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The Biggest Threat to Obama's Health Care "Reform" - Reality - Page 33

post #1281 of 2360
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mumbo Jumbo View Post

Why, trumptman, thank you for answering so thoroughly on behalf of MJ1970.

I think you misread my post in perhaps the most hilariously catastrophic way I've seen in quite some time, but I'll just answer this bit while I wait for MJ1970 (or 'MJ', as I abbreviated his name, by dropping the numbers and leaving the letters- cunning, huh?).

Did I say that 'moral hazard' was a term exclusively associated with Ayn Rand?

Let me just check a minute.

...No, I didn't.

But your rant was very funny, if completely superfluous and missing the point, completely, in a humiliating sort of way.

Now go and re-read my post.

I did but enjoy the attempt to deflect from your accusations yet again.

Quote:
No. It's my way of acknowledging that I'm dealing with someone who's read a lot of Ayn Rand.

He asked about your use of the term and you defined it as someone who's read a lot of Ayn Rand. We need not go into the quantifiers again because you've made it clear you don't understand them.
Quote:
Oh yeah, and goodnight one and all.

Oh wait, trumptman. You love opinion polls, don't you?

http://www.gallup.com/poll/113980/Ga...-Approval.aspx

Yep. By golly, your nation loves Barack Obama, especially now he's passed this popular health care legislation. http://www.usatoday.com/news/washing...avorable_N.htm



I'm sure we can find polls in all sorts of directions right now.
This will be especially true since once again, the media have come off the sidelines and are extolling all the benefits without explaining all the costs. They aren't reporting, they are giant infomercials. So give it a week and let some of the bills come start coming due and we can note the polls then.

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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post #1282 of 2360
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wormhole View Post

OBAMA WON.

And that was really what was most important. To Barack Obama.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Wormhole View Post

Health care reform is reality.

It is? How so? When did this happen?

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post #1283 of 2360
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post

Got that feeling to have you? Try the ignore function. It works wonders.

I used it on Mumbo ages ago and it's really quite refreshing.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #1284 of 2360
This just in:

Over 30 million people - who were uninsured, sick, and dying of various ailments - were miraculously healed today moments after President Obama signed the health care bill into law.

He then turned bottles of Evian into beer for the post-ceremony festivities.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #1285 of 2360
Thread Starter 

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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post #1286 of 2360
Interesting insight:

http://www.miamiherald.com/2010/03/2...-is-suing.html

The Repubs are claiming a provision in the law is unconstitutional... They were the first to push the idea, however. So, they were willing to push an unconstitutional idea as viable and legal when it was different from a Dem idea, but now claim it as unconstitutional when Dems propose it?

A logical progression of understanding and a resultant change in an opinion is one thing, but flailing allover the place simply because somebody else (those evil liberals) presented it is beyond comprehension.

 

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post #1287 of 2360
Reading around the net I saw several people raising interesting points about the requirement for people to have insurance.

One very good one:

Drivers are required to have auto insurance... and nobody is complaining about that gubberment intervention into our precious free lives.

Someone could respond that the government doesn't require them to buy cars. True. But if they do, the they must have insurance. Why? To help them in case of trouble? Well, primarily to help an innocent victim if they drive dangerously.

One poster then suggested that a person with an illness that goes untreated because he can't afford to see a doctor could potentially infect thousands... many times the number often involved in a car accident.

 

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post #1288 of 2360
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bergermeister View Post

Reading around the net I saw several people raising interesting points about the requirement for people to have insurance.

One very good one:

Drivers are required to have auto insurance... and nobody is complaining about that gubberment intervention into our precious free lives.

Someone could respond that the government doesn't require them to buy cars. True. But if they do, the they must have insurance. Why? To help them in case of trouble? Well, primarily to help an innocent victim if they drive dangerously.

One poster then suggested that a person with an illness that goes untreated because he can't afford to see a doctor could potentially infect thousands... many times the number often involved in a car accident.

You already pointed out the flaw in that comparison. Nobody is required to have a car.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #1289 of 2360
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post

Actually since the replies contain nothing but snide asides, what should be addressed?



Well clearly they have fun with their strawmen. The Constitution sets up what the role of the federal government happens to be and if you don't desire to extend it past that role then anarchy for all is the only other possible choice or at least that is what is being portrayed. The whole actually follow the Constitution but, well that is just so passé.

As you note, this is about wealth transfer mostly from the abled bodies and especially the young.



Get used to the accusations. It's what people toss out when they don't have any persuasive reasoning. It goes a bit like this. Post sarcastic or derisive comment. Watch it fail to persuade and then call you a piece of shit because you didn't laugh thus showing you were in with the cool kids. Most of us got over that in middle/high school.



