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Microsoft looking to launch iPhone rival on Verizon's network - Page 3

post #81 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wiggin View Post

While I agree with everyone here that this would be a poor imitation of the iPhone, at best, this could also be a motivation for Apple to get in with Verizon. MS's phone doesn't need to be better than the iPhone, it only needs to be better than the other Verizon phones. MS could establish a beach head with Verizon customers making at more difficult for if/when Apple partners with Verizon.

The true genius of the App Store isn't that Apple makes money off of it, it's that it locks you into the iPhone. Once you've invested loads of money buying apps and spent hours learning them and entering your data, etc, you will be reluctant to switch to another device and have to start all over. The App Store is the equivalent of DRM in iTunes music. It locks you into Apple's hardware.

If MS can make an adequate phone (a long shot, but possible) and get people invest time and money in the platform, it will be more difficult for Apple to lure those customers away. But if Apple were to release an iPhone "lite" on Verizon's network before MS's phone is ready, they could prevent MS from ever getting a foothold.

Microsoft or Verizon won't strongarm Apple into making a deal. No way. Consider Verizon dead to Apple now.

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post #82 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by 801 View Post

Yea, Yea, This supposed product will mainly be released, if ever, for the entertainment of those of us on this site, but I have an odd question:

Does anyone know if there is an equivalent site, like AI, for Microsoft? Like, Microsoft Insider, or whatever would be the clever moniker for a Microsoft Site?

I would love to read it. And read the Apple bashing. Just to see what the reasoning was like.

Anyone? Anyone know the effect? Bueller? Anyone?

I stumble upon them from time to time... but I haven't found a true "Microsoft Insider" or "Think Windows" or anything like that. Yeah, it would be nice to see it for the comparison.

Me, I don't like either company, but use both because I have to. And Linux too. But that's hard to get exactly what you want on it too.
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post #83 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by nikon133 View Post

First reasonable post in this tread so far.

It is incredible how - according to AppleInsider - everything MS does is only because of Apple. Blackberry is still holding huge majority of businesses, and one of major points about Windows Mobile is integration with Exchange, but hey - why would MS want to compete with them, eh? There is only Apple and iPhone.

You're right about one thing. Promoting one point of view reinforces a certain amount of tunnel vision.

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post #84 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by iStink View Post

Everyone here is bashing Microsoft for making bad products, but then they are bashing them for trying to improve their products. What's the deal?

Microsoft is not just another company like Apple and most other companies that have not been convicted of illegal use of monopoly power. Many (most?) people have no memory of when Microsoft could commercially destroy an innovative new rival. The most famous example being Netscape and the browser. An earlier example was Lotus 123 which included some rhyme about how updates to DOS would not ship until 123 would crash. PenPoint was an innovative OS that Microsoft spent money and effort to crush. After they succeeded in its destruction they dropped all further development since they had accomplished their objective. Venture capitalists eventually learned the lesson and for years would not bother backing ventures that might be perceived as a threat of any sort to Microsoft and its OS monopoly.

The internet has gradually changed the landscape so this description may seem fictional but even today Microsoft continues to "innovate" the same way. So when they copy something it is hard for many of us to ignore all the earlier lessons of history. Microsoft elicits hatred because they worked hard to earn it.
post #85 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by hill60 View Post

/ahem, Newton.

ah, good point. Newton message pad had calendar and appointments before palm came out with their device. That was just an ill-thought example. There are plenty of things I could have used. In retrospect I could have said apple is copying windows mobile by introducing copy and paste into 3.0 ;P
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris_CA View Post

#1
#2
See #1

Well the response was to everyone's saying they are building a phone. Your attempt at conveying your message by saying as little as possible was a noble attempt
post #86 of 147
Point of interest about "Pink":

The Apple phone project was called Purple. The EDGE iPhone was known as Purple 2.

