Microsoft to attack Mac pricing in new series of TV ads - Page 4

What photo editing software that is included with the Dell for the price of purchase doesn't suck more than iPhoto?

Just to have some fun on a Friday night:

Let's see about price... Give Ballmer an extra 80+ for iWork and even it out to 600.

For 600 more, you get:

minor points:
- a single phone number to call if you have any problems with hardware or software
- decent-looking hardware as opposed to some of the other stuff out there

major points:
- apps that work well, together, saving time (let's say 30 hours a year saved)
- apps that share many basic functions thus saving learning time (let's say 10 hours a year)
- greater security and less time spent on cleaning viruses, etc. (let's say 10 hours a year)

- fewer headaches and less stress due to the above (50 hours per year)

I figure 100 hours saved per year, 50 if you want to stretch to two. If we look at the median income of 50,000, the average worker is making 25 bucks an hour. A hundred hours comes out to 2500 bucks. Thats a lot of money. Or, if you like, we could figure at a part-time rate of 6.55 an hour, it comes to 655 bucks.

I need another beer... or two... or three...

Perhaps that means exactly that. Maybe this poster wouldn't touch a Mac Mini either. So?

Perhaps this poster wants to play in the deep end of the pool, where the Macs are clearly the more desirable proposition.

well I'm delighted to hear it.

now don't let the door hit you on the way out.

It's actually a bit below 89%. That's in comparison to around 95-96% only a few short years ago. In fact, MS market share is the lowest it has been in over a decade. And IE share is absolutely dismal.

Most Mac users have NO Mac issues. And what issues there are, are nothing like Windows problems. You're going well against the tide here. It's already been acknowledged and accepted that OS X doesn't suffer from nearly or the same problems as Windows. Your exception, if true, simply proves the rule. Short of calling you a liar, I'll simply assume you bought yourself a lemon. shit happens.

And it remains to be seen exactly what impact Windows 7 will have. The same claim was made about Vista. And of course, Snow Leopard is just around the corner, and no one really knows what surprises it will bring. It was widely believed there would be no UI enhancements, and we just discovered that there will be. That's why Apple is so dangerous. They don't show their hand.

Anyway, this ad is hilarious. MS just admitted that their users are . . . Losers. LOL, I can't believe they just did that.

Confused? You should be. This ad parallels the Windows experience perfectly: confusing and frustrating.

This is great! finally someone attacking Apples insane laptop pricing. $2800 for a 17 inch laptop???

I will admit, the $699 one that she bought wasnt comprable to a Macbook, but it is no slouch...ATI GPU, 4GB Ram, and such, but I can get a spec for spec match to the MBP 17 inch, with Blueray, bigger HDD and such for about $1500...


Apples prices are pretty out of touch right now, and windows 7 is looking good...thats all I am gonna say for now...

Let me get this straight. She is given 1000 dollars top if she can find a computer until that price point.

So why does she get a 700$ laptop?!?! Why didn't she picked a 999$ laptop that had more stuff in it?!?

Seriously, this is so insanely bollocks my head hurts. I understand what they tried to do. They tried to say that in Apple you can't buy for less than 1000 bucks what you can buy in other shops for less than 700, but they couldn't do it without shooting in the foot first, now could they?

OTOH, I'd have the same reaction as the girl. I simply don't have enough money to be a "cool" mac person. That's why I'm postponing.

Now run OS X on that $699 laptop.

With a Mac you also get

No antivirus/anti-malware/anti-spyware software required
No maintenance required
No slowdowns over time
More stability
Best-in-class software, most of it right out of the box
Best-in-class design, both of the hardware and the OS
Far better resale value

Apple is, as usual, targeting the PREMIUM END OF THE MARKET.

They've already admitted that they do not and will not, cater to the $400 Dell segment. If your main goal is to save a buck and get whatever is on sale that day, YOU NEED NOT APPLY. MS has you pegged very nicely. In fact, MS has called you a loser.

It is beyond fallacious to compare raw specs between generic PC boxes and Macs without considering the software (and the OS) they run and how that leverages hardware. With Macs, it's a completely different user experience. Like night and day. A recession doesn't change that. A Mac doesn't become a lesser machine simply because you can no longer afford one.

