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iPhone rival Palm Pre to sell for $199 after rebate on June 6th - Page 2

post #41 of 430
Quote:
Originally Posted by al_bundy View Post

there are already rumors that Palm is going to have a model for Verizon later this year

Yes- 6 months supposedly after its release,it goes to Verizon. Did Palm make a CDMA version as well?
post #42 of 430
The only problem I see, is that it's on Sprint, and they are probably the worst of the major 4 carriers in the US.
post #43 of 430
Quote:
Originally Posted by Maury Markowitz View Post

I've been waiting for someone to point out a single killer feature on this phone for weeks now. Here we are, approaching launch, and I still haven't seen one. Let's see: it's fat and heavy, it's linked to Sprint who is widely derided as the worst US carrier, it has no apps (yet) and the company is short on cash.

Now we learn it doesn't even compete on price, until after a mail-in rebate? Mail in rebate? Are you joking?!

Dead.

Wait, here's something: "You can move back and forth between text messaging and e-mail, or search the web while you listen to music," the company said. "You can rearrange items simply by dragging them, and when you are done with something, just throw it away by flicking it off the top of the screen.

Wow! All the things I already do on my iPhone. No seriously, I can do every single one of those things right now. SMS comes up in a pop-up when you're in other apps, and the iPod plays under everything else.

Dead.

Maury

it's supposed to run any app designed for previous palm devices which is around 80,000 from what i heard. and porting apps to it is supposed to be easy and 4000 iphone apps are supposed to be ready for it by next month or so
post #44 of 430
Quote:
Originally Posted by teckstud View Post

I'd rather take any stupid rebate from these companies than no rebate from Apple.
I hate rebates too but still prefer it to nothing or $100 off the company's products.

You may not get the rebate. That's why they offer it that way.

Believe me, I know. I used to be on Sprint. Half of the rebates they refused to give me, even though I was very careful to do exactly what was demanded.

With one, they said that I sent it in too late, even thought I did it online, the very same day. Another time they said that I didn't fill one out correctly, even though I had made a copy, and showed them that I did.

Another time, I was told that I would be given a new phone for one that was broken, and that I should go back to the Sprint store I bought it from, only to have the manager of the store tell me that they didn't have to do what the Sprint telephone reps said they should.

Believe me, Sprint is not a wonderful place to be at.

If they're offering this with a $100 rebate, I guarantee that a fair number of people won't get it, or will have a hell of a time getting it. That's the whole point of rebates.

It used to be that when I sent rebate info in to companies that do that for the sellers, I always got my money. But increasingly over the past few years, that hasn't been so. You really have to fight for it, and so I usually rather buy something that hasn't got a rebate, from a place that has lower prices, but not as low as it would be with a rebate. I figure that over the long haul, I'm doing just as well with a lot less frustration.

As far as this phone goes, the only possible advantage seems to be concurrent programsif it works as well as they say it does, which is something no one knows yet because they haven't allowed it out of the lab except for a couple of short, controlled excursions.

The upper row of keys is too close to the overhanging bottom of the body of the device, something that was mentioned by two reporters allowed to use it for a few minutes under supervision. The screen is quite a bit smaller that the one in the iPhone. 3.1" vs 3.5" may not sound too different, but it is.

At the same price as the current 8 GB iPhone when you, hopefully, get your rebate back from Sprint, it may not be much of a deal either. After all, despite what you say about getting rebates over Apple not giving any, you forget (conveniently, it seems) that this phone WITH the rebate costs the same as Apple's 8 GB model WITHOUT the rebate, and without the rebate (which you may not get), it costs the same as Apple's 16 GB model. Not very impressive. It's very possible that Apple will offer a $199 model with 16 GB and a $299 model with 32 GB this summer on top of that.

If so, how are they going to make money on this without having to drop the price further? If they have to do that, someone will take a big loss. Neither Palm or Sprint can afford that now, with both losing customers at such high rates, along with currently having large losses.
post #45 of 430
Quote:
Originally Posted by guinness View Post

The only problem I see, is that it's on Sprint, and they are probably the worst of the major 4 carriers in the US.

