Wow, I hadn't noticed that HWR was downplayed that much. So in the screenshot of Outlook, you're sending a picture file of what you scribbled!? <img src="graemlins/lol.gif" border="0" alt="[Laughing]" /> So they haven't integrated HWR into the system as much as integrating Paint.exe.
Now let's imagine what Apple could do with Inkwell and the Quartz Compositor layer.
-writing becomes text
-scribbling & drawings become paths
One could turn handwritten notes on-the-fly into typed looking notes with professional looking illustrations. Sounds like something double-plus good for students.
But this group sounds like the people of the 50's and 60's.
"Why would anyone ever want their own computer?", "What kind of person would ever need to carry around thier computer?", "Why would anyone want to write on a computer when they can just as easy write on paper?".
40+ years latter many of you still don't want to see the future. <img src="graemlins/oyvey.gif" border="0" alt="[No]" /> <img src="graemlins/oyvey.gif" border="0" alt="[No]" /> <img src="graemlins/oyvey.gif" border="0" alt="[No]" />
If you ever worked around computers you would already realize that it is impossible to keep people from touching screens that aren't an input device. It is a more natural thing to touch what one wants.
I love my eMate 300, it is a really dumb design but it has better engineering than any PDA of today. I think it is much more like a Tablet than a PDA.
I think form factor of mobile devices is basically determined by the user interface of the device, screen technology for example. Input, such as a keyboard or touchscreen, for another example.
When OLEDs, HUDs in eye glasses or hey, maybe contacts, come about, or we can type on an "air" keyboard like in Minority Report, then PDAs and "laptops" will look a lot different. One company already makes a device that illuminates a keyboard onto a desk, and when you type, it makes clicking sounds! IR is how it works, supposedly (trade secret)
In their current form, "tablets" are useless to almost everyone and will never be successful. I think this even applies to Mira and the like. The UI isn't ready.
But we all know of some company that specializes in an easy, friendly, UI... Hmm who could that be? I can see Apple pioneering on the display front, with HUDs OLEDs, and input on the "Ink" front, as well as with speech technology like speech recognition/synthesis.
They are nearly as sleek and lightweight as the lid (that is, the display-only portion), by itself, of my TiBook.
Despite the light weight, the battery life is at least as good as my TiBook, and hopefully better.
Handwriting recognition works really, really well. I don't think I'll be happy with pen input until display I'm writing on has such tiny pixels that I can write naturally-sized characters and get something more than a lumpy blob of pixels, vaguely reminiscent of what I was trying to write, as a result. The physical analogy is supposed to be of a paper tablet and an ink pen, not a paper tablet and a jumbo magic marker.
The display is durable enough that it can be left exposed without being ruined. If I have deal with an awkward and large removable cover, or if I have to fold open my tablet like a laptop... I might as well have a laptop.
They are nearly as powerful as today's laptops while having a lightweight design with long battery life. I'd accept some small loss of performance as a tradeoff for all of the other features I'd want.
No matter how good the handwriting translation is, the format is fundamentally flawed. While note taking is fine, no one can print as fast as they can type (assuming a modicum of training).
This relegates the device to being an add on, not a replacement for a full fledged laptop or desktop. No one will be willing to pay a premium for a format that actually limits its usability.
There are a few areas where this might be useful, such as inventories, claims adjusting, and other areas where the actual data input needs are limited, but I can just imagine trying to fill out a spreadsheet or a database entry with it.
Tablets are too specialized for mass market acceptance. Mira is actually a better idea, it works as a portable monitor/data entry for another computer. To me, that has a much better chance, if it's priced reasonably (300 or less). The thing is, this is actually being targeted to the home user and is expected to retail for just under $1000. You could buy a computer for that amount.
Microsoft is misreading the market and is going to take a bath on both (X Box anyone?). It makes me so sad.
Ummmm, microsoft has been introducing Tablet PC's for about 7 years now. Dont hold your breath just because someone MS Monkey said 'Toshiba' in a press release.
Who gives a crap? I'd rather keep my 5lb. iBook toting on my shoulder, over a unprotected slate. By the time you add enough armor on to it to protect it, it'll weigh 10lbs. And you know M$ isn't going to make these cheap.
Apparently cyko95 doesn't know what the Ti in TiBook stands for.
Apples big claim of a Titanium shell being a liteweight armor for a notebook should fit perfectly on a Tablet PC.
In a real wireless world you would not need anything but a display that could interact. All of the other peripheral devices (including keyboards) would be accessable in the places that are needed. If you could securely access all of your home harddrives from anywhere, why would you want to carry copies of the same data around. It is the same principle that is pushing the PDA and Cell phone markets together. You wouldn't need a DVD player because you could access them all online. You wouldn't need a writable optical because you could send anything to anyone with the push of a finger.
