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Apple releases public beta of Safari 4 browser - Page 3

post #81 of 278
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zandros View Post

I'm not going to complain about Cover flow but pictures aren't searchable, and I'm rather curious how it's going to be useful for thousands of history items.

It's meant to be used in conjunction with the search box and/or the list view. It provides visual feedback for sites with cryptic URLs like for example this forum thread.

Quote:
Does anyone have an example how the Tabs on Top is a better UI than the old tabs?

The only thing that comes to my mind is that it takes up less space. But like I said, it opens up a can of problems when you want to drag the window... mjtomlin would like to believe that I'm complaining for the sake of complaining but I've already been screwed twice by the "tab ripping" problem that I spoke of earlier.
post #82 of 278
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zandros View Post

Window menu as usual.

Code:

defaults write com.apple.Safari DebugSafari4TabBarIsOnTop -bool NO

Oh, it was hidden on install, thanks
post #83 of 278
Apple has adopted the tab-in-menu-bar layout of Google's Chrome, but did they adopt the most important aspect of Chrome, the sandboxed processes of each tab?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Virgil-TB2 View Post

Not true. Opera passed the Acid 3 test about half a day *after* Safari. I know it's picky, but it happens to be true.

There were also two other issues with Opera passing. One was that it was only in an internal build,not a public one when it claimed to have passed. The second was that there was discovered an error with Hickson's test that pushed Opera back to 99/100. WebKit was the first to get real 100/100 with perfect pixel matching.
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post #84 of 278
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zandros View Post

Window menu as usual.

I'm happy again, I've found the cure for my ailments. No more complaints from me.

Code:

defaults write com.apple.Safari DebugSafari4TabBarIsOnTop -bool NO

Ah...I guess that explains why the "Hide Tab Bar" option is still in the View menu. Still...why is it there is there's no way to opt out of this madness without resorting to the CLI?
post #85 of 278
Google should have patented their tab UI concept to let Apple have a taste of their own patent trolling medicine.
post #86 of 278
I definitely feels a lot faster. Just tried it on the website of the University I work for and the JS elements load much faster than they did in Safari 3. The site normally loads so slowly that you can watch the Javascript stuff drawing itself. Now everything just pops up.
post #87 of 278
Quote:
Originally Posted by kim kap sol View Post

It's meant to be used in conjunction with the search box and/or the list view. It provides visual feedback for sites with cryptic URLs like for example this forum thread.

I think it'd be neat if you really could search for UI elements. For example, you don't quite remember what the page was called, but you do know it had a black and blue banner, so you simply search for "black and blue banner" (semantics aside) and Safari checks the predominant colours in the top 10% of the page. Or perhaps, if you want to find the AI forums, you could search for "Gray forum". Since thread layout is pretty similar for all forum software, it shouldn't be too hard.
post #88 of 278
Quote:
Originally Posted by bokuwaomar View Post

Lastly, the native Windows UI is much appreciated. OS X's UI is nice, but it sticks out like a sore thumb on other systems. I hope iTunes follows suit.

I hope the opposite, in fact I feel so strongly against this move, not only did I just write a feedback concerning this tweak, but also reinstalled safari 3 on my windows machine for its far more visually pleasing appearance. (A lot of animations are been abandoned by Safari 4 beta for windows, which is ludicrous also, now it's just a mediocre WebKit browser for windows with a mediocre interface, but without plug-ins. Well done, Apple)

[Windows XP's Luna is so outdated it looks ridiculous to say at least, especially the default bright blue theme; and Aero's window bezel tend to drive me crazy, not to mention the unnecessary transparent title bar (combined with Safari's new tabs position, seriously take the word messed-up to a new level ). BTW Win7 manage to make things worse somehow.]

OS X's marble on the other hand is a very good looking, un-intrusive UI kit, I would prefer more of these or the likings come to the windows world, screw the native UI of windows!!!

