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Availability of Apple's high-end iMac starting to fade - Page 2

post #41 of 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marvin View Post

If they ship it with SL, then they have to ship it with the others too. As I say, this ties in with the whole Nvidia overhaul. Laptop owners have had their updates for a few months now so having to buy SL shouldn't be a huge issue. If Apple release the hardware in March and expect people to pay for SL in June then it's not so good.

I really hope that Apple don't hold out until the end of March for the press event though. They just need to demo the hardware with SL and say it will be shipping in a week or two. I guess they will want to make the statement of 'shipping today' but at this stage, I don't think it's important.

While SL is pretty stable right now and performance scores on my Mac are higher with SL than with Leopard, I think there is still a lot of work to be done on the back end. Besides GC and OpenCL, there are still some major components that Apple probably wants to make 64-bit and a few visually appealing aspects to the UI that Apple will probably want to include before gold Gold Master. I'm figuring a Demo at an upcoming Mac desktop Special Event (though I thought it would be demoed at MWSF), which will lead the way to SL workshops at WWDC and then a release in Aug/Sept.
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post #42 of 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by hiimamac View Post

I wonder if there will be new price points from Apple?

I think the Mini can easily hit the same price point it's at now. It would be nice to see a drop to $499 but I don't think it needs to go there. 2GHz C2D, 2GB Ram, 9400M, 120-160GB HDD (7200rpm option), DVDRW, $599 is a reasonable deal IMO.

I know it's still integrated graphics but 9400M is over 10 times faster than the current generation Mini.

If they use the desktop Core 2 Quad chips, they will slice about $500 off the cost of the current iMacs. If they use Nvidia integrated on the lowest end model (the desktop 9400 not the 9400M), they will be able to save money over using the ATI dedicated card. These savings can be used to bring in 24" LED models across the whole lineup.

The extra space in the 24" model should allow them to put in more advanced cooling and would most certainly wipe out any PC AIO comparisons. It would also look competitive with the quad PC towers. Not only this but having a common inventory means the same panels are used in all the iMacs and the 24" LED Cinema display.

The price of the 24" LED displays is quite high though so if they did this, it could well mean a price increase. If adding a 20" LED backlit screen isn't too much trouble, they will probably just do that instead.

The Mac Pro could drop a little or at least add more Ram. It should have 4GB on every model as standard and I expect this in the refresh. If the iMacs go quad, there's a possibility Apple will hit the same price points but go 8-core in all models.

I really don't expect the desktops to change in pricing dramatically. The laptops only did due to the unibody manufacturing, which isn't needed in any of the desktop models.
post #43 of 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

Apple is one of the companies that can weather this economic storm without seeing much loss. For starters, they have plenty of capital so making drastic decisions are required.

They are also a higher-end company which don't seem to be hurting much overall. The companies that sell the cheaper items to consumers that are more frugal and less likely to be financially set are more likely to suffer as their volume sales will no longer sustain them and they may have lower prices even more to move product. There is probably a name for this, but I surely don't know it.

Apple also has to worry how a price reduction will affect the perceived value of their product and bottom line over the long term. Once you lower a price it's get harder to raise it.

How long will this economic situation last? If you go to an Apple Store you'd think that things were peachy. What percentage of Apple's potential consumer base will not buy an Apple product because of the situation? They did record sales for the last Holiday quarter while many had record lows. This next quarter will probably be lower than the year's previous, but we are now toward the end of the Mac desktop line and pushing to the end of the iPhone. I imagine that the next quarters after this one will be higher than the year previous.

Remember, marketshare is pointless if you aren't making as much money, overall, for your efforts to get the marketshare. There just aren't many companies that can see this through as is and come out on top. The only other company in my portfolio that will probably best Apple in growth this quarter is McDonalds, for obvious reasons.

PS: I fully expect Snow Leopard to cost $129. Many are going to complain if it cost anything.

