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Would-be iPhone developers "pulling their hair out by the roots"

post #1 of 63
Thread Starter 
Apple's ability to process iPhone developer contracts is quickly turning into a minor crisis as what was once a smooth process is rapidly turning into a months-long backlog that threatens to keep new developers out of the App Store.

Previous reports that the earliest third-party iPhone app developers are facing expired contracts are also being joined by stories from those who have yet to have their very first contracts approved.

Where requests for an agreement once took as little as two days for Apple to handle in the early days of the iPhone SDK, coders speaking to AppleInsider and on the iPhone development boards are increasingly reporting delays in initial approval that have changed from days into months -- even for free apps, which require less paperwork than commercial software.

"Many developers are pulling their hair out by the roots," one such producer tells AppleInsider. "Our corporate contract, submitted around December of last year, has yet to be approved after more than two months. And this is merely for a free app!"

This and other sources also report that many messages to Apple are either given a stock response apologizing for the wait or else receive no answer at all.

It's quickly becoming clear that the long hold times and silence on the matter stem from unpreparedness on Apple's part for the popularity of the App Store and the pressure it creates to renew its relationships with developers. A call by Ars Technica's Erica Sadun to the Apple Developer Connection has not only revealed that the company knows there are "many developers" either without contracts or facing expiry but that there isn't even a system by which Apple can renew its existing deals.

When that system will be put into place isn't known, though the ADC representative promises that Apple will at least avoid a crisis that would see older apps gradually vanish from the store as existing agreements come to an end. Any software that has already been approved will, reportedly, remain on the store even after its associated contract runs out.

That's little comfort to first-time developers, who are increasingly being discouraged by a process that in many cases prevents them from getting their first real foothold in the App Store. Without clear signs that Apple is addressing the problem, companies and individuals alike are questioning whether they should continue to produce iPhone apps in the first place.

"It makes it really tough to continue development," one developer says.
post #2 of 63
... when they've set up such a Soviet system. Only one place to buy apps. Everything controlled by the Apple Kremlin.
post #3 of 63
I originally applied when Apple first announced it "in the early days of the iPhone SDK"... it took almost two months to be approved. I don't see any difference now. As with anything new, it's an inconsistent process full of wrinkles. It'll all get ironed out. I'm sure in another year or two, they won't have any problems with this process. Also, considering the number of developers that applied (and still applying), anyone who doesn't expect a delay is just kidding themselves.

Regardless of how any process or product is implemented, there's always going to be a certain percentage of people who have problems. There is no such thing as perfect and flawless for everyone.
Disclaimer: The things I say are merely my own personal opinion and may or may not be based on facts. At certain points in any discussion, sarcasm may ensue.
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Disclaimer: The things I say are merely my own personal opinion and may or may not be based on facts. At certain points in any discussion, sarcasm may ensue.
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post #4 of 63
Quote:
Originally Posted by jagu View Post

... when they've set up such a Soviet system. Only one place to buy apps. Everything controlled by the Apple Kremlin.

So they can outlaw things that suck, and also things that don't benefit me as a stockholder. I approve!
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post #5 of 63
Like Apple's iPhone cellular partner, AT&T, maybe Apple should consider a two year contract for app store developer contracts and their apps?! It would at least give a little breathing room before the whole cycle starts over.

It's only going to get worse for annual turnover when a year from now you have 50,000 - 75,000 apps in the store versus the 25,000 in there today. \

Ten years ago, we had Steve Jobs, Bob Hope and Johnny Cash.  Today we have no Jobs, no Hope and no Cash.

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Ten years ago, we had Steve Jobs, Bob Hope and Johnny Cash.  Today we have no Jobs, no Hope and no Cash.

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post #6 of 63
Quote:
Originally Posted by e1618978 View Post

So they can outlaw things that suck, and also things that don't benefit me as a stockholder. I approve!

This isn't about that. It's about Apple potentially destroying the developer mindshare it brilliantly created when it opened the app store. Being a first-mover is key, but if another platform becomes more attractive to developers, it will take over. Apple should be KISSING THE BUTT of every iPhone developer, and spend copious cash on making sure the approval process is quick and transparent. This is really foolish on Apple's part and makes me wonder if they are really as well managed as it has seemed over the past eight years.
post #7 of 63
Quote:
Originally Posted by Morky View Post

This is really foolish on Apple's part and makes me wonder if they are really as well managed as it has seemed over the past eight years.

