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Apple laying off 50 sales staff due to economy, enterprise - Page 2

post #41 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by rnp1 View Post

It sounds like you may have a military background. To always place a 'guard' into a common situation, is the real mistake.It sets up a disrespectful atmosphere which breeds further hostilities. So as a supporter of using arms for control, I guess your point of view can never be changed. Once you go down that road, all this stuff seems correct and proper."Those who live by the sword shall die by the sword". I guess my naive background gives me false hope that somehow we can accomplish a positive future based on communication, rather than distrust and the belief that everybody is out to get you. I don't believe there would be 6 billion people on the planet today, if we were not eventually able to solve our problems through working things out by agreement, rather than by force. I fear that kind of control has taken control and common sense has become a mere tool of the true controller(s).

You're not trolling. You're just being incredibly naive and clueless. In your idealistic world where unicorns roam free, everyone is a go-happy camper with not a care in the world. In this world where we will call it "reality" for the time being, how may incidents have made the news where laid-off/fired employees went ballistic on their employers? Some were obvious crackpots, others only needed a trigger to cause damage to people or property (physical or intellectual).

And the results of those incidents? People scream bloody murder as to why proper security was lacking during these times. So while your heart bleeds for the treatment that these unfortunate souls received, I'd bet money that you would also be the first person to get on your high-chair and whine as to how those people were able to commit a violent act and the company was not able to protect the innocent victims.

It only takes one person to cause the damage and companies have to be prepared to act on the worst case scenario..

The guards may have been armed as their duties require, but I seriously, seriously doubt the ex-employees were treated like gestapo guests as you are implying with guns drawn and fingers on the trigger. They were most likely treated with respect and quietly walked to the door. People working in that kind of company environment should never take it personally.

Sheesh... get over yourself Hanoi Jane.
post #42 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by rnp1 View Post

HEY DON"T GET UPSET IF YOU LOOSE YOUR JOB HERE! YOU ARE SHUFFLED OUT THE BACK DOOR BY AN ARMED MONKEY!!!!NUMBER ONE COMPANY TO WORK FOR???? (Puts a new meaning to the word, 'fired'. Didn't this sort of behavior lead to the demise of Saddam Hussein? I never guessed that Al Gore has a Mac as protection from the Bill Clinton disappearance team. Yes, John Scully did sit next to Hilary at Bills' first State of the Union!)

I believe it is actually standard in any work environment (that has full time security staff) for individuals to be escorted off the premises by security. They don't do it to be mean, they do it to protect everyone employed there, some people snap when they get let go.

It's also common practice for security to be present when those individuals turn over any work property.
post #43 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by sflocal View Post

You're not trolling. You're just being incredibly naive and clueless. In your idealistic world where unicorns roam free, everyone is a go-happy camper with not a care in the world. In this world where we will call it "reality" for the time being, how may incidents have made the news where laid-off/fired employees went ballistic on their employers? Some were obvious crackpots, others only needed a trigger to cause damage to people or property (physical or intellectual).

And the results of those incidents? People scream bloody murder as to why proper security was lacking during these times. So while your heart bleeds for the treatment that these unfortunate souls received, I'd bet money that you would also be the first person to get on your high-chair and whine as to how those people were able to commit a violent act and the company was not able to protect the innocent victims.

It only takes one person to cause the damage and companies have to be prepared to act on the worst case scenario..

The guards may have been armed as their duties require, but I seriously, seriously doubt the ex-employees were treated like gestapo guests as you are implying with guns drawn and fingers on the trigger. They were most likely treated with respect and quietly walked to the door. People working in that kind of company environment should never take it personally.

Sheesh... get over yourself Hanoi Jane.

THERE YOU GO!!! "PROPER SECURITY "!!!!! Bang you're dead. There goes the Constitution! David Rockafeller and Henry Kisninger always say that document just gets in the way of home land security. ("W" suggested it be called "FatherLand Security", but Cheney nixed it, reminding George who his father is!)
Oh and the reason all the Unicorns are gone is because manly hunters like you took out the biggest and the best as trophies, leaving the remaining homosexual subordinates to be eaten by the hungry females. No more reproductive rights! Rocky wins again, with helpers like you.
And back in those Hanoi days, when many of our 18-25 year old friends were killed and maimed to further the goals of a few multinationals, and the likes of Richard M Nixon- Steve and I would have gone to prison before being forced to carry a gun, let alone use one. But in defense of SJ, and Apple policy, your values do change when you get stabbed in the back by people you trusted, like Bill Gates-but he is a mighty fine poker player!
post #44 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by hezekiahb View Post

I believe it is actually standard in any work environment (that has full time security staff) for individuals to be escorted off the premises by security. They don't do it to be mean, they do it to protect everyone employed there, some people snap when they get let go.

