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Microsoft's ads doing damage to Apple: study

post #1 of 179
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Even as critics have attacked Microsoft for bending the truth in its PCs-are-cheaper ad campaign, one firm's research shows that it might be working and turning the public minds, though not necessarily wallets, away from Apple.

After talking regularly with 5,000 people over the course of several months, ad trackers at BrandIndex discovered that Microsoft overtook Apple in value perception scores -- the belief that a given brand gives more value for money -- starting from the end of March, or roughly when Microsoft began its Laptop Hunters ad campaign on TV and online.

Where Apple had crested as high as a score of 70 in late February, the advent of Microsoft's promo spots has led to a gradual but noticeable decline that, as of the end of the study on May 12th, gave the Mac maker a score of just 12 points on the study's charts. Microsoft, meanwhile, has almost uniformly risen in its perceived value from very nearly zero (neutral) to 46 points this month, or more than three times Apple's portrayed worth.

The analyst company's global managing director, Ted Marzilli, treats this as a role reversal prompted by the ads. He sees Apple as having regularly trumped Microsoft in the past with a younger, 18-to-35 crowd more receptive to its 'cool' but now challenged by reminders that Macs are frequently more expensive. Many of these are more conscious about what they spend and, particularly in a tough economy, are more likely to think twice about their spending.

"Apple did a great job of putting Microsoft on the defensive," Marzilli told AdAge. "It made them look old, stodgy, complicated to use and unhip. But Microsoft has started to hit back, and younger folks are more cost- or value-focused."

Value perception scores for Apple and Microsoft in 2009; Microsoft's ads started in late March. | Image credits: AdAge.

Cupertino-based Apple has still managed to claw back some of its share in the 35- to 49-year-old set and is tied with Microsoft for the older demographic.

Whether or not Microsoft's campaign reaps any rewards for its investment as part of a larger $300 million project to rejuvenate the Windows name is considerably less certain; BrandIndex tracks perception and not actual purchases. Apple is still expected to ship fewer Macs in spring than it did last year but in line with expectations reflecting the economic reality rather than the effect of an attack by Microsoft.
post #2 of 179
Microsoft: our operating system is loaded onto cheap computers.
post #3 of 179
Makes you wonder what type of people this group interviewed.

Anyone that actually watches the adds from MS and knows anything about Windows vs. OS-X sees how factually incorrect most of what is in the ad is.

If you like windows-cool-buy Windows. But while Apple's ads may stretch the truth, MS ads are clearly false in many cases (comparing unequal machines with different RAM/screen resoultion, showing a MacBook pro for $2,000 and then buying a MacBook class machine for only about $100 less than the MacBook, etc).
post #4 of 179
No one is to blame but Apple...

For years Apple has poked at Microsoft. For years Microsoft stayed quiet.

It was only a matter of time before they upset the GIANT...

Now Microsoft is fighting back... I am surprised it took them this long...

Apple will have to come out with new Ads as the current ones will not work with Windows 7.
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post #5 of 179
F@#k Microsoft.
post #6 of 179
Quote:
Originally Posted by italiankid View Post

No one is to blame but Apple...

For years Apple has poked at Microsoft. For years Microsoft stayed quiet.

It was only a matter of time before they upset the GIANT...

Now Microsoft is fighting back... I am surprised it took them this long...

Apple will have to come out with new Ads as the current ones will not work with Windows 7.

thats one of the most optomistic statements I've ever heard.

they spent, what? like 10 years on Vista, but don't worry windows 7 will be done in three and unquestionably better?

what, are they trying now, but didn't really care before?
post #7 of 179
Quote:
Apple will have to come out with new Ads as the current ones will not work with Windows 7.

I think, as usual, you are missing the point italiankid. Ads do not have to have a basis in fact to be effective. That is the whole premise of the MS campaign.

If what Apple is doing is effective (and i think they probably are due for a change in direction) they can keep on slamming MS products as buggy, security problems, etc. as long as people still perceive them that way no matter how "wonderful" windows 7 will be.
post #8 of 179
It could also be the the economy sucks right now and more people are looking for something dirt cheap and don't mind getting lesser quality if the price is right. MS hasn't said that Apple makes bad or poorly made computers, just that they are more expensive, in some cases.
post #9 of 179
Quote:
Originally Posted by italiankid View Post

No one is to blame but Apple...

For years Apple has poked at Microsoft. For years Microsoft stayed quiet.

It was only a matter of time before they upset the GIANT...

