Apple adds Motorola Droid X to iPhone 4 death grip page

Posted:
in iPhone edited January 2014
Hot on the heels of adding Nokia's N97 to its video showcase of phones that show signal attenuation when held, Apple has added Verizon's new flagship, the Motorola Droid X.



As with the other phones appearing on the company's Smartphone Antenna Performance page, including RIM's BlackBerry Bold 9700, HTC's Android Droid Eris, Samsung's Windows Mobile Omnia II, Nokia's N97 and Apple's own iPhone 3GS and iPhone 4, the new Droid X is shown dramatically dropping from several bars to zero when held with a normal grip.



Apple's videos present evidence for its claim that the Antennagate campaign being waged against iPhone 4 was overblown and exaggerated. Steve Jobs described iPhone 4's antenna issues as "a challenge for the entire industry," in describing the real engineering challenges related to delivering increasingly better reception, smaller device sizes, and improved battery performance.



The rest of the mobile industry, and in particular those companies profiled in the death grip hall of shame Apple published, have shot back with defensive statements that suggested their longer experience in building phones exempted them from any engineering issues related to antenna design.



RIM and Nokia insist Apple is alone in RF issues



BlackBerry maker RIM issued a statement from its two chief executives Mike Lazaridis and Jim Balsillie which didn't deny that RIM's phones had any problems, but did take umbrage at what they called an "attempt to draw RIM into Apple's self-made debacle."



Nokia similarly issued a corporate statement that didn't name Apple, but said "as you would expect from a company focused on people, we prioritize antenna performance over physical design if they are ever in conflict," a not so subtle suggestion that iPhone 4 sacrificed functionality just to look cool.



Prior to Apple's official response, Nokia had egged on criticism of iPhone 4 with a corporate blog posting that claimed Nokia phones could be held in any fashion without any negative impact on performance.



At the same time, Nokia's owners' manuals for its phones include warnings not to hold the phone in a way that touches the antenna when in use, pointing out that this can attenuate the signal and cause the device to work harder, shortening its battery life.



Jobs specifically noted in Apple's press conference that ?you can go on the web and look at pictures of Nokia phones that ship with stickers on the back that say ?don?t touch here?." After Nokia's corporate response repeated the idea that as "the pioneer in internal antennas" its products simply couldn't experience any antenna issues, Apple added Nokia's N97 to the videos of phones that can suffer from a dramatic drop in signal bars when held normally.







HTC and Samsung deny problems exist



Two other vendors included in Apple's original video comparisons were also quick to issue press releases that suggested they've never heard of signal attenuation issues from their customers. HTC, the company the built the vast majority of Windows Mobile phones and now a primary vendor of Android models, issued remarks similar to RIM, which chided Apple for saying every vendor struggles with antenna design issues.



"The reception problems are certainly not common among smartphones," HTC's chief financial officer Hui-Meng Cheng said. "They apparently didn't give operators enough time to test the phone." However, like Nokia, HTC warns customers not to touch the antenna while in use as it may "impair call quality and cause your device to operate at a higher power level than needed."



Samsung issued a milder response, simply saying it "hasn't received significant customer feedbacks on any signal reduction issue for the Omnia II." The company likely lacks the interest in fomenting crisis for Apple in the way RIM, Nokia and HTC have sought to do because it is a major manufacturer of components for Apple, and makes billions of dollars from iPhone sales.







Motorola, Verizon targeted with Droid X video



Apple's latest video targets the newest Android phone to be compared against the iPhone, the Droid X, showing that it too can indicate a rapid signal loss when held normally. Its inclusion illustrates Apple's contention that the "death grip" videos that Gizmodo presented as a unique new problem for iPhone 4 are easy to replicate across a wide variety of models from all the major manufacturers, on phones running different operating systems, and using different network technologies.



Motorola's co-chief executive Sanjay Jha had previously stated that "consumers don't like being told how to hold the phone" and that "it is disingenuous to suggest that all phones perform equally," noting that his company has avoided placing the antenna on the outside of the phone out of fear that could cause reception problems.



Apple's addition of Motorola's latest Droid X to its videos provide evidence that all phones do suffer from some level of attenuation when held, and that this can be dramatically portrayed with signal meter drops, even when the antenna is internal.



