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Better off now than 8 years ago? - Page 2

post #41 of 188
Quote:
Originally Posted by FormerLurker View Post

Wrong, Wrong, Wrong, Wrong, WRONG.


http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/htm...pflooding.html


http://www.fema.gov/news/newsrelease.fema?id=47798


http://www.minnpost.com/stories/2009...fargo_notebook


http://www.wtopnews.com/?nid=104&sid=1559881

Just for kicks, why don't you look up the levy spending in the New Orleans area in the last 10 years, and factor in the populations of Greater New Orleans and Greater Fargo (hint - they differ by an order of magnitude), and then tell us what Federal flood control per capita spending was for each one?

Last, but not least - can you just stop for a minute and imagine what the "why do they live in a floodplain, anyway?" comments about New Orleans would have been like if it had seen similar flooding just 12 years ago?

Both of your posts on this subject provide ample proof that your assumptions about federal involvement in Fargo are.... ummm.... somewhat inaccurate.

You are MISSING MY POINT ENTIRELY.

I'm not talking about what the government did or did't do in each situation. Re-read my posts. I am talking about the attitudes of the residents.

Also keep in mind, the present situation with Fargo is happening post-Katrina. Apparently we've learned from Katrina.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

Reply
post #42 of 188
"The attitudes of the residents"?


Now it sounds like you're just trying to bash poor black people (how many of those are there in Fargo, BTW?).

90% of the population of New Orleans evacuated when asked - 24 to 48 hours before the storm hit. They also didn't have a week or more to get everyone together and fill up millions of sandbags - nor did they have Army Engineers of Corpses contractors erecting a dozen temporary levies.

Again, you seem to be ignoring vast differences in the circumstances of the two events in order to slam "those lazy people in New Orleans" - and I'm still trying to decide if it would be worth the ban in order to tell you exactly how full of it you really are.
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post #43 of 188
Quote:
Originally Posted by FormerLurker View Post

"The attitudes of the residents"?


Now it sounds like you're just trying to bash poor black people (how many of those are there in Fargo, BTW?).

90% of the population of New Orleans evacuated when asked - 24 to 48 hours before the storm hit. They also didn't have a week or more to get everyone together and fill up millions of sandbags.

Again, you seem to be ignoring vast differences in the circumstances of the two events in order to slam "those lazy people in New Orleans" - and I'm still trying to decide if it would be worth the ban in order to tell you exactly how full of it you really are.

You would have me banned over this? You brought up race, not me. I'm sharing my own observations. I understand if you disagree with them, or think my analogy is inaccurate, but having me banned over it? Wow.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

Reply
post #44 of 188
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post

You would have me banned over this? You brought up race, not me. I'm sharing my own observations. I understand if you disagree with them, or think my analogy is inaccurate, but having me banned over it? Wow.

I believe if read closer he was talking about getting banned himself.
Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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post #45 of 188
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post

The Federal government did nothing to help Fargo prepare, and the people went to work evacuating and working to protect their communities.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post

I'm not talking about what the government did or did't do in each situation.

Contradict yourself much?
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post #46 of 188
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

I believe if read closer he was talking about getting banned himself.

Ah ok. That makes sense.

In that case, feel free to "put me in my place", FormerLurker.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

Reply

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

Reply
post #47 of 188
Quote:
Originally Posted by FormerLurker View Post

Contradict yourself much?

Quite often.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

Reply

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

Reply
post #48 of 188
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

I believe if read closer he was talking about getting banned himself.

This, from the "guru" who is slamming MY reading comprehension abilities.....
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post #49 of 188
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post

Quite often.

Apparently so!
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post #50 of 188
Quote:
Originally Posted by FormerLurker View Post

This, from the "guru" who is slamming MY reading comprehension abilities.....

I was merely trying to point out something you didn't seem to understand.

Here we have a prime example of how to react when feeling backed into a corner!

Where's trumpy when you need him?
Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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post #51 of 188
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post

Ah ok. That makes sense.

