Healthcare tech firm Epic Systems says it won't consider any Apple buyout offer

Posted:
in General Discussion
Despite its potentially lucrative nature, the CEO of healthcare IT firm Epic Systems says she won't consider any possible takeover offer by Apple.

Apple Health Records


"We're not going to do that," Judy Faulkner told Healthcare IT News at a conference earlier this week. "It was just very gratifying that not a single health system contacted us about it and said they were worried. They all said they laughed."

The executive was responding to CNBC "Mad Money" host Jim Cramer, who argued that Apple should buy Epic since it sells medical record software to major U.S. hospitals. Apple launched a Health Records feature in March 2018, allowing encrypted patient data to be saved in the iOS Health app for quick access and sharing with caregivers. Earlier this week Apple announced plans to bring the technology to U.S. military veterans.

"I think the thing that amazed me most about it is not that he said it. But that the message is so clear around the whole industry that we wouldn't do that," Faulkner continued. "And nobody questioned it. That was a real achievement, I think."

Faulkner is unusual in the corporate world in refusing to do deals or go public on the stock market. While that strategy carries risks, it also has advantages, such as not being beholden to shareholders concerned only about their own return.
«13

Comments

  • Reply 1 of 60
    I also won’t consider any buyout offer. 😝 
    patchythepirateLordeHawk
  • Reply 2 of 60
    rob53rob53 Posts: 2,032member
    Epic is full of epic user problems. Just talk to any medical receptionist who’s had to transition to Epic. Why would Apple even consider wasting their money buying out this company? Work with them but be able to ditch them whenever they want to. 
    AppleExposedalbegarcberndogktapperacerhomie3mac_dogzeus423williamlondonjbdragondavgreg
  • Reply 3 of 60
    I’m a little confused. Did Apple make an offer that was refused or is this just a hypothetical?  I also don’t understand the quote that finishes with “They all said they laughed”. Who was doing the laughing and what was the laughing in reference to?
    berndogminicoffeewilliamlondonaaronkalbjbdragonStrangeDaysnetmageurahara
  • Reply 4 of 60
    While I congratulate any business for keeping its vision and independence. It’s comical to suggest that Apple would need this company.. at all. 
  • Reply 5 of 60
    Cramer or Kramer? I don't know who is more clueless? 

    edited February 15 GeorgeBMacjony0
  • Reply 6 of 60
    AppleExposedAppleExposed Posts: 891unconfirmed, member
    rob53 said:
    Epic is full of epic user problems. Just talk to any medical receptionist who’s had to transition to Epic. Why would Apple even consider wasting their money buying out this company? Work with them but be able to ditch them whenever they want to. 

    Clicks that's why.


    I’m a little confused. Did Apple make an offer that was refused or is this just a hypothetical?  I also don’t understand the quote that finishes with “They all said they laughed”. Who was doing the laughing and what was the laughing in reference to?


    It was a dumb reply to a hypothetical question.


    I guess employees or something. They always laugh at Apple before they fall. So maybe they're afraid?


    randominternetpersonStrangeDays
  • Reply 7 of 60
    wood1208wood1208 Posts: 1,958member
    If Apple is serious to lead and capture patients records market than Apple has resources and ability to do so.
  • Reply 8 of 60
    I’m a little confused. Did Apple make an offer that was refused or is this just a hypothetical?  I also don’t understand the quote that finishes with “They all said they laughed”. Who was doing the laughing and what was the laughing in reference to?
    “They all laughed when I sat down to play the piano...”
    AppleExposediqatedo
  • Reply 9 of 60
    This s one of the most pretzel logic ways of patting oneself on the back I’ve ever read. It literally makes no sense. 
    AppleExposedaaronkalbRayz2016randominternetpersonStrangeDaysmacguiasdasd
  • Reply 10 of 60
    rob53 said:
    Epic is full of epic user problems. Just talk to any medical receptionist who’s had to transition to Epic. Why would Apple even consider wasting their money buying out this company? Work with them but be able to ditch them whenever they want to. 
    Yes. My doctor agrees wholeheartedly. Spends more time filling in records/forms than spending time with patients (he said). He alluded to the system being broken and ultimately detrimental to the patient recovery time & rate. 

    Fucking insurance companies. And this mentality of profits before people. 
    edited February 15 aaronkalbzeus423GeorgeBMacn2itivguy
  • Reply 11 of 60
    That's unfortunate. EMRs are incredibly complex and require massive amounts of red tape to get through. It would be a great foot in the door to many top hospitals if Apple acquired them.

    I havn't used Epic in a while, but it's probably still one of the best out there, as sad as that is. *All* of the EMRs I have ever used, including Epic, have been beyond terrible. However, I'm sure there are smaller systems out there that are doing it well. If Apple brought up a smaller company, then paired up with a hospital to implement their own system, it would literally save lives. And save doctors from a lot of unnecessary frustration and excessive charting time.
    iqatedonetmagen2itivguycharlesatlas
  • Reply 12 of 60
    MplsPMplsP Posts: 1,364member
    rob53 said:
    Epic is full of epic user problems. Just talk to any medical receptionist who’s had to transition to Epic. Why would Apple even consider wasting their money buying out this company? Work with them but be able to ditch them whenever they want to. 
    As someone who uses Epic on a daily basis, I sorely wish Apple would take them over; they. Oils use a ‘bit of Apple’ in their interface design. A colleague once described Epic as ‘absolutely the worst system out there. Next to everything else.’  They’re a lot like Microsoft in the 90s. Incredibly mediocre, often counterintuitive, buggy and a pain to use, but practically the only game in town. 

