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Microsoft says Zune HD is real, will get multi-touch - Page 5

post #161 of 181
anyone seriously think HD radio is more important than apps??

if the Zilch HD had apps to offer, MS would be talking big about them now you can be sure. hype is their stock and trade. they're not. it don't. there are hacks to run some basic apps on the Zune now, but nothing anywhere near the same universe of what the 2008 Touch can do. Thanks to MS' great engineering, the Win CE Zune cannot run WinMobile apps, old or new, despite the common OS ancestry.

(btw, when i can't get wifi web radio - i like AOL's app which includes song info like HD radio and local news stations, but there are other services like Pandora too - i just play my own lists, like everyone else. local OTA radio music is garbage these days for anyone over 14 years old or who doesn't want to hear the same "classics" from whatever decade over and over and over.)

as to the 2009 Touch, it is very reasonable to anticipate significant upgrades already proven in the current iPhone, since they do share the same OS. which will go to 3.0 in a few week with all the new app capabilities already announced, none of which the Zilch can match. 720p file support for the upcoming 2009 iPhone is widely anticipated, we'll see in two weeks. adding the iPhone's GPS and upcoming compass to the Touch makes total sense. so would a camera. hardly a wild guess.

oh, and if you want to watch TV instead of just hear HD radio, can the Zilch HD do that? un-uh. but my Touch's SlingPlayer Mobile sure does - today.

sorry guys, the Zilch HD is already an obsolete dud months before it even goes on sale.
post #162 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by GTL215 View Post

note my edit at 12:10...they continued the g3 design for those who couldn't afford the LCD (hence eMac). The point is they readily adopted LCD in their primary line of desktops.

It had nothing to do with cost. Schools wanted the all-in-one design for durability. They didn't care for the pivoting LCD. The eMac was never intended for the public, hence the E in eMac. Apple later decided to offer it to the public.
post #163 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by hillstones View Post

It had nothing to do with cost. Schools wanted the all-in-one design for durability. They didn't care for the pivoting LCD. The eMac was never intended for the public, hence the E in eMac. Apple later decided to offer it to the public.

ugh, you're still missing my point. Tech-dud made another retarded comment, this time about how Apple was among the last to drop CRT monitors. I corrected him by pointing out that Apple introduced standard LCD panels in their iMac lineup in Jan-2002 (over 7 years ago). What they continued to sell on the side to the education market is irrelevant. They adopted the LCD technology at an early enough stage.
post #164 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by GTL215 View Post

i'm curious where your pricing info is coming from

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IMac_G4

Third paragraph - "However, the LCD iMacs were unable to match the low price point of the previous iMac G3s, largely because of the higher cost of the LCD technology at the time.
"

Wikipedia is not a valid resource for any information, especially since they don't have any pricing history.

Download Mactracker or visit www.apple-history.com. The original iMac G3 was priced at $1,299, and the original iMac G4 was priced at $1,299. iMac (Bondi Blue) was released in 1998 for $1,299. The iMac G4 (Flat Panel) was released in 2002 for $1,299. There were three models available: $1,299, $1,499, and $1,799. The previous iMac G3 (Summer 2001) was priced at $999, $1,299, and $1,499. So your wiki reference was made by some guy that is talking out of his ass. The last iMac G4 (15" USB 2.0) was still priced at $1,299.
post #165 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by hillstones View Post

Wikipedia is not a valid resource for any information, especially since they don't have any pricing history.

Download Mactracker or visit www.apple-history.com. The original iMac G3 was priced at $1,299, and the original iMac G4 was priced at $1,299. iMac (Bondi Blue) was released in 1998 for $1,299. The iMac G4 (Flat Panel) was released in 2002 for $1,299. There were three models available: $1,299, $1,499, and $1,799. The previous iMac G3 (Summer 2001) was priced at $999, $1,299, and $1,499. So your wiki reference was made by some guy that is talking out of his ass. The last iMac G4 (15" USB 2.0) was still priced at $1,299.

So you say the previous G3 sold for $999, while the new g4 sold for $1299? And i say "the LCD iMacs were unable to match the low price point of the previous iMac G3s, largely because of the higher cost of the LCD technology at the time."