Apple is far from immune to the current state of affairs. one of their their biggest non-corporate/educational demographics are college students, these are students that used to work part time, which are less likely to now, if you cant work, you cant buy shiny new apple products.

dont pretend that apple is an upscale brand similar to something like Ferrari, Prada, or Azimut. those mentioned are the type of company that have little worry about, because the people buying their products may not make as much money as a few years ago, but they are still god damn f***ing rich.

the people that buy apples are not necessarily rich. Your as likely to see an iPod in a Trailer park as you are in first class on a tripple 7. as for their computers? they are in large part purchased by the trendy setting "hipster" crowd, those people arnt known for being rich either.

finally, you have to think about how much they already cost compared to a true competitor. they are often OVER $1000 more than their competitors. thats not so much that it makes them in any way "exclusive", but it is so much that people will be less likely to buy them. this is what they need to work on, either make a small tower, or make the iMac thicker as to allow room to add less expensive more powerful components. on top of that they need to shrink the "apple tax".

im looking at getting a new iMac, i want to have a decent computer, that is also movable, i'd like to be able take it from Mass. to Alaska no problem. this will require an all in one, saddly apples is underpowered and more expensive than the competition, im not saying they should charge the price of a dell, but if they want to keep growing (as they obviously do) then they need to get the price down to some point where its maybe... $250 more than a comparative dell, people will find the high quality to be worth the extra cost... as it stands its about $600 more than an all-in-one with pretty much the same specs.

also, all all-in-ones are in trouble, they need to rethink the design, towers are getting smaller, prettier, and less of a hassle to move around, and they are far more powerful for the price.

for instance:



http://reviews.cnet.com/desktops/hp-...CarouselArea.4
post #44 of 53
Quote:

If THAT is your idea of a "prettier" small tower, then you really need to quit considering an Apple computer anyway!
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post #45 of 53
prettier and smaller than this:
http://www.bmtnet.com/instore/hp_desktop_dc5000.jpg

its all relative really.

but in all honesty, this is far better looking than the Mini...
http://fikriadnan.files.wordpress.co...ell-bamboo.jpg

and the laptop line has this to worry about, which looks very good:
http://blog.gadgetlite.com/wp-conten...-laptop-08.jpg


i still agree that apple has the cleanest best styled line-up, but thats not going to last forever. (although seriously, PC companies took far too long to get to even the point they are today, who didnt see this coming when the first iMac was introduced?)
post #46 of 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by KingOfSomewhereHot View Post

If THAT is your idea of a "prettier" small tower, then you really need to quit considering an Apple computer anyway!

I think it looks quite nice. Maybe not the pattern on the side but the rest looks ok. Part of the appeal is being able to access the internals. Look at the access to the hard drive in the video taking just seconds vs taking the iMac display panel out.

It's a bit pricey but it's cheaper than the 3.06GHz iMac and it has 2 graphics cards as well as a Core 2 Quad and Blu-Ray. Although the iMac comes with a 24" display, you may not want a 24" display, you might want 2 matching 20" displays.

I agree that Dell's small PC looks better than the Mini and has a much better footprint. I always worry about knocking vertical machines over though and damaging the hard drive. What would be nice in a vertical design is being able to swivel the machine round on its base so you can access the ports more easily. The current Mini power cable would probably come out though.

The Dell Adamo, I don't like. It looks like the old black Macbook with a bit sticking out the back:

http://www.engadget.com/2009/01/09/dell-adamo-hands-on/

I don't think the laptop end has anything to worry about with the unibody design.
post #47 of 53
yeah, i agree that the Adamo might quite not be *there* i do think some people will look at it and say it looks better than a macbook. which means they are at least very close. (for instance one thing i like is the font for the keyboard, it just looks better than the font normally used, its those little things that make me think that dell is paying attention)

considering that the macbook just got its refresh, i think it just goes to show you that the rest of the market is in fact catching up. this does not mean that dells are suddenly going to be better looking, but it does show that they *Can* be better looking and when that happens Apple starts to lose one of its biggest leads when compared to other companies... design.

will there be a point where dells/hp's/gateways/sony's are well built as apples? maybe, but if apple wants to make sure that doesnt happen, then they need to renew focus, i mean hasnt it been 2 years since there was a design*refresh* on the iMac? and even then it was mostly going from plastic to metal... people will often sacrifice a few Benjamin's to get a computer that they actually think looks good... but 6 of them? thats a harder sell.

i like apple (maybe not love it like a lot of people) so i want to see them keep this part of the market to themselves, i want them to have design that i always just a little better than everyone else, its one of the many things that makes the so called apple tax worth it. but they also need to continue making them better inside.