From the intense amount of journalism I've pored over it seems Purple 1 was *kind of* related to that joke slide from the iPhone keynote: one of the earliest concepts was to be an iPod video of sorts that was also a cell phone.

Of course, making the whole thing into a real software platform was a far, far better plan.
post #87 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by iMat View Post

This really smells desperation!!
Unbelievable. MS is the biggest case of "wannabe" I have ever seen in my life.

If it is true I do hope industry and consumers realize what MS is all about.

MSs business model is a failure in my opinion, and it is becoming more and more evident each day.

How true.

Having absolute majority - and monopoly - in OS and Office apps market can't be anything but failure.[/sarcasm]

The only problem MS have right now is - they are doing so great with their business model, regarding above mentioned markets, that they don't even try hard elsewhere, thus we have half-hearted attempts like Zune. But they do have potential - and funds. And there are talented people working - or wanting to work for them; heck, there are extremely talented people even working for Palm, GM, Chrysler...

I want MS to release all that raw talent and come out with great product - simply because I want Apple to come with revolutionary iPhone 3 or iPhone 4, rather than adding minor tweaks (like video recording, copy&paste) that should have been present from the beginning. I don't want Apple to fall asleep like Intel did before, releasing overpriced, overheating CPUs that were just a little speed-ups from previous generations - until AMD smacked them up with Athlon 64 and X2 - and forced them to reinvent themselves with Core 2 technology.
post #88 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by sdbryan View Post

Microsoft is not just another company like Apple and most other companies that have not been convicted of illegal use of monopoly power. Many (most?) people have no memory of when Microsoft could commercially destroy an innovative new rival. The most famous example being Netscape and the browser. An earlier example was Lotus 123 which included some rhyme about how updates to DOS would not ship until 123 would crash. PenPoint was an innovative OS that Microsoft spent money and effort to crush. After they succeeded in its destruction they dropped all further development since they had accomplished their objective. Venture capitalists eventually learned the lesson and for years would not bother backing ventures that might be perceived as a threat of any sort to Microsoft and its OS monopoly.

The internet has gradually changed the landscape so this description may seem fictional but even today Microsoft continues to "innovate" the same way. So when they copy something it is hard for many of us to ignore all the earlier lessons of history. Microsoft elicits hatred because they worked hard to earn it.

Everything you just said makes perfect sense, but as i said before, now that they are the underdog in a market like this, they shouldn't be bashed when trying to contend with Apple. I know they have a bad rep, but I think people are missing the bigger picture. I mean, the one thing I like most about the iphone is the excitement it has spurred in the smartphone/ppc market. Look at phones 2 years ago compared to now. It's wild.

I'm not one to defend Microsoft until my face turns blue btw. I just think the more companies there are in the smartphone/ppc market the better. Everyone here should feel the same way but they let their hatred for ms cloud their vision.

Now, lets just hope apple can do to the netbook market what they did to the smartphone market.
post #89 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by GTL215 View Post

What's the deal? The deal is that Microsoft is a company devoid of any sense of innovation, and only came to dominate the market because of their highly suspect business practices. There's nothing wrong with improving your products, but you deserve to be mocked when the only reason you're actually bothering with such improvement is because you've already had your ASS thoroughly handed to you by the competition. How many times must Microsoft "miss the boat" on hit products before people realize we no longer need them around?

I'd like to see what would world look like the next minute everyone decide they don't need MS any more and turn off all their Windows servers, workstations...

Oh, wait; on the second thought, I really would not like to see that mess.
post #90 of 147
Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzune.....: ???:
post #91 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by nikon133 View Post

I'd like to see what would world look like the next minute everyone decide they don't need MS any more and turn off all their Windows servers, workstations...

Oh, wait; on the second thought, I really would not like to see that mess.

You've already seen the mess, it's name is AIG, and it should be turned off.
post #92 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

Microsoft Corp. plans to take aim at Apple's iPhone with its own version of a touch-screen handset that could launch on Verizon's network sometime early in 2010...