In that case, feel free to "put me in my place", FormerLurker.

Naah.

All I really need to do is take a look at the place you're in, and thank God that I'm not in that place myself.
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post #52 of 188
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post

You would have me banned over this? You brought up race, not me. I'm sharing my own observations. I understand if you disagree with them, or think my analogy is inaccurate, but having me banned over it? Wow.

You don't have the slightest clue about what you are talking about with respect to either New Orleans or Fargo.

I happen to have worked for the USACE as a Research Hydraulic Engineer.

As such, I am quite familiar with both situations fully with their underlying hydraulic engineering aspects.

Obviously you are not an engineer, do not understand logistics, and are not even vaguely familiar with either situation in New Orleans or Fargo.

I call BULLSHIT!

Nuff said.
Every eye fixed itself upon him; with parted lips and bated breath the audience hung upon his words, taking no note of time, rapt in the ghastly fascinations of the tale. NOT!
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Every eye fixed itself upon him; with parted lips and bated breath the audience hung upon his words, taking no note of time, rapt in the ghastly fascinations of the tale. NOT!
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post #53 of 188
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

I was merely trying to point out something you didn't seem to understand.

Here we have a prime example of how to react when backed into a corner!

Where's trumpy when you need him?

"guru" was referring to jazzguru, not to you - sorry if I confused things by quoting you.
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post #54 of 188
Quote:
Originally Posted by FormerLurker View Post

Apparently so!

I don't profess to be perfect.

But rather than attack me personally, why not stick to the issue?

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

Reply

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

Reply
post #55 of 188
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post

I don't profess to be perfect.

But rather than attack me personally, why not stick to the issue?

Which issue would that be, exactly?
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post #56 of 188
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post

I don't profess to be perfect.

But rather than attack me personally, why not stick to the issue?

Why should he? You just flipped " Off " on the issue control again!
Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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post #57 of 188
Quote:
Originally Posted by FormerLurker View Post

"guru" was referring to jazzguru, not to you - sorry if I confused things by quoting you.

Oopps! My bad! Up late last night and I guess I really haven't had enough coffee yet!

Anyway Jazzy you still haven't told us what you would do in this economic crisis?
Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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post #58 of 188
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

Why should he? You just flipped " Off " on the issue control again!

Am I attacking any of you personally? Dissecting your grammar/spelling? Analyzing your posts for contradictions? Accusing you of being something or someone you aren't?

You know, most people respond well to criticism when they're not being made fun of or belittled. You might try that with me. I do enjoy learning things.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

Reply

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

Reply
post #59 of 188
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post

Am I attacking any of you personally? Dissecting your grammar/spelling? Analyzing your posts for contradictions? Accusing you of being something or someone you aren't?

You know, most people respond well to criticism when they're not being made fun of or belittled. You might try that with me. I do enjoy learning things.

Well there was this :
Quote:
Any bets on how many more promises Obama will have to break in order for jimmac to snap out of it?

This doesn't seem to be about the issues either.

I'll repeat. What soloutions would you offer?
Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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post #60 of 188
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post

You know, most people respond well to criticism when they're not being made fun of or belittled. You might try that with me. I do enjoy learning things.

Katrina is still a very emotional subject for many people, and for me in particular as much as anyone. I suppose the fact that I've actually been in and seen the post-K destruction and ongoing decay from the lack of rebuilding in Chalmette (middle class, mostly white), Lakefront (middle class, mixed race), Lakeview (upper class, mostly white), New Orleans East (middle class, mostly black), and The Ninth Ward (lower class, mostly black) might have something to do with it. If I had to guess, I'd say you've either never been to New Orleans, or never been outside of the French Quarter there.

I do hope you are learning that your comparison of the circumstances in Fargo and NOLA is rather invalid. I'll try to bring less anger to the discussion if you are truly interested in learning the facts that make your comparison such a bad one.
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post #61 of 188
I'm sorry jimmac, the "snap out of it" question was meant in jest. I apologize if I offended you.

