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Apple's Mac OS X 10.6 Snow Leopard to retail for $29 in September - Page 3

post #81 of 125
Quote:
Originally Posted by TiAdiMundo View Post

New Taskbar, new window controls (Aero Snap and Aero Peek), full multi touch support, virtual folders (libraries) for user files, complete new network connection ui, complete new ui standard for apps (called "Scenic Ribbon") introduced in new versions of Paint and WordPad (first update since a decade), new font rendering, hardware accelerated 2d graphics API, DirectX 11, GPU acceleration for apps, CPU acceleration for 3D (WARP), unified and centralized notification system (Action Center), a new themes system, out-of-the-box codec support even for .mov files, impressive performance improvements.

Are you sure you have tested it?

For me it is clear why Apple has chosen to deliver this next update for a special price: it is more or less just a Service Pack with some new features. But it is a wise move.

Yes I have tested it, although not the multi-touch features as I don't have the hardware.

That is one of the ares that I think looks exciting, along with the cleaned up task bar and window features.

But your analysis is way out: Things like the updates to Wordpad and Paint - well these are long overdue, considering the subtle refinements and updates Apple has made to all their bundled applications during the lifetime of OS X.

Here's a feature list for Snow Leopard (and Apple is not really talking up user facing features):
- New Dock with Exposé and updated contextual menus
- Updated Exposé window management (spring loaded, minimised windows show in exposé)
- Live icon manipulation and preview, icon zoom
- QuickLook in open/save dialogs
- Updated Preview with annotations
- The new stacks concept (added in Leopard) now allows for navigation
- Create your own system wide services (Windows has no such concept) which are now displayed contextually
- System wide auto-correct, text substitutions and data dectectors
- Thesaurus
- Built in screen recording
- Built in video editing in QuickTime and sharing with Quicktime
- Many accessibility improvements (braille device support, web spots, voiceover trackpad control)

That's ignoring the faster startups, faster shutdowns, smaller footprint etc.

The idea that Windows 7 makes Snow Leopard look like a service pack is laughable. All Snow Leopard makes Windows 7 look like is bad value for money.

Overall that list above isn't really that impressive as many features were in Leopard and earlier versions of Mac OS X.
New Taskbar = Exposé Dock (SL)
New Window Controls = Exposé enhancements (SL)
virtual folders = Smart Folders (L)
Complete new network connection ui = WiFi siginal strength in WiFi connection UI (SL)
Complete new ui standard for apps = Standard NS Toolbar
New versions of Paint and WordPad = New versions of TextEdit, Preview, Mail, iCal, Quicktime Address Book, iChat, Safari (with crash protection) etc.
hardware accelerated 2d graphics = Quartz Extreme
GPU acceleration for apps = Open CL

Edit: Not to mention Apple will be including all new and updated developer tools with Snow Leopard, whereas Microsoft will be charging up to many hundreds of dollars for their equivalents (apart from the Express editions).

Edit again: Exchange, I didn't mention Exchange support, something which Windows 7 certainly won't support out the box.
post #82 of 125
Nice rebuttal Columbus!
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post #83 of 125
Quote:
Originally Posted by PG4G View Post

Do service packs have a complete overhaul of multithreading, a complete move to 64bit, a completely new language specification that runs GPUs as CPUs, etc?

Maybe WIndows 7 is a good overhaul graphically and layout wise, but it seems mighty lacking in core changes. Almost everything is to improve the perceived "horribleness" of Vista.

Windows has been fully 64-bit since Windows XP 64-bit. If anything, SL is behind Windows in terms of going fully 64-bit. Windows 7 will have DirectX 11 with Compute Shader, which does highly parallel calculations on the GPU. The graphics subsystem is much more robust allowing hybrid GPU from different vendors say ATI and NVIDIA, the ability to switch GPU on the fly without logging off since Windows Vista (something Leopard can't do), etc...
post #84 of 125
Quote:
Originally Posted by KevinN206 View Post

Windows has been fully 64-bit since Windows XP 64-bit. If anything, SL is behind Windows in terms of going fully 64-bit. Windows 7 will have DirectX 11 with Compute Shader, which does highly parallel calculations on the GPU.