It would be really amazing if this was so effective that it changed minds in the fall considering most of the benefits don't kick in for four years.



Well we can perhaps hope then that when the election comes if this is overturned that it will provide the political will to overturn and remove other actions the federal government ought not be involved in.



Did you "hear(d)" that from someone?

Quote:
It would be really amazing if this was so effective that it changed minds in the fall considering most of the benefits don't kick in for four years.

All the voter has to see is no death panels.

Quote:
Did you "hear(d)" that from someone?

Well.....it's pretty transparent. Much like listening to you. I mean the abortion angle really?
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post #1290 of 2360
Quote:
She said she first heard the concept of the "individual mandate" in a Miami speech in the early 1990s by Sen. John McCain, a conservative Republican from Arizona, to counter the "Hillarycare" the Clintons were proposing.

So McCain is a conservative now? And somehow the individual mandate was a "GOP idea" because McCain The Conservative floated it in 1993?

Really, Berg...this is the worse kind of "cheap." Even if a Republican had proposed it, it's unconstitutional. And I doubt you're going to find many statements from leading conservatives supporting the idea--20 years ago or not. It's a clear violation of the 10th Amendment. States governments can make citizens buy things like auto insurance, for example. The Federal government cannot force citizens to buy something.

Repeal? I don't know. I do think there is a good case for the USSC overturning the mandate.
I can only please one person per day.  Today is not your day.  Tomorrow doesn't look good either.  
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post #1291 of 2360
Sates are suing to stop the bill... but why?

I hear cries of, "Good for them!"


Heh heh heh.

They can opt out of the individual mandate.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/0..._n_511748.html

They're just enjoying putting on a show.

 

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post #1292 of 2360
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bergermeister View Post

Sates are suing to stop the bill... but why?

I hear cries of, "Good for them!"


Heh heh heh.

They can opt out of the individual mandate.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/0..._n_511748.html

They're just enjoying putting on a show.

So what you are doing it calling Obama and others liars when they claim 30 million more will be covered by this bill because there is no means of enforcing the fines or mandates associated with them?

I suspect it is a little more complicated than that. I'm sure the waiver that needs to be applied for has some criteria attached to the granting of it and that is what a court would evaluate.

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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post #1293 of 2360
The GOP is trying so hard to obstruct the bill that they might actually have given the public option a chance at reality sooner than people had thought.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/0..._n_512609.html

If the PO gets approved due to GOP stupidity, how will the Tea Party react?

 

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post #1294 of 2360
Delete

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #1295 of 2360
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bergermeister View Post

The GOP is trying so hard to obstruct the bill that they might actually have given the public option a chance at reality sooner than people had thought.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/0..._n_512609.html

If the PO gets approved due to GOP stupidity, how will the Tea Party react?

Can you say " Apoplectic "?
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post #1296 of 2360
Cahill bashes state -- and national -- health care reform law:

Quote:
Cahill said it is the governor who has not done enough to lower costs imposed by the state's health insurance law, which Cahill said has nearly bankrupted the state.

Cahill said the law is being sustained only with the help of federal aid, which he suggested that the Obama administration is funneling to Massachusetts to help the president make the case for a similar plan in Congress.

The real problem is the sucking sound of money that has been going in to pay for this health care reform, Cahill said. And I would argue that were being propped up so that the federal government and the Obama administration can drive it through Congress.

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post #1297 of 2360
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/36020850...-capitol_hill/

Quote:
Cantor: Dems capitalizing on extremist threats
Condemns violence but says Dems are 'fanning flames' of extremism

The violence isn't just bad it's unacceptable. Don't they get that?

It doesn't do much to fan flames when the fire's already so big and noticable.
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post #1298 of 2360
Quote:
Originally Posted by SDW2001 View Post

So McCain is a conservative now? And somehow the individual mandate was a "GOP idea" because McCain The Conservative floated it in 1993?

Really, Berg...this is the worse kind of "cheap." Even if a Republican had proposed it, it's unconstitutional. And I doubt you're going to find many statements from leading conservatives supporting the idea--20 years ago or not. It's a clear violation of the 10th Amendment. States governments can make citizens buy things like auto insurance, for example. The Federal government cannot force citizens to buy something.

Repeal? I don't know. I do think there is a good case for the USSC overturning the mandate.