You going to answer the question, though?

How many more promises does Obama have to break?

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

Reply

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

Reply
post #62 of 188
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post

I'm sorry jimmac, the "snap out of it" question was meant in jest. I apologize if I offended you.

You going to answer the question, though?

How many more promises does Obama have to break?

Well you see I don't think he's been in office long enough to have broken anything. These are extraordinary times. It might be different if he didn't have to deal with all the crap he inherited.

How about answering my question that I've asked 3 times now.
Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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post #63 of 188
Quote:
Originally Posted by FormerLurker View Post

Katrina is still a very emotional subject for many people, and for me in particular as much as anyone. I suppose the fact that I've actually been in and seen the post-K destruction and ongoing decay from the lack of rebuilding in Chalmette (middle class, mostly white), Lakefront (middle class, mixed race), Lakeview (upper class, mostly white), New Orleans East (middle class, mostly black), and The Ninth Ward (lower class, mostly black) might have something to do with it. If I had to guess, I'd say you've either never been to New Orleans, or never been outside of the French Quarter there.

I do hope you are learning that your comparison of the circumstances in Fargo and NOLA is rather invalid. I'll try to bring less anger to the discussion if you are truly interested in learning the facts that make your comparison such a bad one.

I appreciate any information anyone brings to the discussion. We all form opinions based on our knowledge and experience, and that is why dialogue is important--so we can exchange information, share opinions, and learn together.

I have never been to New Orleans or Fargo. I am not an engineer. And I do see the ways in which my comparison was inaccurate. In retrospect it wasn't the best example to use and I apologize for any offense, as none was intended.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

Reply

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

Reply
post #64 of 188
4 times now.
Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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post #65 of 188
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

4 times now.

Dude. Seriously. Chill. I'm working on the answer. Trying to put some thought into it and come up with one where I don't contradict myself.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

Reply

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

Reply
post #66 of 188
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post


No one can stop all the ups and downs in life, but when you can predict them and prepare for them, it makes you feel good when you can ride them out and be in a good place.

I'm in a great place.

Wow,

All that money and security, and such an unselfish, caring, considerate, pleasant, decent person to boot.

It must be great to be you.

Im doing great aswell, thanks for asking.
post #67 of 188
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post

I appreciate any information anyone brings to the discussion. We all form opinions based on our knowledge and experience, and that is why dialogue is important--so we can exchange information, share opinions, and learn together.

I have never been to New Orleans or Fargo. I am not an engineer. And I do see the ways in which my comparison was inaccurate. In retrospect it wasn't the best example to use and I apologize for any offense, as none was intended.

Fair enough!

Let's try diverting the side discussion about New Orleans to something more positive.

What New Orleans musicians have you listened to, and which (if any) are among your favorites or personal influences?
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post #68 of 188
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post

Dude. Seriously. Chill. I'm working on the answer. Trying to put some thought into it and come up with one where I don't contradict myself.

Well you were quick to complain about what Obama was doing you must have had something in mind.
Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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post #69 of 188
Still collating that data?

Or maybe this is similar to one of trumptman's " Thought experiments ".

Let's see " My mind to my mind "

Well it's a sunny saturday where I live. Too sunny to waste all day on this.

Next time before you find fault with something someone is doing you'd better have something you'd do different to replace it with.
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post #70 of 188
Patience, my young Padawan.

What would I do to fix our current economic situation?

Short term:

First, I would make the Bush tax cuts permanent and implement further tax cuts across the board. The Reagan tax cuts brought us out of a recession and fueled unprecedented economic expansion. Put more money in the hands of the PEOPLE, not the coffers of the government. If tax cuts worked then, they'll work now.

Second, I would get the government out of the way of private sector and let the free market correct itself. If a business is going to fail, let it fail. A new business will rise up in its place. GM was "too big to fail", so we put the taxpayers on the line for billions of dollars to bail them out. Guess what: GM is still going to fail.

