done differently where you wire to a special box with special connectors, and the outlets are on a plate that snap-in. That's going to cost more though, and it seems pretty silly as extra wire in the box really isn't unsafe and almost nobody goes back into those boxes often after it's installed.
post #62 of 116
Yes, the Dock-connector devices by Apple need an extra cable. But only this, one extra cable, not an additional charger. I often travel without a charger, I just take my Dock-connector2USB cable with me. A USB port can be found in a lot of places.

EU regulations are partly meant to allow the (re)use of chargers in order not end up with lots of chargers whose phone has died and cannot be used anymore. Partly is a harmonisation that should enhance competition.
post #63 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by clymans View Post

It was firewire on BOTH ends. It came with a cable with standard firewire ports on both ends and an adapter to attach to a mini-firewire port on a computer.

First generation iPod firewire connector only. I had one.
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post #64 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by Boer View Post

European Union is expected to make compatibility with a standard charger mandatory in few years. This makes perfect sense for customers, makers and the environment. This is also notably something a free market could never achieve.

I once saw a t-shirt with the EU emblem and the words:

"The new Europe: Reminding you why your ancestors left the old Europe."

When the unelected body governing your sovereign nation is drafting legislation regarding mobile phone chargers, it's time to rethink a few things.
post #65 of 116
I think the point the article was trying to make that all you fanboys glossed over is the fact that the iphone will not be your last phone... you will upgrade... when you do, if you go to something other than another iphone, you need to buy a new charger, and a new car charger, and then if you go to another phone after that, repeat the process.. what happens to all those old chargers? Me, I have a drawer full of them in my kitchen. I should take them to a recycling center, but I keep them around in case a friend comes over and needs a charge to their phone, chances are I probably have a connector for them...

why keep throwing out perfectly good chargers every few years when we get new phones.

If Apple were to adopt this policy and move to micro usb like many other phone manufacturers already have done, it would be great for the consumer. Of course I doubt they ever will, but please, just think about how ridiculous you sound defending a proprietary connector just because it's apple. Think about how great it would be, stuck in an airport with no way to charge your phone, just plug it into a dock in a kiosk and grab a few minutes of charge.. if every cell phone used the same connector that could be reality. Cell chargers built into cars... it would be a great situation, but Apple refusing to cooperate stops this from being a reality, or at least stops all of us iphone owners from being able to take advantage of these possibilities.

think of it this way. Let's say Apple created a new technology to charge music players, and every other manufacturer of music players adopted this technology, except microsoft because they think their Zune charger is better... think of the commotion all the fan boys would be making because Microsoft refuses to play nice.... doesn't make much sense does it?
post #66 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by Virgil-TB2 View Post

The more I think about this I don't think it's a good idea. Specifically in a fast moving industry like computer design, to force everyone to use the same connector when the decision on what connector that is has to be made by a giant slow-moving bureaucracy seems destined for problems. Why should a company have to compromise on good design and make a product bulkier and perhaps even less energy efficient merely to comply with a rule?

Designing around standards is what engineers do. Taking your argument a small step further, why should 120V wall-sockets be standardized? Doesn't that prevent GE from innovating with its toasters and microwaves? Sure, but it also means that you can buy a GE toaster, or a Kenmore toaster, or a Panasonic toaster and be confident that they'll all plug into the same outlet. Or for that matter you can buy a microwave instead. Still plugs into the same outlet.

Consumers benefit because they can buy an outlet at Home Depot for about $1.00, and not worry about whether it is compatible with their toaster. Companies benefit because they don't have to design special charging circuitry to work with their low-volume device. But you can bet that if a dominant company were given the option to produce a non-standardized plug, they would. Why? They'd come up with all kinds of reasons about protecting their ability to innovate, blah blah blah. The real reason is that by using a proprietary plug they lock consumers into their products.

Apple's expensive docks serve two purposes. First, they bring in huge profits. Second, they provide a barrier to entry for competitors. Someone who has hundreds of dollars invested in iPod/iPhone docks and cables is that much less likely to want to switch to Nokia or Sony. Apple doesn't want to give up that advantage. It's all about marketing and profits, and nothing about innovation.