Now Microsoft is fighting back... I am surprised it took them this long...

Apple will have to come out with new Ads as the current ones will not work with Windows 7.

italiankid... nice to see you on here again. Maybe it was me that just missed recent posts from you. I thought maybe Microshit had fired you from posting here.

As for the ads... since the first Seinfeld ad I've only heard (in person) one person ever say they liked any of Microsofts ads. In fact even a friend of mine who works for Microsoft in Minneapolis said it's a joke around the office how bad they are. Any small fluctuation in number year over year are merely that, fluctuations and nothing more. Any one with half a brain knows how much bs is in those M$ ads. Plus, they're just badly done. Still amazes me to this day how all the money in the world can't buy them any sense of style or originality.
post #10 of 179
You really have to be an ignorant low class idiot to be a Windows user/deliberate PC buyer. There is no other way to put it. MS bet that 90% of the world population are imbeciles. Turns out they were right. Apple doesn't have to rule the world. We don't want that trash anyhow...MS can KEEP IT.
post #11 of 179
Quote:
Originally Posted by iCarbon View Post

thats one of the most optomistic statements I've ever heard.

they spent, what? like 10 years on Vista, but don't worry windows 7 will be done in three and unquestionably better?

what, are they trying now, but didn't really care before?

Probably...

Just like Apple is trying very hard to get over the 10% marketshare in computers... Its taken how long? L>O>N>G!

You can't bring down the GIANT.

Now Microsoft will try with Windows 7. They listened to the customers and now the efforts are paying off.


Mac will have to be that much better iMO to remain at or above 8%
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post #12 of 179
Quote:
Originally Posted by rg_spb View Post

It could also be the the economy sucks right now and more people are looking for something dirt cheap and don't mind getting lesser quality if the price is right. MS hasn't said that Apple makes bad or poorly made computers, just that they are more expensive, in some cases.

The economy sucked in February when the perceived value was up to 70%. Something is really offer with this study because it fluctuates too much to be accurate. I could see a steady change one way of the other, but this is wild and extreme different. Something is fishy.
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post #13 of 179
This study reminds me of that Glenn Beck character:

They both tell me what people who don't think are thinking.....
post #14 of 179
I can vouch for the ads effectiveness. I know of at least one person who was swayed by the ad, commenting about the cost savings of buying a PC vs. a Mac, but for people who are shopping for a computer solely based on immediate price, there is really no convincing them of the other merits of a Mac.

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post #15 of 179
They are so dumb they all fall over themselves fighting for a $300 netbook and then realize the performance is terrible.

Then they go out and buy a $450 Vista PC and the performance is just a hair better.

Then they rub ashes all over themselves and pray towards Redmond for Windows 7,

which people are saying is as slow as Vista.

Buy the time they pay for Windows 7 and install their XP apps, finding out several won't work in emulation. They are ready to either blow their dumb brains out or give a Mac a try.

By then they are broke. So screw em. :P
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post #16 of 179
I've always thought Apple computers were more expensive, but it doesn't stop me from buying them.
post #17 of 179
Quote:
Originally Posted by italiankid View Post

Apple will have to come out with new Ads as the current ones will not work with Windows 7.

Funny, I've got Win7 RC on my home PC. It's a rather nice improvement over Vista and XP. I'm hoping that my PC-centric employer moves to Win7 rapidly.

However, my MacBook is much more pleasant to use, and remains my primary machine. I haven't even finished installing basic apps on the PC, and I don't really care.

Windows 7 has a major flaw - It's still "Windows", with virtually all of the annoyances and maintenance headaches.
post #18 of 179
By the way,

The Dell XPS in the Microsoft ads has a serious 'screen open blocks heat vent' issue that severely overheats the machine so much that it burns your legs.

It also has a drastically shortened battery life (because of the heat issue perhaps)


What sort of savings is that if the dam thing is going to fail sooner than expected? It actually costs more in premature replacement.
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post #19 of 179
Quote:
Originally Posted by bryanhauer View Post

italiankid... nice to see you on here again. Maybe it was me that just missed recent posts from you. I thought maybe Microshit had fired you from posting here.

As for the ads... since the first Seinfeld ad I've only heard (in person) one person ever say they liked any of Microsofts ads. In fact even a friend of mine who works for Microsoft in Minneapolis said it's a joke around the office how bad they are. Any small fluctuation in number year over year are merely that, fluctuations and nothing more. Any one with half a brain knows how much bs is in those M$ ads. Plus, they're just badly done. Still amazes me to this day how all the money in the world can't buy them any sense of style or originality.