If implement of Core Animation behavior is too costly resource wise, then use the native WPF api, I'm pretty sure WPF is powerful enough, and a lot of windows-only apps use their own UIs anyway (some of them are from MS! See the Zune software! And it's a decent attempt.)
post #89 of 278
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zandros View Post

I think it'd be neat if you really could search for UI elements. For example, you don't quite remember what the page was called, but you do know it had a black and blue banner, so you simply search for "black and blue banner" (semantics aside) and Safari checks the predominant colours in the top 10% of the page. Or perhaps, if you want to find the AI forums, you could search for "Gray forum". Since thread layout is pretty similar for all forum software, it shouldn't be too hard.

Or how about "extra large boobs on a one eyed midget dressed in cammy's". Darn I know that site was around here somewhere.
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post #90 of 278
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zandros View Post

I think it'd be neat if you really could search for UI elements. For example, you don't quite remember what the page was called, but you do know it had a black and blue banner, so you simply search for "black and blue banner" (semantics aside) and Safari checks the predominant colours in the top 10% of the page. Or perhaps, if you want to find the AI forums, you could search for "Gray forum". Since thread layout is pretty similar for all forum software, it shouldn't be too hard.

Yeah, that would actually be useful. There are definitely algorithms that do just that. Delicious Library 2 can search books and DVDs by predominant colors.
post #91 of 278
Safari's been dropping my "saved" passwords ever since I got Parallels 4.

Does anyone else have this problem, and more importantly did installing this beta fix the problem?
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post #92 of 278
Quote:
Originally Posted by abilstein View Post

In case you aren't aware, Foxmarks is available for Safari now.

Outstanding! I played with the beta last year and couldn't get it to work right for me in Safari. I will give that a try.
post #93 of 278
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lorre View Post

I'm glad I gain about 15 pixels of webpage screen real estate on my MacBook. Other than that, I prefer the old way, but the new way doesn't really bother me either.

You'll be even gladder on a 9" netbook running 1024x600.

There's a reason that folks are playing with alternative UI arrangements on the desktop. The constant growth to ever increasing resolution took a huge leap backwards in 2008-2009 with the netbook market.

But okay, it's only JUST a bad idea and folks should summarily dismiss it out of hand...
post #94 of 278
I had to uninstall it from my Windows computer at work. Because apparently Apple decided to copy another UI element from Microsoft, the extraordinarily annoying, reoccuring popup window.

Let me clarify my machine does not have flash on it because it conflicts with one of our programs. So, now every time I navigate to a web page that has flash on it Safari pops up a window asking if I want to install the missing plugin. I hit cancel and move on. Of course, it does this on nearly three quarters of the pages that I visit and every single time that I navigate back to my home page. (For comparison Firefox simply places a relatively unobtrusive notification bar at the top of the page, a little annoying, but it doesn't interfere with my reading or require me to do anything with it.)

This was a bit annoying, but bearable. So after informing Apple of this "bug" in their design I continued to use Safari. Until, I went to the Scientific American site. This site has a nice rotating news section in one of its sidebars. One of those screens includes a flash element. So, I navigated to the site and did my usual click on the popup stating AGAIN that no I didn't want to install the missing plugin. Unfortunately, every time the news section cycled through, about every half a minute, to the pane with the flash the popup reappeared right over the text that I was trying to read. So, I notified Apple of this increasingly annoying "bug" in their UI, and naviagated back to my homepage.

This is when the real fun began. Even after navigating away from the SciAm site Safari would automatically move back to the SciAm site and popup asking if I wanted to install Flash. I would click no and it would then automatically navigate back to my homepage.

Needless to say I notified Apple of this and promptly declared this beta of Safari unusable for anybody not wanting to install a plugin that is fairly common on the internet. What amazes me is that this actually managed to get this far. Didn't anyone at Apple actually test this program in a pure state or did they just assume that every person wants to install every plugin automatically? I just found this to be a glaring oversight from a company that in general makes very well crafted UI decisions.