This is bad news for the world, if Apple bites and goes early with Verizon. Not that the iPhone won't be able to hold up pretty well against such competition, but it will divert valuable people at Apple from working on the best long-term solutions towards supporting dead-end CDMA technology instead.
post #93 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post

Microsoft or Verizon won't strongarm Apple into making a deal. No way. Consider Verizon dead to Apple now.

Exactly. Apple is truly riding high with this technology at this point, and I do not see them trying to make too many deals. Certainly not with anyone that tries to 'strongarm' them, and even more unlikely with CDMA.

In yesterday's earnings announcement, Verizon's CEO, Seidenberg said (according to the paraphrase in the Wall Street Journal) that "it is unlikely that [Verizon] and Apple would partner to create a device tailored to Verizon's current network,..... CDMA."

I am having trouble believing this story.

Add: When I said "...this story.." I actually meant the story about Apple negotiating with Verizon. (I'll just leave this comment in here).
post #94 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by nikon133 View Post

First reasonable post in this tread so far.



Why are you paying so much sick and obsessive attention to everything MS does, or is gossiped to be doing..? Hate, fear..? I'm really not getting it.


It's hilarious, that's why. In the current (or maybe now dated) vernacular, M$ is an epic fail when it comes to their attempts to innovate, or is it replicate?


I'm certain this phone will fall short in similar ways the Zune did...just enough to make it almost cool but mostly -meh-

M$'s best attempts at entering the markets Apple has been, and appears to be, developing would best be started by killing off Apple's design team to give their own a fair chance.
post #95 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by iReality85 View Post

I agree. The contempt between Apple fanboys and Microsoft fanboys is only out done by the contempt that exists between Conservatives and Liberals here in the States

that's too general. how about pro-life and pro-choice or pornstars and vegans. well, you cant be real vegans if you give blowjobs
post #96 of 147
I'm not here to troll, just offer a point of view that's not blinded by any kind of loyalty. Just because I have an opinion different than yours doesn't mean I'm trolling. Never have I posted anything illogical or completely hateful against apple for no reason.

BTW I use this name on other forums. It stemmed from the Samsung Instinct forums I used to go to when I briefly owned that phone. You can check my profile over at techpowerup.com if you don't believe me.

Anyways, thanks for offering nothing to this thread in terms of an actual discussion on the article. Technically if there's a troll here it's you.
post #97 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

"While Microsoft is involved in the design of the phone's software and hardware,*a third-party*is expected to*make the device, just as Google Inc. has worked closely with partners to make handsets based on its Android operating system," the report says. No further details were reported.

Maybe already said but.....

I guess this allows Microsoft to not lose as much as they did on the Zune but still be in control of the device over all? Sounds like a failure in the works. Much like the Zune
post #98 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by lilgto64 View Post

Feature parity with your competition is one thing - but imagine a car commercial that proclaims our vehicles will all have airbags and anti lock brakes in a couple years - when the direct competition has had those features for years already.

LOL, I have a better anology;

Imagine a cell phone company anouncing that they will add an old industry standard feature like MMS sometime this summer. Or a smart phone maker anouncing cut and paste as a revolutionary new feature, or the potential for turn buy turn GPS. Oh wait, no need to imagine, Apple just did that!

I love my iPhone, and it does do some things the competition can't, but it has taken Apple a full two years after initial release to get some basic funtionality in the software. Can MS do it quicker? Maybe maybe not.

As for this rumored device being an iPhone killer, I would bet that if they are reallybuilding a new mobile phone OS, the bigger target is Android. MS is far more concerned about android phones and netbooks eating into the windows laptop market. Iphone is a minor annoyance to MS profits, Google threatens the monopoly because they will support 3rd party devices.
post #99 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by user_23 View Post

It's hilarious, that's why. In the current (or maybe now dated) vernacular, M$ is an epic fail when it comes to their attempts to innovate, or is it replicate?