People who weren't pissed at Apple's prices pre-recession are suddenly up in arms over them. Apparently there's some unwritten rule out there that if you don't lower your prices during a recession, it's somehow an insult to everyone. The reality is, is that the consumers that might have been part of one market have shifted down to another. Tough shit.

I guess one thing that has always confused me (a bit) - was Microsoft doing any ad's against Apple?

Most of their ad's blast Apple / Mac's, yet, MS doesn't even sell computers?

Shouldn't they be relegated to ad's that talk about software only, when comparing?

It's kind of like - Firestone saying Chevy's suck and or aren't as good as Fords? Or Fords run smother, faster, get better fuel milage and are an all around better buy then chevy's because of the tires they come with. This will be interesting in the very near future, when they will start comparing cars, based on the software they are running.

I'm betting there are a few pieces of crap PC's out there sold or at sometime sold, that used MS software? And some that are or were expensive.

If nothing else, this at least gives us something to talk about

Skip

It's not a sensible comparison to compare things using a spec sheet these days, but sadly the average consumer doesn't want to have to understand what s/he is doing, but be 'told' how to choose instead.

First things first, "Lauren" was asked to buy a 17" computer (With speed, and a great keyboard !?) for under $1k. What kind of basis is that for choosing a computer? This add is purely designed to compare all laptops as equal, bar the price. How about asking her to buy something suitable for photo editing, something for archiving her home videa tapes onto, something for doing college work on, something for running a soho business with?

No, just buy something for under an abritary pricepoint that we know will exlcude the most desirable models from competitors. Does she "need" a 17" screen? If so, what for? Why does she need a "great keyboard"? Because the HP one they have picked in advance has a flashy coloured one?

It's a foolish comparison which makes everyone involved look bad.

This draws me to a comparison with the iPhone and it's competitors. It's working to the same philosophy as Apples computing products - don't compete on price, don't compete on "features", compete on providing the best overall experience.

If you compare a HP Vista PC to a Macbook via the specsheets, then chances are the only difference is the price, but the PC may have things that the Mac lacks - it may have a 99-in-1 memory card reader in the front, it may have a fingerprint swipe scanner on it even - these things may make it look like a better value - after all, you get more, for less, right? But wait, what's this? turns out you can only use the finger swipe for unlocking windows, there's no system wide way of using it to say password protect documents, unlock admin privelege or anything - in short it's not a part of the whole experience, it's just extra tat. It's not a cohesive part of the whole package, and as such you'll probably never use it. It provides no extra value to the end user.

Let's move back to phones - now bearing in mind that the iphone is less than 2 years whole as a platform, never mind as a product - I have had phones that murder the iphone when compared to each other on the basis of a tick-box comparison. The iphone has things missing, and the other phones I have had have had extra things (forward facing camera, ringtone editors, memory cards). On paper the iphone is underfeatured and overpriced. But what's this? It's only the biggest selling single-handset ever, already. What's the differentiator? Price? Spec? No, experience. It's a joy to use.

People in other industries already understand that you can't compare on spec and price alone. That's why a Ford Focus with the same number of seats, engine size, safety rating etc etc costs is available at half the cost of the equivalent BMW. And that's why more people buy them, but BMW are still a healthy company producing a better product for those able to afford one, and earning more money, car for car, than Ford. Ford sell to the masses, they are currently in the shit because margins are so tight. BMW sell to a smaller target audience, one that is still able to spend, so they are not in the mire like Ford.

at reading all kinds of grimaces... But that chinese girl at the counter, she seems to look at this happy PC owner as she wants to say: go get some computer, not this piece of crap, you fool!

Same as here.

This is the magic formula. Plain and simple. Well put.

The same type of people who bought the Macbook Air the day it came out....those with too much money to care.