I agree. My thought, though, is how much of this may have to do with AT&T? Avoiding problems with the iPhone is only half the issue. There's a network as well.
post #8 of 63
Hopefully this is a sign that Apple is getting on top of the CrapWare(tm) that currently plagues the AppStore.

This week it was reported that Apple has bested the Microsoft Mobile platform ecosphere with 25k apps available for the iPhone platform. It is such a shame that 23k of those apps are utter garbage!
post #9 of 63
This: "Apple's ability to process iPhone developer contracts"
would make a lot more sense if it read as:
"Apple's INability to process iPhone developer contracts"
post #10 of 63
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

Apple's ability to process iPhone developer contracts is quickly turning into a minor crisis as what was once a smooth process is rapidly turning into a months-long backlog that threatens to keep new developers out of the App Store.

Previous reports that the earliest third-party iPhone app developers are facing expired contracts are also being joined by stories from those who have yet to have their very first contracts approved.

Where requests for an agreement once took as little as two days for Apple to handle in the early days of the iPhone SDK, coders speaking to AppleInsider and on the iPhone development boards are increasingly reporting delays in initial approval that have changed from days into months -- even for free apps, which require less paperwork than commercial software.

"Many developers are pulling their hair out by the roots," one such producer tells AppleInsider. "Our corporate contract, submitted around December of last year, has yet to be approved after more than two months. And this is merely for a free app!"

This and other sources also report that many messages to Apple are either given a stock response apologizing for the wait or else receive no answer at all.

It's quickly becoming clear that the long hold times and silence on the matter stem from unpreparedness on Apple's part for the popularity of the App Store and the pressure it creates to renew its relationships with developers. A call by Ars Technica's Erica Sadun to the Apple Developer Connection has not only revealed that the company knows there are "many developers" either without contracts or facing expiry but that there isn't even a system by which Apple can renew its existing deals.

When that system will be put into place isn't known, though the ADC representative promises that Apple will at least avoid a crisis that would see older apps gradually vanish from the store as existing agreements come to an end. Any software that has already been approved will, reportedly, remain on the store even after its associated contract runs out.

That's little comfort to first-time developers, who are increasingly being discouraged by a process that in many cases prevents them from getting their first real foothold in the App Store. Without clear signs that Apple is addressing the problem, companies and individuals alike are questioning whether they should continue to produce iPhone apps in the first place.

"It makes it really tough to continue development," one developer says.

Typical bull shit.

Since Dec 1st over 15000 new apps. No body expected it. And with such numbers, it would seem evident that the system if anything is just being deluged.

So some, if any, have to wait awhile. So do the guys waiting in the unemployment line. And their priorities are much greater than getting an app up on the shelf.

Easy to yell fire isn't it when nobody even knows you are there. Put some real names up. Bet there isn't a handful if any.

It is just like the rampant shit that flew about Apple's closed NDA policy and how it prevented developers to communicate with each other. Ask O'Reilly how well their program turned out after the restrictions were lifted. http://arstechnica.com/old/content/2...developers.ars

Apple isn't going to take any app off because of they can't get the backlog up-to-date.

And if any body notices, all the crap hitting this rumor is coming from the same bunch of shit heads that defame anything Apple. Give me a break.
post #11 of 63
Quote:
Originally Posted by kresh View Post

Hopefully this is a sign that Apple is getting on top of the CrapWare(tm) that currently plagues the AppStore.

Hopefully it is NOT! Having Apple police app quality is not a win for consumers... it'll put off developers from even attempting to write iPhone software, it'll make the whole process take longer, and it removes any form of letting the market decide whether an app is worth it.

So what if there are hundreds of fart apps online? The only problem is finding the good stuff... so let's solve that, rather than treating the bad stuff as a problem in itself.

Amorya
post #12 of 63
That is why I am developing my first app on Android, not the iPhone. Though, I am not a stellar developer - so I am sure Apple won't be missing me!
post #13 of 63
Quote:
Originally Posted by mjtomlin View Post

As with anything new, it's an inconsistent process full of wrinkles.

Quote:
Also, considering the number of developers that applied (and still applying), anyone who doesn't expect a delay is just kidding themselves.

ditto both.


and I for one like having only one place to look for apps, having apps that won't use an installer that could screw my phone and/or void my warranty, having only one place to have to give my credit cards or even better I can go to an Apple store, pay cash and get a gift card and those random developers don't get my banking info. I mean I know that most of them are probably upstanding folks but all it takes is one bad seed and I'm screwed and possibly penniless.
post #14 of 63
Quote:
This and other sources also report that many messages to Apple are either given a stock response apologizing for the wait or else receive no answer at all.