Oh GOD don't even get me started. Sprint has been some of the worst, and best experiences I've had. You know what I tell people thinking of switching to sprint? As long as you never have to deal with customer service, everything will be hunky dory! That's the truth. Dealing with customer service will enrage you beyond anything you've felt. Some people flat out hang up on you. It's painfully obvious Sprint cuts cost by hiring morons for tier 1 and 2 level customer support.
post #46 of 430
Quote:
Originally Posted by GTL215 View Post

sorry teckstud but he's right. I'm not sure where he's getting that $200-300 figure, but it's definitely a joke to pay the extra $100 up front, including tax, then wait for a rebate.

Maybe I'm the only one but I had no qualms about buying a printer from the Apple store with my last two Mac purchases and then waiting (not long) for my $100 rebate from Apple.
post #47 of 430
my work BB is on sprint, wife's work BB is on verizon and she has an iphone

in NYC sprint it flaky. i can walk down the street and go to 2G, walk a few more blocks and back to 3G. but there are more spots in the subway underground where i can get a signal. speed is about the same as AT&T. once in a while i'll try to pull a youtube video from my BB and my wife's iphone and performance is usually bad on both of them.

not because of the network, but youtube has to go back to google's servers. it's not staged around the internet like a lot of other content.
post #48 of 430
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hudson1 View Post

Maybe I'm the only one but I had no qualms about buying a printer from the Apple store with my last two Mac purchases and then waiting (not long) for my $100 rebate from Apple.

CMON WE'RE TALKING ABOUT PHONES HERE STAY ON SUBJECT lol

but seriously, I see your point. Every company does it, it seems. Is it for marketing research or something? Is it surveying the demographic of who's buying the product? I guess they figure if they are gonna get people to willingly send that info, and for that info to be as precise as possible, they have to offer an incentive nobody with a brain will pass up...
post #49 of 430
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hudson1 View Post

Maybe I'm the only one but I had no qualms about buying a printer from the Apple store with my last two Mac purchases and then waiting (not long) for my $100 rebate from Apple.

The point is they are going up against the iPhone and the iPhone is $199 w/out having to submit for a mail in rebate whereas the Pre is only $199 after the mail in rebate. If you could have had those printers at the same time for the post mail-in rebate price (and not having to pay the tax on that increased price) wouldn't you rather do that?

Also, I was basing the $200-$300 on how much they charge you for the phone w/out the 2 year agreement (I couldn't remember which one it was so I went w/ the range).
post #50 of 430
Quote:
Originally Posted by teckstud View Post

Pre is following Apple with a replaceable battery?
If anything, Palm is responding to the public/corporate outcry for one.

There is no outcry. People are buying iPhones in droves, and many businesses are adopting them.

It gets the highest ratings from consumers, and business as well.
post #51 of 430
Quote:
Originally Posted by bigmc6000 View Post

The point is they are going up against the iPhone and the iPhone is $199 w/out having to submit for a mail in rebate whereas the Pre is only $199 after the mail in rebate. If you could have had those printers at the same time for the post mail-in rebate price (and not having to pay the tax on that increased price) wouldn't you rather do that?

Also, I was basing the $200-$300 on how much they charge you for the phone w/out the 2 year agreement (I couldn't remember which one it was so I went w/ the range).

When I inquired about the iphone at best buy about 8 months ago or so, the girl working there said it was 200 with sign up, but 400 for a replacement (this is the 8gb model.) She was trying real hard to sell me on the 15 dollar insurance that nobody else but best buy offered, but said lost or stolen iphones aren't covered, neither is water damage or broken screen. Basically the phone would have to die on it's own and now I'm ranting so I'll shutup.
post #52 of 430
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacTripper View Post

Normally I would have a Apple fanboy kneejerk reaction to anything non-Apple.

but having seen the Pre now, with it's more mature look and feel compared to the candy looking iPhone

did I mention a real keyboard?

might be my next phone, but alas I can't seem to give up my cheap pay as I go phone.