Not that I have a problem with marketing and profits, but all things equal, I'd prefer to buy from companies that help save me some money. At this point, to mix a few metaphors, Apple seems like the 800 pound gorilla that wants to extract every penny out of the plebs as possible.
post #67 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by clymans View Post

No, they didn't. They started using a firewire connection. I have an original 10GB iPod that doesn't have a dock connector on it. It was the first model that was marketed as being PC compatible out of the box. I don't know my Apple history that well, but I believe the dock connector was introduced shortly after Apple decided to sell PC compatible iPods because most PCs/laptops at the time didn't have firewire. I bought a SB Live! or some such card with a firewire port on it specifically for this purpose.

Without the move to USB compatible cables, I don't think the iPod would be the massive success it is today. I don't think most consumers would go buy a card just to hook up an iPod like I did.

Just goes to show that sometimes Apple does bend to the market and not the other way around. If they thought firewire was such a bang up idea, they could have made the dock connector go to a firewire port instead of USB.

You are right, the first two generations of iPods had a firewire connector on them, the 30-pin didn't come around until the 3rd generation, which was the first iPod I bought, a 30GB unit. Even that cable terminated to a firewire connection on the opposite (computer) end. I had to buy a Soundblaster Live for the firewire connector also.

I remember I bought a 4th generation iPod Photo for my then girlfriend (now wife) and the cable terminated in to a USB connector and the power brick was different.

I can't see Apple getting away from the 30-pin connector anytime soon. Car manufactures are starting to offer iPod kits. You know you have something hot when you can get them to adapt to your technology.
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post #68 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by NeilM View Post

Why? The iPhone's is easily the smallest and most convenient AC charger available in the industry. The body of it is roughly a 1" cube and it's universal 100-240V.

As far as I know, Nokia have got the smallest AC charger available. It may not available on all the markets due to different AC power plugs - but in Europe it's widely available.

See it yourself on Nokia's site...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Virgil-TB2 View Post

For companies like Apple that combine charging and syncing in one port, this is a net loss design wise and actually makes the product less desirable, less efficient etc.

Nokia have had no problems with combining charing & syncing in one port. They have even used a microUSB connector in some of their models, e.g. Nokia 8800 Carbon Arte.

And like someone pointed out, this "universal phone charger push" is all about a universal connector for the charger, not a universal method (i.e. USB) for charging. I'm sure EU will force all the manufacturers to use a universal charger if they don't do it themselves first.
post #69 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by igxqrrl View Post

Apple's expensive docks serve two purposes. First, they bring in huge profits. Second, they provide a barrier to entry for competitors. Someone who has hundreds of dollars invested in iPod/iPhone docks and cables is that much less likely to want to switch to Nokia or Sony. Apple doesn't want to give up that advantage. It's all about marketing and profits, and nothing about innovation.

since when are ipod cables so expensive? First, you get one "free" with every ipod / iphone you buy (two ipods and two iphones later, i personally can find a number of perfectly functioning and compatible cables laying around my house). Secondly, you can choose from any number of suppliers who offer cables if you don't want to buy an official apple-branded cable. I was looking for a car charger for my first iPhone and on eBay I found a set of three cables- one wall charger, one car charger, and one USB ipod cable. I literally paid $3 plus shipping and they worked great. The "expensive" argument simply doesn't hold ANY water. Nobody ever feels locked into a phone because of the cables required.

Also, to remark on the general discussion - as mentioned already, the 30-pin technology does much more than simply charge the device. It allows for A/V transfers, remote control information if in a dock, etc. Apple is not against standards - remember they invented firewire then gave it away for free to anyone who wanted to license it?? Forgot about that. A micro-usb port on the Iphone just wouldn't make sense at this point, so, big surprise - Apple isn't joining this EU effort.
post #70 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by GTL215 View Post

Apple is not against standards - remember they invented firewire then gave it away for free to anyone who wanted to license it?? Forgot about that.

Nope, you're just forgetting about the multi-year gap between 'invented' and 'gave away', during which they did charge license fees, initially quite high. It was only when USB2 started to seriously eat FireWire's lunch, that they woke up and dropped the fees. Too late, I might add.

They've been much better recently, but the FW situation wasn't all doves and roses.
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post #71 of 116
You have to step back a bit and look at the whole picture.

When Apple invented the 30 pin dock connector there was no standard device connector. All of the other PDA and phone manufacturers were either using proprietary connectors or various different types of connectors that were not even interoperable between their own devices.

Apple invented its own proprietary connector during a time when it was common to have proprietary connectors and has stuck with it for 7 years. The 30 pin dock connector was so well designed that its used for purposes and devices that Apple had not thought of when they originally made the connector. Apple has licensed the 30 pin dock connector to many 3rd party manufacturers and its used in hundreds of devices.