Thanks for proving my point.
post #166 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by GTL215 View Post

ugh, you're still missing my point. Tech-dud made another retarded comment, this time about how Apple was among the last to drop CRT monitors. I corrected him by pointing out that Apple introduced standard LCD panels in their iMac lineup in Jan-2002 (over 7 years ago). What they continued to sell on the side to the education market is irrelevant. They adopted the LCD technology at an early enough stage.

But you missed the point in which Apple brought the eMac to the masses, and then was made fun of after claiming the "death of the CRT." Apple continued to sell the eMac everywhere for three more years.
post #167 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by GTL215 View Post

So you say the previous G3 sold for $999, while the new g4 sold for $1299? And i say "the LCD iMacs were unable to match the low price point of the previous iMac G3s, largely because of the higher cost of the LCD technology at the time."

Thanks for proving my point.

The base model was $999. Take a look at the other two models. I proved my point. The LCD did not increase the price above the prior iMac G3 since they both had two models at the same price. The $999 iMac had much lower specs and didn't match the iMac G4. The mid and upper iMac G3 were closer matches.
post #168 of 181
btw, the Touch's 3:2 3.5" touchscreen's area is about 25% larger than the Zilch HD's 16.9 3.3" touchscreen's area. almost the same width (in landscape mode), but that much taller. and for anything visual, but especially games, size matters.
post #169 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by GTL215 View Post

So you say the previous G3 sold for $999, while the new g4 sold for $1299? And i say "the LCD iMacs were unable to match the low price point of the previous iMac G3s, largely because of the higher cost of the LCD technology at the time."

Thanks for proving my point.

In the CRT G3:
$999 for a 500MHz CPU
$1,299 for a 600MHz CPU
$1,499 for a 700MHZ CPU

In the LCD G4:
*$1,299 for a 700MHz CPU w/ CD burner
$1,499 for a 700MHZ CPU w/ combo drive
$1,799 for a 800MHz CPU w/ superdrive

The $999 model had the 500MHz G3, 128MB RAM and a 20GB HDD. The other two models came with double the RAM of the $999 model and had a 40GB and 60GB HDD, respectively.

The LCD G4 had the newer, faster processor, the same amount of RAM as the higher-end CRT G3s, and similar sized HDDs. The LCDs brought more expensive optical drives and the option for an 800MHz model.

If you start with the CPU and then compare with as identical components from the 6 months prior there is a price drop for the increased performance and technology.

The discontinuing of a 500 and 600MHz iMac does not constitute a dramatic price increase or an increased price in LCD panels, merely a starting price hike which is not uncommon for Apple, though the outcries on the forum would make you think it was the first the time theyd ever done such a thing.
Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
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Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
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post #170 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacTel View Post

Exactly! We're comparing to a product that has no solid ship date (sometime in fall). Apple is intro'ing new iPhones next month and maybe new iPod Touches so we'll see how it all shakes out with the latest from Apple and this new Zune when it finally ships.

MS can never keep a secret and often they float these annoucements to create FUD so people on the fence between MS and Apple products will wait a bit longer rather than make a quick buy on a Apple product. I don't know who those people are but MS seems to think there's enough to require this release of info.

I hope they do well. We need the competition to keep the innovation flowing.

I would love to see new ipods come out a month after the zune hd with major upgrades.

just to watch the huge wave of buyer's remorse after realizing their month old technology just got outdated

just hypothetical, but still amusing
post #171 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chase R View Post

I think you missed my point. Apple has seen the reward from Multi-Touch and they will continue to do so even if other companies start incorporating it. Patenting Multi-Touch is like patenting FM radio or whatever. Apple did come up with the idea but it's not like MS is using Apple's code... It's just another feature MS (and others) are significantly late on.

FM Radio was patented. Also, if I'm not mistaken, it required licensing to encourage broad adoption. Multitouch can thrive independently without such support.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edwin_Howard_Armstrong

And to say Apple has seen the reward and that they'll continue to do just fine even if others use it...sounds a little too socialist for my liking. Who's to say that they've seen enough reward and now it's time to share? I say let it be dictated by current patent regulations.
post #172 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by RichL View Post

I also hate how Apple charge for software updates. It's not much money but it's the principle of the matter. When everyone else is giving something away for free, even $10 suddenly looks very expensive. Microsoft have made a lot of mistakes with the Zune but at least the software updates, even major ones, are free.

I know it's been covered before, but basically, if Microsoft uses a standard accounting method (reporting revenues up front as opposed to spread out over an extended period of time) they will be legally required to charge for their software updates as well (few and far between they may be)
post #173 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by res08hao View Post

I would hang myself if I worked for this pathetic company.