I am back... I was on Vacation...

And I don't work for Microsoft!

I just voice my opinion.
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post #20 of 179
Hi,

I wonder who funded this study? Microsoft, Apple, a 3rd party? I am sure it was not done out of the goodness of Ted M's heart.

If MS funded it then of course that explains the results and the conclusions.

Oh! Apple computers are expensive and they have an additional little issue with them. They WORK as advertised.

JD
post #21 of 179
Quote:
Originally Posted by italiankid View Post

Probably...

Just like Apple is trying very hard to get over the 10% marketshare in computers... Its taken how long? L>O>N>G!

Sure, every company would love to see its market share grow but to equate market share percentage with business success is wrong. How else is Rolls Royce still around? It puts out a superb product and is not going to go with a laminated wood grain console to shave a few pennies so that it can increase its market share when it knows its customers want the real wood and pay more for the quality product.


Quote:
Originally Posted by italiankid View Post

You can't bring down the GIANT.

David did a number on Goliath! Didn't he?


Quote:
Originally Posted by italiankid View Post

Now Microsoft will try with Windows 7. They listened to the customers and now the efforts are paying off.

'Now MS will "try" with Windows 7'??? Doesn't sound like you have a whole lot of confidence in their new OS to place your bet. Perhaps it's time to fold your cards! If MS was listening to their customers, they would have dropped Vista sooner and stuck with "XP". Let's hope MS has got it right now for their customer base. It's taken how L>O>N>G and XP's support by MS will end in a round six years and that will be here before you know it. But what will those XP'ers do if Windows 7 blows and MS says this is it, take it or leave it until Windows 8, 9, 10, 11! Maybe then Mac market share goes up???

Quote:
Originally Posted by italiankid View Post

Mac will have to be that much better iMO to remain at or above 8%

Considering Microsoft efforts to bring a Mac like feel to their OS, I thought Macs were much better. If not, why would MS want to emulate after a loser!

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post #22 of 179
Quote:
Originally Posted by italiankid View Post

You can't bring down the GIANT.

Now Microsoft will try with Windows 7. They listened to the customers and now the efforts are paying off.

I wonder if it will pay off well enough for Microsoft to be brave enough to mention their own product in their ads. They've been a little sheepish about their current offering.
post #23 of 179
I'm not a PC fan but I'm thrilled that Microsoft is keeping Apple on its toes.

Competition is good for Apple and it forces them to constantly strive to protect their market share by impressing their consumer base with better hardware and better software.

In short, Apple has to work harder for us. That's not bad.
post #24 of 179
I've been a Windows user for around 8 years. Then, with much thought, jumped to the Mac bandwagon around 3 years back. And one thing is for sure, there's no going back! In 8 years of my Windows experience, i had to spend a lot more time fixing the damn thing than actually using it! Ever since i got a Mac, trust me, i've never had to force shutdown my laptop. I am pretty sure i am more than willing to pay extra for peace of mind, reliability, ease of use, speed and the looks of course!
As far as these ads are considered, it'll only affect the immature minds. The minds that lack the logic to compare Windows and Mac and find out which one is better.
post #25 of 179
Quote:
Originally Posted by italiankid View Post

Probably...

Just like Apple is trying very hard to get over the 10% marketshare in computers... Its taken how long? L>O>N>G!

You can't bring down the GIANT.

Now Microsoft will try with Windows 7. They listened to the customers and now the efforts are paying off.


Mac will have to be that much better iMO to remain at or above 8%

Could you at least try to be a good troll? Apple isn't directly competing with Microsoft. They are competing with the likes of HP, Dell, Acer, etc and they all happen to use Windows (not due to its superiority, but due to a lack of other options as Apple doesn't license its OS out). Given the limited number of computer models Apple produces, they do quite well compared to HP or anyone else. Individual mac computers are always at or near the top in total #'s sold on a model by model basis.

Apple could increase market share by producing more computer models (for example, a traditional desktop) but the more models they produce, the less time they can spend on each model and build quality and the overall level of system wide integration would diminish. Personally, I am quite happy to pay more for a better computer (there is more to a computer than processor speed, ram and hard drive size), and if their market share stays low because they focus on making a few good PC's instead of a bunch of crap ones, I'm fine with that.
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post #26 of 179
Quote:
Originally Posted by manfrommars View Post

I'm not a PC fan but I'm thrilled that Microsoft is keeping Apple on its toes.

