What's the point of watching BR on a 1440x900 screen?
Maybe he ultimately wanted the blu-ray for home viewing, but also wanted to watch it on his laptop? I don't consider buying a blu-ray version for home viewing and a dvd version of the same movie for mobile viewing to be a reasonable option.
I myself don't carry around discs when I travel. I rip movies and music into Quicktime files.
Quote:
Originally Posted by cmf2
Maybe he ultimately wanted the blu-ray for home viewing, but also wanted to watch it on his laptop? I don't consider buying a blu-ray version for home viewing and a dvd version of the same movie for mobile viewing to be a reasonable option.
Now with the rise of large, inexpensive hard drives, movies are next. The only thing keeping BR alive is the lack of bandwidth and none downloadable special features. It is not just that BR is dead; optical is dead. How long will it be before we no longer go to stores to buy applications on disks?
You're operating under the antiquated notion that everybody will do things the same way, using the same technology. Maybe that was true in the 1940s but it's not the case now.
Companies like Apple need to provide the equipment that leaves the choice of how to handle media up to the consumer. That means that if optical media is part of the landscape, Apple's computers need to be able to handle optical media. The only computer Apple sells that doesn't come with an optical drive is the Air and even that one offers such a drive as an add-on. There is no evidence that everybody has abandoned optical media. A few, like yourself, have but that proves nothing. I haven't bought a DVD in more than a year but the last time I checked, they still sell them. Somebody must be buying them.
If Apple is going to be offering optical drives in their computers for the forseeable future, why not Blu-Ray?
I myself don't carry around discs when I travel. I rip movies and music into Quicktime files.
I also rip my movies to my laptop (pysical media takes up way too much space), but even so if you are buying blu-rays for home viewing you will still need a computer with a blu-ray drive to rip the movie. Macs not being blu-ray friendly can create a lot of problems.
I don't think so. TV-shows produced during the 90's usually have terrible sources.
Depends on what are you calling the source. The original negative the show was shot on or the tape format used to broadcast the show.
Quote:
Downscaling 1920*1080 looks far better than upscaling 720*480, especially with a viewing distance of less than a metre. I thought that'd be obvious.
You're not going to see a huge difference on a 13" screen. Resolution isn't the most important factor in the sharpness of an image, it is one link in the chain. Contrast detail plays a bigger part in perceived sharpness.
There are some posts that talk about how cheap BR has become. However, when you look further the cheaper prices and often the availability refers to players only. Do I take it that many here would be happy with a BR player/DVD/CD player/recorder combination.
Although there are BR recorders available, there are very few and many are just notifications that they are coming.
http://www.blu-ray.com/ the BR web site doesn't seem to emulate some of the high degree of availability posted here. Prices are still high.
BR releases are limited as listed in the new releases. Most are older/old movies and very few of them at that.
Although the BR consortium has agreed to license Chinese manufacturing of BR RECORDERS, nobody has officially been approved to do so. Thus the price will remain relatively high.
There are external drives for Blu-ray that can work with the Mac. But then I don't use BR, so its not a problem for me.
Quote:
Originally Posted by cmf2
I also rip my movies to my laptop (pysical media takes up way too much space), but even so if you are buying blu-rays for home viewing you will still need a computer with a blu-ray drive to rip the movie. Macs not being blu-ray friendly can create a lot of problems.
I am so over optical media. Early in our marriage, my wife bought me a 200 disk CD changer for my birthday. This was around the time of the first iPod. It didn't take long before all my music was in portable, digital form. To this day, all of my CD's are still in that disk changer in a closet somewhere. Today, I would rather torrent a movie that I own rather than find the disk and put it into the drive. I don't remember the last time I brought media with me on the road.
I also produce a little music as a hobby. My last CD was literally my last CD. There is no reason to burn them anymore. Digital distribution is the only thing that makes sense to a small producer like me. Giving pieces of plastic to family and friends is silly when you can just point them to a web page. It is much cheaper and more profitable to sell music digitally than on plastic disks.