Yes but the Windows 64-bit transition wasn't without pain. My mother had to replace hardware because developers were lazy about making 64-bit drivers and Vista 64 doesn't handle mixed 32-bit/64-bit environments like Snow Leopard is expected to.

I believe that everything Apple is working on is in some Redmond lab getting tested for Microsoft. Neither company is head and shoulders above the other where it comes to implementing newer computing paradigms IMO.

Apple moved to Cocoa - Microsoft moved to .Net
Apple leveraged the GPU with Quartz Extreme - Microsoft leveraged it with Aero

I think Apple uses scripting to good effect but i'm nowhere conversant enough about scripting in Windows to even broach the subject.

I think it really comes down to aethetics and how the applications are presented. From a functional standpoint both can do the same things overall
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post #85 of 125
Quote:
Originally Posted by columbus View Post

But your analysis is way out: Things like the updates to Wordpad and Paint - well these are long overdue, considering the subtle refinements and updates Apple has made to all their bundled applications during the lifetime of OS X.

Yes they are overdue but the updates are huge! For the first time standard apps will not have menus and toolbars anymore. It's like Vista's Explorer killed the old Lisa OS era menus by introducing a streamlined contextual command bar and Office 2007 introduced the contextual Ribbon, now we will see this paradigm in a lot more third party apps. A lot of people will not believe but Microsoft is leading innovation here in UI design. Snow Leopard is still Lisa OS (old menus) + OpenStep (the Dock) + Exposé.

Quote:
Originally Posted by columbus View Post

The idea that Windows 7 makes Snow Leopard look like a service pack is laughable. All Snow Leopard makes Windows 7 look like is bad value for money.

Do you know the price for an update from Vista to 7?

Btw I forgot to mention Device Stage and Jump Lists before. Very nice and huge features
post #86 of 125
All very nice. This will be an instant update for me. It will solve a lot of problems.

I wonder what's holding them up with Blu-Ray though. When Steve Jobs talked about a "world of hurt" with licensing, I didn't realize he meant "a permanent war of attrition." Not that it affects me, though; I just long for the day when laptop DVD drives support 16x.
post #87 of 125
Quote:
Originally Posted by lfmorrison View Post

By this it appears that you're concerned that you won't be able to use your G4 or G5 based Mac anymore come September when Snow Leopard is released.

Rest assured, those computers will not magically stop working on that day. (On the other hand, my G5 iMac died several months ago, apparently due to exploding capacitors, but that's another story...) And all the same apps that ran on them before will still run on them after.

If you're concerned about the end of security support, your fears are also unfounded. Note that Apple is still actively releasing security updates for Tiger.

If you're just concerned about the fact that new OSes are not being released for PowerPC-based Macs, well, all I can say is, this shouldn't be coming as a surprise: We've heard for quite some time now that the Snow Leopard betas would only run on Intel-based systems.

That's true. If you need to keep your software updated (save for the OS), then you're probably good until 10.7 comes out. Most software seems to support the current and previous version of the OS.
post #88 of 125
Will they have a SL update disk with the new iLife on it as well and what the cost would be?

Anyone?
post #89 of 125
Does the $29 fee come with iWork as well? Because the $169 comes with iWork and iLife for Tiger users. Good move for Apple. :-)
post #90 of 125
Quote:
Originally Posted by Macintosh_Next View Post

Does the $29 fee come with iWork as well? Because the $169 comes with iWork and iLife for Tiger users. Good move for Apple. :-)

Nope ..just the upgrade from Leopard. I'm going to get the SL Mac Box Set even though I have Leopard on disc because I want the family pack of SL, iLife and iWork
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post #91 of 125
Quote:
Originally Posted by hmurchison View Post

Nope ..just the upgrade from Leopard. I'm going to get the SL Mac Box Set even though I have Leopard on disc because I want the family pack of SL, iLife and iWork

Another reason to get the Box Set is to include the 64-bit versions of iLife 09 and iWork 09 along with a 64-bit OS. I am not certain that all these applications will be 64-bit, but most of them should be. Convert over to 64-bits as much as possible at once. Currently I have Leopard and iLife 08, but not iWork.