Competition is good for Apple and it forces them to constantly strive to protect their market share by impressing their consumer base with better hardware and better software.

In short, Apple has to work harder for us. That's not bad.

I don't think Apple needs a Windows-push to strive for development. Apple is a company that thrives on creativity and improvisation. Even if there was no Microsoft, Apple would still be as creative and good as it is now. Maybe it's in their company culture.
post #27 of 179
Quote:
Originally Posted by italiankid View Post

No one is to blame but Apple...

For years Apple has poked at Microsoft. For years Microsoft stayed quiet.

It was only a matter of time before they upset the GIANT...

Now Microsoft is fighting back... I am surprised it took them this long...

Apple will have to come out with new Ads as the current ones will not work with Windows 7.

Dude you sound like a Microsoft fan boy what you Pre-Ordered Windows 7 already?
post #28 of 179
Quote:
Originally Posted by CREB View Post

F@#k Microsoft.

I second that motion! I'm done with Micorosft crap! If there are bunch of dumb people that want cheap computers that going to get viruses and a faulty OS then let them do it. The 1st Amendment does covers a right to be a dumb a**!
post #29 of 179
Quote:
Originally Posted by markb View Post

I think, as usual, you are missing the point italiankid. Ads do not have to have a basis in fact to be effective. That is the whole premise of the MS campaign.

Apple has also been doing this for a long time. I have to use Win XP at work and I have had multiple machines running for years in some cases without a blue screen or a virus. On the other hand, I've had 3 crashes this year with my iMac at home. It's always something to do with bluetooth, but non the less happened.
post #30 of 179
Instead of spending millions on those dumb I'm a Mac ads. just make the computers cheaper. There's no way that white MacBook should cost $999, it should be $600 tops. The top case cracks and the hard drive is crap.

The MacBook Air. $500. It's slow, has no ports and less parts than the MacBook.
post #31 of 179
It's dead easy for anyone to play the "we're cheaper" card during a recession. There's always a lot more of the lowest common denominator.

Except it won't last.

And people will realize just what Windows is after x number of hours of usage. And then we're back to the usual perspectives.

Next.
post #32 of 179
Quote:
Originally Posted by jawporta View Post

Instead of spending millions on those dumb I'm a Mac ads. just make the computers cheaper. There's no way that white MacBook should cost $999, it should be $600 tops. The top case cracks and the hard drive is crap.

The MacBook Air. $500. It's slow, has no ports and less parts than the MacBook.

I'm sorry but $600 is a bit off. I don't think I could purchase a decent PC for that price that gives pretty fast graphics and FW400 powered.

*&^(&) Microsoft !
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post #33 of 179
Quote:
Originally Posted by LE Studios View Post

Dude you sound like a Microsoft fan boy what you Pre-Ordered Windows 7 already?

None of his posts make sense.

He's one of those masochistic types that chooses to live with Windows because of what's supposed to be in the NEXT VERSION. That's the Windows way. In 2000 they were bleating that ME was just an anomaly (as if 98 was actually good) and that XP will be "the one." Then XP was inflicted on those poor WIndows users and not only did the interface look like ass, but it also shipped with FIVE OPEN PORTS. Virus time!! Thanks, MS!! And this was in 2001, no less, when being online was a daily reality. But have no fear, Longhorn will save the day. Until it was canned and replaced by Vista. Then we were told that "Vista is going to rock!" All the testers seemed to have removed their brains from their heads while playing with the betas because inexplicably, mysteriously, Vista was a flop. In many ways worse than XP. And that's after what, 6 YEARS of development! Where did all the R&D money go? Oh, right, the Zune. Yeah, it reeealllly shows.

And now . . . testers are again, as with Vista, tripping over themselves even more, since they're so hard up and desperate for a decent OS, hopefully sometime during this half-century. And they're willing to believe anything beyond belief that it's true.

MS:

"We know our OS is subpar . . . again . . . but really, just wait for the NEXT VERSION. This time we mean it. Really. Everything will be fine in the NEXT VERSION. Seriously, why can't you just wait patiently? Just look at the NEXT VERSION_$MOCKUPS until then. Relax, like your time and money is so important!"
post #34 of 179
Quote:
Originally Posted by jawporta View Post

Instead of spending millions on those dumb I'm a Mac ads. just make the computers cheaper. There's no way that white MacBook should cost $999, it should be $600 tops. The top case cracks and the hard drive is crap.

The MacBook Air. $500. It's slow, has no ports and less parts than the MacBook.

