First 40-gigabit USB4 products shipping as soon as late 2020

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in General Discussion
Even though standards like USB-C and USB 3.2 are still gaining traction, the first devices with USB4 still using the USB-C connector should arrive towards the end of 2020, according the USB Promoter Group.

2018 iPad Pro with Hyper hub


While the standard is currently in a "0.7" release state, a variety of details are already known, Anandtech reported. The standard will for instance be based on Thunderbolt 3, but unlike current USB-C accessories operate at that standard's full 40 gigabits per second. Current USB-C cables are interoperable with Thunderbolt but can never go faster than 20 gigabits via USB 3.2, and more frequently run at 10 or even 5 gigabits.

The Promoter Group is further promising "multiple simultaneous data and display protocols," and backwards compatibility with USB 3.2, Thunderbolt 3, and USB 2.0.

An official USB4 specification is anticipated this summer. The standard is considered to be such a radical change that the Promoter Group is contemplating new logos and branding.

Apple will likely want to adopt USB4 as quickly as possible on Macs, given its rapid adoption of both Thunderbolt and USB-C in the past. Less certain is when the technology will migrate to the iPad Pro -- which already has USB-C -- and whether it will come at all to the iPhone. The company has so far resisted switching iPhones away from Lightning, even as USB-C becomes increasingly de facto on Android devices.
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Comments

  • Reply 1 of 23
    bala1234bala1234 Posts: 20member
    "Less certain is when the technology will migrate to the iPad Pro — which already has USB-C — and whether it will come at all to the iPhone. " Forget iphones. I am desperately hoping the next round of ipad hardware updates will standardize on usb-c.
  • Reply 2 of 23
    lkrupplkrupp Posts: 7,096member
    USB 4 will almost certainly be an optical standard . Otherwise the cable lengths will be limited to about 6”. Copper just can’t go that fast no matter what the encoding scheme is. Copper has resistance, light doesn’t. And someone tell me why an iPhone would need a 40 gigabit connections, hmmmm.
    edited June 12 watto_cobra
  • Reply 3 of 23
    Mike WuertheleMike Wuerthele Posts: 4,604administrator
    lkrupp said:
    USB 4 will almost certainly be an optical standard . Otherwise the cable lengths will be limited to about 6”. Copper just can’t go that fast no matter what the encoding scheme is. Copper has resistance, light doesn’t. And someone tell me why an iPhone would need a 40 gigabit connections, hmmmm.
    Copper goes that fast in six-foot Thunderbolt 3 now. Did you mean six feet, and not six inches?
    muthuk_vanalingamlolliverwatto_cobra
  • Reply 4 of 23
    Eric_WVGGEric_WVGG Posts: 609member
    Apple will likely want to adopt USB4 as quickly as possible on Macs, given its rapid adoption of both Thunderbolt and USB-C in the past. 
    Yeah, but they also skipped over USB 3.0 altogether. I take that back
    edited June 12
  • Reply 5 of 23
    thttht Posts: 3,212member
    Is this the Intel definition of “soon”?

    Adoption is really going to be gated to when Intel puts USB4 support into their PCH chips, and maybe to a lessor extant, AMD puts it into their IO chipsets. Before that, it’s just OEMs who are willing to spend margin on discrete USB4 chips, which won’t be that many if history is a guide.
    dysamoriawatto_cobra
  • Reply 6 of 23
    jdiamondjdiamond Posts: 62member
    lkrupp said:
    USB 4 will almost certainly be an optical standard . Otherwise the cable lengths will be limited to about 6”. Copper just can’t go that fast no matter what the encoding scheme is. Copper has resistance, light doesn’t. And someone tell me why an iPhone would need a 40 gigabit connections, hmmmm.
    Copper goes that fast in six-foot Thunderbolt 3 now. Did you mean six feet, and not six inches?

