What are people's best guess for launch date for 2nd generation Macbook? And what changes are you expecting? Can we expect Skylake processors? And if not, what instead?
It was launched in April so just 6 months ago, which is quite an early refresh. Some Core-M Skylake PCs are shipping next month.
Skylake is unusual as Intel hasn't been pushing Iris branding much. Apple even went with Broadwell for the smaller iMac with Iris graphics rather than Skylake, which would prevent them from moving to TB3. Higher end PC laptops are shipping with GT2 graphics along with NVidia 9-series GPUs. I haven't seen anything about GT4e Iris being used.
Truly wireless charging at a distance would be nice to see with Skylake with the laptop line but PC manufacturers don't seem to be advertising much wireless capability.
Intel said the graphics performance should be significantly improved over the last chips so Skylake Core-M in the Macbook would allow it to replace the Air.
Perhaps Apple can expand the laptop trackpads and allow the Apple Pencil to work with them along with palm rejection.
It's looking like no October Mac event after all. They've had one since at least 2008.
I guess it'll just be a drop-in upgrade to Skylake Core-M for the Macbook next month and some kind of refresh for the MBP line. The 15" MBP is still on Haswell. No Broadwell for the Mac Pro until next year whenever Intel feels like putting out new chips.
There's no reason for Intel to rush anything now given the state of AMD. They own the whole x86 market, server and desktop.
So you expect a processor upgrade for the MacBook next month rather than a wait into the New Year?
Apple is usually fairly quick to use new processors when they become available, they still have to stay somewhat competitive with PC competitors. The holiday quarter is their strongest for sales but November is still quite early for a refresh. It's not like the Macbook would be getting a redesign or anything so it would be a straightforward update but it depends on what the plan is for the next update. If Kaby Lake arrives in September next year then that's 17 months since the initial model so ideally Skylake would fall in the middle, which would be January 2016 but as I say, if PCs are out in November with it, I don't see any reason for them to delay and miss out on holiday sales. It would be more likely to delay the MBP line into the new year.
Apple used to update on a 6 to 9 month time scale, so I don't think it's early. It's all on Intel at the moment. Intel has hit delays over the years, so Apple's refresh cycle has gone a little wonky. This is evidenced by the fact that Apple updated its 13-inch MacBook Pro with retina display using Broadwell back in March... but left the 15-inch model on Haswell with a graphics update back in May. Go figure. It's not Apple's fault per sé.
I think there's a slight chance that Apple updates the MacBook to Skylake before the turn of the year. In 2016, I expect it to be a full coming out for USB C/Thunderbolt 3 on all Mac product lines and the new butterfly style keyboard.
Apple even went with Broadwell for the smaller iMac with Iris graphics rather than Skylake, which would prevent them from moving to TB3.
Yes, I don't understand this choice, since it forced the iMac line to stick with Thunderbolt 2. The iMacs had been left with TB1 for so long, I assumed Apple was leapfrogging to TB3. What's the point of introducing TB2 ports on a computer in October 2015?
Quote:
Originally Posted by DHagan4755
I think there's a slight chance that Apple updates the MacBook to Skylake before the turn of the year. In 2016, I expect it to be a full coming out for USB C/Thunderbolt 3 on all Mac product lines and the new butterfly style keyboard.
The earnings call is next week, so maybe they're waiting on that to unveil the new MacBook Pros. Dell and HP seem to have equalled the current industrial design, so I'm hoping Apple has something special up its sleeve. And that it weighs 4lbs.
After that, then the MacBook upgrade will come.
Putting out the MacBook upgrade before the MB Pros would likely cut into profits, and Apple's not going down that road.
My understanding is that the Skylake Iris graphics for the 21.5-inch iMac aren't available from Intel yet, hence Apple's use of Broadwell chips (whereas Skylake Iris graphics weren't being used on the 27-inch iMacs, they had discreet graphics). Same problem for the MacBook Pros. MacBooks don't use Iris graphics so those could be released any day now.
It was launched in April so just 6 months ago, which is quite an early refresh. Some Core-M Skylake PCs are shipping next month.
