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Apple execs disclose options for boosting iPhone market share - Page 3

post #81 of 95
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

There is no theory, there is only proof. Apple has not chosen to sell subsidized iPhones to all major carriers in any country. You mention France, which it appears you are from, as an experiment. There was no French experiment, there were only laws governing the ways companies can do business. Apple sells the subsidized iPhone to Orange and the unlocked, unsubsidized iPhone to everyone else for an outrageous price. French laws, as I'm sure you know, have restricted locking to no more than 6 months since 1998.

Hop over to Germany. Where Vodafone sought an injunction to not allow T-Mobile to be the only provider of the iPhone. Apple sold the handset for $1,481 USD to discourage sales (remember this was EDGE only at the time). That doesn't sound like an experiment, but a way of circumventing the law while still being within the letter of the law. German iPhones get unlocked after 2 years.

Yes, and this is because I'm speaking about how it happens in France. Can not say how it was in Germany. The prices in France are approximately the same at any of 3 iPhone sellers. The price of iPhone itself is one and the same at Orange and at SFR.
It was not all about money. While Orange were careful, precise and correct about any least comma in contracts and stood on the base of their solid network, SFR didn't care much to make any efforts after their "victory" before eyes of that Commission. They were instantly caught on false advertising. This is not the first time they were, but what may have been tolerated with cheap phones, can not be so with iPhone, which is in the focus of everyone's attention.
Apple have little to do with their business habits... Apple have nothing to do either with the fact Bouygues have 3G coverage merely in their dreams.


Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

I still gotten a viable answer as to why Apple would continue to make carrier lock-ins if their only focus was to sell as many units as possible in the shortest amount of time.

Khm... Don't you remember how sales suffered in the beginning?

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People are lovers, basically. -- Engadget livebloggers at the iPad mini event.

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post #82 of 95
Quote:
Originally Posted by ivan.rnn01 View Post

Don't you remember how sales suffered in the beginning?

I remember lines of people and sold out stores when it went on sale in the US, but that doesn't answer the question as to why Apple should make an extra thick iPhone that supports T-Mobile's WCDMA radios and CDMA/EV-DO chips or create another iPhone or two for these other US carriers when they don't they don't want to sell their phone unfettered to countries that are completely GSM/WCDMA with the exact radios that that are already present? To not acknowledge this is to not look at the Apple's goals here.
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post #83 of 95
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

I remember lines of people and sold out stores when it went on sale in the US, but that doesn't answer the question as to why Apple should make an extra thick iPhone that supports T-Mobile's WCDMA radios and CDMA/EV-DO chips or create another iPhone or two for these other US carriers when they don't they don't want to sell their phone unfettered to countries that are completely GSM/WCDMA with the exact radios that that are already present? To not acknowledge this is to not look at the Apple's goals here.

Why? It hits the nail on the head. Apple weren't phone maker until recently. And gradual prudent changes are their nature. Why to throw 150 different phones on the market and have headaches of the launch (this is the first Apple's phone, remember it) with all of those phones on different networks. It's Microsoft's approach.

And there were no lines abroad. And it was Orange and neither SFR nor Bouygues, who performed that break-dance of business schemes to make iPhone attractive for customers.

We mean Apple no harm.

People are lovers, basically. -- Engadget livebloggers at the iPad mini event.

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We mean Apple no harm.

People are lovers, basically. -- Engadget livebloggers at the iPad mini event.

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post #84 of 95
Quote:
Originally Posted by ivan.rnn01 View Post

And there were no lines abroad. And it was Orange and neither SFR nor Bouygues, who performed that break-dance of business schemes to make iPhone attractive for customers.

If there were no lines and the device was released to most countries over a year after the original iPhone was launched and well proven to be a consumer media phone contender worth copying, then why did not sell to all those GSM/WCDMA based carriers in all those carriers to get more sales.
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post #85 of 95
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

If there were no lines and the device was released to most countries over a year after the original iPhone was launched and well proven to be a consumer media phone contender worth copying, then why did not sell to all those GSM/WCDMA based carriers in all those carriers to get more sales.

Because, as it appeared to be, this does not blow the doors of sales off that much and may even hurt the reputation.

We mean Apple no harm.

People are lovers, basically. -- Engadget livebloggers at the iPad mini event.