Now with the rise of large, inexpensive hard drives, movies are next. The only thing keeping BR alive is the lack of bandwidth and none downloadable special features. It is not just that BR is dead; optical is dead. How long will it be before we no longer go to stores to buy applications on disks?
Until ripping a DVD or Blueray disc is as simple and legal as ripping an audio cd I don't think most people will rip their movies. Right now its a 2-step process that takes a long time and it can be argued that its not legal.
There are external drives for Blu-ray that can work with the Mac. But then I don't use BR, so its not a problem for me.
Still not very elegant. If you were on the road and bought a blu-ray and wanted to watch it before you got home, you would have to a) hope that you brought your external blu-ray drive and b) rip/re-encode it. It would be much nicer if macs supported blu-ray playback and had at least a build to order blu-ray drive option. I've been hoping Snow Leopard would be bringing those things for quite some time now, looks like it could happen.
I actually don't need blu-ray disks either, but I have a bad habit of buying stuff in anticipation of doing something else. I've been planning on moving and buying a new tv for quite some time, and I've already built the htpc/gaming rig (with a blu-ray drive) that I want to sit under it, but right now it is only hooked up to a 22" monitor \
One thing the link to the BD/VHS player also demonstrates is that people don't want a dozen boxes connected to their TVs. I think this is one of the major failings of the AppleTV. It's yet another box to connect, and it doesn't allow me to get rid of any of the boxes I already have. If they had put a DVD player in it it really wouldn't have increased the production cost much, and I think it would have little impact to iTunes sales (because if I want to own the physical disc, I'm going to buy the physical disc regardless). A DVD player would be the perfect Trojan horse to get AppleTVs into living rooms. Then let people discover the convenience of online video renting, buying the TV episodes you forget to record, etc. Instead, they went straight for forced reliance for iTunes content and as a result have a much smaller installed base.
As for the rest of your post, I agree wholeheartedly. Many of us on these forums have good home theater PC set-ups, we have large storage systems with backup, and fat broadband pipes. Most people don't have that. And until they do, downloaded movies are not ideal. Another issue with downloaded content...what happens to the content when you and your significant other breakup/divorce, or when your kids go off to college, or you die? Who ones it? How do you transfer ownership? It essentially become a lifetime license to the person who purchased it. You can't sell, trade, or give it away.
Downloaded content is great for renting, but it's a bad purchase proposition unless it's significantly discounted from the cost of physical media (and it's not).
Yep - until we have plenty of reliable, redundant, expandable, and CHEAP shared networked storage, we'll still have optical discs. Hard drives are cheap, but devices like drobo and others are not.
Until ripping a DVD or Blueray disc is as simple and legal as ripping an audio cd I don't think most people will rip their movies. Right now its a 2-step process that takes a long time and it can be argued that its not legal.
It's not legal at all. But as long as you only use the file for private use no one will ever know.
Some studios began including digital copies of films with the DVD. I'm not sure how well that effort is going. I don't really buy DVD's anymore. I think they should really push the advantage because torrenting movies is only growing.
Depends on what are you calling the source. The original negative the show was shot on or the tape format used to broadcast the show.
You're not going to see a huge difference on a 13" screen. Resolution isn't the most important factor in the sharpness of an image, it is one link in the chain. Contrast detail plays a bigger part in perceived sharpness.
The comment was about 1440x900 pixels, ie, a 15" screen. And I do notice a clear difference on my 15" MBP between a DVD and a HD trailer.
Until ripping a DVD or Blueray disc is as simple and legal as ripping an audio cd I don't think most people will rip their movies. Right now its a 2-step process that takes a long time and it can be argued that its not legal.
I agree with your concerns about legality but ripping is a one-step process (via MacTheRipper).
It's not legal at all. But as long as you only use the file for private use no one will ever know.
Some studios began including digital copies of films with the DVD. I'm not sure how well that effort is going. I don't really buy DVD's anymore. I think they should really push the advantage because torrenting movies is only growing.