We could see an update next month. I'm not convinced that the performance delta will be that great but time will tell.
Skylake is unusual as Intel hasn't been pushing Iris branding much. Apple even went with Broadwell for the smaller iMac with Iris graphics rather than Skylake, which would prevent them from moving to TB3. Higher end PC laptops are shipping with GT2 graphics along with NVidia 9-series GPUs. I haven't seen anything about GT4e Iris being used.
Intel seems to be having significant problems at 14 nm. They have basically lost their process lead. TSMC now has three variants of its 16 nm process to offer customers.
Truly wireless charging at a distance would be nice to see with Skylake with the laptop line but PC manufacturers don't seem to be advertising much wireless capability.
I've yet to see anything convincing when it comes to wireless charging. it si a bit like cold fusion except that cold fusion does have some interesting science to go along with it.
Intel said the graphics performance should be significantly improved over the last chips so Skylake Core-M in the Macbook would allow it to replace the Air.
Doesn't matter if the performance is improved you will get similar improvements at the 12-15 watts seen in the Air. In fact Apple has a significant opportunity here to make the Air a much better machine with the SkyLake chip sets. rebooting. (MacOS update)
Perhaps Apple can expand the laptop trackpads and allow the Apple Pencil to work with them along with palm rejection.
That is an interesting idea.
It's looking like no October Mac event after all. They've had one since at least 2008.
I blame this on Intel. Intel ability to get product to market has been terrible, inconsistent and for manufactures like Apple hard to swallow.
I guess it'll just be a drop-in upgrade to Skylake Core-M for the Macbook next month and some kind of refresh for the MBP line. The 15" MBP is still on Haswell. No Broadwell for the Mac Pro until next year whenever Intel feels like putting out new chips.
In many ways the recent iMac updates especially the 4K machine have been pathetic. Adoption of new technology should be high on Apples list of things to integrate into the iMac. The lack of USB-C/TB3 is just a sad statement on the desktop/laptop market these days.
There's no reason for Intel to rush anything now given the state of AMD. They own the whole x86 market, server and desktop.
AMD is hurting but Intel could find themselves in the same position. All the market needs is a compelling ARM based laptop solution.
The interesting thing about AMD is the rumor that was floated a few days ago about them doing a custom x86 chip for Apple. While that is hard to believe on the surface it does cause the imagination to run wild. This especially if Apple worked with them to integrate some of the support electronics in the A series chips. Imagine for example the video processor handling the cameras ported to an AMD chip. Or maybe the built in flash controller. In the end the only way for Apple to move forward is to have some control over the X86 SoC, as I've stated before the SoC is the printed circuit board of the 1900's. If you really want to think wild, imagine an X86 based chip with a complement of A9 cores to allow Apple a transitional machine to the a future of all ARM devices.
I'm pulling the thread off the tracks here but I can see Apple becoming very frustrated with Intel. This could put the Mac Book upgrade off into the future when they feel Intel is more reliable. The other thing here is what are the sales numbers for the Mac Book? I'm not seeing compelling evidence of a great success here, it is one of the few machines from Apple that people return for poor performance.
Personally I think Apple needs to refactor the entire Mac Book line up but that is me.
Yes, I don't understand this choice, since it forced the iMac line to stick with Thunderbolt 2. The iMacs had been left with TB1 for so long, I assumed Apple was leapfrogging to TB3. What's the point of introducing TB2 ports on a computer in October 2015?
Seriously here don't blame Apple, this is all on Intel. Apple is frustrated, as is most of the industry, with intel inability to get products out the door. I know everybody rags on AMD but AMD isn't promising as much as Intel is and breaking those promises.
The earnings call is next week, so maybe they're waiting on that to unveil the new MacBook Pros. Dell and HP seem to have equalled the current industrial design, so I'm hoping Apple has something special up its sleeve. And that it weighs 4lbs.