Macs grow obsolete at a slower pace than cheap PCs bought at a Best Buy. I'm not sure if I'm in the minority, but I buy Macs and do my best to get my money's worth. I had a B&W G3 for almost 7 years that required one $80 repair before getting my current MacBook. Sure, I'm not a "power user" so I can be content not having the latest specs, but I don't know of many PCs that last that long without serious problems. In the end, I need to replace my Mac less often than I would need to fix or upgrade a PC. In addition, it costs a whole lot less to take advantage of new features in a new Mac OS, if I'm willing to skip a version or two. Sure, if you need a 17" computer NOW and only have $1,000, you might be in trouble, but if you're looking for value, invest in a Mac and save money later.

Why does apple blast microsoft when microsoft doesnt sell pc's either. Microsoft is helping their partners out thats all.

Plus if you guys actually went to stores there are pc's with gpus and dual core for under $1000. I saw a 15.4 inch hp with amd x 2 processor and ati gpu with 2 gig ram for $599. This was at radio shack.

Its funny that mac has been attacking microsoft for years and when microsoft finally fights back this site goes crazy.

I never understood why this site is so biast against microsoft. I wont mention other sites by name but mac fans on other sites arent so anti microsoft.

The problem is that MS' attacks on Apple are LAME. ALL of them since the Seinfeld ads.

How can a company with such a an R&D budget, not only fail to do any compelling R&D but also fail so hard at marketing? And consistently at that.

In one fell swoop, MS has:

1) admitted they are the cheap budget brand
2) implied that their user base - current and prospective, are losers
3) admitted openly that Apple is still the cooler, more expensive, and thus more desirable option

We're anti-Microsoft for the following reason:

Mac + OS X. (And plus an assload of revolutionary or otherwise compelling new products since 2001.)

With a Mac you get:

No antivirus/anti-malware/anti-spyware software required
No maintenance required
No slowdowns over time
More stability
Best-in-class software, most of it right out of the box
Best-in-class design, both of the hardware and the OS
Far better resale value

So why can't MS do this for its customers???

The reasons are many and have been covered at length before. But it all comes down to this:

MS' entire business model renders it next to impossible to trump Apple's strengths. Their model is geared toward the business/enterprise market with the home market as an afterthought. Windows is a banana-boat OS that is positioned to appeal to everyone, thereby rendering it not particularly good at anything, delivering a mishmash of different elements to combine into a confusing user experience. MS has no focus. They have no overarching mission statement. They are the typical monolithic organization that tries to have its finger in every pie without nurturing their core. Look at their management. Look at their absolutely horrible keynote events. the outside reflects exactly what's going on on the inside. This results in a Wal-Mart brand that people settle for, rather than covet. This latest ad merely reinforces their cheap, lousy image: "When you can't afford something better, try us!" Way to cheapen your name. Who on earth, in light of all this, would think that MS is synonymous with "innovation", or anything remotely desirable?

Let the masses have their HPs and Dells.
Anyone with half a brain who uses a bargain PC and then uses a Mac will realize the Mac is worth the extra money anyway, which is why the Apple retail stores have done so much good for the brand. People go in and play with a Mac and walk out determined to save the extra money they need. It happens every day.

I think that the MS add is dumb but everything you point out is right.

All I'm going to say is that the 80's called and they want their insane computer pricing back.

I disagree, I think Macs are priced well for what you get. You have to take into account more than initial price. What about longevity, 'uptime', lack of support issues etc. etc. etc.

For example, there are numerous Macs including the latest 8 Core Mac Pro in the next room used for my work but I am typing this on my stock, bottom of the line G4 iBook, sitting at the breakfast table. This G4 iBook is running Leopard 10.5.6 and used for Mail, Safari and iWork and works as flawlessly (on my .11g wi-fi used by iPhones) as the day I bought it. I have lost track of its age. Its initial price therefore has to be amortized over a heck of a lot of years and the daily use I have had out of it. The cheaper PC Laptops from the year my iBook was made are now where I wonder and if they still run what version of M$ OS can they run?

A friend of mine after bragging his Acer Laptop only cost $400 admitted the 'dealer' in Canada put on illegal versions of Office and other stuff (all included in the $400 of course) and since he has owned it (three years) he has paid over $500 in charges to get it working again after software nightmares caused by various updates.

I rest my case

p.s. To the trolls ... this is why 'Mac Fans' exist ... get it?