How about the Heritage Foundation, who (like most other Republicans until recently) were proposing Romneycare/Obamacare, including an individual mandate as recently as 2003.
Quote:
This translates into a requirement on individuals to enroll themselves and their dependents in at least a basic health plan - one that at the minimum should protect the rest of society from large and unexpected medical costs incurred by the family. And as any social contract, there would also be an obligation on society. To the extent that the family cannot reasonably afford reasonable basic coverage, the rest of society, via government, should take responsibility for financing that minimum coverage.

But who knows, with this activist conservative court we have now, it wouldn't surprise me if they did strike it down.
post #1299 of 2360
Taxing tanning. It seems that one of the small parts (no doubt there will be many that come out as we learn what is actually in this bill) of ObamaCare is a new tax on tanning salons. It's 10% I think. Anyone know why they chose to do this? Why specifically tanning salons?

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post #1300 of 2360
The Party of No has a new name: "The party of the hissy fit"

http://opinionator.blogs.nytimes.com...me&ref=general


He also points out a member of congress who not long ago ran for the highest office with the lofty slogan "Country First" who just recently said "no cooperation for the rest of the year."

Gotta love these GOPpers.

 

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post #1301 of 2360
Quote:
Originally Posted by MJ1970 View Post

Taxing tanning. It seems that one of the small parts (no doubt there will be many that come out as we learn what is actually in this bill) of ObamaCare is a new tax on tanning salons. It's 10% I think. Anyone know why they chose to do this? Why specifically tanning salons?

I would think it would be obvious. It's something people do alot but don't really need.
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post #1302 of 2360
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

I would think it would be obvious. It's something people do alot but don't really need.

Isn't there also am increased risk of cancer?

 

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post #1303 of 2360
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bergermeister View Post

Isn't there also am increased risk of cancer?

Yup! So really anti healthy.
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post #1304 of 2360
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

I would think it would be obvious. It's something people do alot but don't really need.

So they are taxing it so people will do it less?

Is this the same thinking behind taxing the so-called "Cadillac" health insurance plans also?

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post #1305 of 2360
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

I would think it would be obvious. It's something people do alot but don't really need.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bergermeister View Post

Isn't there also am increased risk of cancer?

Actually, there is a growing body of evidence that vitamin D deficiencies are at the root of quite a number of health problems we have today, including breast cancer. Vitamin D is generated in the body as a reaction to and result of exposure to the UV rays of the sun. Scientists are looking at correlations between the increase in the whole sunscreen and "stay out of the sun" movement over the past 20-30 years and increases in a variety of ailments (including cancer risks). So, the science on this area doesn't seem to be quite settled yet it seems.

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post #1306 of 2360
As someone with a pre-existing (not congenital) condition I do approve of the mandated coverage for those conditions, even more so for stories like I posted below. Pretty much the only way I have coverage right now is due to my Tricare Retiree insurance from my military service having to accept all applicants regardless of health status on retirement from the military. So basically I already have an equivalent to "Obamacare". And I only pay about $35/month for the coverage.

10-Day-Old Baby Denied Health Care Coverage

Quote:
Houston Tracy is just 10 days old, but the little boy has already lived through trying times.

"He was born with what's called transposition of the great arteries." his father, Doug Tracy said. "It's heart wrenching; I hated it."

The congenital heart defect causes the two major vessels that carry blood away from the heart to become switched.

It's a condition rarely detected before birth.

"My whole pregnancy was simple, it was easy, no complications, doctor visits were great," Houston's mother, Kim Tracy said. "Perfect sonograms, great little pictures and then, he wasn't perfect."

The baby was rushed to Cook Children's Medical Center in Fort Worth where he had life-saving surgery.

"He's doing really good," his mother said with a smile, "he's a little tough guy."

While baby Houston is fighting for recovery, his parents found themselves in another battle: Fighting the insurance company, Blue Cross and Blue Shield of Texas.

The Tracy's are both small business owners and do not carry health insurance for themselves. They do carry insurance on their two other children and tried to get insurance for Houston, but they found out Wednesday his coverage was denied.

"They kept saying it's preexisting, it's preexisting, but I don't know how it can be preexisting on a baby that was just born." his father said. "If it's mandated that everyone have health insurance, than how can one be denied?"

Blue Cross and Blue Shield can't comment on the family's situation, but did comment about the health care reform law, and how it may affect coverage.

"We will work closely with our customers to keep them informed of any changes that may result from the new law," said Margaret Jarvis, the company's Senior Manager of Media Relations. "We will continue to review the bill's requirements on our business and their respective time frames to ensure full compliance."