It should be legal though. We should have been able to import DVD's like CD's long ago. The lengths they go to in preventing paying customers from doing what they want with the media they purchased annoys me to no end. I really have my doubts about how much piracy they actually prevent with their legal battles and copyright protection. It is probably less than than the money they spend developing these scemes as it does nothing to stop downloads. Except for HDCP of course, since they charge a licensing fee to cripple HD media. DVD's and Blu-ray should be free of DRM and you should be legally allowed to copy them to your computer, no strings attached. The rental versions could keep their copyright protection if they are really worried about the rent and rip phenomenon.
Sorry for the somewhat unrelated rant, but that is a real sore point for me.
Back on topic. I have seen both free and "discounted" digital copies available. Both have DRM that limits the number of computers/programs you can use them on. The discounted ones really annoy me because they are still charging you for something you have already purchased, and could have freely made your own digital copy if they didn't work to prevent it. That said, digital copies are better than nothing, and they do take a lot less time to transfer than jumping through hoops to re-encode your media.
They had also said that they were leaving too much money on the table by not joining in.
When a former rival who seems insistent in the beginning to refuse to support the now standard technology, decides to do so, it's not just because of a whim, but because large amounts of money are to be made.
If B-R wasn't going anywhere, it's not likely Toshiba would bother.
Are the current screen/monitors from Apple considered HD? Wouldnt this be a requirement for BD?
Now THAT's getting interesting. I'm perfectly happy to buy my content and use it in a legally licensed way, but I want them to get the ergonomics to match my actual usage.
I'd like to see if Apple could use Managed Copy functionality to remove the optical drive from the Macbook entirely. It takes up to much dead space inside. I'd load up at home, then watch on the go.
Comments
ummm 6 feet is perfect for a 40".
What's the point of watching BR on a 1440x900 screen?
Maybe he ultimately wanted the blu-ray for home viewing, but also wanted to watch it on his laptop? I don't consider buying a blu-ray version for home viewing and a dvd version of the same movie for mobile viewing to be a reasonable option.
can we convert old movies into bluray or even tv series like dark angel
Your conversion will only be as good as the copy you are making it from.
Maybe he ultimately wanted the blu-ray for home viewing, but also wanted to watch it on his laptop? I don't consider buying a blu-ray version for home viewing and a dvd version of the same movie for mobile viewing to be a reasonable option.
Now with the rise of large, inexpensive hard drives, movies are next. The only thing keeping BR alive is the lack of bandwidth and none downloadable special features. It is not just that BR is dead; optical is dead. How long will it be before we no longer go to stores to buy applications on disks?
You're operating under the antiquated notion that everybody will do things the same way, using the same technology. Maybe that was true in the 1940s but it's not the case now.
Companies like Apple need to provide the equipment that leaves the choice of how to handle media up to the consumer. That means that if optical media is part of the landscape, Apple's computers need to be able to handle optical media. The only computer Apple sells that doesn't come with an optical drive is the Air and even that one offers such a drive as an add-on. There is no evidence that everybody has abandoned optical media. A few, like yourself, have but that proves nothing. I haven't bought a DVD in more than a year but the last time I checked, they still sell them. Somebody must be buying them.
If Apple is going to be offering optical drives in their computers for the forseeable future, why not Blu-Ray?
If its a professionally produced DVD/Blu-ray the quality of the source should be top notch.
I don't think so. TV-shows produced during the 90's usually have terrible sources.
What's the point of watching BR on a 1440x900 screen?
Downscaling 1920*1080 looks far better than upscaling 720*480, especially with a viewing distance of less than a metre. I thought that'd be obvious.
Anyway, another great benefit of Blu-ray is that we don't have to deal with the PAL speedup nonsense any more, or the terrible NTSC->PAL transfers.
I myself don't carry around discs when I travel. I rip movies and music into Quicktime files.
I also rip my movies to my laptop (pysical media takes up way too much space), but even so if you are buying blu-rays for home viewing you will still need a computer with a blu-ray drive to rip the movie. Macs not being blu-ray friendly can create a lot of problems.