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post #92 of 125
Quote:
Originally Posted by BertP View Post

Another reason to get the Box Set is to include the 64-bit versions of iLife 09 and iWork 09 along with a 64-bit OS. I am not certain that all these applications will be 64-bit, but most of them should be. Convert over to 64-bits as much as possible at once. Currently I have Leopard and iLife 08, but not iWork.

I sold my iLife 08 and I've got Leopard which I'll likely sell in anticipation of SL Mac Box Set. It would make sense for Apple to deliver SL versions of iLife and iWork with the Box Set.

iLife could really use Grand Central and Quicktime X support sooner rather than later.
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post #93 of 125
I'm curious as to how well Snow Leopard will run iLife '06 and iWork '06. Does anybody have any thoughts/experiences?
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post #94 of 125
Quote:
Originally Posted by dino View Post

I'm curious as to how well Snow Leopard will run iLife '06 and iWork '06. Does anybody have any thoughts/experiences?

Anyone that can run Snow Leopard will have an Intel Mac and that means they'll want iLife 09 and iWork 09 IMO.
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post #95 of 125
I want the new iLife and iWork, but I don't use them enough to make it worth upgrading.
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post #96 of 125
Quote:
Originally Posted by columbus View Post

What have they added new to Windows 7 that isn't in Vista? I've used the beta of Win 7 and Vista and the only big difference I noticed was the new Taskbar.

There are a number of visual enhancements in Snow Leopard, the Dock and Exposé being big ones. The difference is Apple isn't marketing these as big features, they are just slipping them in.

Windows 7 makes a big play of the new taskbar, because they haven't got as much going on in the back-end (things like HomeGroup are cool and all), but they play catch up to Bonjour, and open standard Microsoft could have been using for years.

For me Snow Leopard is a steal, easily as many features as 10.2 and 10.3 added, but with a far smaller price.

I've been using the beta of win 7 for awhile. I reminds me of windows 2000, which was probably their best effort. With that said, the GUI and UI are infurating and stupid. It's amazingly badly designed at every level I can think of and I hate using it.

I was trying to move files around the other day and I couldn't believe how shitty it was.
post #97 of 125
Quote:
Originally Posted by freakboy View Post

I've been using the beta of win 7 for awhile. I reminds me of windows 2000, which was probably their best effort. With that said, the GUI and UI are infurating and stupid. It's amazingly badly designed at every level I can think of and I hate using it.

I was trying to move files around the other day and I couldn't believe how shitty it was.

What was shitty about the process of moving files around? I am interested in knowing why rather than that it was "shitty" without any explanation.
post #98 of 125
Quote:
Originally Posted by KevinN206 View Post

What was shitty about the process of moving files around? I am interested in knowing why rather than that it was "shitty" without any explanation.

I'll chime in on this digression. For starters, the ridiculous "replace file" dialog box. Instead of just asking if I want to replace an (older/newer/same) file, Win7 has a nonstandard "click an icon" dialog box, with no obvious indicator of which is which -- you just have to read through the dialog text and file info and compare the dates yourself. Not only that, but clicking the "Don't Move" icon has the exact same effect as the "Cancel" button at the bottom, which in turn has the same effect as the red X at the top. Seriously. Three buttons that do the exact same thing in a single dialog box. Nice one, Microsoft.
post #99 of 125
I'll be upgrading to Snow Leopard once it is released. I'm really loving everything about it. And will also buy a new MacBook at release.

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post #100 of 125
Quote:
Originally Posted by minderbinder View Post

What do you mean what happened to it? It's not like anyone expected any word of it today.

mac soda said it would be there!
post #101 of 125
Quote:
Originally Posted by jamiec View Post

Three buttons that do the exact same thing in a single dialog box. Nice one, Microsoft.

Microsoft is all about choice!



