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The Biggest Threat to Obama's Health Care "Reform" - Reality - Page 8

post #281 of 2277
8/18/09 at 1:44pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by involuntary_serf View Post

I won't. In fact I'd prefer that it all stayed.

Excellent, cunt shit piss balls, Ron Paul is a despicable fucking clit-faced ballbag. Thanks scrotum cockhole shit and piss.
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post #282 of 2277
8/18/09 at 1:53pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by involuntary_serf View Post

You've made your opinion and disdain for his position clear.

It's the advertising of his position that makes him a dumb fuck.
Do you think those charged with protecting the public and those that serve them would just turn a blind eye?
Quote:
What does that have to do with the price of tea in China?

Raise a red flag to those looking for potential trouble.
Has the same mindset and could be on the verge of acting?
Quote:
Indeed that's a risk under a tyrannical government.

How tiresome.
Quote:
Yes, that's one of the prices we're forced to pay for the upkeep of tyranny.

Try enjoying the few liberties you think you have left because your idea of utopia won't ever happen.
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post #283 of 2277
8/18/09 at 2:02pm
Were you outraged over this, too?

http://forums.appleinsider.com/showp...9&postcount=43

A guy quotes Thomas Jefferson and he's an extremist.

These people chant "Bush is a terrorist!" and carry signs that say BUSH: WANTED DEAD OR ALIVE with ALIVE crossed out.

I await your "outrage".

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #284 of 2277
8/18/09 at 2:03pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by screener View Post

It's the advertising of his position that makes him a dumb fuck.

So people are allowed to have an opinion but not to advertise it?


Quote:
Originally Posted by screener View Post

Do you think those charged with protecting the public and those that serve them would just turn a blind eye?

No. But sometimes exercising your rights gets extra special attention from the authorities.


Quote:
Originally Posted by screener View Post

How tiresome.

It is. I wish it would stop.


Quote:
Originally Posted by screener View Post

Try enjoying the few liberties you think you have left because your idea of utopia won't ever happen.

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post #285 of 2277
8/18/09 at 2:12pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by involuntary_serf View Post



He's right. Your liberties are not threatened.

Your idea of free market utopia exists. It is called "Nigeria."
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post #286 of 2277
8/18/09 at 2:14pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mumbo Jumbo View Post

He's right. Your liberties are not threatened.

I think I'll be the judge of that TYVM.
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post #287 of 2277
8/18/09 at 2:18pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by involuntary_serf View Post

I think I'll be the judge of that TYVM.

Your threatened liberties. List them.
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post #288 of 2277
8/18/09 at 2:29pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by involuntary_serf View Post

So people are allowed to have an opinion but not to advertise it?

Where did I say he isn't allowed to advertise it.

Quote:
No. But sometimes exercising your rights gets extra special attention from the authorities.

Go figure, you advertise the fact that sometimes it's a good thing to advocate spilling blood because of "tyranny", MEANING WHAT ELSE, government or Obama or maybe killing some people at random to show your anger.
Quote:
It is. I wish it would stop.

So stop.
Quote:

What, is utopia not the word to describe the kind of world you envision, a totally unfettered free market.

I don't have a problem with guns or carrying them where legal but combined with promoting shedding blood at an event where the president and scores if not hundreds of people are is idiotic and the guy is a total dumb fuck.
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post #289 of 2277
8/18/09 at 2:32pm
Helloooooo?

http://forums.appleinsider.com/showp...&postcount=283

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #290 of 2277
8/18/09 at 2:36pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by screener View Post

Where did I say he isn't allowed to advertise it.

I'm asking.

You said:

Quote:
Originally Posted by screener View Post

It's the advertising of his position that makes him a dumb fuck.

How should we interpret your statement?
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post #291 of 2277
8/18/09 at 2:38pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post

Helloooooo?

http://forums.appleinsider.com/showp...&postcount=283

There's no mention of them carrying guns. What kind of a gun is that guy carrying anyway. It looks pretty serious.

Edit- sorry it was posted earlier semi-auto ar15

"If your enemies cannot find a flaw in your reasoning, they will find it in your reputation".