While the Tracys said they'll do whatever it takes for their baby, they have no idea at what cost.
You need skeptics, especially when the science gets very big and monolithic. -James Lovelock
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post #1307 of 2360
Quote:
Originally Posted by MJ1970 View Post

Actually, there is a growing body of evidence that vitamin D deficiencies are at the root of quite a number of health problems we have today, including breast cancer. Vitamin D is generated in the body as a reaction to and result of exposure to the UV rays of the sun. Scientists are looking at correlations between the increase in the whole sunscreen and "stay out of the sun" movement over the past 20-30 years and increases in a variety of ailments (including cancer risks). So, the science on this area doesn't seem to be quite settled yet it seems.

But there is a huge difference in relative UV dose between natural light spectrum from a source millions of miles away that is attenuated by the atmosphere, and an artificial source much higher in ratio of UV to visible light only inches from the skin. Inverse square law and all that. This is the real problem with tanning beds.
You need skeptics, especially when the science gets very big and monolithic. -James Lovelock
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post #1308 of 2360
Quote:
Originally Posted by iPoster View Post

But there is a huge difference in relative UV dose between natural light spectrum from a source millions of miles away that is attenuated by the atmosphere, and an artificial source much higher in ratio of UV to visible light only inches from the skin. Inverse square law and all that. This is the real problem with tanning beds.

Right, which is why you wouldn't spend all day underneath one of them.

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post #1309 of 2360
Quote:
Originally Posted by MJ1970 View Post

Actually, there is a growing body of evidence that vitamin D deficiencies are at the root of quite a number of health problems we have today, including breast cancer. Vitamin D is generated in the body as a reaction to and result of exposure to the UV rays of the sun. Scientists are looking at correlations between the increase in the whole sunscreen and "stay out of the sun" movement over the past 20-30 years and increases in a variety of ailments (including cancer risks). So, the science on this area doesn't seem to be quite settled yet it seems.

While that's true take it from someone who'd Doctor perscribes 2000 iu a day because of a lack. Yes it's important but tanning booths supply much more than you need and people tend to over do it. Also exposure to UV rays can cause skin cancer. One of the most deadly.
Surely you're not trying to buld an argument that Obama's HCR bill is evil because it taxes tanning booths which by some stretch of the imagination are really a necessity?
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post #1310 of 2360
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

Also exposure to UV rays can cause skin cancer. One of the most deadly.

First it has always been an issue of too much exposure. However, more current research is bringing this connection into question. It seems there may need to be a balance. As with many things, we may have been convinced to swing too far in one direction and that may be having negative side-effects.

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post #1311 of 2360
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

Surely you're not trying to buld an argument that Obama's HCR bill is evil because it taxes tanning booths which by some stretch of the imagination are really a necessity?

Not at all*. There are so many other higher order reasons to be opposed to ObamaCare.


*I will say that there is valid concern that the government, where it does control health care practices and procedures (and ti will control what it funds), there may be a risk it will lag in support of the most current research findings.

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post #1312 of 2360
Quote:
Originally Posted by MJ1970 View Post

First it has always been an issue of too much exposure. However, more current research is bringing this connection into question. It seems there may need to be a balance. As with many things, we may have been convinced to swing too far in one direction and that may be having negative side-effects.

Yes but can't you just avoid the risk by just getting out in the sun more often or suppliments? It's not a health necessity. It's an option which can be done in a much more safe manner. Besides people don't go to tanning salons to up their vitamin D. They go to get a tan. It's for looks.
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post #1313 of 2360
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

Yes but can't you just avoid the risk by just getting out in the sun more often or suppliments?

This might not be as good an option in winter months and for those living further north.


Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

It's not a health necessity. It's an option which can be done in a much more safe manner.

Thanks Doc. My wife's been researching this for like 2 years. I've heard just about everything about it.


Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

Besides people don't go to tanning salons to up their vitamin D. They go to get a tan. It's for looks.

Why people do something doesn't change the effects. For example, Barack Obama proposed and got passed a law changing things in the health care market because he wanted to help people ( we'll just pretend that's true for now). However the outcomes and results won't change because of why he did it.


P.S. Did you see my response to the tax question? Do you have anything more to add?

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post #1314 of 2360
Quote:
Originally Posted by MJ1970 View Post

This might not be as good an option in winter months and for those living further north.




Thanks Doc. My wife's been researching this for like 2 years. I've heard just about everything about it.




Why people do something doesn't change the effects. For example, Barack Obama proposed and got passed a law changing things in the health care market because he wanted to help people ( we'll just pretend that's true for now). However the outcomes and results won't change because of why he did it.

Quote:
This might not be as good an option in winter months and for those living further north.

I live in Oregon give me a break.

Quote:
Thanks Doc. My wife's been researching this for like 2 years. I've heard just about everything about it.