I'm certain this phone will fall short in similar ways the Zune did...just enough to make it almost cool but mostly -meh-

M$'s best attempts at entering the markets Apple has been, and appears to be, developing would best be started by killing off Apple's design team to give their own a fair chance.

Don't agree.

MS is in that market for ages, though not overly successful lately. This phone - if there is any at all - will be just another winmobile phone, probably based on new/upgraded winmobile platform (as many others will) and made by a company that already makes winmobile phones. Only difference is, it might have Microsoft name printed instead of/alongside real manufacturer's name.

It will not completely suck because, with all the experience - own and borrowed from the others - it is hard nowadays to make completely useless smart phone; on the other hand, it is more likely to be just another "me, too" product than real killer; most of the phones are, statistically speaking.

And why killing iPhone's design team? It is much more useful to buy them over. Like Palm did with that Pre guy. Each team has many talented people who feel they'd be better project leaders than current one (and some actually might be) and will jump boats if right position - and right money - are on the table.

But all together, there is no real news there... nothing to justify such "enthusiasm".
post #100 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by iStink View Post

Everyone here is bashing Microsoft for making bad products, but then they are bashing them for trying to improve their products. What's the deal?

The deal is that Microsoft has not produce a product that seriously begins to compete with Apple's products in literally a decade, and yet Microsoft is consistently perceived as ramping up the competition with Apple.

Look, I'd be perfectly happy to see people talking about Google competing with Apple. I'd be delighted to talk about the people I know who've chucked their iPhones in favor of a G1, the people I know who've stuck by their iPhones, and why.

But media-time spent discussing Microsoft's entries into the markets that Apple's choosing to dominate are sort of a waste of time, and clearly missing the point.


That point, for them what haven't noticed, is that Microsoft is living on their inheritance: they're unable to bring new product to market in anything like a reasonable timeframe, and the products that they have brought to market in the past 5 years (Vista, Zune, Windows Mobile 7) fail to gain traction even with their core userbase or (XBox, 360) fail to produce actual profits.


So, for my own part, I think it's completely reasonable to find Microsoft's entry into a market as laughable. And, yes, I recognize that MS is hardly "entering" the smartphone market, since they've been there since WinCE back in the 1990s; we're really just talking about another semi-generic HTC platform running WM, but this one happen to have Microsoft's name on the front... That's why I appreciate that a lot of the conversation here has been focused on the decisions and negotiations that *do* get made by the guys whose name is on the box (to whit, negotiating with the network provider for what features will be enabled / required / unavailable)
post #101 of 147
On a different, but slightly related topic....Is there truth to the rumor that the Xbox 360 uses the powerpc mac processor? I saw this potential factoid posted in a completely unrelated forum, however, if it's true, it does speak to M$ whoring the competition. \

UPDATE: Before the launch of the Xbox 360, several alpha development kits were spotted using Apple's Power Mac G5 hardware. This was due to the system's PowerPC 970 processor running the same PowerPC architecture that the Xbox 360 would eventually run under IBM's Xenon processor. - Wiki
post #102 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by AIaddict View Post

LOL, I have a better anology;

Imagine a cell phone company anouncing that they will add an old industry standard feature like MMS sometime this summer. Or a smart phone maker anouncing cut and paste as a revolutionary new feature, or the potential for turn buy turn GPS. Oh wait, no need to imagine, Apple just did that!

I love my iPhone, and it does do some things the competition can't, but it has taken Apple a full two years after initial release to get some basic funtionality in the software. Can MS do it quicker? Maybe maybe not.

As for this rumored device being an iPhone killer, I would bet that if they are reallybuilding a new mobile phone OS, the bigger target is Android. MS is far more concerned about android phones and netbooks eating into the windows laptop market. Iphone is a minor annoyance to MS profits, Google threatens the monopoly because they will support 3rd party devices.

Completely agree.

Plus, they'd probably like to get a piece of RIM's corporate market.