No response? Sounds like developers who are going to add nothing but crap to the store. If you know what you're doing you CALL.
post #15 of 63
At any one point in time, Apple cares about 100-200 app developers (my guess), simply because 90% of their app revenue comes from a small fraction of their app developer community. It's a waste of their money to be diligent and fair in the treatment of all the developers interested in grabbing a piece of the pie. Rest assured that the most advantageous app developers (to Apple) are finding the way less bumpy.

Apple doesn't owe anyone fair treatment. Apple created the tremendous money generating machine. The laws of the land require Apple to create an arcane approval system in order to control their own empire. The same laws don't require Apple to justify it to anyone that complains.
post #16 of 63
Quote:
Originally Posted by mjtomlin View Post

... As with anything new, it's an inconsistent process full of wrinkles
... anyone who doesn't expect a delay is just kidding themselves.
... There is no such thing as perfect and flawless for everyone.

"It's new and nothing is perfect"

Quote:
Originally Posted by dasein View Post

I agree. My thought, though, is how much of this may have to do with AT&T? Avoiding problems with the iPhone is only half the issue. There's a network as well.

"Blame the partners"

Quote:
Originally Posted by Abster2core View Post

Typical bull shit.
... Easy to yell fire isn't it when nobody even knows you are there. Put some real names up. Bet there isn't a handful if any.
... And if any body notices, all the crap hitting this rumor is coming from the same bunch of shit heads that defame anything Apple. Give me a break.

"Blame biased developers"

Quote:
Originally Posted by crees! View Post

No response? Sounds like developers who are going to add nothing but crap to the store....

"Ridicule the developers"

Quote:
Originally Posted by fpink3 View Post

...Apple doesn't owe anyone fair treatment. Apple created the tremendous money generating machine. The laws of the land require Apple to create an arcane approval system in order to control their own empire. The same laws don't require Apple to justify it to anyone that complains.

"Apple is King -- Go **** yourself"

Wow, the apologists are out in force!

With a $20 billion pile of cash, and the App store being vital to the next 10 years of the success of Apple, there is no excuses for this nonsense. Beyond the long lag time in registering new developers, it is more ridiculous that they are having so many problems with old contracts expiring! They knew this day was coming from the beginning and should have had a system in place to make this painless.
post #17 of 63
Quote:
Originally Posted by e1618978 View Post

So they can outlaw things that suck, and also things that don't benefit me as a stockholder. I approve!

So you're the one who's been buying all the fart apps and flashlight apps?
post #18 of 63
Quote:
Originally Posted by jagu View Post

... when they've set up such a Soviet system. Only one place to buy apps. Everything controlled by the Apple Kremlin.

First post wasted on drivel.
post #19 of 63
We've been trying to establish an Enterprise developer agreement for a year. A year! Despite being a very well known consumer goods company, Apple's process is basically that they have no process. They have some objective rules and, if you don't meet them they simply reject the application. Any attempt to work with Apple to resolve the issue goes unanswered.
post #20 of 63
Quote:
Originally Posted by e1618978 View Post

So they can outlaw things that suck, and also things that don't benefit me as a stockholder. I approve!

I take it you have never used the app store: I would say about 80% of whats out there sucks, and I know some guys with great apps that it took months to get approved, even after paying their $99, I am talking about November sign ups and late February confirmations...

If my money as a dev isnt good enough for apple, then fuck them, I will move to the next thing.
You can't quantify how much I don't care -- Bob Kevoian of the Bob and Tom Show.
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You can't quantify how much I don't care -- Bob Kevoian of the Bob and Tom Show.
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post #21 of 63
It's perfectly understandable. Apple needs every minute they can to evaluate every fart app for correct pitch and timbre.

For the humor impaired, this is just a shallow joke, don't read too deeply into it.
post #22 of 63
Quote:
Originally Posted by foolinator View Post

That is why I am developing my first app on Android, not the iPhone. Though, I am not a stellar developer - so I am sure Apple won't be missing me!

I've got over 2.5GB of Apps installed on my iPhone and spend $20 or more a month on them, can you install applications for Android on the memory card yet?

I don't think I could handle being restricted to 256MB of phone memory.

You do the math, how many applications can an Android user install?