My perfect world and I am trying to make it happen.
<strong>No matter how good the handwriting translation is, the format is fundamentally flawed. While note taking is fine, no one can print as fast as they can type (assuming a modicum of training).</strong><hr></blockquote>
I wonder how true this is for languages like Chinese and Japanese?
<strong>Apparently cyko95 doesn't know what the Ti in TiBook stands for.</strong><hr></blockquote>
And apparently you have never read comparison information between the iBook and the TiBook. The Ti isn't as durable in everyday use as the Polycarbonate shell of the iBook.
My point wasn't for the casing of the system, but lack thereof for the screen. Yes, i'm sure that they will have covers and screens for it, but I feel comfortable in saying that I doubt that it will be as durable as the iBook or TiBook that we love so much today.
<strong>I wonder if I care about Chinese or Japanese?
....ummm....nope. Don't care one bit.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Do you work hard at being jingoistic and parochial? Or does it just come naturally?
I'm not personally excited about tablet PCs, or tablet Macs for that matter. My point was that the possible utility of handwriting recognition vs. keyboarding can't be completely dismissed. While the Chinese economy wouldn't support many sales, the Japanese economy might.
Also, for people with some kinds of physical impairments, writing with a stylus might be easier than keyboarding.
<strong>I might get excited about tablet PCs when:
Handwriting recognition works really, really well. I don't think I'll be happy with pen input until display I'm writing on has such tiny pixels that I can write naturally-sized characters and get something more than a lumpy blob of pixels, vaguely reminiscent of what I was trying to write, as a result. The physical analogy is supposed to be of a paper tablet and an ink pen, not a paper tablet and a jumbo magic marker.
</strong><hr></blockquote>
Well, the display doesn't have to super high resolution, just the touch-sensitive layer. As long as the two resolutions are proportional, your input can be sized down, and we all know Quartz does a wonderful job of scaling and anti-aliasing and such. This would also play well into the new "zoomable" display in 10.2.
Also, for people with some kinds of physical impairments, writing with a stylus might be easier than keyboarding.</strong><hr></blockquote>
That's my big fear. If such a device requires pen input, I (and many others) are stuffed. If it has a USB port and can run off a mouse/trackball then I'll buy one.
I think it could be useful in a few limited situations now. Until handwriting recognition becomes 99.9% accurate, weight is cut in half, & we have pervasive high-speed wireless connections, tablets will be a niche product. However MS can afford to develop it and not be restricted by a 4 product matrix. Apple will wait until the tech & market is proven.
On the other hand, when I move from crt->lcd, I might go wireless, if the cost difference is only $100-200 like some manufacturers have claimed.
As I have said for many years "Apple (Jobs) only wants to make products for the student market". Students have no practical use for a Tablet until the Colleges and Universities truely go wireless.
The iPod, iMac, eMac, iTunes, etc., etc. are all young market products. The new Apple servers are a great upgrade for many Institutions of higher learning( They certainly aren't marketed to Joe business man ).
There are thousands of business applications for a Tablet device. Hell, there are thousands of business applications for a Portable PC, but Apple will never make one of them either(The original Macintosh might actually have been their only one).
Of course the day Apple stores have Tablets to sell, I will be there to buy one.
Do you need to be AirTrained to attach an AirPort to an AirBus? <img src="graemlins/bugeye.gif" border="0" alt="[Skeptical]" />
eMate was just a newton with a keyboard.</strong><hr></blockquote>
the original newton was designed as a tablet, but the screens were too expensive at the time to produce them that way. too bad, would have been interesting to see if there would have been much hoopla over tablets now if apple had produced on years ago. also, the new tablet pc's are actually pretty damned cool.
Personally, I have a feeling that an Apple tablet device is more likely than an Apple handheld. I think it would make a great secondary computer for a household or buisness environment.
I think it's be great to have such a device for web browsing from the couch, or using Ink to jot down quick notes for later use. It could even be a person's primary computer, just by adding a USB mouse and keyboard, and placing the unit on a stand (or integrating a fold-out stand).
No, it likely won't be as powerful as an iBook. But, to compensate, it can be smaller. Maybe a 9" or 10" screen, half as thick, and using the iPod's slim hard drive... make full use of the pen interface and Ink, and you've got a great little device for taking around the house or buisness. And as someone else said, this would be perfect for the medical field (where some doctors are already using handhelds) or another job that involves carrying large amounts of data and taking notes on the go.