The obsession with industrial design is interesting but misplaced in my mind. If new models don't significantly increase performance and offer worthwhile features there is no need to buy new machines. Anybody buying Apple laptops because of industrial design is in my mind missing out on the positives of owning a Mac Book.
As for a new machine Intels line up of chips, especially actual availability is pretty opaque, I'm not even sure MBP suitable chips exist at the moment.
After that, then the MacBook upgrade will come.
Putting out the MacBook upgrade before the MB Pros would likely cut into profits, and Apple's not going down that road.
Apple doesn't care. They will put effort into devices that have decent sales first.
My understanding is that the Skylake Iris graphics for the 21.5-inch iMac aren't available from Intel yet, hence Apple's use of Broadwell chips (whereas Skylake Iris graphics weren't being used on the 27-inch iMacs, they had discreet graphics). Same problem for the MacBook Pros. MacBooks don't use Iris graphics so those could be released any day now.
Thanks. I'm not really in the loop on the chip side of things, and had no idea Intel had released Skylake but was lagging on the graphics side. That's insane. No wonder Apple, who usually gets early access to chips, is lagging behind on upgrades this time.
Guess this means the MacBook Pros may take awhile.
Thanks. I'm not really in the loop on the chip side of things, and had no idea Intel had released Skylake but was lagging on the graphics side. That's insane. No wonder Apple, who usually gets early access to chips, is lagging behind on upgrades this time.
Sad isn't it, Intel offers up hardware you can't buy and gets away with it. Imagine if AMD debuted a chip and then didn't deliver for months on end.
Guess this means the MacBook Pros may take awhile.
Imagine a machine built with an AMD APU using their new HBM memory. Produce that chip on a 14 nm technology and they would have a very credible challenger to Intels current performance crown. In this case the HBM would be available to all processors on the SoC, an 8 or 16 GB machine would fly and still be extremely compact (the memory goes in package).
AMD has new cores coming (supposedly) which would close some of the performance issues vs Intel with the HBM providing the rest of the performance advantage. Tie this dream chip in with rumors that Apple and AMD are working together on a chip and you could have Apples first custom x86 processor.
Comments
Skylake is unusual as Intel hasn't been pushing Iris branding much. Apple even went with Broadwell for the smaller iMac with Iris graphics rather than Skylake, which would prevent them from moving to TB3. Higher end PC laptops are shipping with GT2 graphics along with NVidia 9-series GPUs. I haven't seen anything about GT4e Iris being used.
Truly wireless charging at a distance would be nice to see with Skylake with the laptop line but PC manufacturers don't seem to be advertising much wireless capability.
Intel said the graphics performance should be significantly improved over the last chips so Skylake Core-M in the Macbook would allow it to replace the Air.
Perhaps Apple can expand the laptop trackpads and allow the Apple Pencil to work with them along with palm rejection.
It's looking like no October Mac event after all. They've had one since at least 2008.
I guess it'll just be a drop-in upgrade to Skylake Core-M for the Macbook next month and some kind of refresh for the MBP line. The 15" MBP is still on Haswell. No Broadwell for the Mac Pro until next year whenever Intel feels like putting out new chips.
There's no reason for Intel to rush anything now given the state of AMD. They own the whole x86 market, server and desktop.
Apple is usually fairly quick to use new processors when they become available, they still have to stay somewhat competitive with PC competitors. The holiday quarter is their strongest for sales but November is still quite early for a refresh. It's not like the Macbook would be getting a redesign or anything so it would be a straightforward update but it depends on what the plan is for the next update. If Kaby Lake arrives in September next year then that's 17 months since the initial model so ideally Skylake would fall in the middle, which would be January 2016 but as I say, if PCs are out in November with it, I don't see any reason for them to delay and miss out on holiday sales. It would be more likely to delay the MBP line into the new year.
Apple used to update on a 6 to 9 month time scale, so I don't think it's early. It's all on Intel at the moment. Intel has hit delays over the years, so Apple's refresh cycle has gone a little wonky. This is evidenced by the fact that Apple updated its 13-inch MacBook Pro with retina display using Broadwell back in March... but left the 15-inch model on Haswell with a graphics update back in May. Go figure. It's not Apple's fault per sé.