    My guess is Ikrupp probably didn't realize this was actually 10 gigabits x 4 and thought it was a single 40 GHz serial line.  But yeah - this offers nothing to the Mac camp - we've had TB3 since 2016.  On copper.  ;)  I'm waiting and hoping for TB4, so we can have ever better eGPUs.
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 7 of 23
    Let's hope USB4 builds in some security to only allow certified cables to power a device. USBC was almost ruined by cheap fake cables from China sold via Amazon with no one checking that they actually were safe to use.
  • Reply 8 of 23
    chasmchasm Posts: 1,545member
    I’m pleased that this transition will be far smoother than the form-factor change from USB-A to USB-C. It looks like the TB3/USB-C connector will be standard across platforms and backward compatible with USB-C cords, which is very pro-consumer for once.
    p-dogwatto_cobra
  • Reply 9 of 23
    dysamoriadysamoria Posts: 2,152member
    Let's hope USB4 builds in some security to only allow certified cables to power a device. USBC was almost ruined by cheap fake cables from China sold via Amazon with no one checking that they actually were safe to use.
    Amazon still sells fake “USB to FireWire adapters”. Yes I’ve reported it. Shit just doesn’t matter anymore.
    p-dogwatto_cobra
  • Reply 10 of 23
    dougddougd Posts: 252member
    Here we go again...obsolete the old connector so people have to pay to upgrade. Planned obsolesce 
  • Reply 11 of 23
    sflocalsflocal Posts: 4,624member
    It's pretty amazing the once lowly USB standards now beginning to show some serious chops.  Of course, it will still not be as efficient as the Thunderbolt interface, which by the time USB4 comes out, TB4 will be introduced with at least 80gb/s bandwidth.

    Either way, I look forward to seeing what devices come out that utilize all that amazing bandwidth.
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 12 of 23
    p-dogp-dog Posts: 19member
    dougd said:
    Here we go again...obsolete the old connector so people have to pay to upgrade. Planned obsolesce 
    Did you not read the part in the article where it stated, “The Promoter Group is further promising "multiple simultaneous data and display protocols," and BACKWARDS COMPATIBILITY with USB 3.2, Thunderbolt 3, and USB 2.0.”? Sheesh!
    muthuk_vanalingamchasmlollivercommentzillawatto_cobrastompy
  • Reply 13 of 23
    macseekermacseeker Posts: 431member
    I wonder when printers and scanners will implement the USB 4.0 standard and connector.  Also for the external storage devices.  Until then, we still need computers to have the USB - A connector.
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 14 of 23
    Mike WuertheleMike Wuerthele Posts: 4,604administrator
    dougd said:
    Here we go again...obsolete the old connector so people have to pay to upgrade. Planned obsolesce 
    Still no. It says at least twice in the article that USB-C is still being used, and once that backwards compatibility is being maintained.
    muthuk_vanalingamchasmlollivercommentzillawatto_cobra
  • Reply 15 of 23
    mknelsonmknelson Posts: 339member
    dougd said:
    Here we go again...obsolete the old connector so people have to pay to upgrade. Planned obsolesce 
    Still no. It says at least twice in the article that USB-C is still being used, and once that backwards compatibility is being maintained.
    Not to mention it's pretty hard to build higher speeds, more power, etc. in a 20+ year old connector (USB-A).

    What I'm trying to understand is if the 40GBps performance is using Thunderbolt technology that has been merged into the USB 4 standard. Would that make it just be a TB3 cable in which case the higher speed USB 4 items would work with a TB3 computer?  :s
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 16 of 23
    fastasleepfastasleep Posts: 2,865member
    dougd said:
    Here we go again...obsolete the old connector so people have to pay to upgrade. Planned obsolesce 
    Here we go again...another hot take without any critical thinking applied whatsoever by dougd. 
    muthuk_vanalingamchasmroundaboutnowlolliverwatto_cobrastompy
  • Reply 17 of 23
    fastasleepfastasleep Posts: 2,865member
    macseeker said:
    I wonder when printers and scanners will implement the USB 4.0 standard and connector.  Also for the external storage devices.  Until then, we still need computers to have the USB - A connector.
    No, we don’t. USB is backwards compatible, all you need is a different cord or an adapter. Nobody needs to be saddled with legacy 5Gbps USB-A ports for this reason. 

    Who even uses wires with printers anymore?
    chasmwatto_cobra
  • Reply 18 of 23
    chasmchasm Posts: 1,545member
    dougd said:
    Here we go again...obsolete the old connector so people have to pay to upgrade. Planned obsolesce 
    Um ... no. Maybe read the article.
    lolliverfastasleepwatto_cobra
  • Reply 19 of 23
    chasmchasm Posts: 1,545member
    macseeker said:
    I wonder when printers and scanners will implement the USB 4.0 standard and connector.  Also for the external storage devices. 
    They are using it right now. It's called Thunderbolt 3 and USB-C -- the former can do the full 40, the latter can do "fast" but not "fastest," but it will all work with USB4.

    Maybe read the article next time!
    lolliverwatto_cobra
  • Reply 20 of 23
    Ha ha, a super fast connection to the printer!  That is really great :-) Can hardly wait until next year, or is it the year after? 
    watto_cobra
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