Yes, you can do most of this with a laptop. The advantage of a tablet, though, is that it's slimmer, (hopefully) lighter, and you don't need a flat surface to use it on.
Will Apple ever do this? Well, Ink makes me think Jobs might just try it out... but I'm not holding my breath.
I hope apple doesnt get into this. I only like it when apple gets into technology that hasn't been widely accepted and they basically find the product's acceptance in the market place. If apple brings a tablet to market, it wont be bringing anything new to the table.
Comments
Now let's imagine what Apple could do with Inkwell and the Quartz Compositor layer.
-writing becomes text
-scribbling & drawings become paths
One could turn handwritten notes on-the-fly into typed looking notes with professional looking illustrations. Sounds like something double-plus good for students.
Screed
[ 06-26-2002: Message edited by: sCreeD ]</p>
But this group sounds like the people of the 50's and 60's.
"Why would anyone ever want their own computer?", "What kind of person would ever need to carry around thier computer?", "Why would anyone want to write on a computer when they can just as easy write on paper?".
40+ years latter many of you still don't want to see the future. <img src="graemlins/oyvey.gif" border="0" alt="[No]" /> <img src="graemlins/oyvey.gif" border="0" alt="[No]" /> <img src="graemlins/oyvey.gif" border="0" alt="[No]" />
If you ever worked around computers you would already realize that it is impossible to keep people from touching screens that aren't an input device. It is a more natural thing to touch what one wants.
I love my eMate 300, it is a really dumb design but it has better engineering than any PDA of today. I think it is much more like a Tablet than a PDA.
Kenny must live... to die
When OLEDs, HUDs in eye glasses or hey, maybe contacts, come about, or we can type on an "air" keyboard like in Minority Report, then PDAs and "laptops" will look a lot different. One company already makes a device that illuminates a keyboard onto a desk, and when you type, it makes clicking sounds! IR is how it works, supposedly (trade secret)
In their current form, "tablets" are useless to almost everyone and will never be successful. I think this even applies to Mira and the like. The UI isn't ready.
But we all know of some company that specializes in an easy, friendly, UI... Hmm who could that be? I can see Apple pioneering on the display front, with HUDs OLEDs, and input on the "Ink" front, as well as with speech technology like speech recognition/synthesis.
Go Apple go!!!
Let's hope M$ loses lots of money!
[ 06-26-2002: Message edited by: Aquatik ]</p>
As for Tablet PC's
now- <a href="http://www.viewsonic.com/products/index.htm"; target="_blank">http://www.viewsonic.com/products/index.htm</a>;
and then theres <a href="http://www.fpc.fujitsu.com/www/products_overview.shtml"; target="_blank">http://www.fpc.fujitsu.com/www/products_overview.shtml</a>;
They have a damb notebook with a 14 hour battery life..
If anyone has the nuts with this hole TabletPC thing then its
these companies. But when it all comes down to it, its STILL WINDOWS CRAP .......END RANT HERE.....
IN CLOSING-MAC USERS ROCK!
This relegates the device to being an add on, not a replacement for a full fledged laptop or desktop. No one will be willing to pay a premium for a format that actually limits its usability.
There are a few areas where this might be useful, such as inventories, claims adjusting, and other areas where the actual data input needs are limited, but I can just imagine trying to fill out a spreadsheet or a database entry with it.
Tablets are too specialized for mass market acceptance. Mira is actually a better idea, it works as a portable monitor/data entry for another computer. To me, that has a much better chance, if it's priced reasonably (300 or less). The thing is, this is actually being targeted to the home user and is expected to retail for just under $1000. You could buy a computer for that amount.
Microsoft is misreading the market and is going to take a bath on both (X Box anyone?). It makes me so sad.
Who gives a crap? I'd rather keep my 5lb. iBook toting on my shoulder, over a unprotected slate. By the time you add enough armor on to it to protect it, it'll weigh 10lbs. And you know M$ isn't going to make these cheap.
[ 06-26-2002: Message edited by: cyko95 ]</p>
Apples big claim of a Titanium shell being a liteweight armor for a notebook should fit perfectly on a Tablet PC.
In a real wireless world you would not need anything but a display that could interact. All of the other peripheral devices (including keyboards) would be accessable in the places that are needed. If you could securely access all of your home harddrives from anywhere, why would you want to carry copies of the same data around. It is the same principle that is pushing the PDA and Cell phone markets together. You wouldn't need a DVD player because you could access them all online. You wouldn't need a writable optical because you could send anything to anyone with the push of a finger.