Third, I would significantly reduce government and stop the ridiculous pork spending. Which "business" is experiencing unprecedented growth during this down economy while most others are struggling or just trying to maintain the status quo? The government. They're hiring! Any business that needs to save money and cut expenses will lay off employees, downsize, sell assets, etc. The government should follow suit, rather than sign our children's children's children up to pay off a ridiculous amount of debt.

If tax cuts are implemented and government gets out of the way, the PEOPLE will figure this thing out. The government would supervise, but very rarely would it intervene (if at all) to the extent it already has.

Long term:
  • Return to the system of money referred to in the Constitution (the Gold Standard)
  • Repeal the Federal Reserve Act and reform the current Federal Reserve banks to become clearing houses only
  • Prohibit fractional reserve banking
  • Abolish the IRS and completely overhaul the current tax system, replacing it with a tariff-based revenue system supplemented with excise taxes

There's a lot more I would do that would probably help our economy prosper, but this is the gist of it.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

Reply
post #71 of 188
Good Lord!

Thats so un-Republican.
post #72 of 188
Quote:
Originally Posted by nordkapp View Post

Good Lord!

Thats so un-Republican.

Indeed it is.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

Reply

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

Reply
post #73 of 188
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post

Indeed it is.

Why dont you speculate for us what McCain and Palin would have done if in the distant parallel universe they inherited the same situation...
post #74 of 188
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post

Patience, my young Padawan.

What would I do to fix our current economic situation?

Short term:

First, I would make the Bush tax cuts permanent and implement further tax cuts across the board. The Reagan tax cuts brought us out of a recession and fueled unprecedented economic expansion. Put more money in the hands of the PEOPLE, not the coffers of the government. If tax cuts worked then, they'll work now.

Wow.

The fact that these are the EXACT SAME economic policies of the last 8 years doesn't even register with you, does it?

News Flash - if those policies were so great, we wouldn't be in the worst recession in 2 generations right now....
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post #75 of 188
Quote:
Originally Posted by FormerLurker View Post

Wow.

The fact that these are the EXACT SAME economic policies of the last 8 years doesn't even register with you, does it?

News Flash - if those policies were so great, we wouldn't be in the worst recession in 2 generations right now....

dont forget the "Long-term" as described by jazzguru, - Im sure even trumptman thinks thats a little bat-shit crazy

[edit]spellings!
post #76 of 188
Quote:
Originally Posted by nordkapp View Post

dont forget the "Long-term" as described by jizzguru, - Im sure even trumptman thinks thats a little bat-hit crazy

He should have just listed his long-term ideas like this:
Ron Paul!!!

It would have saved him a lot of typing.
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post #77 of 188
Quote:
Originally Posted by FormerLurker View Post

He should have just listed his long-term ideas like this:
Ron Paul!!!

It would have saved him a lot of typing.

In an ideal world where anything was possible, i'd go for old Ron, but as it is, the best we can do is just stave off the collapse of the Western World for as long as possible.

Oh shucks.
post #78 of 188
Quote:
Originally Posted by nordkapp View Post

In an ideal world where anything was possible, i'd go for old Ron, but as it is, the best we can do is just stave off the collapse of the Western World for as long as possible.

I Agree Completely.
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post #79 of 188
Quote:
Originally Posted by FormerLurker View Post

Wow.

The fact that these are the EXACT SAME economic policies of the last 8 years doesn't even register with you, does it?

News Flash - if those policies were so great, we wouldn't be in the worst recession in 2 generations right now....

You left out my second and third short-term items, neither of which were policies of the last 8 years.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

Reply
post #80 of 188
Quote:
Originally Posted by nordkapp View Post

Why dont you speculate for us what McCain and Palin would have done if in the distant parallel universe they inherited the same situation...

Why speculate? I didn't vote for them, anyway.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

Reply

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

Reply
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