It's also common practice for security to be present when those individuals turn over any work property.

What has become a common practice doesn't make it logical or beneficial. Apple sales staff are most likely not the kind of people who explode unexpectedly. This whole Nazi mentality is an over reaction which only reads downhill. Security guards are generally more likely to be the type of person who could become hostile, as this is the training of a watchdog. Believe me. I have worked with some of the sweetest Rotwielers, German Shephards and Dobermans. But most of them are very dangerous. I put more trust in a cocker than a trained guard dog to not misunderstand a quick move that is not meant to be a threat.
Here is a recent example of where we are going down the slippery path toward martial law:
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servl...l_gam_mostview
post #45 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by rnp1 View Post

THERE YOU GO!!! "PROPER SECURITY "!!!!! Bang you're dead. There goes the Constitution! David Rockafeller and Henry Kisninger always say that document just gets in the way of home land security. ("W" suggested it be called "FatherLand Security", but Cheney nixed it, reminding George who his father is!)
Oh and the reason all the Unicorns are gone is because manly hunters like you took out the biggest and the best as trophies, leaving the remaining homosexual subordinates to be eaten by the hungry females. No more reproductive rights! Rocky wins again, with helpers like you.
And back in those Hanoi days, when many of our 18-25 year old friends were killed and maimed to further the goals of a few multinationals, and the likes of Richard M Nixon- Steve and I would have gone to prison before being forced to carry a gun, let alone use one. But in defense of SJ, and Apple policy, your values do change when you get stabbed in the back by people you trusted, like Bill Gates-but he is a mighty fine poker player!

You don't want to carry a gun, that is your right and I respect it. However if you ever find yourself in your cubicle working away like a worker bee only to be looking down the barrel of a shotgun from some recently laid-off nutjob that feels the world owes him something, you better hope there is someone else watching your back to eliminate the threat by force if need be.

And I hate to burst your bubble but Unicorns never existed (except in your mind) to be eradicated by gut-toting Cheney lovers. I'm sorry that you're still dealing with the trauma of not having them around, but I'm sure we can stick a glittery candlestick on the head of a pony for you.

Steve Jobs didn't doesn't need to carry a gun. He has paid security guards at Apple to do that for him. I guess he must be a little more grounded on what can happen out there.

And for clarification, Bill Gates was more a Bridge player than Poker I believe.
post #46 of 73
And for clarification, Bill Gates was more a Bridge player than Poker I believe.[/QUOTE]

Your clarification is more like a clara-bell-ification! That is because you didn't grew up here in the great NW, never went canoeing at the UofW dock across from U Village and weren't there putting Fortran cards into the mainframe in the middle of the night in the 70's. Some of us did that. Bill plays only bridge now because he is over 50!!! But back then he had a green eye shade and everything.
post #47 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by rnp1 View Post

HEY DON"T GET UPSET IF YOU LOOSE YOUR JOB HERE! YOU ARE SHUFFLED OUT THE BACK DOOR BY AN ARMED MONKEY!!!!NUMBER ONE COMPANY TO WORK FOR???? (Puts a new meaning to the word, 'fired'. Didn't this sort of behavior lead to the demise of Saddam Hussein? I never guessed that Al Gore has a Mac as protection from the Bill Clinton disappearance team. Yes, John Scully did sit next to Hilary at Bills' first State of the Union!)

ALL major companies do this - especially technology companies. They still get their two weeks pay (or whatever's in their contracts), but once someone is fired, they can't go back to their company computer. If you can't figure out why this makes sense, I'll fill you in - as soon as you learn that people lose jobs, not loose them.
post #48 of 73
I agree, the Cnet buzz group complains about how bad Apple is and how there products are missing everything, but if they're so bad why do they all own iPhones, Macbook pros and MacBooks? And why are these products doing better than there pc counter parts? I am laughing at those people at Cnet that said the iPhone was doomed and they wouldn't buy one, and now they say they can't live without it. One last thing, it seems like they think an occasional illegal dowload is okay.
post #49 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by iPeon View Post

AI should lay off publishing "dramatization" type style reports. It's getting stinky in here. Why do reporters feel need to give their opinion? We could care less about opinions. Facts is what we want. Real facts, not opinionated "facts." Come on!

Facts from a website that is meant to deliver rumors?