The "Snow Leopard is a Service Pack" meme is already annoying and i fear it's not going to go away any time soon. I'm betting it's going to be the #1 troll talking point related to SL
post #102 of 125
Probably I missed it, but what about Rosetta? Is it going to be included or not in Snow Leopard?
post #103 of 125
Quote:
Originally Posted by columbus View Post

Yes I have tested it, although not the multi-touch features as I don't have the hardware.

That is one of the ares that I think looks exciting, along with the cleaned up task bar and window features.

But your analysis is way out: Things like the updates to Wordpad and Paint - well these are long overdue, considering the subtle refinements and updates Apple has made to all their bundled applications during the lifetime of OS X.

Here's a feature list for Snow Leopard (and Apple is not really talking up user facing features):
- New Dock with Exposé and updated contextual menus
- Updated Exposé window management (spring loaded, minimised windows show in exposé)
- Live icon manipulation and preview, icon zoom
- QuickLook in open/save dialogs
- Updated Preview with annotations
- The new stacks concept (added in Leopard) now allows for navigation
- Create your own system wide services (Windows has no such concept) which are now displayed contextually
- System wide auto-correct, text substitutions and data dectectors
- Thesaurus
- Built in screen recording
- Built in video editing in QuickTime and sharing with Quicktime
- Many accessibility improvements (braille device support, web spots, voiceover trackpad control)

That's ignoring the faster startups, faster shutdowns, smaller footprint etc.

The idea that Windows 7 makes Snow Leopard look like a service pack is laughable. All Snow Leopard makes Windows 7 look like is bad value for money.

Overall that list above isn't really that impressive as many features were in Leopard and earlier versions of Mac OS X.
New Taskbar = Exposé Dock (SL)
New Window Controls = Exposé enhancements (SL)
virtual folders = Smart Folders (L)
Complete new network connection ui = WiFi siginal strength in WiFi connection UI (SL)
Complete new ui standard for apps = Standard NS Toolbar
New versions of Paint and WordPad = New versions of TextEdit, Preview, Mail, iCal, Quicktime Address Book, iChat, Safari (with crash protection) etc.
hardware accelerated 2d graphics = Quartz Extreme
GPU acceleration for apps = Open CL

Edit: Not to mention Apple will be including all new and updated developer tools with Snow Leopard, whereas Microsoft will be charging up to many hundreds of dollars for their equivalents (apart from the Express editions).

Edit again: Exchange, I didn't mention Exchange support, something which Windows 7 certainly won't support out the box.

That is why i always have problem understanding Apple's pricing system.

$29 for all of those?? Its a STEAL!.

It must be the calculation of owing an Apple Laptop that has already subsidized the cost of OS development.
post #104 of 125
Quote:
Originally Posted by Solar View Post

Microsoft is all about choice!

Heh. I almost posted exactly this.

Quote:
The "Snow Leopard is a Service Pack" meme is already annoying and i fear it's not going to go away any time soon. I'm betting it's going to be the #1 troll talking point related to SL

Meh. The idea of various OS X releases being "service packs" has been a stable of PC chauvinism for a while. It's a twofer-- you can claim that Mac software is a poor value while forcing the argument into Microsoft-centric terminology, as if Apple were just an imperfect Windows client. Never mind that "service pack" is purely an MS marketing label, and has no meaning whatsoever outside of that context.

PC chauvinists are like the ugly Americans of the computer world-- self satisfied, certain that they are the very definition of "normal", and completely unwilling to pay any attention to local custom or language when they venture forth from their strip malls and suburban tract houses.

Talking to such people is like having a red-faced guy in bermuda shorts shouting at you because he's convinced that volume is the only barrier to driving his point home amongst the woefully ignorant locals.
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post #105 of 125
Quote:
Originally Posted by bdkennedy1 View Post

I don't see 10.6 competing with or stealing Windows 7's thunder.

Windows 7 is being marketed as a major new OS and OS X 10.6 doesn't offer anything new or exciting for the consumer that you can see on the outside.