I got a Macbook Pro and internet, I'm not mobile enough. I live in the country.

will they last? I don't think so, the market is flooded.

but then I said that about Apple and the iPhone.

what do I know...?

You think the iPhone looks like candy and this doesn't?
post #53 of 430
Quote:
Originally Posted by iStink View Post

CMON WE'RE TALKING ABOUT PHONES HERE STAY ON SUBJECT lol

but seriously, I see your point. Every company does it, it seems. Is it for marketing research or something? Is it surveying the demographic of who's buying the product? I guess they figure if they are gonna get people to willingly send that info, and for that info to be as precise as possible, they have to offer an incentive nobody with a brain will pass up...

Nah, it's because they market it with big huge 144pt font $199 and then in tiny 12pt font they put the asterisk and the "after mail-in rebate" part. They know there's a decent % of people that never even submit the form because they lose their receipt or just plain forget about doing it within the tiny window allowed for submitting it. You're telling people "Hey, we'll give you 33% off but you have to got through 5 steps after you get home to get it and you have to make sure you do it in the next 3 weeks." There's going to be plenty of people that don't do it and you end up raking in the moola. Not to mention those companies get the extra cash now even if they have to give it back to you in a month or two they'd rather have it now.

Ya know, an iPhone in the hand is worth 2 pre's in the bush
post #54 of 430
I currently have an iPhone, and I love it. However the thought of having a phone that has a tactile keyboard and a touch screen is very appealing to me. Giving up a tactile keyboard for a mutable interface was an even compromise for me, but it was a compromise. Getting the best of both worlds would be amazing.

From what I have seen the OS/interface look to be very capable and easy to use. A lot of cues from the iPhone but quite a bit of original stuff and/or improvements.

However the Pre has some serious issues that I can see:
  • Screen appears to be plastic not glass. Sounds like a it would be easy to scratch.
  • No landscape mode.
  • Lack of multi-touch?(pinch/zoom/etc)
  • No App Store. The App Store extends the iPhone to an extent that would be hard to match.

Finally, how does it sync with a Mac? Can it use iCal/Mail/Address Book/etc? There has to be a vehicle of some sort. An iTunes equivalent. Palm Desktop software SUCKS in general and even more so on a Mac. Or it did. Even if the above problems are addressed or mitigated being able to sync with my computer is a deal breaker.

Oh, and Sprint... I hate AT&T but Sprint is worse.
post #55 of 430
Quote:
Originally Posted by al_bundy View Post

there are already rumors that Palm is going to have a model for Verizon later this year

I was kidding, sorry. I wish them all best sales ever.

We mean Apple no harm.

People are lovers, basically. -- Engadget livebloggers at the iPad mini event.

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We mean Apple no harm.

People are lovers, basically. -- Engadget livebloggers at the iPad mini event.

Reply
post #56 of 430
First, I am going to BestBuy to get the Pre because they don't do mail in rebates. So it will just be $200. Also, Sprints 3G network is so much faster than AT&T's that I think it is a very smart choice to put the phone on. Plus the wireless touchstone charger is a plus! Can't wait. Finally something better than the iPhone.
post #57 of 430
Don't forget that the iPhone feature set that the Pre is competing against is effectively 2 years old. Last year's update was really only pretty minor, with the addition of 3G and GPS. People seem to be pre-judging the Pre (ack - awful pun) based on comparison's with LAST YEAR's iPhone. Wait and see what June brings...

As an experienced iPhone developer, I seriously, seriously doubt that the apps that you'll see on the Pre will come anywhere close to what's possible on the iPhone. You aren't going to get Tiger Woods Golf written in Javascript anytime soon, believe me.