So now other handheld device manufacturers are tired of their confusion of connectors and are ready to establish one standard. Which I agree is a good idea. Apple has set up a ecosystem based on its own connector that works, why should Apple change what works, simply because the other manufacturers were not forward thinking enough to have done the same years ago?



Quote:
Originally Posted by igxqrrl View Post

.
Apple's expensive docks serve two purposes. First, they bring in huge profits. Second, they provide a barrier to entry for competitors. Someone who has hundreds of dollars invested in iPod/iPhone docks and cables is that much less likely to want to switch to Nokia or Sony. Apple doesn't want to give up that advantage. It's all about marketing and profits, and nothing about innovation.

Not that I have a problem with marketing and profits, but all things equal, I'd prefer to buy from companies that help save me some money. At this point, to mix a few metaphors, Apple seems like the 800 pound gorilla that wants to extract every penny out of the plebs as possible.
post #72 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by jinx101 View Post

I don't know why people are defending Apple's use of proprietary, expensive chords and converters. I don't care if other companies do it also, it's bad for consumers (yes, you). Why should you have to lug your laptop around with you (if you have one) just to be able to charge the iPod out of the box? It should at least come with a USB adapter to electrical outlet adapter (but, they want to sell it seperately).

Whoever said it's a way for Apple to nickle and dime their customers is correct. Just because other comanies do the same thing doesn't make it right (like having to buy a $45 chord to get pictures off of your phone...e.g. Verizon).

The only other beef I have is having to have my iPod Touch tethered to iTunes (which, can barely handle the load of music I have.. while every other program I use runs peppy, iTunes crawls at a snails pace). It would be much easier if you could dock, and then just copy music to it like a drive (like most other MP3 players). That, would be simplistic. Not having to use a bloated mandatory software package.

An iPhone cord can be had for as little as $2.
When I got my Griffin Powerjolt for $19.95, it came with ONE car charger, with a USB type A port, and two cables - one for a BB and one for the iPhone.

Personally, I would rather everyone move to standard USB A type chargers, and supply a cord - JUST like Apple has. All the other solutions (a wall charger to Mini/micro USB) would entail you carrying a charger and a separate sync cable.

As per your bitchin' about iTUnes and the way it syncs - some people really like that their music is NOT transferred by dragging and dropping, and actually nicely uses tags. Bitchin' about that is a topic for another article, not one about chargers.
post #73 of 116
Government should not be involved in forcing electronics standards, they should let the market work it out.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ThreeFirstDots View Post

And like someone pointed out, this "universal phone charger push" is all about a universal connector for the charger, not a universal method (i.e. USB) for charging. I'm sure EU will force all the manufacturers to use a universal charger if they don't do it themselves first.
post #74 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by GTL215 View Post

Also, to remark on the general discussion - as mentioned already, the 30-pin technology does much more than simply charge the device. It allows for A/V transfers, remote control information if in a dock, etc. Apple is not against standards - remember they invented firewire then gave it away for free to anyone who wanted to license it?? Forgot about that. A micro-usb port on the Iphone just wouldn't make sense at this point, so, big surprise - Apple isn't joining this EU effort.

What about this... A cord with a standard USB connector (at the charger end) and 2 microUSB connectors (at the phone end). The same idea Apple used with the new LED Cinema Display.

To charge, use one microUSB connector. To charge & sync, use both microUSB connectors.

Both microUSB are identical and the phone (and the computer/charger) automatically recognice which mode to use (charge/sync).

One could even charge 2 different phones with a single cord.

(iPhone would have 2 microUSB connectors.)
post #75 of 116
[QUOTE=Kickaha;1377900]Nope, you're just forgetting about the multi-year gap between 'invented' and 'gave away', during which they did charge license fees, initially quite high.
QUOTE]

Fair enough. That being said, it's because other manufacturers were in such a race to the bottom of the market they refused to pay a measly $0.25 per end-user device for a better technology. If there were enough other quality-oriented companies like Apple around making computers, the Firewire story may have turned out differently (note the number of higher-end devices which do in fact use firewire, like certain external HDs and digital video cameras).
post #76 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by ThreeFirstDots View Post


(iPhone would have 2 microUSB connectors.)

that's why it won't happen
post #77 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by ThreeFirstDots View Post

As far as I know, Nokia have got the smallest AC charger available. It may not available on all the markets due to different AC power plugs - but in Europe it's widely available.