I don't think so. TV-shows produced during the 90's usually have terrible sources.
Depends on what are you calling the source. The original negative the show was shot on or the tape format used to broadcast the show.
Downscaling 1920*1080 looks far better than upscaling 720*480, especially with a viewing distance of less than a metre. I thought that'd be obvious.
You're not going to see a huge difference on a 13" screen. Resolution isn't the most important factor in the sharpness of an image, it is one link in the chain. Contrast detail plays a bigger part in perceived sharpness.
There are some posts that talk about how cheap BR has become. However, when you look further the cheaper prices and often the availability refers to players only. Do I take it that many here would be happy with a BR player/DVD/CD player/recorder combination.
Although there are BR recorders available, there are very few and many are just notifications that they are coming.
http://www.blu-ray.com/ the BR web site doesn't seem to emulate some of the high degree of availability posted here. Prices are still high.
BR releases are limited as listed in the new releases. Most are older/old movies and very few of them at that.
Although the BR consortium has agreed to license Chinese manufacturing of BR RECORDERS, nobody has officially been approved to do so. Thus the price will remain relatively high.
I also rip my movies to my laptop (pysical media takes up way too much space), but even so if you are buying blu-rays for home viewing you will still need a computer with a blu-ray drive to rip the movie. Macs not being blu-ray friendly can create a lot of problems.
I am so over optical media. Early in our marriage, my wife bought me a 200 disk CD changer for my birthday. This was around the time of the first iPod. It didn't take long before all my music was in portable, digital form. To this day, all of my CD's are still in that disk changer in a closet somewhere. Today, I would rather torrent a movie that I own rather than find the disk and put it into the drive. I don't remember the last time I brought media with me on the road.
I also produce a little music as a hobby. My last CD was literally my last CD. There is no reason to burn them anymore. Digital distribution is the only thing that makes sense to a small producer like me. Giving pieces of plastic to family and friends is silly when you can just point them to a web page. It is much cheaper and more profitable to sell music digitally than on plastic disks.
Now with the rise of large, inexpensive hard drives, movies are next. The only thing keeping BR alive is the lack of bandwidth and none downloadable special features. It is not just that BR is dead; optical is dead. How long will it be before we no longer go to stores to buy applications on disks?
---------------------------------------------------------------
Until ripping a DVD or Blueray disc is as simple and legal as ripping an audio cd I don't think most people will rip their movies. Right now its a 2-step process that takes a long time and it can be argued that its not legal.
There are external drives for Blu-ray that can work with the Mac. But then I don't use BR, so its not a problem for me.
Still not very elegant. If you were on the road and bought a blu-ray and wanted to watch it before you got home, you would have to a) hope that you brought your external blu-ray drive and b) rip/re-encode it. It would be much nicer if macs supported blu-ray playback and had at least a build to order blu-ray drive option. I've been hoping Snow Leopard would be bringing those things for quite some time now, looks like it could happen.
I actually don't need blu-ray disks either, but I have a bad habit of buying stuff in anticipation of doing something else. I've been planning on moving and buying a new tv for quite some time, and I've already built the htpc/gaming rig (with a blu-ray drive) that I want to sit under it, but right now it is only hooked up to a 22" monitor
One thing the link to the BD/VHS player also demonstrates is that people don't want a dozen boxes connected to their TVs. I think this is one of the major failings of the AppleTV. It's yet another box to connect, and it doesn't allow me to get rid of any of the boxes I already have. If they had put a DVD player in it it really wouldn't have increased the production cost much, and I think it would have little impact to iTunes sales (because if I want to own the physical disc, I'm going to buy the physical disc regardless). A DVD player would be the perfect Trojan horse to get AppleTVs into living rooms. Then let people discover the convenience of online video renting, buying the TV episodes you forget to record, etc. Instead, they went straight for forced reliance for iTunes content and as a result have a much smaller installed base.