Palm do not have some secret mojo as regards battery life either - if you have multiple apps running and hitting the networking hardware (WiFi, GSM or GPS) then you are going to take a big hit on battery life. Perhaps they are hoping people will have those induction chargers dotted around the house, office and car so the thing charges up whilst you're using it... ?
post #58 of 430
Quote:
Originally Posted by al_bundy View Post

it's supposed to run any app designed for previous palm devices which is around 80,000 from what i heard. and porting apps to it is supposed to be easy and 4000 iphone apps are supposed to be ready for it by next month or so

In emulation. No one has seen that yet, so we don't know how well it might work. It might be fine, and it might not.
post #59 of 430
Quote:
Originally Posted by kylemac09 View Post

First, I am going to BestBuy to get the Pre because they don't do mail in rebates. So it will just be $200. Also, Sprints 3G network is so much faster than AT&T's that I think it is a very smart choice to put the phone on. Plus the wireless touchstone charger is a plus! Can't wait. Finally something better than the iPhone.

Spot the astroturf
post #60 of 430
Quote:
Originally Posted by markb View Post

...for the 5 minutes before the battery goes dead. Until there is some massive breakthrough in battery life or power consumption, push notification is a better model.

Push notification is absolutely not a better solution. It is a very limited solution to a very limited set of problems.

For instance, it does not solve the problem of an incoming phone call interrupting Skype. Nor does it allow incoming Skype calls to get to you -- for that you have to remain logged in. Nor does it allow location-aware apps to tell people where you are. Nor can you

There is a non-multitasking solution to all of these problems, however. But when I mention it here everyone calls me an idiot. I'll say it again anyway.

The iPhone API needs a separate "PresenceKit". This is an API and associated daemon that any application can use to keep itself "alive" on the network, even when it's not running. For instance, Skype would have a library that used it which would log into the Skype network, keeping you "alive" and thereby allowing incoming calls even if you're not running Skype on the iPhone. The user could select what conditions it would log in - for instance, perhaps you want to use it with only certain WiFi's (like at home), or maybe only if you aren't logged into Skype somewhere else (like your iMac).

Chat clients, location-aware social networking apps, phone-like applications could all make use of this. Better yet, since some of the state is universal (ie, Skype only works on WiFi), the iPhone could turn off the code when those conditions are not met. The plug-ins could also tell the PresenceKit daemon how often they have to be checked, or what should happen when they start up or shut down. All of these features would allow the CPU and networking needs to be tightly controlled, and thereby maximize battery life.

I would also argue that there should be a similar plug-in for Phone and Messages (nee SMS). Skype would use the former to allow Phone to act as the UI, so I could get all my inbound and outbound "phone-like calls" from within a single interface. Or get GChat from within Messages.

Maury
post #61 of 430
[*]Screen appears to be plastic not glass. Sounds like a it would be easy to scratch.[*]No landscape mode.[*]Lack of multi-touch?(pinch/zoom/etc)[*]No App Store. The App Store extends the iPhone to an extent that would be hard to

It does do the multi touch. A couple designers of the iPhone helped design this phone. Remember the lawsuits that Apple was threating about the touch??? Also, their will be an app store. The 35,000 palm apps that already exist will work on the Pre, plus it was released to developers to design apps. Do you thing they wouldn't compeat? Try some more arguements.
post #62 of 430
personally i wouldn't buy it for at least 2 years or until they sell a million units, whichever comes first

if this isn't a hit and palm goes under, you will be paying a lot of money every month for what is essentially a worthless phone
post #63 of 430
"Spot the astroturf"

Go to their website and call, NO MAIL IN REBATES!!! What a great idea! Also, their people don't work on commision! What a plus!
post #64 of 430
When my iPhone battery starts getting low I just pull my fully charged Kensington battery out of my pocket and plug it into the dock connector then I've got another full charge, I don't have to turn my iPhone off, I can do it in the middle of a call and I don't have to mess around juggling phone backs and batteries to do it.

It also charges using mini USB so I can use it to charge my iPhone using a Blackberry or Motorola charger, I can also use my Navman charger in the car or a standard USB cable and a PC.

A removable battery is no big deal.

Quote:
Originally Posted by iStink View Post

Being able to replace the battery is an attractive feature. For example, if you're traveling for an extended period of time, and you've got a fully charged spare battery, it's nice to just pop it in and go after the first battery is drained.