~ William Hazlitt

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"If your enemies cannot find a flaw in your reasoning, they will find it in your reputation".

~ William Hazlitt

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post #292 of 2277
8/18/09 at 2:39pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mumbo Jumbo View Post

Your threatened liberties. List them.

Can we start with my lack of liberty to decide what I can do with about 30% (or more of my income)?

There are, of course, many many smaller ones. But that's a big one.

Then of course there's my privacy as well.

But I forgot, restrictions on liberty and invasions of privacy are all fine now that the Democrats are in charge.
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post #293 of 2277
8/18/09 at 2:41pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hands Sandon View Post

What kind of a gun is that guy carrying anyway. It looks pretty serious.

Looks like an M4/AR15 semi-automatic.
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post #294 of 2277
8/18/09 at 2:41pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bergermeister View Post

Some guy showed up at one of Obama's talks carrying a semi-automatic weapon:

http://www.azcentral.com/community/p...ama-scene.html

I'm so glad I live in a country where I don't have to worry about insurance and I certainly don't have to worry about idots feeling a need to express themselves with a weapon of mass-murder.

That was a sensible display of his right to bear arms, something other states would do well to emulate. Open carry is an excellent way to deter crime. How many robberies and other crimes do you think would happen if the majority of the population was well trained and well armed?

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post #295 of 2277
8/18/09 at 2:42pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hands Sandon View Post

There's no mention of them carrying guns. What kind of a gun is that guy carrying anyway. It looks pretty serious.

Oh, so if they're carrying guns, which is perfectly legal, then they don't have a right to free speech?

Otherwise, they can have posters that say OBAMA: WANTED DEAD OR ALIVE with ALIVE crossed out and it's perfectly fine?

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #296 of 2277
8/18/09 at 2:44pm
The funny thing about this whole gun things is that nothing happened at all. No one was shot. No one was assaulted or threatened. Nothing happened. Which, I suspect, was part of this guy's (and the guy in New Hampshire's) point.

"Buu..bbuut...buut...something could have happened!!!"

The other thing is that the president of the United States is surrounded by dozens of men and women with multiple, loaded (and probably automatic) weapons.

"Buu..bbuut...buut...they aren't extremist-terrorist-wanna-be-nutjobs!"
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post #297 of 2277
8/18/09 at 2:48pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post

Oh, so if they're carrying guns, which is perfectly legal, then they don't have a right to free speech?

Otherwise, they can have posters that say OBAMA: WANTED DEAD OR ALIVE with ALIVE crossed out and it's perfectly fine?

I don't condone posters with that on them (though I suspect it was tongue in cheek, given Bush's Texas Tough Talk). However, if they were armed to the teeth like that guy, I personally would want the secret service to apprehend them. That's just common sense.

"If your enemies cannot find a flaw in your reasoning, they will find it in your reputation".

~ William Hazlitt

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"If your enemies cannot find a flaw in your reasoning, they will find it in your reputation".

~ William Hazlitt

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post #298 of 2277
8/18/09 at 2:48pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by involuntary_serf View Post

I'm asking.

You said:



How should we interpret your statement?

Unless he welcomes the scrutiny from the tyrants, he's a dumb fuck for putting himself in that position and not expecting it.

How is me calling him a dumb fuck being interpreted as I think he shouldn't be allowed to advertise his position.
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post #299 of 2277
8/18/09 at 2:50pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post

Oh, so if they're carrying guns, which is perfectly legal, then they don't have a right to free speech?

Otherwise, they can have posters that say OBAMA: WANTED DEAD OR ALIVE with ALIVE crossed out and it's perfectly fine?

It's certainly true that a poster saying "BUSH (or OBAMA): WANTED DEAD or ALIVE" is a more clearly direct threat. As is a photo of Bush (or Obama) showing a gun barrel pressed against his temple. But you know...that's just free speech and this...well this is terrorism. Or something.
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post #300 of 2277
8/18/09 at 2:52pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by screener View Post

Unless he welcomes the scrutiny from the tyrants, he's a dumb fuck for putting himself in that position and not expecting it.

I don't know whether he was inviting or expecting it. Maybe he was. Sometimes that needs to be done to make a point.