To me there is a contradiction on how it's being presented and actuality. Where Windows 7 is presented as a new OS and will have a premium price, it appears to be a Vista make-over what I read about it (and I'm no Windows expert, so who will extend on this?), whereas Snow Leopard, which is stil a .x upgrade, is practically given away as 'fine tuning', but look at the impact:
- FULL 64-bit support, including that for developers (64-bit made idiot proof),
- support for GPU use in regular (e.g. non graphical) tasks,
- 50% footprint reduction (!),
- Safari plug-in sandboxing
- etc., etc.
The truth is out there: Windows 7 is a limited update to Vista and Snow Leopard features some great innovations that will enhance the user experience.

The irony of course is that a more compact OS that could run great on limited hardware will not run on limited Apple hardware (G4/G5), although from a business point of view this is totally understandable. I'm curious how well Snow Leopard works on netbooks and old Intel CPUs...
post #106 of 125
To me the 'service pack' way to act of Microsoft is marketing to keep users from getting the full blow of what is actually changing in the OS. I've seen some update lists of these service packs and some are really complete overhauls of parts of the system. To me it's: "Hey, let's say it's a big bug fix instead of that we gave them a non-finished product that we are completing with this major update."
post #107 of 125
surprised to see no news/discussion of major interface changes
post #108 of 125
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aglaea View Post

To me there is a contradiction on how it's being presented and actuality. Where Windows 7 is presented as a new OS and will have a premium price, it appears to be a Vista make-over what I read about it (and I'm no Windows expert, so who will extend on this?)

Well the truth is that neither Snow Leopard nor Seven represent a new generation of their platforms. But Windows 7 will be targeted more to the XP users. And for them, who haven't really given Vista a chance, may be shocked how good a Windows version actually can be (I know people who tested 7 on their old XP-machines and where indeed impressed). A lot of Vista features will be new to them when they first discover them in 7. The jump from XP to 7 is also higher than the update from Tiger to Snow Leopard.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aglaea View Post

To me the 'service pack' way to act of Microsoft is marketing to keep users from getting the full blow of what is actually changing in the OS. I've seen some update lists of these service packs and some are really complete overhauls of parts of the system. To me it's: "Hey, let's say it's a big bug fix instead of that we gave them a non-finished product that we are completing with this major update."

There are also new technologies and therefore new features. I just say full Blu-Ray support with Vista SP2 for f r e e
post #109 of 125
Quote:
Originally Posted by jonnyboy View Post

surprised to see no news/discussion of major interface changes

I think the "Marble" interface is still coming in Snow Leopard; it's the only reason I can see waiting until September to release an OS that many are saying is 'code complete'. In the next few weeks Apple will release the UI updates to developers for testing/implementation, and accompany it with a Steve-note on a new product (or Beatles iTunes availability) where he showcases the refinements.

They basically said in the presentation that Snow Leopard was the last of the big cats. Refine the code, trim it down, incorporate new 'building block' technologies, and add a layer of polish to the UI...Why? Because it will be the last OS release until late 2011; when Apple releases OS11. OS11 will be a major new update taking advantage of the core technologies and stability achieved in Snow Leopard, but with sweeping new features including full multi-touch support, new 3D desktop options, and much more.
post #110 of 125
Quote:
Originally Posted by minderbinder View Post

http://www.apple.com/macosx/specs.html

Upgrading from Mac OS X v10.4 Tiger.
If your Intel-based Mac is running Mac OS X v10.4 Tiger, purchase the Mac Box Set (when available), which is a single, affordable package that includes Mac OS X v10.6 Snow Leopard; iLife ’09, with the latest versions of iPhoto, iMovie, GarageBand, iWeb, and iDVD; and iWork ’09, Apple’s productivity suite for home and office including Pages, Numbers, and Keynote.

why buy the 09 apps in Sept-Oct when the new 2010 releases drop in Jan or Feb every year?