Not a key feature everyone looks for, but not a bad one either.
Better than my Bose, better than my Skullcandy's, listening to Mozart through my LeBron James limited edition PowerBeats by Dre is almost as good as my Sennheisers.
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Better than my Bose, better than my Skullcandy's, listening to Mozart through my LeBron James limited edition PowerBeats by Dre is almost as good as my Sennheisers.
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post #65 of 430
Quote:
Originally Posted by al_bundy View Post

it's supposed to run any app designed for previous palm devices which is around 80,000 from what i heard. and porting apps to it is supposed to be easy and 4000 iphone apps are supposed to be ready for it by next month or so

If anyone gave a hoot about Palm apps, they wouldn't be on the verge of bankruptcy.

Being able to run iPhone apps is a good argument to buy an iPhone, not a Pre. And given the years and years of utterly crappy sync support they've had, does anyone really expect the Pre to offer a better experience than the iPhone? It's going to need to.

Maury
post #66 of 430
Quote:
Originally Posted by kylemac09 View Post

First, I am going to BestBuy to get the Pre because they don't do mail in rebates. So it will just be $200. Also, Sprints 3G network is so much faster than AT&T's that I think it is a very smart choice to put the phone on. Plus the wireless touchstone charger is a plus! Can't wait. Finally something better than the iPhone.

I was on Sprint until I bought our iPhones late last August. Their network, while much better than it was a few years before, is not that great. Certainly no better than AT&T's, and worse that Verizons'.
post #67 of 430
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

You may not get the rebate. That's why they offer it that way.

Believe me, I know. I used to be on Sprint. Half of the rebates they refused to give me, even though I was very careful to do exactly what was demanded.

With one, they said that I sent it in too late, even thought I did it online, the very same day. Another time they said that I didn't fill one out correctly, even though I had made a copy, and showed them that I did.

Another time, I was told that I would be given a new phone for one that was broken, and that I should go back to the Sprint store I bought it from, only to have the manager of the store tell me that they didn't have to do what the Sprint telephone reps said they should.

Believe me, Sprint is not a wonderful place to be at.

If they're offering this with a $100 rebate, I guarantee that a fair number of people won't get it, or will have a hell of a time getting it. That's the whole point of rebates.

It used to be that when I sent rebate info in to companies that do that for the sellers, I always got my money. But increasingly over the past few years, that hasn't been so. You really have to fight for it, and so I usually rather buy something that hasn't got a rebate, from a place that has lower prices, but not as low as it would be with a rebate. I figure that over the long haul, I'm doing just as well with a lot less frustration.

As far as this phone goes, the only possible advantage seems to be concurrent programsif it works as well as they say it does, which is something no one knows yet because they haven't allowed it out of the lab except for a couple of short, controlled excursions.

The upper row of keys is too close to the overhanging bottom of the body of the device, something that was mentioned by two reporters allowed to use it for a few minutes under supervision. The screen is quite a bit smaller that the one in the iPhone. 3.1" vs 3.5" may not sound too different, but it is.

At the same price as the current 8 GB iPhone when you, hopefully, get your rebate back from Sprint, it may not be much of a deal either. After all, despite what you say about getting rebates over Apple not giving any, you forget (conveniently, it seems) that this phone WITH the rebate costs the same as Apple's 8 GB model WITHOUT the rebate, and without the rebate (which you may not get), it costs the same as Apple's 16 GB model. Not very impressive. It's very possible that Apple will offer a $199 model with 16 GB and a $299 model with 32 GB this summer on top of that.

If so, how are they going to make money on this without having to drop the price further? If they have to do that, someone will take a big loss. Neither Palm or Sprint can afford that now, with both losing customers at such high rates, along with currently having large losses.

It's a marketing stategy to entice penetration. The price will probably drop in a year or less to match Apple's. And later they'll move over to Veriizon, which is pretty smart.
post #68 of 430
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

I was on Sprint until I bought our iPhones late last August. Their network, while much better than it was a few years before, is not that great. Certainly no better than AT&T's, and worse that Verizons'.

Ever think about why both AT&T and Verizon are picking up so many customers, but why Sprint is losing so many?

No?