See it yourself on Nokia's site...

Apple's trumps it, and you need not carry an additional sync cable - you just disconnect it from the charger...


Quote:
Originally Posted by ThreeFirstDots View Post

Nokia have had no problems with combining charing & syncing in one port. They have even used a microUSB connector in some of their models, e.g. Nokia 8800 Carbon Arte.

Well then, they should do what Apple does and not supply two cables, one permanently attached to the charger, and one needed to sync. Apple actually is the company that gets it right here...
post #78 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by chadisawesome View Post

I think the point the article was trying to make that all you fanboys glossed over is the fact that the iphone will not be your last phone... you will upgrade... when you do, if you go to something other than another iphone, you need to buy a new charger, and a new car charger, and then if you go to another phone after that, repeat the process.. what happens to all those old chargers?

Use it with by wife's iPod and my iPod touch and maybe my iPhone without contract as an iPod? The fact is I use my wife's iPod wall wart all the time at home and my iPhone wall wart at work.

Quote:
If Apple were to adopt this policy and move to micro usb like many other phone manufacturers already have done, it would be great for the consumer.

No, it wouldn't because then we'd have two cables to deal with between iPod and iPhone. Apple's 30 pin dock interface is a de facto standard given the market dominance of the iPod.

Quote:
Of course I doubt they ever will, but please, just think about how ridiculous you sound defending a proprietary connector just because it's apple. Think about how great it would be, stuck in an airport with no way to charge your phone, just plug it into a dock in a kiosk and grab a few minutes of charge.. if every cell phone used the same connector that could be reality.

I can do that today as long as I'm flying Southwest that provides nice USB ports for recharging. The only real issue I had was with some of the USB car adapters I have that don't have D+/D- lines implemented for power negotiation.

So I had to get one of these:

http://www.iogear.com/product/GMPT047AI/

A shame but power negotiation is part of the USB spec. I guess that the little adapter forces 100mA draw to be on the safe side since without knowing you don't know if you can go 100ma, 500ma, 1A or up to 1.8A from a dedicated charger.

Quote:
Cell chargers built into cars... it would be a great situation, but Apple refusing to cooperate stops this from being a reality, or at least stops all of us iphone owners from being able to take advantage of these possibilities.

Standard USB port. Use your normal dock cable that magically attaches to USB.

Yes, a standard dock is better but it would be better to be standardized to iPods rather than some phone spec because more folks use iPods for MP3 play in cars than phones.

So the 30 pin dock IS the standard, with the only problem with the firewire pins issue and the 3G.

Quote:
think of it this way. Let's say Apple created a new technology to charge music players, and every other manufacturer of music players adopted this technology, except microsoft because they think their Zune charger is better... think of the commotion all the fan boys would be making because Microsoft refuses to play nice.... doesn't make much sense does it?

Actually I like the Pre charger and it would fail any EU rule to standardize on one charging interface. Which would lock the industry into one aging wired standard when you could be completely wire free.

Induction to charge, BT, 3g and wireless for accessories, audio and data. Video streams would still probably require a dock though.
post #79 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by Virgil-TB2 View Post

The way the article talks about energy savings is a bit weird also. Changing the type of plug to mini USB shouldn't have any effect on energy savings. It almost sounds like what they are really doing is changing the "brick" part to a smaller, more energy efficient USB connected thing, (like Apple has been doing for years and years). At least that's the only way I could see any energy savings, but I am hardly an expert in such matters.

In the future, put that disclaimer at the beginning of your post, so we don't have to waste our time reading more of your bullshit.
post #80 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by ThreeFirstDots View Post

As far as I know, Nokia have got the smallest AC charger available. It may not available on all the markets due to different AC power plugs - but in Europe it's widely available.

See it yourself on Nokia's site...

Except that Apple's isn't much bigger and provides a far more useful USB connector which does take up the difference in space. I'd MUCH rather have the apple one since I can use that to charge any USB device.

Quote:
And like someone pointed out, this "universal phone charger push" is all about a universal connector for the charger, not a universal method (i.e. USB) for charging. I'm sure EU will force all the manufacturers to use a universal charger if they don't do it themselves first.

Mmmm...if the micro USB port is on the charger this is fine. If the EU specifies that the phone much have a micro USB port that would be stupid. The language seems iffy...
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AppleInsider › Forums › Mobile › iPhone › Apple absent from universal phone charger push