Oh, and I absolutely loved the top pages and cover flow history. Although, it was far from intuitive for me to access my top pages. Another UI oversight in my opinion. Especially for something that could be so useful.
post #95 of 278
Perhaps the greatest thing about the top site UI is how it tells you which page has been updated.
post #96 of 278
Quote:
Originally Posted by irchs View Post

Has the inline address bar progress indicator stopped working for anyone else? I get a little spinny indicator on the right, but the blue progress bar doesn't show at all...

It does not show up for me either but it is still in the features list.
Time to fill out a bug report I guess
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post #97 of 278
On XP, how do I force Safari to open all links in a new Tab rather than a new window?
post #98 of 278
Quote:
Originally Posted by Erunno View Post

Google should have patented their tab UI concept to let Apple have a taste of their own patent trolling medicine.

That's hilarious - and moronic.
post #99 of 278
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zandros View Post

I think it'd be neat if you really could search for UI elements. For example, you don't quite remember what the page was called, but you do know it had a black and blue banner, so you simply search for "black and blue banner" (semantics aside) and Safari checks the predominant colours in the top 10% of the page. Or perhaps, if you want to find the AI forums, you could search for "Gray forum". Since thread layout is pretty similar for all forum software, it shouldn't be too hard.

That is an excellent idea. Several years away from being a reality, and I think we would see Google implement something first that uses the power of their servers to more fuzzy search items, but a great idea nonetheless.

Quote:
Originally Posted by wirc View Post

Safari's been dropping my "saved" passwords ever since I got Parallels 4.

Does anyone else have this problem, and more importantly did installing this beta fix the problem?

Off the top of my head it sounds like your permissions are messed up, thus you are not being able to save to new passwords or perhaps even access them. Have you tried using Disk Utility to repair them?

Quote:
Originally Posted by vinea View Post

You'll be even gladder on a 9" netbook running 1024x600.

There's a reason that folks are playing with alternative UI arrangements on the desktop. The constant growth to ever increasing resolution took a huge leap backwards in 2008-2009 with the netbook market.

But okay, it's only JUST a bad idea and folks should summarily dismiss it out of hand...

I'm using a netbook with that resolution. Besides my favorite aspects of Opera and Chrome being integrated into Safari, and this being the first major browser release (yes I know it's still a Beta) that gets 100% on Acid3, the additional browser window real estate is quite welcome.

Now, if only they would make the Downloads window that snokey, transparent overlay or an inspector window, and have and option for it to go away when the DL is complete I would be very happy.
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post #100 of 278
Did anybody try to install it on leopard 10.5.5?
Here it refuses saying that it requires 10.5.4 or higher =)


No big deal, about time to apply the .6 update, but just curious...
post #101 of 278
It's faster than Safari 3 for me at least. I like the quick page building now.

What annoys me is that when you have the a page open and take a look at the Top Sites with the help of the icon in the bookmark bar, you can only go back by going back (arrow or Cmd + <). Then it has to rebuild the page again. Which is fast of course.
Not even ESC helped, or pressing the icon again.
post #102 of 278
What's not to like about Safari 4?

Work great.

Hey, anyone else think it's snappier too?
post #103 of 278
Quote:
Originally Posted by tpf1952 View Post

What's not to like about Safari 4?

Work great.

Hey, anyone else think it's snappier too?

Definitely snappier for me too and I like getting more vertical space back. I've got eons of horizontal space (well 24" to be exact) so compressing vertically makes sense to me functionally even if the UI looks a bit strange at first blush.
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post #104 of 278
Top Sites is, so far, a great new feature and I like the cover flow browser history as well. Speed is definitely improved!
post #105 of 278
1) coverflow history doesn't show 'thumbnail' of SSL sites... just grey page with lock icon. If you use a lot of ssl pages, it makes the feature pretty ugly/useless.
2) ok, I know I'm just blind, but where is the 'home' icon anywhere on the page?
3) don't understand the griping about the tabs in the title bar. Seems like a better use of lost space, and dragging works fine, even with tons of tabs open.
4) can't find a way to import my Firefox favorites... if I could do that, I'd probably switch now.