I'm not saying they are not looking at - and trying to analyse - success of iPhone, but knowing MS, they would like to re-establish themselves at business end of market first, before dwelling to personal/home market. It also makes more sense since they already have strong presence and products (Exchange) they can use to promote new Winmobile platforms and products.
post #103 of 147
i don't see the problem with bashing microsoft. bash away, i say.
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post #104 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by jpklock View Post

That point, for them what haven't noticed, is that Microsoft is living on their inheritance: they're unable to bring new product to market in anything like a reasonable timeframe, and the products that they have brought to market in the past 5 years (Vista, Zune, Windows Mobile 7) fail to gain traction even with their core userbase or (XBox, 360) fail to produce actual profits.

I think they are doing quite well on some markets, and are far from just living on inheritance; Server 2008 is, for example, great product and Hyper-V is technology that will be important on corporate market in following years. And will generate big money on licensing and user CALs.

360 is doing OK, much as I know. It is still way ahead of PS3 and has decent number of exclusive titles. When it came out, it was really an edge over any other existing console at the time.

Vista is cannon fodder - an ice breaker for Windows 7. Microsoft did the same - and with success - with Windows 2000 and XP. All I can see there is that they are following their own business practice that worked well in past.

I really wouldn't call that living on inheritance.
post #105 of 147
When I spend my hard earned money on electronics, I want it to be cool. Microsoft has never created anything cool. They simply do not know what cool is. Whatever it is that they are working on will be just a copy of someone else's work.
post #106 of 147
oh dear....

I have to say that it continues to baffle me how Microsoft can continue to put out such terrible consumer products. I absolutely blame it squarely on inept, stubborn, and greedy management.

Over the last few years as I got into desktop and web app development on the Windows .NET platform, I have read, viewed, or listened to all types of articles, technical papers, books, interviews, tutorials, conferences, etc written/created/given by Microsoft employees, from both the commercial development guys and the Microsoft research/U of Washington unit. And I have to say that they have an amazing amount of human capital .. the sheer brain power at that company among their legions of highly intelligent and highly skilled employees is incredible.

Now how all of that genius gets translated into the unintuitive, unstable, and inefficient windows OSs, Microsofts' completely failed online strategy, The Zune, the wretched Windows CE and Windows mobile, etc I do not know.

They are probably the best example of how much potential can be squandered and how many resources can be thrown down the toilet when a large company is under incompetent arrogant leadership.

(That said, to be fair, I will say that Microsoft's development infrastructure and enterprise/server software is far better than anything they've done for their consumer products. I guess the XBOX series has been successful)
post #107 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post

Microsoft or Verizon won't strongarm Apple into making a deal. No way. Consider Verizon dead to Apple now.

Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post

Exactly. Apple is truly riding high with this technology at this point, and I do not see them trying to make too many deals. Certainly not with anyone that tries to 'strongarm' them, and even more unlikely with CDMA.

In yesterday's earnings announcement, Verizon's CEO, Seidenberg said (according to the paraphrase in the Wall Street Journal) that "it is unlikely that [Verizon] and Apple would partner to create a device tailored to Verizon's current network,..... CDMA."

I am having trouble believing this story.

Add: When I said "...this story.." I actually meant the story about Apple negotiating with Verizon. (I'll just leave this comment in here).

Of course, I said nothing about anyone being in a position to strong-arm Apple. I was only suggesting that it would be more efficient for Apple to simply prevent MS (or anyone else) from gaining any appreciable % of Verizon's customer base in the first place, rather than have to take it from them later on. Something as simple as the rumored iPhone lite would be enough to prevent any Verizon customers from even thinking about any other phone. And Apple would then have a whole flock of customers ready to upgrade to a full-blown iPhone when the time comes.
post #108 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by winterspan View Post

oh dear....

I have to say that it continues to baffle me how Microsoft can continue to put out such terrible consumer products. I absolutely blame it squarely on inept, stubborn, and greedy management.