Well, think about it!
post #69 of 430
Quote:
Originally Posted by Maury Markowitz View Post

Push notification is absolutely not a better solution. It is a very limited solution to a very limited set of problems.

For instance, it does not solve the problem of an incoming phone call interrupting Skype. Nor does it allow incoming Skype calls to get to you -- for that you have to remain logged in. Nor does it allow location-aware apps to tell people where you are. Nor can you

There is a non-multitasking solution to all of these problems, however. But when I mention it here everyone calls me an idiot. I'll say it again anyway.

The iPhone API needs a separate "PresenceKit". This is an API and associated daemon that any application can use to keep itself "alive" on the network, even when it's not running. For instance, Skype would have a library that used it which would log into the Skype network, keeping you "alive" and thereby allowing incoming calls even if you're not running Skype on the iPhone. The user could select what conditions it would log in - for instance, perhaps you want to use it with only certain WiFi's (like at home), or maybe only if you aren't logged into Skype somewhere else (like your iMac).

Chat clients, location-aware social networking apps, phone-like applications could all make use of this. Better yet, since some of the state is universal (ie, Skype only works on WiFi), the iPhone could turn off the code when those conditions are not met. The plug-ins could also tell the PresenceKit daemon how often they have to be checked, or what should happen when they start up or shut down. All of these features would allow the CPU and networking needs to be tightly controlled, and thereby maximize battery life.

I would also argue that there should be a similar plug-in for Phone and Messages (nee SMS). Skype would use the former to allow Phone to act as the UI, so I could get all my inbound and outbound "phone-like calls" from within a single interface. Or get GChat from within Messages.

Maury

no way

apple should let you pick 2-5 apps to run in the background if you want. if they release an API for devs then everyone will be making apps to run in the background. it will be like adobe running in the background just to open acrobat faster and will kill your phone

if there is one thing the MS DOS/Windows experience has taught us is that you never trust developers to do the right thing
post #70 of 430
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

I was on Sprint until I bought our iPhones late last August. Their network, while much better than it was a few years before, is not that great. Certainly no better than AT&T's, and worse that Verizons'.




I'm talking about 3G. Not regular coverage. With them rolling out 4G, they have the stronges and you get a hell of a lot more featues than AT&T or Verizon. Look at the tests, Sprint's 3G is faster.
post #71 of 430
I don't think $299 is good enough to stay in the game.

Sprint didn't bet enough on this.
post #72 of 430
Quote:
Originally Posted by probably View Post

I don't think $299 is good enough to stay in the game.

Sprint didn't bet enough on this.

Best Buy doesn't do mail in rebates, buy from their.
post #73 of 430
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gee4orce View Post

Don't forget that the iPhone feature set that the Pre is competing against is effectively 2 years old. Last year's update was really only pretty minor, with the addition of 3G and GPS. People seem to be pre-judging the Pre (ack - awful pun) based on comparison's with LAST YEAR's iPhone. Wait and see what June brings...



And what will June bring? A evolutionary new iPhone model? No. Groundbreaking features not found anywhere else? No. It is bringing features that have been around other free phones for awhile, and will still lack a few things that other phones have. The only thing new this June is an OS upgrade and minor enhancements. Faster processor speeds and standard storage capacity upgrades are hardly anything major.

No background apps? Check.

No removable battery? Check.

A phone behind the times feature wise in less than a handful of areas? Check.

A phone getting features that have been around for years on other phones? Check.

Yeah, the iPhone is the best phone out there for many, but not everyone. All phones can co-exist. It's just the way it is. I would get a Pre in a flash if I wasn't so vested in the Apple ecosystem.
post #74 of 430
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

It used to be that when I sent rebate info in to companies that do that for the sellers, I always got my money. But increasingly over the past few years, that hasn't been so.

That's because the rebates are being offered by someone else...

Originally, rebates were a way to clear out old inventory. A company would ship their product to their retail chain in advance, who would stock them in their warehouses. If the price dropped, the retailers would end up in the uncomfortable position of having paid more for the item than they could sell it for. In this case, the manufacturer would offer a rebate, so the retailer could keep selling the item for "full price" while the user would still get the new, lower price.