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post #86 of 95
Quote:
Originally Posted by ivan.rnn01 View Post

Because, as it appeared to be, this does not blow the doors of sales off that much and may even hurt the reputation.

Half the sales come from outside the US and from carriers that don't have a dominate subscriber base. If they went for an open free for all in those countries the sales would be significantly higher.

You are saying that Apple SHOULD spend the money on R&D to make a CDMA iPhone for Sprint and Verizon in the US and a GSM/WCDMA iPhone for T-Mobile because the carrier lock in means absolutely nothing to Apple in the US , but selling their already made iPhone without any changes whatsoever to the HW doesn't make sense for all those GSM/WCDMA countries that don't have disparate networks with uncommon 3G radios. With all due respect, that doesn't make any sense. On top of that, the new network variances in each device increase how many they have to keep on hand while increasing customer confusion and , most of all, losing the one thing that will push the iPhone further than other media phones in the future, the carrier lock in.

This whole Apple should make a phone for Verizon doesn't make any sense. It's mostly an emotional response from people who prefer the cell quality of CDMA and the coverage of Verizon but don't want to look at the big picture.
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post #87 of 95
PS: It's now available in 88 countries, they advertise the GSM/UMTS/HSDPA as being a "worldphone" standard and the 3 new countries coming soon each have a single carrier, exclusivity attached to them. Guinea-Bissau and Equatorial Guinea with Orange, and Qatar with Vodafone.

That will be 91 countries and after two years of use they are still pushing the single carrier model in every country where the laws allow it. If it's not apparent that Apple's business model relies on having access to the carrier with the lock-in then I I don't have the skills to make it anymore clearer that I already have. I can't even get an answer to my oft asked question about the continued lock-ins so I'll have to leave it at that as I really don't have anything else to say on this matter.
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post #88 of 95
Until I can buy a new iphone from Apple that's unlocked so I can pick my own provider you won't see me buying a new phone. At&T's price gouging is unacceptable to me & should be to anyone who values getting a good cellular plan that's in line with other companies. T-Mobile offers a $135 rebate for those that need to port over another number, a college student discount plus unlimited minutes, 200 text & unlimited internet (edge only) for less than $50.00 -- Yes this figure is correct because that's what I pay & my iPhone preforms great.
post #89 of 95
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lancelot9201 View Post

Until I can buy a new iphone from Apple that's unlocked so I can pick my own provider you won't see me buying a new phone. At&T's price gouging is unacceptable to me & should be to anyone who values getting a good cellular plan that's in line with other companies. T-Mobile offers a $135 rebate for those that need to port over another number, a college student discount plus unlimited minutes, 200 text & unlimited internet (edge only) for less than $50.00 -- Yes this figure is correct because that's what I pay & my iPhone preforms great.

I understand not wanting to go to a particular carrier, but AT&T is right in line with the other major carrier in the US. Sprint and T-Mobile are having to lower prices and increase services to get consumers to stay. Sprint has lost millions of subs to AT&T and Verizon and T-Mobile only added 384k in the three month period between December 2008 and March 2009. Despite that gain in subs and their 4% increase in gross revenue, they lost over 4% in profits, but that isn't a big deal for T-Mobile USA as their backer will surely have longterm plans that supersede any short-term loses. They need to get their 3G network up and once 4G is up in 5 years they will be a good option for many

If T-Mobile suits your needs then use them, you can certainly get good rates with them right now, but AT&T is not making the iPhone rates unreasonably high.
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post #90 of 95
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

I understand not wanting to go to a particular carrier, but AT&T is right in line with the other major carrier in the US. Sprint and T-Mobile are having to lower prices and increase services to get consumers to stay. Sprint has lost millions of subs to AT&T and Verizon and T-Mobile only added 384k in the three month period between December 2008 and March 2009. Despite that gain in subs and their 4% increase in gross revenue, they lost over 4% in profits, but that isn't a big deal for T-Mobile USA as their backer will surely have longterm plans that supersede any short-term loses. They need to get their 3G network up and once 4G is up in 5 years they will be a good option for many

If T-Mobile suits your needs then use them, you can certainly get good rates with them right now, but AT&T is not making the iPhone rates unreasonably high.

Now that's longterm thinking aka Apples way!

"TRAVEL is Fatal to Prejudice,Bigotry,Narrowmindedness"mt

TRY IT!