If I were advising a customer who uses intel 10.4 I would recomend the following:

buy a new HDD, todays HDDs are bigger and faster than 3 years ago, buy ram because maxing out the ram is the cheapest boost you can do, buy an SATA to usb or FW device and pick up a $29 copy of snow leopard and do as follows:

put the new hdd and ram in and install 10.6 to the blank disk, use the USB kit to connect the old drive and copy all needed files over, then wipe the old drive and use it for time machine. this will get you a much better system for about $100. and if you do want ilife, you can just install the version that came on your system disk untilll the 2010 versions of iwork and ilife ship in Jan.
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post #111 of 125
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sport73 View Post

I think the "Marble" interface is still coming in Snow Leopard; it's the only reason I can see waiting until September to release an OS that many are saying is 'code complete'. In the next few weeks Apple will release the UI updates to developers for testing/implementation

What makes you to believe so? Apple's own page on SL shows the same old blue scroll bars for the Finder windows (see the Time Machine picture). Although they carefully hide the window scrollbar in the Finder section of the same page, we can still see the blue Aqua theme in the selected items. I don't see why they would change this now that it is displayed publicly.
post #112 of 125
I suspect the reason Apple has decided to price the new OS so low is that by doing so, the company's sales numbers will be better between now and the September launch. Otherwise, you have to know that some people would hold off on buying a new computer in order to save money by buying one with the new OS included.

$29, on the other hand, is a really small amount and as such, no one would put off buying a new machine.

Considering the current economic climate, it's a smart move. Don't know if Apple will keep it at $29 but it certainly makes a lot of sense right now.

Also, it's in Apple's best interests to have their customers convert over to the new OS as quickly as possible to avoid the confusion of having two OSs out there running fundamentally different base code.
post #113 of 125
Quote:
Originally Posted by minderbinder View Post

http://www.apple.com/macosx/specs.html

Upgrading from Mac OS X v10.4 Tiger.
If your Intel-based Mac is running Mac OS X v10.4 Tiger, purchase the Mac Box Set (when available), which is a single, affordable package that includes Mac OS X v10.6 Snow Leopard; iLife 09, with the latest versions of iPhoto, iMovie, GarageBand, iWeb, and iDVD; and iWork 09, Apples productivity suite for home and office including Pages, Numbers, and Keynote.

Okay, but that is not the $29 upgrade, which is what a_greer asked about.
"They didnt mention a price to upgrade from Tiger, so will Tiger users on the early Macbooks be able to upgrade for $29?"
post #114 of 125
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carmissimo View Post

I suspect the reason Apple has decided to price the new OS so low is that by doing so, the company's sales numbers will be better between now and the September launch. Otherwise, you have to know that some people would hold off on buying a new computer in order to save money by buying one with the new OS included.

$29, on the other hand, is a really small amount and as such, no one would put off buying a new machine.

Considering the current economic climate, it's a smart move. Don't know if Apple will keep it at $29 but it certainly makes a lot of sense right now.

Also, it's in Apple's best interests to have their customers convert over to the new OS as quickly as possible to avoid the confusion of having two OSs out there running fundamentally different base code.

Even if they priced it at $129, the costumers who buy new Macs between now and the September launch only need to pay something around $9 to update so your first point is irrelevant IMO.

However, I agree it is in their best interest to have the majority of their user base upgrade to Snow Leopard, given it lays foundation for future technologies, and by pricing it at $29, which is really a steal for such performance improvement, it can make it.

In the meantime, since Microsoft loves to criticise Apple's pricing that much, I am really looking forward to how much they price Windows 7. The version I am talking about is not some basic version, Home version etc., but the version comes with full functionality like Snow Leopard delivers.
post #115 of 125
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rokken View Post

However, I agree it is in their best interest to have the majority of their user base upgrade to Snow Leopard, given it lays foundation for future technologies, and by pricing it at $29, which is really a steal for such performance improvement, it can make it.

+1

If you want developers to take advantage of 64-bit and GCD and OpenCL and QTX you need to create a viable market. $29 adds money to the til for Apple and gives value to Snow Leopard. This is about forward momentum. Snow Leopard is unlike any OS X version we've had. It resets the baseline.
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post #116 of 125
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carmissimo View Post

I suspect the reason Apple has decided to price the new OS so low is that by doing so, the company's sales numbers will be better between now and the September launch. Otherwise, you have to know that some people would hold off on buying a new computer in order to save money by buying one with the new OS included.