Apple was criticized by Consumer Reports over the issue, and the magazine withheld its "recommendation" listing for iPhone 4 despite giving it top marks among smartphones. The site has given is "recommended" seal to other phones with the same issues.



«13456714

Comments

  • Reply 1 of 278
    richlrichl Posts: 2,213member
    All phones suffer from death grip.



    Only the iPhone 4 suffers from the finger of death (and it's not that common):



    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4gb3aQ5XoQw



    Why is everyone (including Apple) obsessed with death grip when it isn't the real issue here?
  • Reply 2 of 278
    prof. peabodyprof. peabody Posts: 2,860member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by RichL View Post


    All phones suffer from death grip.



    Only the iPhone 4 suffers from the finger of death (and it's not that common):



    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4gb3aQ5XoQw



    Why is everyone (including Apple) obsessed with death grip when it isn't the real issue here?



    Your the one that's confused.



    The issue isn't the "finger of death." The issue is blocking the signal by means of the users hand, and related to that, the dropping of calls.



    Apple's antenna is on the outside, therefore it's more sensitive to the issue. No one at Apple has ever denied that, they have even touted the extra sensitivity as a good thing. All phones have the issue, most of the time they don't drop calls however.



    If you hold the iPhone in a natural way, it won't suffer from this and won't drop calls. If you insist on holding your finger over the antenna, it will drop bars, but for the most part still won't drop the call. If you are in a marginal signal area while participating in such hijinks, you might drop the call.



    I hold my iPhone in my left hand exclusively while making a call but I never get my fingers near that spot unless I contort myself on purpose. It's a non-issue because it's almost impossible to reproduce for the vast majority of users.



    I feel sorry for you if you hold your phone that way and also live in a low signal area, but that doesn't make it an issue for the rest of us. Try holding the phone with your fingers like most folks do instead of slapping it to the side of your head with your entire hand cupped around it (the only way you'd see any problem at all).



    It's not healthy to have the antenna touching your face anyway. A more normal grip would eliminate your problem with the signal as well as make it less likely you will get jaw cancer or something.
  • Reply 3 of 278
    solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    The other handset vendors shouldn't have cast stones and they might not have been targeted so readily. That said, while I don't recall Moto speaking up on the issue they do have the "latest and greatest" iPhone competitor which brings with it it's own bullseye for scrutiny, which is a good thing for Moto.
  • Reply 4 of 278
    drdoppiodrdoppio Posts: 1,132member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Prof. Peabody View Post


    Your the one that's confused...



    ...as well as make it less likely you will get jaw cancer or something.



    Do you have any hard data linking GSM radiation to jaw cancer or something, Professor... or something?
  • Reply 5 of 278
    doorman.doorman. Posts: 158member
    >Two other vendors included in Apple's original video comparisons were also quick to issue press releases that suggested they've never heard of signal attenuation issues from their customers.



    Well, that is maybe because they did not have a system in place through which the customers could do it...
  • Reply 6 of 278
    shoozzshoozz Posts: 26member
    I have had a few calls suddenly lose signal on my iphone 4 and managed to change my grip on the phone. I learn not to have my finger in one particular spot. The issue is real for iphone 4 but it is also real for other phones. What Apple is having to deal with is the perception that the iphone4 is unique to the antenna problem. The reality is that this is not true, but many people and the media continue to perceive it to be true. Apple is now in the unfortunate position of trying to educate their customers, the public, and the media. Good luck. I am however very happy with my new iphone.
  • Reply 7 of 278
    If I were in the market for a cell phone and saw that all of the other company's CEOs were lying about their phones reception problems then I definitely wouldn't buy their products. They deny the problem yet the videos by their own customers prove them wrong. I could understand their situations if they admitted their phones had problems when the antennas were covered. When they deny the problems exist when within their own literature they admit it, then that is outright lying.



    I do my best to avoid dealing with liars. If they lie once then they are likely to be lying about other things.