This problem has largely gone away due to better supply-side management. Retailers carefully control their stock levels and rarely end up with product backlogs (at least not on the "wrong side"). Manufacturers have also become far more efficient, so they can supply the products when the retailer needs them. The result is that there aren't these huge stockpiles in the channel any more, so the need for manufacturer rebates has fallen dramatically.

Sprint's rebate, you'll note, is NOT a manufacturer's rebate. Obviously, because the item isn't even available yet. This is simply a way to lower the sticker shock of the item, but hopefully get some percentage of the people to not receive the rebate, and thereby increase the per-unit profit averaged over all the sales. It's a dastardly sales method, and should, IMHO, be illegal (and is in many similar cases).

Maury
post #75 of 430
Quote:
Originally Posted by ghostface147 View Post

And what will June bring? A evolutionary new iPhone model? No. Groundbreaking features not found anywhere else? No. It is bringing features that have been around other free phones for awhile, and will still lack a few things that other phones have. The only thing new this June is an OS upgrade and minor enhancements. Faster processor speeds and standard storage capacity upgrades are hardly anything major.

No background apps? Check.

No removable battery? Check.

A phone behind the times feature wise in less than a handful of areas? Check.

A phone getting features that have been around for years on other phones? Check.

Yeah, the iPhone is the best phone out there for many, but not everyone. All phones can co-exist. It's just the way it is. I would get a Pre in a flash if I wasn't so vested in the Apple ecosystem.



Pre supporting flash. Check!
post #76 of 430
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

There is no outcry. People are buying iPhones in droves, and many businesses are adopting them.

It gets the highest ratings from consumers, and business as well.

I beg to differ. Any review of iPhone or any product for that matter show both pros and cons.
Always - ALWAYS -in the con column is "NO REPLACEABLE BATTERY".
post #77 of 430
Quote:
Originally Posted by Maury Markowitz View Post

That's because the rebates are being offered by someone else...

Originally, rebates were a way to clear out old inventory. A company would ship their product to their retail chain in advance, who would stock them in their warehouses. If the price dropped, the retailers would end up in the uncomfortable position of having paid more for the item than they could sell it for. In this case, the manufacturer would offer a rebate, so the retailer could keep selling the item for "full price" while the user would still get the new, lower price.

This problem has largely gone away due to better supply-side management. Retailers carefully control their stock levels and rarely end up with product backlogs (at least not on the "wrong side"). Manufacturers have also become far more efficient, so they can supply the products when the retailer needs them. The result is that there aren't these huge stockpiles in the channel any more, so the need for manufacturer rebates has fallen dramatically.

Sprint's rebate, you'll note, is NOT a manufacturer's rebate. Obviously, because the item isn't even available yet. This is simply a way to lower the sticker shock of the item, but hopefully get some percentage of the people to not receive the rebate, and thereby increase the per-unit profit averaged over all the sales. It's a dastardly sales method, and should, IMHO, be illegal (and is in many similar cases).

Maury

Why deal with mail in rebates? Best Buy doesn't do mail in rebates! They are sooo much better than the Sprint stoes and their people are not rude!
post #78 of 430
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Originally Posted by bigmc6000 View Post

Nah, it's because they market it with big huge 144pt font $199 and then in tiny 12pt font they put the asterisk and the "after mail-in rebate" part. They know there's a decent % of people that never even submit the form because they lose their receipt or just plain forget about doing it within the tiny window allowed for submitting it. You're telling people "Hey, we'll give you 33% off but you have to got through 5 steps after you get home to get it and you have to make sure you do it in the next 3 weeks." There's going to be plenty of people that don't do it and you end up raking in the moola. Not to mention those companies get the extra cash now even if they have to give it back to you in a month or two they'd rather have it now.