What happens when their memory is full?

I've got over 100 Apps, variety is the spice of life.
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post #23 of 63
You know what, F Apple and F the AppStore! The open source/jailbreak world has taken a pole and shoved it up Steve Jobs a** recently by releasing the Cydia Store. No more limits, no more Hitler restricting what you can or can't sell, this is a free market economy last I checked and Apple has become the industrial Titanic! I cant wait to watch it sink!
post #24 of 63
Obviously they didn't fire the dotMac/MobileMe exec - they merely put him in charge of the iPhone Apps. Come on Apple hire more people to take up the demand! You got one guy working on this in a basement with no windows or what? Hey Steve, Ballmer's laughing his ass off!
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2011 13" 2.3 MBP, 2006 15" 2.16 MBP, iPhone 4, iPod Shuffle, AEBS, AppleTV2 with XBMC.
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post #25 of 63
I find it funny how most people comment saying Apple should do this or that, while knowing quite well what Apple's view on most things is, "We do it our way, and to h*** with the rest of the universe." Also, I really don't get jail breakers, I mean, you obviously don't like how the iPhone works if you're going to the trouble of messing with it like that, so why buy one? I mean it's like taking a Mustang and then changing everything except the outer skin into a Dodge Challenger. Yeah, makes perfect sense...
post #26 of 63
Quote:
Originally Posted by shavex View Post

You know what, F Apple and F the AppStore! The open source/jailbreak world has taken a pole and shoved it up Steve Jobs a** recently by releasing the Cydia Store. No more limits, no more Hitler restricting what you can or can't sell, this is a free market economy last I checked and Apple has become the industrial Titanic! I cant wait to watch it sink!

Yeah, too bad WebKit isn't open source...

...oh hang on.

H8tr express has been delayed.

Do you think Apple should join the push to force people to use Adobe products?

By allowing Flash or Flash Lite.
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post #27 of 63
Quote:
Originally Posted by shavex View Post

You know what, F Apple and F the AppStore! The open source/jailbreak world has taken a pole and shoved it up Steve Jobs a** recently by releasing the Cydia Store. No more limits, no more Hitler restricting what you can or can't sell, this is a free market economy last I checked and Apple has become the industrial Titanic! I cant wait to watch it sink!

I don't want anything developed by you, that is for sure.

Go away and don't darken our doors again, what an idiot!
post #28 of 63
Quote:
Originally Posted by shavex View Post

You know what, F Apple and F the AppStore! The open source/jailbreak world has taken a pole and shoved it up Steve Jobs a** recently by releasing the Cydia Store. No more limits, no more Hitler restricting what you can or can't sell, this is a free market economy last I checked and Apple has become the industrial Titanic! I cant wait to watch it sink!

Dumbest comment in this thread.

You do realize that the kind of "freedom" you espouse is exactly what plagues Microsoft. No control over the user experience = shitty user experience.

And as for the economy, it's looking very much like Apple would be the LAST to "sink."

You can go crawl back under your bridge now. Better yet, go grab yourself a Windows Mobile product. I'm quite sure Apple doesn't need you, LOL. Users like you end up causing more harm than good.

And that Cydia Store's day's are probably numbered . . .
post #29 of 63
Quote:
Originally Posted by EVWeb View Post

I find it funny how most people comment saying Apple should do this or that, while knowing quite well what Apple's view on most things is, "We do it our way, and to h*** with the rest of the universe."

And that view has been working out beautifully so far. It's what saved Apple. In most cases, Apple does indeed know best. At least over the past few years. I'm quite content to let them continue having their way. It seems they know something the rest of the industry doesn't.
post #30 of 63
Quote:
Originally Posted by shavex View Post

You know what, F Apple and F the AppStore! The open source/jailbreak world has taken a pole and shoved it up Steve Jobs a** recently by releasing the Cydia Store. No more limits, no more Hitler restricting what you can or can't sell, this is a free market economy last I checked and Apple has become the industrial Titanic! I cant wait to watch it sink!

Too bad Apple ain't going nowhere, sucks for you.
post #31 of 63
Soooo while you read / receive mails about people that b*tch about the process taking forever... you start to think it affects alot of devs out there.

I'm in Canada and the whole process for the contracts and stuff took rougly a week. And that was a 3-4 weeks ago. So I'm calling BS on that. I'm pretty sure for most people the process is running smoothly.