Any change in in interface, no matter how trivial, takes a bit to get used to. The question always becomes, can I devote a day to just get used to it?
I can't get my wife to switch from Thunderbird to Mail because she doesn't see the learningCurve/benefits ratio as being worth if. Others of us just switch to keep things interesting.
post #106 of 278
The "Top Sites" display on first launch with an iMac G5 2.1 GHz with 2.5 GB of RAM is PAINFULLY SLOW. I can't imagine how painful it would be on a G3 or G4. Will have to turn off that feature. I don't need to see 12 webpages at one time.
post #107 of 278
Quote:
Originally Posted by hillstones View Post

The "Top Sites" display on first launch with an iMac G5 2.1 GHz with 2.5 GB of RAM is PAINFULLY SLOW. I can't imagine how painful it would be on a G3 or G4. Will have to turn off that feature. I don't need to see 12 webpages at one time.

Just guessing but probly has more to do with your weak graphics card
post #108 of 278
Quote:
Originally Posted by kim kap sol View Post

Wow...Apple has really gone out of its way to fuck up all HI guidelines with Safari 4.

In you want to move a Safari window and you like tabs, good luck clicking part of the titlebar that isn't a "rip a tab out" grab-handle widget or a close widget.

Although the concept is interesting, in practice, this tab UI is horrendous.

Everything else about Safari 4 is excellent though...nice use of Cover Flow and Core Animation for the top sites preview wall. Great history and bookmark search. And full page zoom is finally enabled for the unwashed masses. Google search suggestions. Overall, this version of Safari is the biggest update since version 1.0...too bad about the unconventional tab UI.


What are you talking about - click and hold the mouse and move. It's not gonna close the tab if you hold the button pressed.
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post #109 of 278
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zandros View Post

Agreed. Even more awful is that I have to hit the ribbed part to reorder the tabs

What where they thinking?

Remember folks, people like you and I "Beta Test" most applications - BEFORE they get to this stage. So it would seems folks like you and me, are to blame when issues are what they are.

Yes I know that sometimes we make suggestions, and they don't get into the current version, but none the less, we the beta testers provide the feedback for companies, so they may or may not change or fixed things. They WILL NOT make all of us happy. Most decisions are based on the number of comments, good or bad, and from there it's anyone guess what happens.

I haven't downloaded this application yet, but it's safe to say they have a button or link for "Feedback" - let them know what you think, what you like, what you dislike, it's the only way things will change.

Skip
post #110 of 278
Quote:
Originally Posted by Virgil-TB2 View Post

For the record, Safari AdBlock still works perfectly and since that's the only plug-in I use I'm a happy camper.

Thanks! I was about to ask about that before going through the whole installation rigmarole. Heading for the download now. FAB, Virgil.

Wait, on second thought, anyone know if it breaks 1Password?
post #111 of 278
Quote:
Originally Posted by ncee View Post

Remember folks, people like you and I "Beta Test" most applications - BEFORE they get to this stage. So it would seems folks like you and me, are to blame when issues are what they are.

Yes I know that sometimes we make suggestions, and they don't get into the current version, but none the less, we the beta testers provide the feedback for companies, so they may or may not change or fixed things. They WILL NOT make all of us happy. Most decisions are based on the number of comments, good or bad, and from there it's anyone guess what happens.

I haven't downloaded this application yet, but it's safe to say they have a button or link for "Feedback" - let them know what you think, what you like, what you dislike, it's the only way things will change. Skip

"Bug" at the top right side.

Love the tabs at the top

Now they are more like my filing cabinet. Easier to read and faster, particularly if use Tabs a lot, which I do. And more room for the content. As Apple states, "In its new efficient and compact design, Safari integrates tabs at the top of your browser window, giving you more room to enjoy your favorite sites."