Over the last few years as I got into desktop and web app development on the Windows .NET platform, I have read, viewed, or listened to all types of articles, technical papers, books, interviews, tutorials, conferences, etc written/created/given by Microsoft employees, from both the commercial development guys and the Microsoft research/U of Washington unit. And I have to say that they have an amazing amount of human capital .. the sheer brain power at that company among their legions of highly intelligent and highly skilled employees is incredible.

Now how all of that genius gets translated into the unintuitive, unstable, and inefficient windows OSs, Microsofts' completely failed online strategy, The Zune, the wretched Windows CE and Windows mobile, etc I do not know.

They are probably the best example of how much potential can be squandered and how many resources can be thrown down the toilet when a large company is under incompetent arrogant leadership.

(That said, to be fair, I will say that Microsoft's development infrastructure and enterprise/server software is far better than anything they've done for their consumer products. I guess the XBOX series has been successful)

Bigger you are, more inertia you have.

Everything has it's price. When you are catering to vast majority of home users and almost all business users, you are much more limited than other... less involved players.

MS has to keep backward compatibility, and that feature has huge luggage of it's own. So many different hardware vendors. So many software developers. Business demands. You name it.

Can MS create desktop OS that will completely give up on registry, NTFS... all the technologies MS is dragging for ages? I bet they can. But think of it - all the bad publicity Vista picked up for trying to do some (arguably) small, evolutionary changes in OS structure; what would happen if MS decided to turn page completely and do new OS from scratch..? No one would even look at it.

I think that MS will try to address this changes-stopper in a different manner in the future. Windows 7 will have - according to the latest reports - virtual Windows XP environment within. If I understood correctly (I just had a glimpse), legacy software installed under virtual machine will be accessible under native Windows 7 environment, without need to open virtual machine first; if that gives good results compatibility and performance wise, I wouldn't be surprised if next iteration of Windows doesn't have much more revolutionary changes - with functional virtual XP/Vista.

I also wouldn't agree Vista is not intuitive, or is unstable by the design. Most stability issues were caused by sloppy drivers hardware vendors were initially releasing for Vista; people got spoiled by 7 years of supporting same one platform, XP. But at present, with drivers reaching reasonable maturity, Vista is quite robust. Can't compare it with OSX as I'm not using it, but Vista is more stable product than XP - and by a margin. And XP wasn't bad at all when released - major problem there is MS was dragging it for too long.

Other points - I agree with you, mostly. Zune wasn't such bad product but MS didn't really bother much to market and support it. Add to that MS's existing image (boring, corporate) and lack of marketing presence (until recently), from this point of view it really isn't such a surprise Zune failed. Lets face it - even if MS and Apple would release same consumer product under both names, I bet Apple would sell better - such is the power of Apple's consumer image.

I think that MS is slowly turning it's approach to consumer market, and is doing that from multiple angles. Marketing campaign. United front with hardware manufacturers. Microsoft stores. Publicity Windows 7 is receiving, effort MS is putting in new features (even with all the architectural limitations they are still dealing with) - and the way MS is promoting them. But they are huge monster, and as such require time and space to turn 180 degrees. They'll get there - eventually.

Back to phones - I really hope Pre, Winmobile, Android will be good and do well. I recall times when there was almost no competition in CPU and GPU markets, and really sub par results such environments were producing. I want as much competition as I can get. I want all of them to wow me, and keep wowing me in the future, rather than just providing me with small updates and stability/performance fixes.
post #109 of 147
Without singling out the pros and cons of MS as a company, they will have a much harder time trying to emulate what Apple has done. Logistically speaking, Apple has made things as simple as possible with their handset, whose only HW difference each year was storage capacity, and a 2nd year model with many of the same part, including display size, which has made the SDK and App Store much easier to create and advance. Unless MS (and others) are going to move to a simplified HW platform for their handset creating an SDk and App Store to rival the iPhone will be exponentially more difficult to complete. Especially if they continue to bow to carrier demands, like Verizon wanting devices with less RAM, no Bluetooth, etc. (example video). It looks like Palm is doing that with the Pre and by starting (hoping just starting) their SDK off with tried and true webcode. If anything is going to compete head-to-head with Apple's ecosystem it is Palm.
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post #110 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dlux View Post

Awesoooooome!!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WRLRjKCGHek


And what's up with 'Pink'?