    My 2008 Mac Book battery has expanded within the computer and the Apple online tech guy said it was a normal occurrence for safety reasons. That was a lie. The battery only had 19 cycles on it since it is mostly used as a desktop computer. If Apple doesn't acknowledge this as a defective unit after only 19 months I'll stop dealing with Apple too. I didn't buy Applecare. I dual booted Linux on an HP computer in part because of this situation. I'm preparing to give up on Apple if they don't act responsibly and replace this defective battery.
  • Reply 8 of 278
    richlrichl Posts: 2,213member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Prof. Peabody View Post


    Your the one that's confused.



    The issue isn't the "finger of death." The issue is blocking the signal by means of the users hand, and related to that, the dropping of calls.



    Yes, correct. It's a light touch (reproducible with a single finger) rather than some kind of hard grip that causes problems with some iPhone 4 units.



    This is the difference between the iPhone 4 and other phones.



    And yet, Apple and others are still posting video after video showing someone purposefully gripping onto phones tight in order to show dropped bars. That's not the issue that was originally reported at all!
  • Reply 9 of 278
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Smallwheels View Post


    If I were in the market for a cell phone and saw that all of the other company's CEOs were lying about their phones reception problems then I definitely wouldn't buy their products. They deny the problem yet the videos by their own customers prove them wrong.



    Well you have to realize that some (maybe many) of these CEOs have no clue about specifics with their products hardware or even what is inside the user manuals. Todays CEO looks at stat sheets with data analysis all day that others (worker grunts) compile for them. Some of them care little about specifics. All they understand is what is being displayed on a data sheet, bar graph, pie chart etc.



    Todays CEOs are kind of clueless.
  • Reply 10 of 278
    As Apple customers, we really shouldn't care if competing products also have problems. It's APPLE product we're concerned with.



    Even Toyota was above putting out information that compared their product to others ("See! GM and Ford cars have problems too!").



    Apple really, really needs to improve their crisis management. No, it should never be needed. But like firefighting equipment, it should be ready and effective when hell does break out.
  • Reply 11 of 278
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by DrDoppio View Post


    Do you have any hard data linking GSM radiation to jaw cancer or something, Professor... or something?



    Here is a start if you want to get into it:



    http://www.gq.com/cars-gear/gear-and...hone-radiation
  • Reply 12 of 278
    voodooruvoodooru Posts: 70member
    this antenna issue seems to be put to rest at this point.



    now the real drama coming next is the glass.





    dropping an iPhone 2G, 3G and 3GS has never been a cause for concern. now with the iPhone 4 it will be a major headache going forward.



    drop your phone and crack or shatter it and bam! you're out of $199 for a replacement. no sympathy, you broke it you pay!



    interesting months are ahead!





  • Reply 13 of 278
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Prof. Peabody View Post


    Your the one that's confused. It's not healthy to have the antenna touching your face anyway. A more normal grip would eliminate your problem with the signal as well as make it less likely you will get jaw cancer or something.



    I know a guy who got tongue cancer. He never smoked or dipped tobacco a day in his life. Of course no one really knows why cancer forms. And he doesn't have an iPhone. He lives in Florida where there is terrible coverage. He had one and returned it.
  • Reply 14 of 278
    boeyc15boeyc15 Posts: 986member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Prof. Peabody View Post


    Your the one that's confused.



    The issue isn't the "finger of death." The issue is blocking the signal by means of the users hand, and related to that, the dropping of calls.



    Apple's antenna is on the outside, therefore it's more sensitive to the issue. No one at Apple has ever denied that, they have even touted the extra sensitivity as a good thing. All phones have the issue, most of the time they don't drop calls however.



    If you hold the iPhone in a natural way, it won't suffer from this and won't drop calls. If you insist on holding your finger over the antenna, it will drop bars, but for the most part still won't drop the call. If you are in a marginal signal area while participating in such hijinks, you might drop the call.



    I hold my iPhone in my left hand exclusively while making a call but I never get my fingers near that spot unless I contort myself on purpose. It's a non-issue because it's almost impossible to reproduce for the vast majority of users.



    I feel sorry for you if you hold your phone that way and also live in a low signal area, but that doesn't make it an issue for the rest of us. Try holding the phone with your fingers like most folks do instead of slapping it to the side of your head with your entire hand cupped around it (the only way you'd see any problem at all).