Kenny must die... to live
<strong>No matter how good the handwriting translation is, the format is fundamentally flawed. While note taking is fine, no one can print as fast as they can type (assuming a modicum of training).</strong><hr></blockquote>
I wonder how true this is for languages like Chinese and Japanese?
-Kerry
....ummm....nope. Don't care one bit.
Let M$ sell their tablets to the chinese, as if they could afford an $800 toy that's useless for getting anything done.
<strong>Apparently cyko95 doesn't know what the Ti in TiBook stands for.</strong><hr></blockquote>
And apparently you have never read comparison information between the iBook and the TiBook. The Ti isn't as durable in everyday use as the Polycarbonate shell of the iBook.
My point wasn't for the casing of the system, but lack thereof for the screen. Yes, i'm sure that they will have covers and screens for it, but I feel comfortable in saying that I doubt that it will be as durable as the iBook or TiBook that we love so much today.
<strong>I wonder if I care about Chinese or Japanese?
....ummm....nope. Don't care one bit.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Do you work hard at being jingoistic and parochial? Or does it just come naturally?
I'm not personally excited about tablet PCs, or tablet Macs for that matter. My point was that the possible utility of handwriting recognition vs. keyboarding can't be completely dismissed. While the Chinese economy wouldn't support many sales, the Japanese economy might.
Also, for people with some kinds of physical impairments, writing with a stylus might be easier than keyboarding.
<strong>I might get excited about tablet PCs when:
- Handwriting recognition works really, really well. I don't think I'll be happy with pen input until display I'm writing on has such tiny pixels that I can write naturally-sized characters and get something more than a lumpy blob of pixels, vaguely reminiscent of what I was trying to write, as a result. The physical analogy is supposed to be of a paper tablet and an ink pen, not a paper tablet and a jumbo magic marker.
</strong><hr></blockquote>Well, the display doesn't have to super high resolution, just the touch-sensitive layer. As long as the two resolutions are proportional, your input can be sized down, and we all know Quartz does a wonderful job of scaling and anti-aliasing and such. This would also play well into the new "zoomable" display in 10.2.
<strong>
Also, for people with some kinds of physical impairments, writing with a stylus might be easier than keyboarding.</strong><hr></blockquote>
That's my big fear. If such a device requires pen input, I (and many others) are stuffed. If it has a USB port and can run off a mouse/trackball then I'll buy one.
On the other hand, when I move from crt->lcd, I might go wireless, if the cost difference is only $100-200 like some manufacturers have claimed.
The iPod, iMac, eMac, iTunes, etc., etc. are all young market products. The new Apple servers are a great upgrade for many Institutions of higher learning( They certainly aren't marketed to Joe business man ).
There are thousands of business applications for a Tablet device. Hell, there are thousands of business applications for a Portable PC, but Apple will never make one of them either(The original Macintosh might actually have been their only one).
Of course the day Apple stores have Tablets to sell, I will be there to buy one.
Do you need to be AirTrained to attach an AirPort to an AirBus? <img src="graemlins/bugeye.gif" border="0" alt="[Skeptical]" />
Kenny must live... to die
<strong>
eMate was just a newton with a keyboard.</strong><hr></blockquote>
the original newton was designed as a tablet, but the screens were too expensive at the time to produce them that way. too bad, would have been interesting to see if there would have been much hoopla over tablets now if apple had produced on years ago. also, the new tablet pc's are actually pretty damned cool.
[ 06-29-2002: Message edited by: admactanium ]</p>
Personally, I have a feeling that an Apple tablet device is more likely than an Apple handheld. I think it would make a great secondary computer for a household or buisness environment.
I think it's be great to have such a device for web browsing from the couch, or using Ink to jot down quick notes for later use. It could even be a person's primary computer, just by adding a USB mouse and keyboard, and placing the unit on a stand (or integrating a fold-out stand).
No, it likely won't be as powerful as an iBook. But, to compensate, it can be smaller. Maybe a 9" or 10" screen, half as thick, and using the iPod's slim hard drive... make full use of the pen interface and Ink, and you've got a great little device for taking around the house or buisness. And as someone else said, this would be perfect for the medical field (where some doctors are already using handhelds) or another job that involves carrying large amounts of data and taking notes on the go.
Yes, you can do most of this with a laptop. The advantage of a tablet, though, is that it's slimmer, (hopefully) lighter, and you don't need a flat surface to use it on.
Will Apple ever do this? Well, Ink makes me think Jobs might just try it out... but I'm not holding my breath.
[ Edited for grammar. Bad grammar! No biscuit!
[ 06-30-2002: Message edited by: Kesh ]</p>