Daddy, what do you do at microsoft?
I work on the zune.
What's that?
It's like the ipod.
Never heard of it.
I know.

Steve Ballmer, man of vision and dynamic leader. What a loudmouth blustering buffoon.

I just got this from M$:

Exploring Windows: Special Beta Edition -- Correction

Because you signed up to test the Windows 7 Beta, we recently sent you mail about the expiration dates for the Beta and Release Candidate. Unfortunately, we made a mistake.

We said the Beta would start shutting down every two hours on June 1, 2009. The correct date is July 1, 2009.


The rest of the dates in the mail were correct. Heres a quick summary:
Version:
Starts shutting down every two hours:
Expires:
Beta
July 1, 2009
August 1, 2009
Release Candidate
March 1, 2010
June 1, 2010


We apologize for the error and any confusion it may have caused.

Thanks again for helping us test Windows 7.

Microsoft Development Team

....

ROFL, what are they thinking, Windoze shutting down every two hours, isn't that normal?
From Apple ][ - to new Mac Pro I've used them all.
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"Google doesn't sell you anything, they just sell you!"
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From Apple ][ - to new Mac Pro I've used them all.
Long on AAPL so biased
"Google doesn't sell you anything, they just sell you!"
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post #174 of 181
If Apple's iPhone/iPod Touch display was deficient or people complained, then indeed OLED would be needed. OLED is only appropriate if it's batter savings countered its expense.

Talking to my friends that are contrarian to the iPod/iPhone platform, the are all holding out to buy the Palm Pre when it comes out. I don't know where MS's Zune fits in the marketplace...
post #175 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by halfyearsun View Post

I would love to see new ipods come out a month after the zune hd with major upgrades.

just to watch the huge wave of buyer's remorse after realizing their month old technology just got outdated

just hypothetical, but still amusing

you may have heard of Apple's 'back to school' promotion announced yesterday. buy any Mac, get a $229 touch free - through Sept 8. which is almost the same as last year's, when Apple then rolled out the new 2008 touch later that month. so expect the same timing for the 2009 touch announcement, to come this September.
post #176 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post

Yeah, but the point is whether they all have the cash to savor the "experience."

Nah. I think point is they would never swap Windows for Mac experience. Gamers being first obvious group, but one could probably scrap a few more categories.

Mac experience - nice as it is - is still not as widespread as Windows experience, and there are still much more people gaming than garage-banding, IMHO.
post #177 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by GTL215 View Post

so it sounds like a forgone conclusion the iPhone will have OLED screen, probably this year. Where are the Pre fanboys? All of a sudden multiple "web apps" on Sprint doesn't seem as enticing. Another iPhone killer, kicked to the curb.

I like Pre features and screen looks decent - whatever it is. I don't need best screen on the market; I need good overall device. My final decision to buy (or not to buy) Pre/iPhone/... will be based on whole package, not just one cosmetic feature like OLED screen. In fact, multiple web apps (on very nice looking screen) still look very enticing, compared to single app on OLED screen.

And your point is..?
post #178 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by halfyearsun View Post

just to watch the huge wave of buyer's remorse after realizing their month old technology just got outdated

Since when is 27 people a "huge wave"?
post #179 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by minderbinder View Post

Depends what you use it for. The apps are a major selling point for the iphone and touch, and it remains to be seen if the zune will be able to match that. Especially since it's a chicken and egg situation - if you're a third party dev, do you risk coding for a platform that is so far behind in market share?

You're right... The App-ability of the Touch is superior at this point. I'm sure MS will make a good run at it though.

However, after reading about the new Palm Pre... if they only offered a non-phone option, as the iPod Touch - that would be very enticing. Also being a Palm PDA owner, I think I would jump right on a non-phone Pre. There are many, many apps for the Palm, and what's nice, is they allow for some geeking (unlike Apple, which likes to lock down and control everything).

Aaah, a non-phone Pre.... now that would be sweet!
post #180 of 181
If I remember correctly, Windows CE was developed into Pocket PC, which was developed into Windows Mobile...

Oh no, it's not Windows Mobile.

It's an illegitimate child of the grand-daddy of Windows Mobile!
post #181 of 181
Windows CE is the foundation of several operating systems, including Windows Mobile.
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