i know this post was all over the place, with the huge amount of money im looking to spend in a few months time, ive been looking all around, and i really want an iMac, but there are as many reasons not to get one than there is *too* get one... i just hope the refresh they give us is a HUGE one, one that might actually have a few pleasant surprises. maybe im vein, but i do care how the computer looks in my home office, even if its only me seeing it, so i hope that this update is one that effects the outside just as much as the inside. it might be time for apple to take a bit of a risk with the iMac, like they did by releasing it in the first place.
post #48 of 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by SmilinGoat View Post

but in all honesty, this is far better looking than the Mini...
http://fikriadnan.files.wordpress.co...ell-bamboo.jpg

If Apple really wanted to go eco-friendly, they'd cut the aluminum/plastic crap and go with the all bamboo casings.
post #49 of 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by pmjoe View Post

If Apple really wanted to go eco-friendly, they'd cut the aluminum/plastic crap and go with the all bamboo casings.

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post #50 of 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

Apple is one of the companies that can weather this economic storm without seeing much loss. For starters, they have plenty of capital so making drastic decisions are required.

They are also a higher-end company which don't seem to be hurting much overall. The companies that sell the cheaper items to consumers that are more frugal and less likely to be financially set are more likely to suffer as their volume sales will no longer sustain them and they may have lower prices even more to move product. There is probably a name for this, but I surely don't know it.

Apple also has to worry how a price reduction will affect the perceived value of their product and bottom line over the long term. Once you lower a price it's get harder to raise it.

How long will this economic situation last? If you go to an Apple Store you'd think that things were peachy. What percentage of Apple's potential consumer base will not buy an Apple product because of the situation? They did record sales for the last Holiday quarter while many had record lows. This next quarter will probably be lower than the year's previous, but we are now toward the end of the Mac desktop line and pushing to the end of the iPhone. I imagine that the next quarters after this one will be higher than the year previous.

Remember, marketshare is pointless if you aren't making as much money, overall, for your efforts to get the marketshare. There just aren't many companies that can see this through as is and come out on top. The only other company in my portfolio that will probably best Apple in growth this quarter is McDonalds, for obvious reasons.

PS: I fully expect Snow Leopard to cost $129. Many are going to complain if it cost anything.

True but remember, the iMac has gone down in price over the years.

Just a few years ago, the iMac was almost $2000 for the bottom of the line (the white iMac) and dropped in price when they went to Intel.
My thinking is, Apple really went for a push when they released Leopard, and did a lot of marketing (haven't seen any I"M A MAC commercials since MSFT started using children that said "I'm A Pc" and one thing Apple has never done is GO AFTER business with it's server software. Apple has always been known to shy away from pushing IT software.

You have to wonder with all the smart phones coming out (and much cheaper), millions of iPhone users coming up on their two (2) years, plus the looming Windows 7 software if Apple feels the need to make a push as I am sure they don't want to lose the marketshare they have. Remember, at least 2-3% of switchers had to be from the lack luster VISTA and Windows 7 doesn't carry the same stigma.

Either way, I think it's a good time for Apple consumers - just hope they start to focus on some PRO APPLICATIONS again. Have a friend that has seen the NEW FINAL CUT PRO - says its somewhat like iMovie 08, but still very deep. Two years in development.

Also good to see Pro Tools offer SURROUND now on their LE software, plus lots of midi so wondering if Apple will UPDATE LOGIC as well.

Time will tell.

I love Apple software, heck, I love MAC software - so much cool stuff.
post #51 of 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by hiimamac View Post

True but remember, the iMac has gone down in price over the years.

Just a few years ago, the iMac was almost $2000 for the bottom of the line (the white iMac) and dropped in price when they went to Intel.

I wouldn't be surprised if the iMac dropped its price, These new Intel CPUs designed for AIOS offer more performance at a lower cost. If Apple doesn't use LED backlit displays or offer major upgrades of other components, like RAM or HDD capacity, then a price lowering may happen. Not so much because of the economy, but because desktops in general are slowly getting less popular in favour of notebooks.
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post #52 of 53
I really think we are going to see a mac mini and imac update come the same day. Neither are going to be major. The top mini will slide down to the base, more or less, and then a new faster top end one. I know people want the mini to follow the regular Apple life cycle, but it's cheap, and they benefit from a long R&D cycle on a low yield unit, so I don't expect to see a massive re-design.

I am waiting on a Mac Mini too, so I hope we see both updated before the end of March.
post #53 of 53
I can definitely say inventory is constrained. I work at Best Buy and the three best buy stores in our city that carry apple products are basically out of all 3 models and there is none in the regional warehouse so I would expect updates soon.
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