Don't like it? Go develop for the Samsung Store or the Nokia Store or whatever. Geez.
post #32 of 63
Quote:
Originally Posted by hill60 View Post

I've got over 2.5GB of Apps installed on my iPhone and spend $20 or more a month on them, can you install applications for Android on the memory card yet?

Yet is the key word in that phrase. I'm sure that applications will be installable to the memory card soon.

Quote:
I've got over 100 Apps, variety is the spice of life.

How many do you actually use? I've tried quite a few apps but I keep coming back to the same small subset. I don't like my device getting into a big mess of icons. I think I've got three apps installed on my iPod touch.


I wonder what Apple's response will be to the other app stores. Potentially, the developer base for Android, Windows Mobile or Symbian could be far greater since they'll have Windows-based development tools. Would we ever see XCode for Windows in the same way that the iPod eventually resulted in iTunes for Windows?
post #33 of 63
Umm... how exactly does pull one's hair out *by the roots*? Surely one pulls the other end.
post #34 of 63
Quote:
Originally Posted by Morky View Post

This isn't about that. It's about Apple potentially destroying the developer mindshare it brilliantly created when it opened the app store. Being a first-mover is key, but if another platform becomes more attractive to developers, it will take over. Apple should be KISSING THE BUTT of every iPhone developer, and spend copious cash on making sure the approval process is quick and transparent. This is really foolish on Apple's part and makes me wonder if they are really as well managed as it has seemed over the past eight years.

Anyone have data on how many applications they are still receiving, or what kind of applicants? If we have 9 & 12 year olds developing apps then it scares me a little to think of what sort of applications Apple is having to sift through.
post #35 of 63
Quote:
Originally Posted by RichL View Post

Yet is the key word in that phrase. I'm sure that applications will be installable to the memory card soon.



How many do you actually use? I've tried quite a few apps but I keep coming back to the same small subset. I don't like my device getting into a big mess of icons. I think I've got three apps installed on my iPod touch.


I wonder what Apple's response will be to the other app stores. Potentially, the developer base for Android, Windows Mobile or Symbian could be far greater since they'll have Windows-based development tools. Would we ever see XCode for Windows in the same way that the iPod eventually resulted in iTunes for Windows?

I use most of them, it's good to revisit some of the games's the fart App I've got keeps young kid's amused so the keep out of trouble, I use VOIP and IM, the Nightstand replaces my clock radio as do Internet radio streaming Apps, I touch up photo's before posting them or emailing them.

As I said variety is the spice of life.
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post #36 of 63
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quadra 610 View Post

Dumbest comment in this thread.

You do realize that the kind of "freedom" you espouse is exactly what plagues Microsoft. No control over the user experience = shitty user experience.

And as for the economy, it's looking very much like Apple would be the LAST to "sink."

You can go crawl back under your bridge now. Better yet, go grab yourself a Windows Mobile product. I'm quite sure Apple doesn't need you, LOL. Users like you end up causing more harm than good.

And that Cydia Store's day's are probably numbered . . .

touche!
post #37 of 63
this delay "STIFLE INNOVATION" ?!

Give us all a break 25,000 apps and because a few developers have to wait innovation is going to die?????

This drama and expectation for instant attention are absurd and unreasonable.

Nothing will happen if these poor souls have to wait till they get processed.... instant gratification leads to obesity. Chill.
post #38 of 63
This is trivial. The contract length is a single number in a template somewhere. Change it. Kinda like adding months to MobileMe as a concession. Odds are they will figure it out. So how many actual developers are there in a rage as opposed to the one source for this article?
post #39 of 63
Quote:
Originally Posted by shavex View Post

You know what, F Apple and F the AppStore! The open source/jailbreak world has taken a pole and shoved it up Steve Jobs a** recently by releasing the Cydia Store. No more limits, no more Hitler restricting what you can or can't sell, this is a free market economy last I checked and Apple has become the industrial Titanic! I cant wait to watch it sink!

Well if Apple's ship sinks then you wont have to worry about the AppStore, because there wont be any more iPhones to install apps on...
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post #40 of 63
Quote:
Originally Posted by EVWeb View Post

Also, I really don't get jail breakers, I mean, you obviously don't like how the iPhone works if you're going to the trouble of messing with it like that, so why buy one?

No offense, but are you retarded?

"Go to the trouble of messing with it" -- do you mean downloading a couple of files, and running an app? A process that takes all of about 15 minutes including the d/l time?

Great first post!

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