Now that I have been running it for a couple of hours, I just went and clicked Cover Flow: wow.
post #112 of 278
Quote:
Originally Posted by bbwi View Post

Just guessing but probly has more to do with your weak graphics card

No, it is more like trying to load 12 different web pages at one time. No matter how fast your connection may be, or your graphics card may be, internet traffic will slow that process down.
post #113 of 278
Quote:
Originally Posted by kim kap sol View Post

Wow...Apple has really gone out of its way to fuck up all HI guidelines with Safari 4.

In you want to move a Safari window and you like tabs, good luck clicking part of the titlebar that isn't a "rip a tab out" grab-handle widget or a close widget.

Although the concept is interesting, in practice, this tab UI is horrendous.

Everything else about Safari 4 is excellent though...nice use of Cover Flow and Core Animation for the top sites preview wall. Great history and bookmark search. And full page zoom is finally enabled for the unwashed masses. Google search suggestions. Overall, this version of Safari is the biggest update since version 1.0...too bad about the unconventional tab UI.

I have no problem moving the window. Stop being a drama queen!
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post #114 of 278
Quote:
Originally Posted by hillstones View Post

No, it is more like trying to load 12 different web pages at one time. No matter how fast your connection may be, or your graphics card may be, internet traffic will slow that process down.

It doesn't load all the pages when you click on top sites. It loads the page you select
post #115 of 278
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kolchak View Post

Thanks! I was about to ask about that before going through the whole installation rigmarole. Heading for the download now. FAB, Virgil.

Wait, on second thought, anyone know if it breaks 1Password?

From Daring Fireball...
Joe Messina tweets:

Safari 4 looks effing amazing but breaks 1Password. Fail.

Assuming hes right and 1Password indeed doesnt (yet) work in Safari 4, lets just get things straight. 1Passwords Safari integration is an input manager hack. There are no supported plugin APIs to enable what 1Password does. Apple cant break something they never supported in the first place.
post #116 of 278
I love it!
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post #117 of 278
Quote:
Originally Posted by Abster2core View Post

Unbelievably fast!

Make sure your computer meets the specs:

Macintosh Requirements
  • Any Mac running Security Update 2009-001 and Mac OS X Leopard 10.5.6 or Mac OS X Tiger 10.4.11
  • Mac with an Intel processor or a Power PC G5, G4, or G3 processor and built-in FireWire┬«
  • 256MB of RAM
  • Top Sites and Cover Flow on Mac OS X Tiger require a Quartz-Extreme compatible video card.

Click More details while you are on the page (http://www.apple.com/safari/download/)

And it wouldn't be a bad idea to review the 150 Features (http://www.apple.com/safari/features.html) before asking dumb questions or making stupid assumptions.

Interesting that Apple mentioned "built-in Firewire" since there is no FW included on the new MB. I don't think FW is required for Safari... but who does use FW for Safari? I think PR need to be more careful what to say. :P
post #118 of 278
Quote:
Originally Posted by dr_lha View Post

Gmail works fine for me in Safari 4.

Gmail works on my PC running Safari 4, but it does not work on my Mac.
post #119 of 278
Quote:
Originally Posted by supremedesigner View Post

Interesting that Apple mentioned "built-in Firewire" since there is no FW included on the new MB. I don't think FW is required for Safari... but who does use FW for Safari? I think PR need to be more careful what to say. :P

'Clipboard Inheritance' error.
post #120 of 278
I thought i would give it another try but to no avail.

I reset my disk permissions thinking that, that was the problem, reset Safari 3 before i did the install of Safari 4 and BOOM! Unexpected Error message and i never get to see the Safari window.

If anybody can give me an explanation as to why this is happening to me, i would greatly appreciate it. I've deleted the .plist in hoping it would fix it but i got nothing.
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