I'm guessing that it involves Vitamin D more than it involves tanning booths.

Quote:
Why people do something doesn't change the effects

No. But it might influence why you and I might not oject to taxing something that's not necessary to help pay for things that are. Like cigarettes for example.
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post #1315 of 2360
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

I live in Oregon give me a break.

So?


Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

I'm guessing that it involves Vitamin D more than it involves tanning booths.

Are you telling me what my wife has been researching?


Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

No. But it might influence why you and I might not want to pay for something that's not necessary.

Yes, I agree now that the government is even more involved with health care that more people will have opinions about what kind of care I should get and the health care, in general, will become politicized.

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post #1316 of 2360
Quote:
Originally Posted by MJ1970 View Post

So?




Are you telling me what my wife has been researching?




Yes, I agree now that the government is even more involved with health care that more people will have opinions about what kind of care I should get and the health care, in general, will become politicized.

Quote:
So?

I guess you don't get out much. Reputation for not much sunshine and a lot of rain. Grass growing captol of the world because of that etc.

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Are you telling me what my wife has been researching?

No. I'm telling you what I know and what my Doctor ( you know the guy who wentr to medical school ) is telling me.

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Yes, I agree now that the government is even more involved with health care that more people will have opinions about what kind of care I should get and the health care, in general, will become politicized

So? It has been for a long time I guess you just haven't been paying attention.
Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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post #1317 of 2360
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

I guess you don't get out much. Reputation for not much sunshine and a lot of rain. Grass growing captol of the world because of that etc.

I know about Oregon's climate. I was wondering if that was some weak attempt to counter my statement. The answer appears to be yes.


Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

No. I'm telling you what I know and what my Doctor ( you know the guy who wentr to medical school ) is telling me.

Oh Then I guess I misunderstood the statement: "I'm guessing that it involves Vitamin D more than it involves tanning booths." in direct response to my statement "My wife's been researching this for like 2 years. I've heard just about everything about it."


Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

So?

You're okay with healthcare becoming politicized and your healthcare choices being debated and lobbied by the rest of the country?


Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

It has been for a long time I guess you just haven't been paying attention.

I have been.

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #1318 of 2360
Quote:
Originally Posted by MJ1970 View Post

So?

Obviously Oregon is as far North as the US goes...

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Are you telling me what my wife has been researching?

He would know better than you right?

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Yes, I agree now that the government is even more involved with health care that more people will have opinions about what kind of care I should get and the health care, in general, will become politicized.

I am more concerned about where the government will feel that it now has the right to stick its nose now that it has its self proclaimed responsibility to provide health coverage to all people. First tanning beds, Cigarettes, alcohol and such. After that what's next? Certain sports/outdoor activities, other "high risk" activities as proclaimed by the government? Where does the invasion of privacy end?
NoahJ
"It is unwise to be too sure of one's own wisdom. It is healthy to be reminded that the strongest might weaken and the wisest might err." - Mahatma Gandhi
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NoahJ
"It is unwise to be too sure of one's own wisdom. It is healthy to be reminded that the strongest might weaken and the wisest might err." - Mahatma Gandhi
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post #1319 of 2360
Quote:
Originally Posted by NoahJ View Post

Obviously Oregon is as far North as the US goes...

Well more to the point it seemed like he had not other way to address my comment that "This (sunshine and supplements) might not be as good an option in winter months and for those living further north."


Quote:
Originally Posted by NoahJ View Post

I am more concerned about where the government will feel that it now has the right to stick its nose now that it has its self proclaimed responsibility to provide health coverage to all people. First tanning beds, Cigarettes, alcohol and such. After that what's next? Certain sports/outdoor activities, other "high risk" activities as proclaimed by the government? Where does the invasion of privacy end?

It won't end. This absolutely will happen. The golden rule applies here. He who has the gold (or, in this case, worthless pieces of green paper) makes the rules. That's as it's always been and always will be. Those who've voted for and supported this thing have struck a Faustian bargain. They just don't know it yet.

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

Reply

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #1320 of 2360
Quote:
Originally Posted by MJ1970 View Post

I know about Oregon's climate. I was wondering if that was some weak attempt to counter my statement. The answer appears to be yes.




Oh Then I guess I misunderstood the statement: "I'm guessing that it involves Vitamin D more than it involves tanning booths." in direct response to my statement "My wife's been researching this for like 2 years. I've heard just about everything about it."




You're okay with healthcare becoming politicized and your healthcare choices being debated and lobbied by the rest of the country?




I have been.

God you guys are laughable! If you think this will be a big issue with HCRF I'm sorry for you.
Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
Reply
Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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