I love when people state what the prices should be on tech forums. While a lower price obviously attracts more customers a company in a free market can charge what they wish providing they are not illegally crippling the market.

Since Im sure your well thought out and stated prices for the aforementioned Macs are based on comparisons of other machines PCs we know that other machines are available at lower prices so Apple is not abusing any monopoly situation of that would not be possible. So
  1. Why do you think the MBA should be $500 when the CPU along cost over $300?
  2. How do you justify the $300-$1000+ price for a netbook when you can get a 15-16 notebook with a faster CPU, more RAM, more HDD, running Vista over XP or Linux, with a lot more ports, a DVD burner for $400?
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post #35 of 179
Quote:
Originally Posted by CREB View Post

F@#k Microsoft.

Word!
post #36 of 179
Quote:
The Dell XPS in the Microsoft ads has a serious 'screen open blocks heat vent' issue that severely overheats the machine so much that it burns your legs.

Come on dude, its a Dell! just drill a couple extra holes in it wherever you think will help. Its not like it will change the aesthetics any.
post #37 of 179
Quote:
Originally Posted by markb View Post

I think, as usual, you are missing the point italiankid. Ads do not have to have a basis in fact to be effective. That is the whole premise of the MS campaign.

If what Apple is doing is effective (and i think they probably are due for a change in direction) they can keep on slamming MS products as buggy, security problems, etc. as long as people still perceive them that way no matter how "wonderful" windows 7 will be.

Keep in MIND windows 7 security is better ONLY, ONLY, ONLY because MS moved where things are stored! Virus's for 7 have already been developed and changed however are NOT being sent to the wild until Week 2 of release (depending on release take)... This was told to MANY MANY people who write stuff like that (not that I know any... I DO NOT take part-anymore).

Old virus's modified for 7 will take effect in the same manner.

And as a user of 7, it's not bad but it doesn't come with anything in fact it comes with LESS than Vista or XP. It's also having issues with LDAP in 2008... the PC goes to sleep and upon wakening will not reconnect to LDAP (LDAP is AD in 08') without a restart. This was the latest build (Public beta with 3 update).

I still prefer to run Vista over 7.

As for the poll... I ran a poll with 5000 people and everyone sad MS sucked and they were never gonna use their stuff again... I ran it outside an office in Cuppertino, does that matter?
post #38 of 179
Quote:
Originally Posted by jawporta View Post

Instead of spending millions on those dumb I'm a Mac ads. just make the computers cheaper. There's no way that white MacBook should cost $999, it should be $600 tops. The top case cracks and the hard drive is crap.

The MacBook Air. $500. It's slow, has no ports and less parts than the MacBook.

Find a PC laptop with aluminum and glass shell, 1066 bus, wireless N, bluetooth 2.0, under 5lbs with a 5hr battery life. You can include plastic shelled units if you like but keep the specs the same.

Find a PC laptop under 3.2lbs that has a real CPU and is less than 1/2" thick CLOSED, then make your MBAir point.

Then you can make your point. You want a quality PC, buy a Mac. You want creaky plastic running 2 year old high end parts buy anything else.
post #39 of 179
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rot'nApple View Post

Sure, every company would love to see its market share grow but to equate market share percentage with business success is wrong. How else is Rolls Royce still around? It puts out a superb product and is not going to go with a laminated wood grain console to shave a few pennies so that it can increase its market share when it knows its customers want the real wood and pay more for the quality product.




David did a number on Goliath! Didn't he?




'Now MS will "try" with Windows 7'??? Doesn't sound like you have a whole lot of confidence in their new OS to place your bet. Perhaps it's time to fold your cards! If MS was listening to their customers, they would have dropped Vista sooner and stuck with "XP". Let's hope MS has got it right now for their customer base. It's taken how L>O>N>G and XP's support by MS will end in a round six years and that will be here before you know it. But what will those XP'ers do if Windows 7 blows and MS says this is it, take it or leave it until Windows 8, 9, 10, 11! Maybe then Mac market share goes up???



Considering Microsoft efforts to bring a Mac like feel to their OS, I thought Macs were much better. If not, why would MS want to emulate after a loser!

because they can lol
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post #40 of 179
Quote:
Originally Posted by italiankid View Post

because they can lol

No. Because they haven't had an interesting, remotely compelling idea since Clippy. And because they either don't know how or are unable to attract the best minds in the business. Those have all gone to Apple, where all the interesting and compelling things in the industry are actually happening in an environment which fosters the same.
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