Ya know, an iPhone in the hand is worth 2 pre's in the bush

I think you're over complicating things in your mind. Rebates are really easy. In fact, all I had to do was print out my receipt from sprint's website, along with the rebate form (also from sprint's website) and mail it in from work here. The stamp cost like a a quarter or something? I mean it's REALLY not that hard, and I think a lot more people do it than you think. Proof of purchase for a phone is easy to track down with Sprint's website. If anyone doesn't do the rebate, it's because they simply have that much money to blow. Trust me, it's not as bad as you think.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Gee4orce View Post

Don't forget that the iPhone feature set that the Pre is competing against is effectively 2 years old. Last year's update was really only pretty minor, with the addition of 3G and GPS. People seem to be pre-judging the Pre (ack - awful pun) based on comparison's with LAST YEAR's iPhone. Wait and see what June brings...

As an experienced iPhone developer, I seriously, seriously doubt that the apps that you'll see on the Pre will come anywhere close to what's possible on the iPhone. You aren't going to get Tiger Woods Golf written in Javascript anytime soon, believe me.

Palm do not have some secret mojo as regards battery life either - if you have multiple apps running and hitting the networking hardware (WiFi, GSM or GPS) then you are going to take a big hit on battery life. Perhaps they are hoping people will have those induction chargers dotted around the house, office and car so the thing charges up whilst you're using it... ?

They gotta start somewhere lol. The iphone didn't have a ton of apps written for it right away either.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kylemac09 View Post

[*]Screen appears to be plastic not glass. Sounds like a it would be easy to scratch.[*]No landscape mode.[*]Lack of multi-touch?(pinch/zoom/etc)[*]No App Store. The App Store extends the iPhone to an extent that would be hard to

It does do the multi touch. A couple designers of the iPhone helped design this phone. Remember the lawsuits that Apple was threating about the touch??? Also, their will be an app store. The 35,000 palm apps that already exist will work on the Pre, plus it was released to developers to design apps. Do you thing they wouldn't compeat? Try some more arguements.

I always wondered how that keyboard would come in handy if you were browsing the web in landscape mode. Typing sideways seems like a moronic design.

Quote:
Originally Posted by hill60 View Post

When my iPhone battery starts getting low I just pull my fully charged Kensington battery out of my pocket and plug it into the dock connector then I've got another full charge, I don't have to turn my iPhone off, I can do it in the middle of a call and I don't have to mess around juggling phone backs and batteries to do it.

It also charges using mini USB so I can use it to charge my iPhone using a Blackberry or Motorola charger, I can also use my Navman charger in the car or a standard USB cable and a PC.

A removable battery is no big deal.

I never said it was a big deal lol. I think the benefits of having a removable battery are obvious, but not heavy enough for it to weigh in on most consumer's purchasing decision (unless the salesperson convinces them its a bigger featyre than it is.)
Quote:
Originally Posted by al_bundy View Post

no way

apple should let you pick 2-5 apps to run in the background if you want. if they release an API for devs then everyone will be making apps to run in the background. it will be like adobe running in the background just to open acrobat faster and will kill your phone

if there is one thing the MS DOS/Windows experience has taught us is that you never trust developers to do the right thing

the reasoning seems to be that battery life gets drained, but then I think, does EVERY app need access to the radio? It can't just lie dormant in the background? I've got plenty of apps running in the background on my touch pro, and the battery life is the same as if I didn't run them...
post #79 of 430
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Originally Posted by melgross View Post

You think the iPhone looks like candy and this doesn't?

Indeed - it looks like the result of eating too much candy...
post #80 of 430
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Originally Posted by GTL215 View Post

so for an 8gb iPhone, you'd rather shell out $300 up front, then wait for your 100 bucks to come back in the mail....rather than just pay $200 and be done? Makes sense.....

Didn't the Pre CEO (or sprint CEO, i forget) make some snively comment such as, "why would we price it the same as an iPhone when we have the better product"? HA what a shithead. Is a mail-in rebate his idea of pricing the Pre higher? Gimmie a break.

That's what I'm saying, when you go into the store to buy the phone you have to have 300 dollars in hand and not 200 dollars like some want you believe, screw a rebate, I'm more concerned about how much I'll play in the store instead of a rebate.
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