If you're going to copy Apple, at least don't copy the parts that failed.

Great video!

Speaking of Pink, didn't Microsoft have a project at one point named Pink that never came to fruition, it ended up being all made up or something to try & hype up their position & discourage competition from even trying.

Anyone else remember that or am I cracked?
post #111 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by iStink View Post

Oh how the hatred flies around here. Lets all say the same thing and agree, that makes it right!

First of all, I doubt there's any truth to this. Microsoft has stated for months now they won't make the phone, they'll make the software. Companies like samsung and HTC make the hardware.

Secondly, even if Microsoft DID attempt at a good phone, WHAT THE FUCK IS WRONG WITH THAT PEOPLE? Apple ignited competition! That's awesome. Instead of bashing anyone who comes along and tries to step up to said competition, you should embrace it and hope it drives Apple to deliver an even better product.

Seriously, the level of contempt you people have for Microsoft amazes me. I know they fuck up, but reasoning around here is starting to go beyond facts and more like mere opinion driven by other hateful comments.

Don't hate on competition, embrace it. Root for Microsoft, hope they deliver, because in the long run you'll profit from it.




Sounds more plausible to be honest.

I agree. So what if they make a phone and it flops. Is it costing the "so-called" share holders in this forum anything? No.... If it gets traction, Apple will respond as will the other producers and a healthy competition will be born with the upside being that consumers will get better and better products. The fanboyism and Appleista fetish of this forum is sickening at best. Some of you zealots really need to grow up.
post #112 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by iStink View Post

I'm not here to troll, just offer a point of view that's not blinded by any kind of loyalty. Just because I have an opinion different than yours doesn't mean I'm trolling. Never have I posted anything illogical or completely hateful against apple for no reason.

BTW I use this name on other forums. It stemmed from the Samsung Instinct forums I used to go to when I briefly owned that phone. You can check my profile over at techpowerup.com if you don't believe me.

Anyways, thanks for offering nothing to this thread in terms of an actual discussion on the article. Technically if there's a troll here it's you.

Dude,

You do not have to justify yourself to anyone in this forum, let alone those calling you a troll. This is par for the course if you offer anything other than: "Apple, Apple uber alles". The only posters in this forum worth paying attention to are: solipsism, melgross, and virgil-TB2, as they post with logic and good arguments and not from emotion, and can see the benefits in all technology. Not just stuff out of Culpertino.
post #113 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by sapporobabyrtrns View Post

I agree. So what if they make a phone and it flops. Is it costing the "so-called" share holders in this forum anything? No.... If it gets traction, Apple will respond as will the other producers and a healthy competition will be born with the upside being that consumers will get better and better products. The fanboyism and Appleista fetish of this forum is sickening at best. Some of you zealots really need to grow up.

Apple is foremost a company software too but unlike MS they make their own hardware to run it

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post #114 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by P L View Post

Apple is foremost a company software too but unlike MS they make their own hardware to run it

oops: "software company" And was meant as answer to iStink !

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post #115 of 147
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Originally Posted by P L View Post

oops: "software company" And was meant as answer to iStink !

No worries. I got your drift.
post #116 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by sennen View Post

i don't see the problem with bashing microsoft. bash away, i say.

"Can't we all just get along?"