I think there's a slight chance that Apple updates the MacBook to Skylake before the turn of the year. In 2016, I expect it to be a full coming out for USB C/Thunderbolt 3 on all Mac product lines and the new butterfly style keyboard.
Apple even went with Broadwell for the smaller iMac with Iris graphics rather than Skylake, which would prevent them from moving to TB3.
Yes, I don't understand this choice, since it forced the iMac line to stick with Thunderbolt 2. The iMacs had been left with TB1 for so long, I assumed Apple was leapfrogging to TB3. What's the point of introducing TB2 ports on a computer in October 2015?
I think there's a slight chance that Apple updates the MacBook to Skylake before the turn of the year. In 2016, I expect it to be a full coming out for USB C/Thunderbolt 3 on all Mac product lines and the new butterfly style keyboard.
The earnings call is next week, so maybe they're waiting on that to unveil the new MacBook Pros. Dell and HP seem to have equalled the current industrial design, so I'm hoping Apple has something special up its sleeve. And that it weighs 4lbs.
After that, then the MacBook upgrade will come.
Putting out the MacBook upgrade before the MB Pros would likely cut into profits, and Apple's not going down that road.
Frank,
My understanding is that the Skylake Iris graphics for the 21.5-inch iMac aren't available from Intel yet, hence Apple's use of Broadwell chips (whereas Skylake Iris graphics weren't being used on the 27-inch iMacs, they had discreet graphics). Same problem for the MacBook Pros. MacBooks don't use Iris graphics so those could be released any day now.
AMD is hurting but Intel could find themselves in the same position. All the market needs is a compelling ARM based laptop solution.
The interesting thing about AMD is the rumor that was floated a few days ago about them doing a custom x86 chip for Apple. While that is hard to believe on the surface it does cause the imagination to run wild. This especially if Apple worked with them to integrate some of the support electronics in the A series chips. Imagine for example the video processor handling the cameras ported to an AMD chip. Or maybe the built in flash controller. In the end the only way for Apple to move forward is to have some control over the X86 SoC, as I've stated before the SoC is the printed circuit board of the 1900's. If you really want to think wild, imagine an X86 based chip with a complement of A9 cores to allow Apple a transitional machine to the a future of all ARM devices.
I'm pulling the thread off the tracks here but I can see Apple becoming very frustrated with Intel. This could put the Mac Book upgrade off into the future when they feel Intel is more reliable. The other thing here is what are the sales numbers for the Mac Book? I'm not seeing compelling evidence of a great success here, it is one of the few machines from Apple that people return for poor performance.
Personally I think Apple needs to refactor the entire Mac Book line up but that is me.
As for a new machine Intels line up of chips, especially actual availability is pretty opaque, I'm not even sure MBP suitable chips exist at the moment.
Apple doesn't care. They will put effort into devices that have decent sales first.
Frank,
My understanding is that the Skylake Iris graphics for the 21.5-inch iMac aren't available from Intel yet, hence Apple's use of Broadwell chips (whereas Skylake Iris graphics weren't being used on the 27-inch iMacs, they had discreet graphics). Same problem for the MacBook Pros. MacBooks don't use Iris graphics so those could be released any day now.
Thanks. I'm not really in the loop on the chip side of things, and had no idea Intel had released Skylake but was lagging on the graphics side. That's insane. No wonder Apple, who usually gets early access to chips, is lagging behind on upgrades this time.
Guess this means the MacBook Pros may take awhile.
Imagine a machine built with an AMD APU using their new HBM memory. Produce that chip on a 14 nm technology and they would have a very credible challenger to Intels current performance crown. In this case the HBM would be available to all processors on the SoC, an 8 or 16 GB machine would fly and still be extremely compact (the memory goes in package).
AMD has new cores coming (supposedly) which would close some of the performance issues vs Intel with the HBM providing the rest of the performance advantage. Tie this dream chip in with rumors that Apple and AMD are working together on a chip and you could have Apples first custom x86 processor.