No, they will not. Lack of MDI, maximize/minimize buttons on another side, much narrower variety of software to steal, etc, etc... It's a real PITA after years of PC experience. It takes the entire brain and years and years again to understand where and why Mac is better...

You think? Most switchers I know seem to take to the Mac interface in a few days. Whereas they never were totally at ease with PC since there is no consistency to speak of. I even know a guy who is 86 and it only took a week or two and a few phone calls for him to be totally at ease on his new iMac. His only regret is wasting so many years on a PC.

Indeed I do. And I'm a switcher with several 10's of years of PC and around 10 years now of Mac, I know exactly what I'm talking about.


My professional use may be to blame. When it's not about to entertain yourself but about to produce something with the help of computer, you develop reflexes, almost motor. It's painful to break all that.

IMHO...MS Should focus on telling folks why their offerings are better, rather than on why Apple's are too expensive, etc. Why are the fearful if their products are superior, and less $$$ [in their minds]. Too funny.

Let's see...A Mac, that does cost more, but will give me a better user experience, allow me to be more productive, with none of the issues of a Windows box. Or a less expensive DELL, that I'll get a couple of good years out of, and then have to scrap it and buy yet another one at the same/more $$$??? Nope...I'll keep my Mac thanks...

I thought the same thing too until I actually started shopping for them. I was amazed at how good I could spec an HP or Toshiba laptop for $1000 or less. When I found out they were made by the same subcontractor as Apple anyway, that's when I realized just how out of whack Apple's pricing really is.



You don't use memory cards, good for you. We do. A lot. A laptop MUST have one, full stop. Macbook Pros get in the backdoor by at least having an Express card slot that I can get a memory card reader for, but then I'm adding even more to the price.

There are plenty of HP and Toshiba laptops with number pads in the 15" to 16" range. Apple doesn't make ANY, not even on the 17".


You see this on all the computers at Best Buy, at least as often on Macs. Unattended kids can do serious damage very quickly.

And who wants to make a bet that the ad agency uses Macs?

This is just sad. The fact that MS, once again, has nothing new and unique to say about its own product other than "It's cheap" is so 3rd grade. And how can you compare price points of a Mac compared to....??? Exactly. It's like saying, "Don't buy that Ferrari because this toaster is cheaper." What??? How's about investing all that marketing budget on actually developing a product worth paying an extra $500+ for? How about MS stop trying to make themselves feel better by trying to knock down the competition.

I agree with other posters that this will only result in more publicity for Apple. Apple has a solid brand identity and a solid line of products. MS is a joke at best and continues to prove that point by it's sad marketing efforts.

So go ahead and buy a PC with an bloatware laden disc image of Windows from HP. I have a Pavilion PC and it is an awful user experience. I would never again buy a computer that doesn't even come with a copy of the operating system. And from what I have read, she will need every bit of RAM to run Vista. There won't be much left over to do anything.

How come they didn't film any scenes within the Apple Store? It was just an exterior shot!

This ad does the best job of describing the advantages of using Microsoft's OS, which is the sheer variety of computers available, allowing consumers options to buy what they need/or want, think they need/or want or perceive they need/or want.

While not directly or even directly comparing the OS to Mac OS X most consumers will not care. Most consumers already run Microsoft's OS. I believe these ads are/will be the most effective in the latest series of ads, most of which have failed.

While I am a Mac user and have been since '95, this ad with the woman examining all the options available made me jealous. Will I buy into this ad, no, but how will the consumers react, we'll have to wait and see.

I'd be pretty pissed off if I was Michael Dell, and had spent big money on OS licensing and advertising my products as being designed for using Windows, only to have Microsoft turn around and stab me in the back by telling all my PC customers that they'd get a better deal buying an HP.

Ten bucks says someone will go find the actress who plays "Lauren" in the ad, and she'll admit in an interview that she really owns a MacBook, an iPod and an iPhone.

Well said.