    It's not healthy to have the antenna touching your face anyway. A more normal grip would eliminate your problem with the signal as well as make it less likely you will get jaw cancer or something.



    Yes please teach us Prof... What is the correct or normal way to hold phone? The nerve.
  • Reply 15 of 278
    extremeskaterextremeskater Posts: 2,248member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by solipsism View Post


    The other handset vendors shouldn't have cast stones and they might not have been targeted so readily. That said, while I don't recall Moto speaking up on the issue they do have the "latest and greatest" iPhone competitor which brings with it it's own bullseye for scrutiny, which is a good thing for Moto.



    It really doesn't matter at this point because Apple is the only one get continuous bad press related to this subject.



    The problem is Apple has now become of victim of its own advertising. Steve Jobs makes a point of bashing as many companies as he can and even the "Get A Mac" ads are seen as annoying by anyone except an Apple fan. They have set themselves up to take a major beating when something like this happens.



    The media in the US loves to do two things build up the underdog and then tear them down as soon as they get on top. Apple no longer enjoys the benefits of being the underdog.



    There is a long time saying that is painfully true, when you become #1 there is only one direction to go and that is downhill.
  • Reply 16 of 278
    g3prog3pro Posts: 669member
    Actually, the iPhone 4 is the only phone in existence which loses 5 bars when a single finger touches the insulator between the two external antennae, without even holding the phone.



    The more Apple is trying to divert attention away from its idiotic design flaw, the more hilarious it's getting.
  • Reply 17 of 278
    bcs123bcs123 Posts: 46member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by sippincider View Post


    As Apple customers, we really shouldn't care if competing products also have problems. It's APPLE product we're concerned with.



    Even Toyota was above putting out information that compared their product to others ("See! GM and Ford cars have problems too!").



    Apple really, really needs to improve their crisis management. No, it should never be needed. But like firefighting equipment, it should be ready and effective when hell does break out.



    Wow. Logical fallacy.



    You can't really compare toyotas safety issues with apple's antenna sensitivity. They are vastly different in every way. The main one being that Toyota had nobody to point a finger at. The antenna problem is an industry wide phenomena, to some extent. Apple is mearly trying to show that they are being singled out for a problem that all phones have, even if it's not as extreme. Toyota had nobody else having the same or even marginally similar serious problems.



    Whether it was ethically right for apple to drag other people into the fray is questionable, but most of the companies entered it willingly to trash apple. But comparing them to Toyota is a bit extreme and logically fallacious.
  • Reply 18 of 278
    joe hsjoe hs Posts: 488member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by voodooru View Post


    this antenna issue seems to be put to rest at this point.



    now the real drama coming next is the glass.





    dropping an iPhone 2G, 3G and 3GS has never been a cause for concern. now with the iPhone 4 it will be a major headache going forward.



    drop your phone and crack or shatter it and bam! you're out of $199 for a replacement. no sympathy, you broke it you pay!



    interesting months are ahead!









    iPhone 4s have a one year wannanty- that includes cover if you drop it.
  • Reply 19 of 278
    exscapeexscape Posts: 27member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Blackintosh View Post


    I know a guy who got tongue cancer. He never smoked or dipped tobacco a day in his life. Of course no one really knows why cancer forms. And he doesn't have an iPhone. He lives in Florida where there is terrible coverage. He had one and returned it.



    Uh...

    1) We do know how cancer forms. Even several different ways AFAIK.

    2) A single person is just an anecdote. (Also, I like the phrase "the plural of anecdote isn't data".)

    3) I'm sorry for your friend, whatever happened. I don't mean to come off as insensitive; it's just that this post is pretty OT.
  • Reply 20 of 278
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by exscape View Post


    Uh...

    1) We do know how cancer forms. Even several different ways AFAIK.

    2) A single person is just an anecdote. (Also, I like the phrase "the plural of anecdote isn't data".)

    3) I'm sorry for your friend, whatever happened. I don't mean to come off as insensitive; it's just that this post is pretty OT.



    Perhaps, but getting cancer on the tongue is pretty odd. Why there? Especially for a non smoker. But like you said, no one knows. I use the ear piece anyway, to be on the safe side. And I dislike holding the phone to my ear.
Sign In or Register to comment.