Quote:
Originally Posted by screener View Post

How is me calling him a dumb fuck being interpreted as I think he shouldn't be allowed to advertise his position.

As I said I was asking for further clarification of your statement. So you think he should be allowed to. Good. That's all I wanted clarification about.
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post #301 of 2277
8/18/09 at 3:20pm
Rights are funny things. It sounds like some want to be able to turn them on and off at will, with no more necessity than the perceived safety of the president. It's like, for some one person to have more rights, others need have less.

Another interesting thing I've noticed - when rights are encroached because of the perceived safety of the entire nation, it's an atrocity. When the perceived safety of a single person is compromised, it's time to put the rights away for another day.

I wonder what Obama's opinion on the subject is. If I were in his shoes, I'd rather one of the people I volunteered to serve retain their rights than I retain mine.

But, that's me.
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post #302 of 2277
8/18/09 at 3:29pm
Oh, look. There goes Osama's terrorists flying airplanes. Oh well. They have every right to fly airplanes.

No one could've predicted.....
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post #303 of 2277
8/18/09 at 3:45pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Northgate View Post

Oh, look. There goes Obama's terrorists flying airplanes. Oh well. They have every right to fly airplanes.

No one could've predicted.....

Surely you mean Osama?
NoahJ
"It is unwise to be too sure of one's own wisdom. It is healthy to be reminded that the strongest might weaken and the wisest might err." - Mahatma Gandhi
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NoahJ
"It is unwise to be too sure of one's own wisdom. It is healthy to be reminded that the strongest might weaken and the wisest might err." - Mahatma Gandhi
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post #304 of 2277
8/18/09 at 3:50pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by NoahJ View Post

Surely you mean Osama?

LOL! Yes.
"The selfishness of Ayn Rand capitalism is the equivalent of intellectual masturbation -- satisfying in an ego-stroking way, but an ethical void when it comes to our commonly shared humanity."
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post #305 of 2277
8/18/09 at 3:51pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Northgate View Post

LOL! Yes.

Let me guess, you "misspoke"?

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #306 of 2277
8/18/09 at 3:54pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hands Sandon View Post

I don't condone posters with that on them (though I suspect it was tongue in cheek, given Bush's Texas Tough Talk). However, if they were armed to the teeth like that guy, I personally would want the secret service to apprehend them. That's just common sense.

The laws in his state are quite progressive about open carry. Even here on the west coast open carry is legal, but people are subject to arrest and harassment from police because they are not fully aware of the law. Also, out here the weapon cannot be loaded, unlike in New Hampshire.

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Proud AAPL stock owner.

 

GOA

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post #307 of 2277
8/18/09 at 3:58pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Taskiss View Post

Rights are funny things. It sounds like some want to be able to turn them on and off at will, with no more necessity than the perceived safety of the president. It's like, for some one person to have more rights, others need have less.

Another interesting thing I've noticed - when rights are encroached because of the perceived safety of the entire nation, it's an atrocity. When the perceived safety of a single person is compromised, it's time to put the rights away for another day.

I wonder what Obama's opinion on the subject is. If I were in his shoes, I'd rather one of the people I volunteered to serve retain their rights than I retain mine.

But, that's me.

The funny thing is, not one peep on this subject from the president, but plenty of peeps from others.

Proud AAPL stock owner.

 

GOA

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Proud AAPL stock owner.

 

GOA

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post #308 of 2277
8/18/09 at 4:08pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post

The laws in his state are quite progressive about open carry. Even here on the west coast open carry is legal, but people are subject to arrest and harassment from police because they are not fully aware of the law. Also, out here the weapon cannot be loaded, unlike in New Hampshire.

But the secret service won't let anyone near him with guns like that. That's my point.

"If your enemies cannot find a flaw in your reasoning, they will find it in your reputation".

~ William Hazlitt

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"If your enemies cannot find a flaw in your reasoning, they will find it in your reputation".

~ William Hazlitt

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post #309 of 2277
8/18/09 at 4:09pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hands Sandon View Post

But the secret service won't let anyone near him with guns like that. That's my point.