$29, on the other hand, is a really small amount and as such, no one would put off buying a new machine.

That explanation doesn't make sense because everyone buying a mac between yesterday and the day SL is released can upgrade for $10.
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post #117 of 125
Quote:
Originally Posted by hmurchison View Post

Apple leveraged the GPU with Quartz Extreme - Microsoft leveraged it with Aero

Five years later. Except even then the performance was terrible, even though they (MS) had far, far faster hardware to play with.

Quote:
Originally Posted by hmurchison View Post

Yes they are overdue but the updates are huge! For the first time standard apps will not have menus and toolbars anymore. It's like Vista's Explorer killed the old Lisa OS era menus by introducing a streamlined contextual command bar and Office 2007 introduced the contextual Ribbon, now we will see this paradigm in a lot more third party apps. A lot of people will not believe but Microsoft is leading innovation here in UI design. Snow Leopard is still Lisa OS (old menus) + OpenStep (the Dock) + Exposé.

The reason Leopard has old style menus is because they work and have worked for years. Its very easy to scan down a list to see options.

And lets not pretend Apple hasn't made refinements. Unlike in Windows the menu items are indexed and searchable. You can also customise keyboard shortcuts (and add new ones) for many apps using the Keyboard Preference Pane.

Here's what I think of the ribbon:
[1] Its a jumbled mess of arbitrarily sized icons and text arranged haphazardly across the toolbar.
[2] Screens are wide, not tall, anything stealing horizontal space from the content is a bad thing. The ribbon steals lots of space.


Quote:
Originally Posted by hmurchison View Post

Btw I forgot to mention Device Stage and Jump Lists before. Very nice and huge features

Jump Lists… well put the bunting out! OS X has had contextual menus above dock items for years and very few people use them. I doubt many people will use jump lists either. Device stage looks promising though.
post #118 of 125
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris_CA View Post

Okay, but that is not the $29 upgrade, which is what a_greer asked about.
"They didnt mention a price to upgrade from Tiger, so will Tiger users on the early Macbooks be able to upgrade for $29?"

Using your fingers and checking out the price from Tiger to Leopard Pack one should use their brain and realize that it won't be $29 from Tiger to Snow Leopard with iLife '09 plus iWorks '09.
post #119 of 125
Quote:
Originally Posted by columbus View Post

Five years later. Except even then the performance was terrible, even though they (MS) had far, far faster hardware to play with.



The reason Leopard has old style menus is because they work and have worked for years. Its very easy to scan down a list to see options.

And lets not pretend Apple hasn't made refinements. Unlike in Windows the menu items are indexed and searchable. You can also customise keyboard shortcuts (and add new ones) for many apps using the Keyboard Preference Pane.

Here's what I think of the ribbon:
[1] Its a jumbled mess of arbitrarily sized icons and text arranged haphazardly across the toolbar.
[2] Screens are wide, not tall, anything stealing horizontal space from the content is a bad thing. The ribbon steals lots of space.



Jump Lists well put the bunting out! OS X has had contextual menus above dock items for years and very few people use them. I doubt many people will use jump lists either. Device stage looks promising though.

Not sure how this came to be but you're attributing quotes to Murch that were posted by TiAdiMundo.
They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
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They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
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post #120 of 125
Quote:
Originally Posted by TiAdiMundo View Post

A lot of Vista features will be new to them when they first discover them in 7. The jump from XP to 7 is also higher than the update from Tiger to Snow Leopard.

Not surprising given the 8 year vs. 4 year gap between those two releases.

Not sure that impressing your customers with a big leap forward because they largely ignored your last big leap forward and have been standing pat for 8 years is a huge win, however. I imagine that if most of Apple's customers had hung onto 10.1 till now and then went straight to Snow Leopard, they'd be pretty impressed as well.
They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
Reply
They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
Reply
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