As for the rest of your post, I agree wholeheartedly. Many of us on these forums have good home theater PC set-ups, we have large storage systems with backup, and fat broadband pipes. Most people don't have that. And until they do, downloaded movies are not ideal. Another issue with downloaded content...what happens to the content when you and your significant other breakup/divorce, or when your kids go off to college, or you die? Who ones it? How do you transfer ownership? It essentially become a lifetime license to the person who purchased it. You can't sell, trade, or give it away.
Downloaded content is great for renting, but it's a bad purchase proposition unless it's significantly discounted from the cost of physical media (and it's not).
--------------------------------------------------
Yep - until we have plenty of reliable, redundant, expandable, and CHEAP shared networked storage, we'll still have optical discs. Hard drives are cheap, but devices like drobo and others are not.
Until ripping a DVD or Blueray disc is as simple and legal as ripping an audio cd I don't think most people will rip their movies. Right now its a 2-step process that takes a long time and it can be argued that its not legal.
It's not legal at all. But as long as you only use the file for private use no one will ever know.
Some studios began including digital copies of films with the DVD. I'm not sure how well that effort is going. I don't really buy DVD's anymore. I think they should really push the advantage because torrenting movies is only growing.
Depends on what are you calling the source. The original negative the show was shot on or the tape format used to broadcast the show.
You're not going to see a huge difference on a 13" screen. Resolution isn't the most important factor in the sharpness of an image, it is one link in the chain. Contrast detail plays a bigger part in perceived sharpness.
The comment was about 1440x900 pixels, ie, a 15" screen. And I do notice a clear difference on my 15" MBP between a DVD and a HD trailer.
---------------------------------------------------------------
Until ripping a DVD or Blueray disc is as simple and legal as ripping an audio cd I don't think most people will rip their movies. Right now its a 2-step process that takes a long time and it can be argued that its not legal.
I agree with your concerns about legality but ripping is a one-step process (via MacTheRipper).
What the hell is wrong with you?
For a moment i thought you was my wife screaming at me.
damn dude i almost died from fright.
It's not legal at all. But as long as you only use the file for private use no one will ever know.
Some studios began including digital copies of films with the DVD. I'm not sure how well that effort is going. I don't really buy DVD's anymore. I think they should really push the advantage because torrenting movies is only growing.
It should be legal though. We should have been able to import DVD's like CD's long ago. The lengths they go to in preventing paying customers from doing what they want with the media they purchased annoys me to no end. I really have my doubts about how much piracy they actually prevent with their legal battles and copyright protection. It is probably less than than the money they spend developing these scemes as it does nothing to stop downloads. Except for HDCP of course, since they charge a licensing fee to cripple HD media. DVD's and Blu-ray should be free of DRM and you should be legally allowed to copy them to your computer, no strings attached. The rental versions could keep their copyright protection if they are really worried about the rent and rip phenomenon.
Sorry for the somewhat unrelated rant, but that is a real sore point for me.
Back on topic. I have seen both free and "discounted" digital copies available. Both have DRM that limits the number of computers/programs you can use them on. The discounted ones really annoy me because they are still charging you for something you have already purchased, and could have freely made your own digital copy if they didn't work to prevent it. That said, digital copies are better than nothing, and they do take a lot less time to transfer than jumping through hoops to re-encode your media.
you never know what might happen do you?
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/8192840.stm
They had also said that they were leaving too much money on the table by not joining in.
When a former rival who seems insistent in the beginning to refuse to support the now standard technology, decides to do so, it's not just because of a whim, but because large amounts of money are to be made.
If B-R wasn't going anywhere, it's not likely Toshiba would bother.
Are the current screen/monitors from Apple considered HD? Wouldnt this be a requirement for BD?
Now THAT's getting interesting. I'm perfectly happy to buy my content and use it in a legally licensed way, but I want them to get the ergonomics to match my actual usage.
I'd like to see if Apple could use Managed Copy functionality to remove the optical drive from the Macbook entirely. It takes up to much dead space inside. I'd load up at home, then watch on the go.