On the other hand, enjoy the argument over corporate ethics. I know it is an oxymoron, but people expect to be treated well by an entity that exists to make money. Being escorted out of an organization like a criminal after spending several years of your life toiling for the organization is somehow OK these days. Screw individual respect. I am waiting for the day when disposable robots can replace people and termination can be more fun for the employer.
Most of us employ the Internet not to seek the best information, but rather to select information that confirms our prejudices. - Nicholas D. Kristof
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Most of us employ the Internet not to seek the best information, but rather to select information that confirms our prejudices. - Nicholas D. Kristof
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post #50 of 73
I worked at a very small London based company a few years ago and when one (1!) of the senior people was let go there was a security guard present. I am afraid that this is very common when dealing with either large numbers of people at once, or someone high profile in the company being let go. As weird as it seemed at the time (the company had 15 staff), I can understand why the management did it.
post #51 of 73
They should lay off the guy who designed the glossy screens
dreamery
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dreamery
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post #52 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by hezekiahb View Post

I believe it is actually standard in any work environment (that has full time security staff) for individuals to be escorted off the premises by security. They don't do it to be mean, they do it to protect everyone employed there, some people snap when they get let go.

It's also common practice for security to be present when those individuals turn over any work property.

I like the way they did it in the old days:

NCR (cash registers) was a major corporation in the early-mid 20th century, One day an executive came in to work at headquarters and found his desk on the front lawn...

...on fire!
"...The calm is on the water and part of us would linger by the shore, For ships are safe in harbor, but that's not what ships are for."
- Michael Lille -
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"...The calm is on the water and part of us would linger by the shore, For ships are safe in harbor, but that's not what ships are for."
- Michael Lille -
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post #53 of 73
on a side note, al gore is more fat than ever! way too much private jetting.
post #54 of 73
In my experience the security guard escort is common practice these days. It's mostly done to prevent the former employees from taking any documents, etc with them when they leave. Sad but not sinister, although I do think escorting them out the 'back door' is wrong. Leave with your head held high people.
post #55 of 73
Quote:
As the number of layoffs in the enterprise sales division wasn't large enough to require a public announcement, Apple is thought to have taken the same approach as for Jobs and kept silent in hopes that shareholders wouldn't take notice.

Is Apple a public company or not??

Maybe we should rename Infinite Loop as The Kremlin.
post #56 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by dreamery View Post

They should lay off the guy who designed the glossy screens

Or the dude who copied Dell's black and metallic color combination.
post #57 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by emulator View Post

on a side note, al gore is more fat than ever! way too much private jetting.

Or way too many transfats. Did McDonalds go green?
post #58 of 73
They have to have a security guard - it's standard practice at any large company when you lay people off because of how other people have reacted in the past. There's plenty of stories of people getting belligerant when they get fired/laid off so they always have security present when they do it - it's just how it is. It's nothing against the people they laid off, it's just standard practice...
post #59 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by bigmc6000 View Post

They have to have a security guard - it's standard practice at any large company when you lay people off because of how other people have reacted in the past. There's plenty of stories of people getting belligerant when they get fired/laid off so they always have security present when they do it - it's just how it is. It's nothing against the people they laid off, it's just standard practice...

I have this weird vision of some dude being dragged out of the genius bar, going all Appleballistic.
post #60 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by teckstud View Post

I have this weird vision of some dude being dragged out of the genius bar, going all Appleballistic.

haha, that'd be too funny. "No, no. If you fire me I'm just another dork, I've tasted what it's like to be a genius, I don't want to go back to Dell, no, please, NNOOO!!!!!!!"

Also, could be worse, my company is cutting over 5% of it's work force immediately after giving our CEO a $16 million bonus for "surviving the economic downturn so well" - grr much?
http://www.usatoday.com/money/indust...nologies_N.htm
post #61 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by rnp1 View Post

HEY DON"T GET UPSET IF YOU LOOSE YOUR JOB HERE! YOU ARE SHUFFLED OUT THE BACK DOOR BY AN ARMED MONKEY!!!!

All the talk about guns, how do you know they were armed?

Anyway, why wouldn't security have guns as part of their everyday security job?
post #62 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by hezekiahb View Post

I believe it is actually standard in any work environment (that has full time security staff) for individuals to be escorted off the premises by security. They don't do it to be mean, they do it to protect everyone employed there, some people snap when they get let go.

It's also common practice for security to be present when those individuals turn over any work property.

Spot on. This is standard procedure and done to protect staff and other employees - some people get really emotional, or even snap, and you don't want that to happen/share this with other co-workers who might get upset by it - not to mention the lawsuits when someone snaps and start hurting/killing people.

It might not be the best method, hurt peoples feeling, but I don't think that any of these sales-reps didn't knew what was coming - new boss, new direction, moving sales to companies like Ingram Micro and others.