Look, let's be real. All apple cares about is bread and butter products like the iPhone and touch/iPod. They dropped .mac name to appeal to more users. They drop computer from their name. And not only are the products over proved for spec, they fail in that they have no midrange for the dedicated mac user and releasing the x1300 when the macbook could run motion but no games, bringing gpu scores down from 171% to 70% then releasing MacBook with nvidia but no FireWire, is a huge slap in the face to those who stood by apple for all these years. Like it would kill them if the 1% of pro users had a cheap solution. Who does that. It's insane. Don't underestimate windows folks. Imam an old pc user who is mostly mac iPhone but win 7 is strong, hardly any bugs and runs faster than vista in older hardware. If they trick it out more and consider it runs with a lot of high end audio video hardware plus no more needing to support three different os's, microsoft could be doing very well. Again, look at their mobile software screen shots. Very nice which means on millions of phones.

Apple will have to repond with mid range and price cuts unless they want to get back to 3% again. And with palm coming and lots of androids,thy could be in for a very bad day.

Hope Apple wakes up.

To me the add works in pointing out that there is greater variety and cheaper prices with pcs.

But, IMO, they blew it when she talked about how she wasn't cool enough to get a Mac. She said it almost wistfully. If she would have said it in a clearly mocking tone it might have worked. If she would have just walked out of the Apple store mad that they only had one laptop under 1k THAT might have ben the best response. I felt sorry for her that she couldn't afford a Mac.

Now some will argue that the add agency who made this had no control over how a 'real' person would act in this reality add, but according to Gruber this girl was an actress. I suspect this add was scripted like any other add.

We will see what Windows 7 turns out to be, hope it's not like the last one.

It is an ad. As in short for advertisement. "Add" is a verb that describes what you do when you put two things together.

She's right...she's not cool enough to own a Mac. LOSER HAHAHAHAHAHAHA

But seriously...that was pretty funny. She goes to an Apple store first, and realizes...wow...I'm out of my league. I guess I'll go to Best Buy, and talk to the pimple faced kid and get a consumer based HP. She must cry every night going to sleep..."Waahhaaaa....I wish it was a Macbook Pro...sniff"

There's something called "choiceless choices." It's when you're presented with a number of supposed options, which are essentially the same. Aside from some raw specs, there is nothing to really differentiate an HP form a Dell. Both are generic boxes. All of them run Windows.

I don't see choices here. I see the same crap repackaged in a different plastic case most of which look like a notebook version of a cyborg - stuff is slapped on all over the place. With more or less RAM, a better videocard or a more ecnomical one, you're still stuck with Windows and the whole Windows user experience. That's the kicker right there.

There will always be more bargain-basement flotsam and jetsam products. You'll always find more choice with generic PC boxes. Unless you're in an Apple Store, it's a Wal-Mart world. A world in which you invariably get what you pay for.

Funny how I stopped caring about "choices" when I demo'd a Mac back in 2006 . . . yeah, that kind of closed the door on every other option out there. I'm glad it did. Makes life a helluva lot easier.

Because the interiors of most Apple Stores are stylish and the products are showcased beautifully. Showing the interior will just pique the viewer's interest in Apple even more.

Well OK but from what you say it seems you are referring about your personal experience. I part owned a training school for Macs and saw hundreds of switchers sigh with relief in a few short days; these were mostly Newspaper and Magazine publishing and graphics professional not those 'entertaining themselves'.

Also I switched from using a high end video editing system (not PC I admit) to Apple software and Macs for TV video production as did many I know and had the same fast relearning experience.

It is easy to learn something that is logical, intuitive and seamless. Rather like going from a manual / clutch to an automatic - please don't flame me - I know a stick shift can be fun Perhaps taking a PC around a few hairpin bends once in a while can be too :

I agree but I bet like me you agonize once in a while over the choices from Apple ... a new MacPro and a MacBook or perhaps a MacBook Pro and a second 24" LCD Monitor, it's sooo hard to choose at times... even if it's fantasy some days

You may both be correct, but I don't think the consumer thinks things through a thoroughly as you do. I believe that is why the Apple Mac/PC ads resonated so well with much of the population.

Hi Italiankid, have you tried using the Mac set to Italian?

Seriously though, I have been running Windows 7 aka Vista 2.0 since it was available to test and good luck there