The Secret Service won't let anyone who hasn't been checked out near him, period. Armed or not.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #310 of 2277
8/18/09 at 4:12pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post

The Secret Service won't let anyone who hasn't been checked out near him, period. Armed or not.

Exactly.

"If your enemies cannot find a flaw in your reasoning, they will find it in your reputation".

~ William Hazlitt

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"If your enemies cannot find a flaw in your reasoning, they will find it in your reputation".

~ William Hazlitt

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post #311 of 2277
8/18/09 at 4:24pm
I hope the president doesn't continue to make life difficult for the secret service by making any more surprise visits to Hell Burger.

All it takes is one simple mistake at the wrong time, "Mr. President...." BAM!!!

A friend of mine who served in Iraq has two friends over at the secret service. They're not on presidential detail (counterfeit money is their game). But they've relayed some stories about how Obama is very difficult for the secret service to handle. He's very "slippery". He enjoys his freedom too much. Bush, they say, never took any chances. Was scared to death of getting shot. Obama? Could care less.

Recipe. For. Disaster.
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post #312 of 2277
8/18/09 at 4:34pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Northgate View Post

I hope the president doesn't continue to make life difficult for the secret service by making any more surprise visits to Hell Burger.

All it takes is one simple mistake at the wrong time, "Mr. President...." BAM!!!

A friend of mine who served in Iraq has two friends over at the secret service. They're not on presidential detail (counterfeit money is their game). But they've relayed some stories about how Obama is very difficult for the secret service to handle. He's very "slippery". He enjoys his freedom too much. Bush, they say, never took any chances. Was scared to death of getting shot. Obama? Could care less.

Recipe. For. Disaster.

So there's Hope after all.

That really was just a joke.

That's really discomforting. I was surprised seeing him 'kick the doors open' getting out of the limo with the ss asking him to wait.

"If your enemies cannot find a flaw in your reasoning, they will find it in your reputation".

~ William Hazlitt

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"If your enemies cannot find a flaw in your reasoning, they will find it in your reputation".

~ William Hazlitt

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post #313 of 2277
8/18/09 at 4:39pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post

That was a sensible display of his right to bear arms, something other states would do well to emulate. Open carry is an excellent way to deter crime. How many robberies and other crimes do you think would happen if the majority of the population was well trained and well armed?

I don't agree, and the US ranks #8 in crimes per capita:

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cr...mes-per-capita

#6 in assault
#9 in rape
#24 in murder

If gun toting deterred crime, these rates would be lower.

Then we could look at the mass shootings... Va Tech, Columbine... just to name two.

This guy did not need to carry an assault rifle (yeah, assault rifle) to a public area. It raises tension, leading to less dialogue and more fear.

Self defense requires an assault rifle? Sounds like we have more serious problems to deal with, but showing the weapon won't help fix them, it will only increase them.

 

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post #314 of 2277
8/18/09 at 4:47pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bergermeister View Post

This guy did not need to carry an assault rifle (yeah, assault rifle) to a public area. It raises tension, leading to less dialogue and more fear.

But that's the whole point. Raise tension. More fear. Less dialog.
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post #315 of 2277
8/18/09 at 4:53pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bergermeister View Post

I don't agree, and the US ranks #8 in crimes per capita:

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cr...mes-per-capita

#6 in assault
#9 in rape
#24 in murder

If gun toting deterred crime, these rates would be lower.

Then we could look at the mass shootings... Va Tech, Columbine... just to name two.

This guy did not need to carry an assault rifle (yeah, assault rifle) to a public area. It raises tension, leading to less dialogue and more fear.

Self defense requires an assault rifle? Sounds like we have more serious problems to deal with, but showing the weapon won't help fix them, it will only increase them.

The term "assault rifle" is an incendiary, sensational term used by the media for...well...incendiary sensationalism. It was most likely a semi-automatic, which means it is not technically an "assault rifle". Fully automatic weapons are all but illegal under numerous acts of legislation.