@rnp1: I think I know what you are trying to address here, because I lost a contract many years ago and had to sign a: "I won't hack you letter". I tell you that did hurt because I worked so hard for them (I was a hacker back then) but it wasn't that much of a deal after all and thus I signed the letter, but not without saying what I thought of it. I walked out with my head up knowing that I would never ever do such thing. I knew that they were just protecting their business, but I still wonder if they ever really knew who I was (a good guy).
post #63 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by bigmc6000 View Post

haha, that'd be too funny. "No, no. If you fire me I'm just another dork, I've tasted what it's like to be a genius, I don't want to go back to Dell, no, please, NNOOO!!!!!!!"


http://www.usatoday.com/money/indust...nologies_N.htm

I think I'm having those visions because NY's Apple store, Station A, was a former US Post Office.
post #64 of 73
double post
post #65 of 73
You are absolutely good for pulling pure fantasy out of your hind quarters. What makes you think Dell started the black/metallic theme? Apple has used black notebooks since the PowerBook 100 in 1991. Apple began using metallic notebooks in 2001, Dell was still making beige boxes.

Quote:
Originally Posted by teckstud View Post

Or the dude who copied Dell's black and metallic color combination.
post #66 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by rnp1 View Post

I don't believe there would be 6 billion people on the planet today, if we were not eventually able to solve our problems through working things out by agreement, rather than by force. I fear that kind of control has taken control and common sense has become a mere tool of the true controller(s).

I suspect that if we were able to solve our problems through working things out, there would be 20 billion people on the planet by now.

You really are naive aren't you? Don't you realize that it only takes one disgruntled employee to ruin your whole day?

Thompson
post #67 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by thompr View Post

I suspect that if we were able to solve our problems through working things out, there would be 20 billion people on the planet by now.

You really are naive aren't you? Don't you realize that it only takes one disgruntled employee to ruin your whole day?

Thompson

Better not fly either, because the plane could crash. Millions of people have died in plane crashes-all because the airplane companies haven't over reacted. Using the gun owner logic, the plane should stay on the ground the whole time-one bad crash can ruin your whole life!
Oh and as far population goes, my point is, that if everyone had used a weapon to solve their disputes, neither of us would be here. Gun propagation and Population control is a long term goal of the financial elite. To think otherwise is to be truly naive!
post #68 of 73
Do not feed the troll
post #69 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by rnp1 View Post

It sounds like you may have a military background. To always place a 'guard' into a common situation, is the real mistake.It sets up a disrespectful atmosphere which breeds further hostilities. So as a supporter of using arms for control, I guess your point of view can never be changed. Once you go down that road, all this stuff seems correct and proper."Those who live by the sword shall die by the sword". I guess my naive background gives me false hope that somehow we can accomplish a positive future based on communication, rather than distrust and the belief that everybody is out to get you. I don't believe there would be 6 billion people on the planet today, if we were not eventually able to solve our problems through working things out by agreement, rather than by force. I fear that kind of control has taken control and common sense has become a mere tool of the true controller(s).

Uhh, it's called Information Security. Look it up. You are naive if you think that everyone is the world posseses every good quality and that nobody does any wrong at anytime. Go ask San Francisco if they probably should have watched their employees a littler closer as they fired them recently.
post #70 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by patricia.harlow View Post

Uhh, it's called Information Security. Look it up. You are naive if you think that everyone is the world posseses every good quality and that nobody does any wrong at anytime. Go ask San Francisco if they probably should have watched their employees a littler closer as they fired them recently.

IT IS A DISEASE CALLED "MILITARY INDUSTRIAL COMPLEX". Believing that this is 'normal' is exactly what the financial elite want you to think. Congratulations. But you may want to Goolge M.I.C. and Eisenhower-heed the warning!
post #71 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by rnp1 View Post

HEY DON"T GET UPSET IF YOU LOOSE YOUR JOB HERE! YOU ARE SHUFFLED OUT THE BACK DOOR BY AN ARMED MONKEY!!!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by rnp1 View Post

So they don't loose it in a private meeting from a cold manager who prefers to use a PC at home. Those 'smart' managers who were hired by Apple because they know how to 'handle' people!!!

Always good to see the updated version of the word "lose" being used. Now it matches the word caboose.
post #72 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by (g_g) View Post

Always good to see the updated version of the word "lose" being used. Now it matches the word caboose.

AHA! Sometimes my spelling is as loose as a goose, which does sound like caboose. But loose is knot what i meant, but spell checkers don't know a pepper from a pecker. And I'm a hunt and pecker.Thank you for making me aware of my error. Sometimes my proses are sheer poetry, sometimes they are sheer pantyhose, but some feel they are sheer folly. How does one sheer a sheep? Gotta cut loose!
post #73 of 73
the alleged layoff of 50 enterprise sales people made me wonder why, with numerous viable sales channels in place, why AAPL needs an enterprise sales group?

can anyone articulate a justification for this group?
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