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"TRAVEL is Fatal to Prejudice,Bigotry,Narrowmindedness"mt

TRY IT!

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post #91 of 95
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

Half the sales come from outside the US and from carriers that don't have a dominate subscriber base. If they went for an open free for all in those countries the sales would be significantly higher.

This is where the theory doesn't get well along with practice. The sales don't appear to be significantly higher. Not higher enough to justify headaches.

Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

You are saying that Apple SHOULD spend the money on R&D to make a CDMA iPhone for Sprint and Verizon in the US and a GSM/WCDMA iPhone for T-Mobile because the carrier lock in means absolutely nothing to Apple in the US , but selling their already made iPhone without any changes whatsoever to the HW doesn't make sense for all those GSM/WCDMA countries that don't have disparate networks with uncommon 3G radios. With all due respect, that doesn't make any sense. On top of that, the new network variances in each device increase how many they have to keep on hand while increasing customer confusion and , most of all, losing the one thing that will push the iPhone further than other media phones in the future, the carrier lock in.

No. Upon 2 years of iPhone's triumph, I'd say it's up to carriers to make an effort and to launch small parcels of network, that iPhone is made for.

Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

This whole Apple should make a phone for Verizon doesn't make any sense. It's mostly an emotional response from people who prefer the cell quality of CDMA and the coverage of Verizon but don't want to look at the big picture.

+1

We mean Apple no harm.

People are lovers, basically. -- Engadget livebloggers at the iPad mini event.

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We mean Apple no harm.

People are lovers, basically. -- Engadget livebloggers at the iPad mini event.

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post #92 of 95
Its just not worth the huge hit to get out of a contract and then have to pony up tons of money to get an iphone.

Apple is missing out on sales b/c of their exclusive arrangement. Maybe it's worth it.
post #93 of 95
Quote:
Originally Posted by freakboy View Post

Its just not worth the huge hit to get out of a contract and then have to pony up tons of money to get an iphone.

Apple is missing out on sales b/c of their exclusive arrangement. Maybe it's worth it.

The contract cancelation is only $175. You can buy an iPhone at $199 under contract, then say you lost/stole/broke it or whatever the next day and pay the cancellation fee. You will prorated for the amount used, not the full month. That is cheaper than buying it the in-contract price for current AT&T customers and surely cheaper than what it would cost you unsubsidized.

But that isn't your real issue. Regardless of how much you pay for it it still won't do 3G on T-Mobile or work on Sprint or Verizon, even if you got it unlocked.

Logically speaking, the exclusivity agreements have to profitable otherwise Apple wouldn't continue doing them and other, more established phone vendors wouldn't continue to do them for their new, higher-end devices. BB Storm is with Verizon, Palm Pre is with Sprint, HTC Android is with T-Mo and those are only a few of the recent model releases.
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post #94 of 95
[QUOTE=AppleInsider;1417327]Apple executives said this week they believe the iPhone remains in its infancy and went on to -- somewhat uncharacteristically -- reveal a series of strategic measures they may employ in the near term to help grow the handset's share of the booming smartphone market.

I have had an AT&T account and used it Nationwide. Customer service was horrible. I paid the cancellation fee. Used Sprint and customer service was good. Coverage could have been better.
Went with Verizon had poor customer service and billing issues. But the coverage awesome.
Then I went with Cingular....I was in cell phone heaven. Finally trouble free billing and great customer service and coverage until AT&T bought Cingular. Gradually Cingular service and customer service became worse. A friend with Verizon offered for me to Hitch a ride on her account. Now I have someone who knows how to talk to these folks and watch the billing. I have great coverage and a so so phone.
I want an IPHONE but what good is it without good customer service... I would prefer dealing with APPLE, Not AT&T. APPLE has the best customer service ever. I suspect AT&T has improved coverage. I hope so. But they have the rudest customer service. AT7T needs to take lessons from APPLE on how to work with customers.
If Verizon hooks up with APPLE...BRAVO! I will not use another phone with WINDOWS on it. To buggy!
post #95 of 95
are not the only input for customer demand planning

We mean Apple no harm.

People are lovers, basically. -- Engadget livebloggers at the iPad mini event.

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We mean Apple no harm.

People are lovers, basically. -- Engadget livebloggers at the iPad mini event.

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