From Wikipedia:

Quote:
Civilian ownership of assault rifles is regulated under the National Firearms Act of 1934 as amended by Title II of the Gun Control Act of 1968. In addition, the Firearms Owners' Protection Act of 1986 halted the manufacture of assault rifles for the civilian market and currently limits legal civilian ownership to units produced and properly registered with the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives before May 1986. In addition, some states enforce their own laws regulating or forbidding civilian possession of assault rifles. Civilians may purchase semi-automatic versions of such firearms without requiring NFA clearance, although some states (including California and New Jersey) enforce their own restrictions on such weapons.

Regardless of the guy's motive, he was well within his rights. I'm not saying it was a tasteful thing for him to do, I'm just saying he had the right to do it.

What about the other people there at the demonstration openly displaying their handguns? Were they out of line?

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

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post #316 of 2277
8/18/09 at 5:53pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Northgate View Post

Bush, they say, never took any chances. Was scared to death of getting shot. Obama? Could care less.

It's more likely that Bush was respectful of the mandate of the SS, and did not go out of his way to cause problems for them. Obama's team 'couldn't care less' about anyone not in their club.

Entitlement is a Liberal thing.
The evil that we fight is but the shadow of the evil that we do.
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The evil that we fight is but the shadow of the evil that we do.
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post #317 of 2277
8/18/09 at 6:24pm
Bush enjoyed fear. He made the populace fearful. So, yeah, he lived in fear.

However, on September 11, he and his entourage stayed at the school in Florida long enough to appear on TV (something he could easily do on Air Force 1) before boarding the plane and then flying all over out of fear... timing is off, sorry, buddy.

Obama is more a common guy and not necessarily used to nor appreciative of the need for the protection.

Even with the lunatic policies Bush enacted, how many people showed up at his speeches bearing assault weapons (yeah I use the term for anything that can fire more than 8 bullets a minute)?

Some people are really, really starting to jump off the deep end and it is frightening to watch. I'm getting worried that something really is going to happen. The stupidity is verifiable.

 

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post #318 of 2277
8/18/09 at 6:32pm
So, wait wait wait wait. So the man behind the idea of bringing firearms to town hall meetings and Obama events .... wait for this .... is a vocal supporter of a far-right wing anti-government militia who were convicted of conspiracy and weapons charges!!!!

Does these mean we can start making Roger Ailes dispersions now?

REPUBLICANS ARE COHORTING WITH TERRORISTS TO KILL HEALTH CARE REFORM!!!!

Quote:
Ernest Hancock, the online radio host who staged an interview with an assault rifle-wielding cohort at the Obama event in Arizona yesterday -- and was himself armed with a 9 millimeter pistol -- was a vocal supporter and friend of right-wing anti-government militia members who were convicted of conspiracy and weapons charges in the 90s.

And in an interview today with TPMmuckraker, Hancock said he still believes the Viper Militia case was "manufactured" by the same government that manufactured Waco and lied to its people about 9/11.

The federal government initially accused the Arizona Viper Militia of plotting to blow up federal buildings, which the twelve-member group cased on videotape.
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post #319 of 2277
8/18/09 at 6:43pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bergermeister View Post

Bush enjoyed fear. He made the populace fearful. So, yeah, he lived in fear.

That doesn't make any sense. How could Bush 'enjoy fear' and 'live in fear" at the same time?

I think the left sees the public option dying, and has collectively decided to go off their meds.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Northgate View Post

REPUBLICANS ARE COHORTING WITH TERRORISTS....

Heh. Did you mean cavorting? Again, check those meds.


Anyway, Obama doesn't really need to fear pro-gun activists.
He should definitely fear a group of people who have a history of going postal...
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post #320 of 2277
8/18/09 at 6:59pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank777 View Post

That doesn't make any sense. How could Bush 'enjoy fear' and 'live in fear" at the same time?

I think the left sees the public option dying, and has collectively decided to go off their meds.



Heh. Did you mean cavorting? Again, check those meds.


Anyway, Obama doesn't really need to fear pro-gun activists.
He should definitely fear a group of people who have a history of going postal...

Wow, that's nit picky. I'm sure everyone knew what he meant. He's the president after all.

"If your enemies cannot find a flaw in your reasoning, they will find it in your reputation".

~ William Hazlitt

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"If your enemies cannot find a flaw in your reasoning, they will find it in your reputation".

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