    As big as Apple is, Epic is probably worth billions and would it would be a major endeavor to purchase them. Given the mess our health care and insurance system is, I’m not sure apple would want to take this on. 
  • Reply 13 of 60
    entropysentropys Posts: 1,706member
    Whenever Cramer offers up an opinion like this, the wise thing to do is ask what his motive is. Because no doubt he has an angle.

    it can’t be share price, because epic is private, is it not?
  • Reply 14 of 60
    RE; Rob53, Mac_Dog, Patchythepirate.  Yes.

    All current major electronic health record systems in the US have wonderfully efficient, easy-to-use, billing modules.
    The Patient part?  Shared health information, history, recent health care encounters - absolutely terrible.

    I don't know where this so-called "news" came from, but as someone who as worked in health care IT for all my life, the best thing Apple could do if they bought Epic would be to close the company and start again.  Apple certainly has the UX capabilities to do a much better job for health providers. ;-)


    patchythepiratezeus423iqatedomacgui
  • Reply 15 of 60
    sumergo said:
    RE; Rob53, Mac_Dog, Patchythepirate.  Yes.

    All current major electronic health record systems in the US have wonderfully efficient, easy-to-use, billing modules.
    The Patient part?  Shared health information, history, recent health care encounters - absolutely terrible.

    I don't know where this so-called "news" came from, but as someone who as worked in health care IT for all my life, the best thing Apple could do if they bought Epic would be to close the company and start again.  Apple certainly has the UX capabilities to do a much better job for health providers. ;-)


    I figured it was as bad as I suspected, or worse. It's nice to have some extra validation. It's incredible that the epic people can be so proud of themselves for being such..epic..failures :#
  • Reply 16 of 60
    It's amazing that there are people on this site, presumably with IT backgrounds, who would be so clueless as to think integration of medical records, diverse and incompatible insurance requirements, diverse and incompatible health delivery systems is easy, or that it is just a UX problem. 

    Now where Apple and others might offer a service is to implement deep learning on the data collected by Epic and similar companies to identify important health information. 
  • Reply 17 of 60
    While I congratulate any business for keeping its vision and independence. It’s comical to suggest that Apple would need this company.. at all. 
    You have no clue what you're talking about- you obviously don't work in health care. Epic, like all EMRs, isn't great. I'd love to have Apple buy them. But the EMR business is a harsh one- there's a reason Apple, Microsoft and Google haven't tried to enter this market and I'll spell it out for you. Creating a mediocre EMR would cost several billion. Creating a great one would cost tens of billions. Am I pulling these numbers from my ass? Nope. Ontario's ehealth spent over a billion trying to make an EMR and got nothing. Ditto for many other attempts. 

    The complexity of an EMR is amazing. Think of everything that happens in health- documenting physical exams, ordering labs, biopsies, diagnostics of every other kind, billing, medical legal stuff, etc. Creating a system that does what a family doc needs would cost millions, but that wouldn't cover what a cardiologist needs to process EKGs and echocardiograms, or what a nurse needs to administer meds. There are 30+ medical specialties of doctors plus nurses, pharmacists, clerks, respiratory therapist, physiotherapists, etc., etc., who all need millions of dollars worth of software. And you can't piecemeal it- they all have to work together. It doesn't mean shit if I, as a family doc, have an EMR if all the specialists are sending me faxes. 

    Bottom line, if Apple wanted to make a great EMR, they would need a viable place to start and Epic is probably that place. Cramer is right. But the EMR industry, while big, is too risky and Apple won't touch it. 
    iqatedo
  • Reply 18 of 60
    Unfortunately, i use epic on a daily basis. It is horrible. As a radiation oncologist, my biggest challenge on a daily basis now seems to be keeping epic satisfied. As much as i would love Apple to haul over epic to something a normal person could understand and actually would like to use, I cannot blame anybody for not wanting to buy epic. 
    MplsPdavgregcharlesatlas
  • Reply 19 of 60
    A bit OT, perhaps: I think Apple should follow SJ’s advice to say 1000 times
    ”no” before saying one “yes”. In other words, focus, and then be consequent. 
    I would have no issue if Apple bought out Epic or someone else out there for billions - if they go all in and don’t drop the ball half way. They really could bring a lot to the table of administrative systems. But currently we have half hearted music steaming, some core services that need attention (such as Siri) to really really be on “it just works” level. 
    Then some stuff around self driving, AR. 
    I agree that Apple should think in many directions but then be fully committed.  How is Apple’s foot in the door of supporting school system doing currently? After some media hype, is Apple consequent enough for schools and teachers to really rely on it - or does it go the ping way? That’s the biggest concern I would have. Other than taking away valuable resources potentially used to create real value-add somewhere else. 
    entropys
  • Reply 20 of 60
    Unfortunately, i use epic on a daily basis. It is horrible. As a radiation oncologist, my biggest challenge on a daily basis now seems to be keeping epic satisfied. As much as i would love Apple to haul over epic to something a normal person could understand and actually would like to use, I cannot blame anybody for not wanting to buy epic. 
    Same here. Unfortunately, the CEO of Epic seems to be tone-deaf here. The lack of outrage she heard after Cramer's suggestion doesn't mean "Epic is great and everyone trusts us not to sell out to the big, bad companies", but rather "that would be awesome, too bad it won't happen." 
    randominternetpersoncharlesatlas
Sign In or Register to comment.