Rodney King
post #117 of 147
articles have been run probably by shills for verizon to say apple is in talks, perhaps to put pressure on ATT, they don't need any more pressure than ATT last financials
verizon is getting behind in speed as per ATT data roll out, and if apple makes a evdo it will be obsolete in two years as one writer said evdo will be edge in two years.
long story short
verizon wants people to THINK the iphone is coming to verizon to keep them from switching, see how many already have to ATT

apple won't be on verizon MS rumor of a "loon"phone (to rhymn with zune and for anyone thinking it will work) quarantees that iphone won't be on the verizon network

shills trying to keep verizon people from splitting, how many contracts are up for renewal next 3-4 months.

MS phone "loon phone"
I APPLE THEREFORE I AM
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I APPLE THEREFORE I AM
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post #118 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by sapporobabyrtrns View Post

Dude,

You do not have to justify yourself to anyone in this forum, let alone those calling you a troll. This is par for the course if you offer anything other than: "Apple, Apple uber alles". The only posters in this forum worth paying attention to are: solipsism, melgross, and virgil-TB2, as they post with logic and good arguments and not from emotion, and can see the benefits in all technology. Not just stuff out of Culpertino.

Dude- That's totally you own opinion . 2 out of those 3 are totally biased fanboyz. Speak for yourself.
post #119 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by GTL215 View Post

What's the deal? The deal is that Microsoft is a company devoid of any sense of innovation, and only came to dominate the market because of their highly suspect business practices. There's nothing wrong with improving your products, but you deserve to be mocked when the only reason you're actually bothering with such improvement is because you've already had your ASS thoroughly handed to you by the competition. How many times must Microsoft "miss the boat" on hit products before people realize we no longer need them around?

That happened many years ago.
post #120 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by UltimateKylie View Post

Microsoft doesn't innovate? Pure lies!

Microsoft was the first to introduce a HDD in gaming consoles. Before you couldn't save game without going out and buying a memory card first. Now all consoles have included HDD or Flash memory at no extra cost.
Microsoft was the first to successfully create online gaming thru Xbox Live.
Microsoft Windows Media Center is extremely innovate, indeed surpassing Tivo in functionality and style while not requiring a subscription for Guide data.
Photosynth is innovative.

And while the Zune was a last ditch copy of the iPod system. It itself brought new idea such as WiFi syncing, WiFi sharing, FM song recognition, Zune Marketplace on a small Nano sized device. We still don't have iTunes Store on the iPod Nano do we?

I think to dismiss Microsoft as being lazy, only copying is quite stupid. They brought Windows Mobile that had all the capabilities of the iPhone years before the iPhone was dreamed. Sure it was sluggish (100% do to multitasking) and the interphase was based on Windows 95/98. But to claim the iPhone was a new market or new type of device is wrong. Windows Media Player would sync GBs of music to Windows Mobile phones equipped with SD cards. The only thing that the iPhone really innovated was to be completely touch (though at the expense of the accuracy of resistive screens) and the innovative Safari browser. Microsoft vision was different, to really create two internets. A regular one and a mobile one. (Hence even the creation of .Mobi) Nokia with Symbian and pretty much everyone else adopted this 'two web' idea. The iPhone did change that. Though in other discussions I have had about netbooks and Apple's stance on them with the iPod Touch or iPhone being a replacement I have received the argument that most sites are now a different mobile version and not the full version so the need for zoom is not required and thus the fact that you have more screen real estate on a netbook is mute. That argument only confirms Microsoft initiative with PocketIE back in 2000 which no did do regular pages but did work well and still does with pages created for the mobile web. We will see how PocketIE in 6.5 and 7.0 compete with Opera and Safari in the mobile sphere but PocketIE was another Microsoft Innovation that I used in 2000 and did well for getting certain sites on the go. Microsoft biggest fault with Windows Mobile was not broadening its appeal, making it faster or easier to use. It felt that only corporate users would be interested in such a device or geeks. No, I think and have always thought that eventually everyone will want a smartphone. I knew that since my first PocketPC in 2000.

microsoft is incompetent. they cannot and do not innovate. they are wannabes and pathetic at that.

windows mobile 6.5 says it all.
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